Calguns.net  

Home My iTrader Join the NRA Donate to CGSSA Sponsors CGN Google Search
CA Semiauto Ban(AW)ID Flowchart CA Handgun Ban ID Flowchart CA Shotgun Ban ID Flowchart
Go Back   Calguns.net > POLITICS, LITIGATION AND ACTIVISM > 2nd Amend. Litigation Updates & Legal Discussion
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Mark Forums Read

2nd Amend. Litigation Updates & Legal Discussion Discuss California 2A related litigation and legal topics here. All advice given is NOT legal counsel.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1921  
Old 03-25-2020, 10:13 AM
ScottsBad ScottsBad is offline
No Prisoners!
CGN Contributor - Lifetime
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 4,455
iTrader: 2 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bubbapug1 View Post
If we get a majority in the 9th the world will be a different place. Somehow we also need to get republican politicians to realize the demographics of the state and trim their sails accordingly. Hispanics used to be republican before racism took hold in the party. Why the hate towards our amigos who after all founded California?!?!
Pure crap.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #1922  
Old 03-25-2020, 10:51 AM
sfpcservice's Avatar
sfpcservice sfpcservice is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Suisun City
Posts: 1,778
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bubbapug1 View Post
If we get a majority in the 9th the world will be a different place. Somehow we also need to get republican politicians to realize the demographics of the state and trim their sails accordingly. Hispanics used to be republican before racism took hold in the party. Why the hate towards our amigos who after all founded California?!?!
If expecting people to obey our laws, stand on your own two feet and stop asking for free stuff is racist then I guess your statement is valid...
__________________
http://theresedoksheim.files.wordpress.com/2010/03/gridlock.jpg


John 14:6
Reply With Quote
  #1923  
Old 03-25-2020, 11:11 AM
OCEANCRITTER's Avatar
OCEANCRITTER OCEANCRITTER is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 306
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bubbapug1 View Post
If we get a majority in the 9th the world will be a different place. Somehow we also need to get republican politicians to realize the demographics of the state and trim their sails accordingly. Hispanics used to be republican before racism took hold in the party. Why the hate towards our amigos who after all founded California?!?!
^^^^^ Completely bull*****. Using the race card is so last century and shows your intellectual laziness.

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk
Reply With Quote
  #1924  
Old 03-25-2020, 11:17 AM
kuug's Avatar
kuug kuug is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 343
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Does anyone who has kept track of the court documents know if the plaintiffs filed for an introduction of a preliminary injunction by the 3 judge panel? Will there be an opportunity to reintroduce Benitez's injunction while these proceedings carry out?
Reply With Quote
  #1925  
Old 03-25-2020, 11:40 AM
ar15barrels's Avatar
ar15barrels ar15barrels is offline
I need a LIFE!!
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Van Nuys
Posts: 47,938
iTrader: 103 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by kuug View Post
Does anyone who has kept track of the court documents know if the plaintiffs filed for an introduction of a preliminary injunction by the 3 judge panel? Will there be an opportunity to reintroduce Benitez's injunction while these proceedings carry out?
Benitez's orders are still in place until the next proceedings vacate it or replace it.
Reply With Quote
  #1926  
Old 03-25-2020, 2:42 PM
aBrowningfan aBrowningfan is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 1,293
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dvrjon View Post
9CA:
Uphold: State Request for injunction to stay ruling
Overturn: Plaintiff Request for injunction to stay ruling

2 years to En Banc:
Ditto
Ditto

3 years to SCOTUS:
Uphold: The BS goes away
Overturn: My kids and grandkids have had an additional 5 years to enjoy freedom and understand the BS this state has wrought. The grandkids will be able to vote.
Some random thoughts -
1. If for some reason, we can't get a reversal at CA9 granted cert at SCotUS, that is effectively an Overturn, since the lower court's (CA9) ruling is retained.

2. That said, I still like the odds, because there appear to be only 2 outcomes where an Overturn occurs, and the chances of either of those outcomes seems less than 25%.

3. I can patiently wait for the case to work its way to SCotUS, especially since it is unlikely that SCotUS would let the present status of the case be revoked during the appeal.
Reply With Quote
  #1927  
Old 03-25-2020, 4:04 PM
kuug's Avatar
kuug kuug is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 343
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ar15barrels View Post
Benitez's orders are still in place until the next proceedings vacate it or replace it.
Yes I am aware of that. My question is specifically about whether there is an opportunity to lift the stay on his injunction before we get to the panel opinion.
Reply With Quote
  #1928  
Old 03-25-2020, 4:24 PM
ar15barrels's Avatar
ar15barrels ar15barrels is offline
I need a LIFE!!
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Van Nuys
Posts: 47,938
iTrader: 103 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by kuug View Post
My question is specifically about whether there is an opportunity to lift the stay on his injunction before we get to the panel opinion.
Good luck with that.
Reply With Quote
  #1929  
Old 03-25-2020, 5:11 PM
abinsinia's Avatar
abinsinia abinsinia is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Posts: 799
iTrader: 1 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by kuug View Post
Yes I am aware of that. My question is specifically about whether there is an opportunity to lift the stay on his injunction before we get to the panel opinion.
It seems possible to me. The original order was well written and logical, and at least 2 of the new judges are legitimate. I'm looking forward to seeing what happens.
Reply With Quote
  #1930  
Old 03-25-2020, 5:15 PM
Sputnik's Avatar
Sputnik Sputnik is offline
Shiny
CGN Contributor
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: East Bay
Posts: 1,680
iTrader: 2 / 100%
Default

If I had to guess I'd say 'no'. The stay remains in place until the panel makes a ruling. That's the point (technically) of the appeal: to find out if the lower court judge made a procedural mistake.
Based on the make up of the panel I have hope for this case. At the very least it won't be decided against us based on "guns are bad".
Reply With Quote
  #1931  
Old 03-25-2020, 5:38 PM
Dvrjon Dvrjon is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 7,500
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by kuug View Post
Yes I am aware of that. My question is specifically about whether there is an opportunity to lift the stay on his injunction before we get to the panel opinion.
No.
__________________
"People say nothing is impossible, but I do nothing every day.”
"Nothing is foolproof to a sufficiently-talented fool."
"The things that come to those who wait may well be the things left by those who got there first."
Reply With Quote
  #1932  
Old 03-25-2020, 6:46 PM
Uxi's Avatar
Uxi Uxi is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Southern California
Posts: 5,152
iTrader: 2 / 100%
Default

As much as I'd hope for another Freedom Week, not expecting it.
__________________
"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms. The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government." -- Thomas Jefferson

9mm + 5.56mm =
.45ACP + 7.62 NATO =
10mm + 6.8 SPC =


Et Verbum caro factum est et habitavit in nobis; Jn 1:14
Reply With Quote
  #1933  
Old 03-25-2020, 6:51 PM
aBrowningfan aBrowningfan is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 1,293
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Uxi View Post
As much as I'd hope for another Freedom Week, not expecting it.
+1. The only freedom week will be what occurs if Judge Benitez' ruling is upheld by SCotUS. Then, it won't be limited to a week...
Reply With Quote
  #1934  
Old 03-25-2020, 6:54 PM
Californio Californio is offline
CGN/CGSSA Contributor - Lifetime
CGN Contributor - Lifetime
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: So. Cal
Posts: 4,046
iTrader: 3 / 100%
Default

In my family, the Hispanics, the 2nd Colony in Alta California, members of the 1775/1776 Anza Party have always voted Republican, they were Basque as was their leader Anza.

In my family the Hispanics the colonized Arizona and New Mexico, most have done the same. Of course we are a Heinz 57 of European flavors and Indigenous Peoples of North America.

Spanish 1500's, Dutch 1620's, English 1630's, Scots 1680's, Scot-Irish 1720's, German's 1720's, Indigenous Peoples from both the Western and the Eastern seaboards.

Spanish in Mexico, Dutch in New Amsterdam, now New York City, English in the Massachusetts Bay Colony, between my wife and I we claim 9 men that fought in the American Revolution, I am working on a 10th.

They fought in New Jersey, Maryland, Pennsylvania , Virginia, Kentucky etc.

My 5th GGP and their oldest son, my 4th GGF have their names on the granite monument outside Fort Boonesborough.

I agree, idiots that don't know the their history, make really stupid comments.


Quote:
Originally Posted by bubbapug1 View Post
If we get a majority in the 9th the world will be a different place. Somehow we also need to get republican politicians to realize the demographics of the state and trim their sails accordingly. Hispanics used to be republican before racism took hold in the party. Why the hate towards our amigos who after all founded California?!?!
__________________
"The California matrix of gun control laws is among the harshest in the nation and are filled with criminal law traps for people of common intelligence who desire to obey the law." - U.S. District Judge Roger T. Benitez

Last edited by Californio; 03-25-2020 at 7:04 PM..
Reply With Quote
  #1935  
Old 03-25-2020, 7:15 PM
cockedandglocked's Avatar
cockedandglocked cockedandglocked is offline
Vendor/Retailer
CGN Contributor - Lifetime
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Near Excremento
Posts: 15,845
iTrader: 10 / 100%
Blog Entries: 1
Default

Getting things back on track, since I don't see where discussions about politics and racism have anything to do with this thread...

I've noticed that it's generally assumed by most that this case (and generally any/all other 2A cases) will always be granted an en banc hearing. While that has certainly happened on more than one occasion, it's hardly "par for the course," especially with the less liberal tilt we have in the 9th these days.

The circuit courts of appeals, as a whole, only hear en banc around 5% of the cases that request it.

So, just saying that it's not "a given", as most have implied it is. It very well could go straight to SCOTUS after this.
__________________
Sorry, Benelli C-stock button kits out of stock indefinitely.


Last edited by cockedandglocked; 03-25-2020 at 7:17 PM..
Reply With Quote
  #1936  
Old 03-25-2020, 7:22 PM
Librarian's Avatar
Librarian Librarian is offline
Administrator
CGN Contributor - Lifetime
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Cottage Grove, OR
Posts: 39,737
iTrader: 4 / 100%
Blog Entries: 6
Default

A member PMs this link, https://www.ca9.uscourts.gov/calenda...aseno=19-55376 on which is the link to the oral args upcoming 4 - 2
__________________
No one will really understand politics until they understand that politicians are not trying to solve our problems. They are trying to solve their own problems - of which getting elected and re-elected are number one and number two. Whatever is number three is far behind.
- Thomas Sowell
I've been saying that for years ...

There is no value at all complaining or analyzing or reading tea leaves to decide what these bills really mean or actually do; any bill with a chance to pass will be bad for gun owners.

The details only count after the Governor signs the bills.


Gregg Easterbrook’s “Law of Doomsaying”: Predict catastrophe no later than ten years hence but no sooner than five years away — soon enough to terrify people but distant enough that they will not remember that you were wrong.


Not a lawyer, just Some Guy On The Interwebs.


Reply With Quote
  #1937  
Old 03-26-2020, 12:10 AM
Sputnik's Avatar
Sputnik Sputnik is offline
Shiny
CGN Contributor
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: East Bay
Posts: 1,680
iTrader: 2 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by cockedandglocked View Post
Getting things back on track, since I don't see where discussions about politics and racism have anything to do with this thread...

I've noticed that it's generally assumed by most that this case (and generally any/all other 2A cases) will always be granted an en banc hearing. While that has certainly happened on more than one occasion, it's hardly "par for the course," especially with the less liberal tilt we have in the 9th these days.

The circuit courts of appeals, as a whole, only hear en banc around 5% of the cases that request it.

So, just saying that it's not "a given", as most have implied it is. It very well could go straight to SCOTUS after this.
I could be mistaken but hasn't the 9th taken every single pro2A win, up to now, en banc? Due to the recent changes in composition on the court I'm not saying it'll happen again should we win here...but in the past their activities to deny us a win were, imo, most unprecedented.

Last edited by Sputnik; 03-26-2020 at 12:14 AM..
Reply With Quote
  #1938  
Old 03-26-2020, 3:40 AM
kuug's Avatar
kuug kuug is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 343
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by cockedandglocked View Post
Getting things back on track, since I don't see where discussions about politics and racism have anything to do with this thread...

I've noticed that it's generally assumed by most that this case (and generally any/all other 2A cases) will always be granted an en banc hearing. While that has certainly happened on more than one occasion, it's hardly "par for the course," especially with the less liberal tilt we have in the 9th these days.

The circuit courts of appeals, as a whole, only hear en banc around 5% of the cases that request it.

So, just saying that it's not "a given", as most have implied it is. It very well could go straight to SCOTUS after this.
It may not go to SCOTUS at all if it doesn't go en banc. CA doesn't want to go in front of a hostile 5-4 conservative majority.
Reply With Quote
  #1939  
Old 03-26-2020, 7:29 AM
champu's Avatar
champu champu is offline
NRA Member, CRPA Member,
CGN Contributor
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Redondo Beach
Posts: 1,206
iTrader: 1 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by kuug View Post
It may not go to SCOTUS at all if it doesn't go en banc. CA doesn't want to go in front of a hostile 5-4 conservative majority.
California would likely draw similar ire from gun-disliking politicians and groups across the country as did DC when they considered petitioning for cert after their loss in Wrenn/Grace.
Reply With Quote
  #1940  
Old 03-26-2020, 1:40 PM
kuug's Avatar
kuug kuug is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 343
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by champu View Post
California would likely draw similar ire from gun-disliking politicians and groups across the country as did DC when they considered petitioning for cert after their loss in Wrenn/Grace.
Exactly. With the comp of judges we have we are likely facing another win in this case. Our biggest worry is the leftists voting to go en banc because that would slow us down by another year at the very least.
Reply With Quote
  #1941  
Old 03-26-2020, 1:51 PM
cockedandglocked's Avatar
cockedandglocked cockedandglocked is offline
Vendor/Retailer
CGN Contributor - Lifetime
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Near Excremento
Posts: 15,845
iTrader: 10 / 100%
Blog Entries: 1
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sputnik View Post
I could be mistaken but hasn't the 9th taken every single pro2A win, up to now, en banc? Due to the recent changes in composition on the court I'm not saying it'll happen again should we win here...but in the past their activities to deny us a win were, imo, most unprecedented.
That's right, but the thing is, it's a very small sample size to draw a conclusion from. How many 2a cases have we won in the 9CA that CADOJ then requested an en banc hearing for? Peruta is the only one I can think of, maybe there was also another one in recent years that I'm not remembering. So yes, 1-for-1 or 2-for-2 is 100%, but it's such a small sample (and from a time when 9CA was far more heavily liberal) that I really don't think it's indicative of all 2A cases going forward.
__________________
Sorry, Benelli C-stock button kits out of stock indefinitely.


Last edited by cockedandglocked; 03-26-2020 at 2:05 PM..
Reply With Quote
  #1942  
Old 03-26-2020, 1:59 PM
cockedandglocked's Avatar
cockedandglocked cockedandglocked is offline
Vendor/Retailer
CGN Contributor - Lifetime
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Near Excremento
Posts: 15,845
iTrader: 10 / 100%
Blog Entries: 1
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by champu View Post
California would likely draw similar ire from gun-disliking politicians and groups across the country as did DC when they considered petitioning for cert after their loss in Wrenn/Grace.
I agree - the only cases that are going to SCOTUS are the ones where CADOJ won at CA9, and our side petitioned for SCOTUS cert, like Pena v Lindley. It's extremely unlikely that CADOJ would petition for cert after losing at CA9 - especially when the law in question is similar to laws shared by other states in other circuits.

Although, it wouldn't be the first time CADOJ has done something embarrassingly stupid... I recall not too long ago, with this very case, they filed an appeal with CA9 about the preliminary injunction, and the 3-judge panel came just short of laughing them out of the courtroom
__________________
Sorry, Benelli C-stock button kits out of stock indefinitely.


Last edited by cockedandglocked; 03-26-2020 at 2:04 PM..
Reply With Quote
  #1943  
Old 03-26-2020, 3:31 PM
TruOil TruOil is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2017
Posts: 790
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by cockedandglocked View Post
That's right, but the thing is, it's a very small sample size to draw a conclusion from. How many 2a cases have we won in the 9CA that CADOJ then requested an en banc hearing for? Peruta is the only one I can think of, maybe there was also another one in recent years that I'm not remembering. So yes, 1-for-1 or 2-for-2 is 100%, but it's such a small sample (and from a time when 9CA was far more heavily liberal) that I really don't think it's indicative of all 2A cases going forward.
True BUT, as I recall, it only takes one judge to ask for en banc review. And Sidney Thomas is about as anti-gun as they come. He will delay any case as long as he can, especially one where the gun guys win. His real problem right now is that he painted himself into a corner with Peruta--if there is no right to concealed carry a firearm, then there must be a right to open carry, or there is no right at all. (I have no doubt that he would wish it to be the latter, but I have a feeling that choice will be taken away from him by the Supreme Court.)
Reply With Quote
  #1944  
Old 03-26-2020, 5:24 PM
kuug's Avatar
kuug kuug is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 343
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TruOil View Post
True BUT, as I recall, it only takes one judge to ask for en banc review. And Sidney Thomas is about as anti-gun as they come. He will delay any case as long as he can, especially one where the gun guys win. His real problem right now is that he painted himself into a corner with Peruta--if there is no right to concealed carry a firearm, then there must be a right to open carry, or there is no right at all. (I have no doubt that he would wish it to be the latter, but I have a feeling that choice will be taken away from him by the Supreme Court.)
It's not a question of if there will be a vote for en banc, it's a matter of when and if they have the votes to actually take the case up. The leftists know they can only delay and that is exactly what they will do with the en banc vote. But they do run the risk of if they win the en banc vote, then the Supreme Court will likely take the case up because it will absolutely be appealed by the plaintiffs. They might think it is better to take the L for CA to prevent Hawaii, New York, Virginia, and the other democrat strongholds from having to allow standard capacity mags. This doesn't even take into account that the question may already be settled by NYSRPA when we finally get the opinion for that case.
Reply With Quote
  #1945  
Old 03-26-2020, 6:41 PM
cockedandglocked's Avatar
cockedandglocked cockedandglocked is offline
Vendor/Retailer
CGN Contributor - Lifetime
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Near Excremento
Posts: 15,845
iTrader: 10 / 100%
Blog Entries: 1
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by kuug View Post
It's not a question of if there will be a vote for en banc, it's a matter of when and if they have the votes to actually take the case up. The leftists know they can only delay and that is exactly what they will do with the en banc vote. But they do run the risk of if they win the en banc vote, then the Supreme Court will likely take the case up because it will absolutely be appealed by the plaintiffs. They might think it is better to take the L for CA to prevent Hawaii, New York, Virginia, and the other democrat strongholds from having to allow standard capacity mags. This doesn't even take into account that the question may already be settled by NYSRPA when we finally get the opinion for that case.
That's a good point. That's a risk they could take with Peruta, since SCOTUS was likely to (and indeed, did) decline cert back in 2016. That's not the case anymore.

A slight correction to your post above, although I do agree with the point you were making: Hawaii is in the 9th circuit, so they will lose their magazine restrictions if we win in the 9th, whether or not SCOTUS takes this.
__________________
Sorry, Benelli C-stock button kits out of stock indefinitely.

Reply With Quote
  #1946  
Old 03-26-2020, 6:43 PM
bronco75a's Avatar
bronco75a bronco75a is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2016
Posts: 596
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Couldn't the 9th Circuit not rule favorably and like has been the norm lately with Chief Justice Roberts - the SCOTUS gutlessly just decides NOT to take it up and the 9th Circuit Ruling stands. No one seems to be mentioning that.
Reply With Quote
  #1947  
Old 03-26-2020, 6:45 PM
cockedandglocked's Avatar
cockedandglocked cockedandglocked is offline
Vendor/Retailer
CGN Contributor - Lifetime
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Near Excremento
Posts: 15,845
iTrader: 10 / 100%
Blog Entries: 1
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bronco75a View Post
Couldn't the 9th Circuit not rule favorably and like has been the norm lately with Chief Justice Roberts - the SCOTUS gutlessly just decides NOT to take it up and the 9th Circuit Ruling stands. No one seems to be mentioning that.
That's virtually the only thing anyone was saying, for the first roughly 47 pages of this thread, until a few weeks ago, when things took an unexpected turn in a favorable direction.
__________________
Sorry, Benelli C-stock button kits out of stock indefinitely.

Reply With Quote
  #1948  
Old 03-26-2020, 7:16 PM
Sputnik's Avatar
Sputnik Sputnik is offline
Shiny
CGN Contributor
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: East Bay
Posts: 1,680
iTrader: 2 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by cockedandglocked View Post
That's virtually the only thing anyone was saying, for the first roughly 47 pages of this thread, until a few weeks ago, when things took an unexpected turn in a favorable direction.
I'm finding it hard to not be excited by these unexpected favorable turns. I have to force myself not to get all giddy with the idea of winning this case. Can't start counting chickens just yet...but boy do I want to.
Reply With Quote
  #1949  
Old 03-26-2020, 7:17 PM
Transient Transient is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2020
Location: Currently in Virginia. Moving to San Diego summer 2020.
Posts: 238
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by cockedandglocked View Post
That's a good point. That's a risk they could take with Peruta, since SCOTUS was likely to (and indeed, did) decline cert back in 2016. That's not the case anymore.

A slight correction to your post above, although I do agree with the point you were making: Hawaii is in the 9th circuit, so they will lose their magazine restrictions if we win in the 9th, whether or not SCOTUS takes this.
Hawaii would also push for appeal, and would file an amicus. But, everybody here already knows that.

Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk
Reply With Quote
  #1950  
Old 03-26-2020, 7:26 PM
cockedandglocked's Avatar
cockedandglocked cockedandglocked is offline
Vendor/Retailer
CGN Contributor - Lifetime
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Near Excremento
Posts: 15,845
iTrader: 10 / 100%
Blog Entries: 1
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Transient View Post
Hawaii would also push for appeal, and would file an amicus. But, everybody here already knows that.

Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk
Case was already appealed - do you mean they'll push for en banc if the appeal is lost? If so, yes I agree.
__________________
Sorry, Benelli C-stock button kits out of stock indefinitely.

Reply With Quote
  #1951  
Old 03-26-2020, 8:44 PM
RickD427's Avatar
RickD427 RickD427 is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: King County
Posts: 6,538
iTrader: 7 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TruOil View Post
True BUT, as I recall, it only takes one judge to ask for en banc review. And Sidney Thomas is about as anti-gun as they come. He will delay any case as long as he can, especially one where the gun guys win. His real problem right now is that he painted himself into a corner with Peruta--if there is no right to concealed carry a firearm, then there must be a right to open carry, or there is no right at all. (I have no doubt that he would wish it to be the latter, but I have a feeling that choice will be taken away from him by the Supreme Court.)
You're correct that any single judge on the court can request an en banc review, but it takes a majority vote of all non-recused judges on the court in order to grant the review.
__________________
If you build a man a fire, you'll keep him warm for the evening. If you set a man on fire, you'll keep him warm for the rest of his life.
Reply With Quote
  #1952  
Old 03-26-2020, 9:22 PM
Transient Transient is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2020
Location: Currently in Virginia. Moving to San Diego summer 2020.
Posts: 238
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by cockedandglocked View Post
Case was already appealed - do you mean they'll push for en banc if the appeal is lost? If so, yes I agree.
No. I mean what I said. Cases can be appealed all the way up to SCOTUS. SCOTUS is not just the final word, they are the ultimate appellate court.

Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk
Reply With Quote
  #1953  
Old 03-27-2020, 1:57 AM
kuug's Avatar
kuug kuug is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 343
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by cockedandglocked View Post
That's a good point. That's a risk they could take with Peruta, since SCOTUS was likely to (and indeed, did) decline cert back in 2016. That's not the case anymore.

A slight correction to your post above, although I do agree with the point you were making: Hawaii is in the 9th circuit, so they will lose their magazine restrictions if we win in the 9th, whether or not SCOTUS takes this.
This lawsuit involves CA magazine laws. A win here does not automatically mean Hawaii magazine laws are struck down. A new lawsuit challenging Hawaii mag bans with these cases as precedent would have to be initiated.
Reply With Quote
  #1954  
Old 03-27-2020, 8:46 AM
mcbair mcbair is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2019
Posts: 29
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Chambers v U.S. opinions written in the Ninth are binding upon all federal judges within the Circuit. A case may need to be brought but Federal judges are bound to follow the ruling.
Reply With Quote
  #1955  
Old 03-27-2020, 8:52 AM
kuug's Avatar
kuug kuug is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 343
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by mcbair View Post
Chambers v U.S. opinions written in the Ninth are binding upon all federal judges within the Circuit. A case may need to be brought but Federal judges are bound to follow the ruling.
Now go ahead, read my post, and explain how that is different from what I said.
Reply With Quote
  #1956  
Old 03-27-2020, 9:03 AM
Transient Transient is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2020
Location: Currently in Virginia. Moving to San Diego summer 2020.
Posts: 238
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by mcbair View Post
Chambers v U.S. opinions written in the Ninth are binding upon all federal judges within the Circuit. A case may need to be brought but Federal judges are bound to follow the ruling.
Not exactly. If another case is brought forth on the same subject matter the prior ruling will be heavily considered, but the argument may throw a wrench into how the previous ruling was wrong. For example, Intermediate Scrutiny was used when Stricter Scrutiny should've been applied. For the most part I agree with what was said, but there's always that "what if" scenario.

Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk
Reply With Quote
  #1957  
Old 03-27-2020, 8:00 PM
aBrowningfan aBrowningfan is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 1,293
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by kuug View Post
This lawsuit involves CA magazine laws. A win here does not automatically mean Hawaii magazine laws are struck down. A new lawsuit challenging Hawaii mag bans with these cases as precedent would have to be initiated.
And what makes you think a lawsuit in Hawaii wouldn't be initiated?
Reply With Quote
  #1958  
Old 03-27-2020, 9:50 PM
Paladin's Avatar
Paladin Paladin is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: SFBA
Posts: 9,634
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Will CA9 live stream orals? Link?
Reply With Quote
  #1959  
Old 03-27-2020, 10:51 PM
wolfwood's Avatar
wolfwood wolfwood is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: San Diego
Posts: 1,332
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Paladin View Post
Will CA9 live stream orals? Link?
I don't know but its going to be a video argument the lawyers won't be live.
I suspect that will cause some technical problems

Its going to require a lawsuit to overturn the Hawaii law but if the NRA wins in Duncan wins then that is pretty easy to do.
__________________
“We are twice armed if we fight with faith.”

― Plato
Reply With Quote
  #1960  
Old 03-28-2020, 1:36 AM
kuug's Avatar
kuug kuug is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 343
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by aBrowningfan View Post
And what makes you think a lawsuit in Hawaii wouldn't be initiated?
One will be initiated and that's my point. Just because our work might be done against CA doesn't mean we just sit back and Hawaii's domino falls. It's going to be a little while longer for those in other states to get their rights back. Just like how a win with Young v. Hawaii doesn't automatically mean we in CA can openly carry.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



All times are GMT -8. The time now is 1:09 AM.




Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Proudly hosted by GeoVario the Premier 2A host.
Calguns.net, the 'Calguns' name and all associated variants and logos are ® Trademark and © Copyright 2002-2020, Calguns.net an Incorporated Company All Rights Reserved.
All opinions, statements and remarks made by Calguns.net on this web site and elsewhere are solely attributable to Calguns.net.
Tactical Pants Tactical Boots Tactical Gear Military Boots 5.11 Tactical