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Curio & Relic/Black Powder Curio & Relics and Black Powder Firearms, Old School shooting fun!

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  #1  
Old 10-27-2021, 6:16 PM
johncage johncage is offline
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Default what stops the hk p7 from qualifying for c&r status?

it has a unique, possibly one of a kind cocking/safety mechanism, it is of immense interest to collectors and historians.

surely it is more qualified to be c&r than the cz82 in all relevant categories?

is it simply a matter of finding a curator who can draft a letter, or perhaps it was a one off thing that happened at the atf c&r approval department and they no longer have such a policy of accepting "outside opinions"

thank you
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  #2  
Old 10-27-2021, 6:27 PM
HibikiR HibikiR is offline
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The ATF has pretty clear rules concerning additions to the C&R list and yes, having a curator of an actual museum get involved is still one way it's done as evidenced by the CZ-82.

The uniqueness of the mechanism isn't what matters to historians/curators apparently. The curator behind the CZ-82 was more about it being a military firearm of a now defunct nation (unlike the CZ-83, which technically wasn't adopted by said defunct nation).

Last edited by HibikiR; 10-27-2021 at 6:29 PM..
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  #3  
Old 10-27-2021, 7:23 PM
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Short answer is its not going to happen.

But when were they first produced? At 50 years old they automatically become C&R's.
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Old 10-27-2021, 7:51 PM
HibikiR HibikiR is offline
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Started in 1979, ended in 2008.
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  #5  
Old 10-28-2021, 12:47 AM
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And HK hasn't actually and fully retired it yet. They're still open to doing the 'Jubilee' production runs of various supposedly discontinued models.

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Old 10-28-2021, 8:03 AM
johncage johncage is offline
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i wonder if there will be a big sell off from p7 collectors before it hits the 50 year mark? the closer it is to that date, the harder it might be to sell at premium because people would rather wait. and i wonder what will become its new value after the initial productions become c&r in a few years. i think there will be a massive amount of surplus police imports from europe based on demand. i predict 600 dollars per unit
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Old 10-28-2021, 8:21 AM
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Originally Posted by johncage View Post
i wonder if there will be a big sell off from p7 collectors before it hits the 50 year mark? the closer it is to that date, the harder it might be to sell at premium because people would rather wait. and i wonder what will become its new value after the initial productions become c&r in a few years. i think there will be a massive amount of surplus police imports from europe based on demand. i predict 600 dollars per unit
I'd like that to be the case, as well, but I think it wishful thinking. Unless some very large number come to the market in one lot and flood demand, people will snap them up as the 50 year mark ticks by day after day.
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Old 10-28-2021, 8:25 AM
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The closer it gets to 50 years old, the MORE VALUABLE it becomes, in every single state.

This gun commands a premium in all states, and when it is available to transfer WITHOUT FFL across state lines amongst C&R holders in nearly every state, it becomes more valuable - not less valuable.

And police surplus units would be rode hard and put away wet. A supply of worn out P7s will do nothing to depress the value of excellent condition examples.

But keep waiting on prices to drop
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Old 10-28-2021, 12:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SkyHawk View Post
The closer it gets to 50 years old, the MORE VALUABLE it becomes, in every single state.

This gun commands a premium in all states, and when it is available to transfer WITHOUT FFL across state lines amongst C&R holders in nearly every state, it becomes more valuable - not less valuable.

And police surplus units would be rode hard and put away wet. A supply of worn out P7s will do nothing to depress the value of excellent condition examples.

But keep waiting on prices to drop
I agree 100%. Plus those "Police surplus " guns were sold long ago. No agency keep old guns around, especially when they get discounts on trade in's.

C&C status always brings a rise in prices. Colt SP1 AR-15's that are now over 50 years old sell at quite a premium.
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  #10  
Old 10-29-2021, 8:58 AM
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I agree 100%. Plus those "Police surplus " guns were sold long ago. No agency keep old guns around, especially when they get discounts on trade in's.

C&C status always brings a rise in prices. Colt SP1 AR-15's that are now over 50 years old sell at quite a premium.
Agree: by comparison, Colt Pythons and SAA as C&R have never dropped in value, and each of those saw much higher production numbers for any single year, than the P7 series.

Even now, auction-ending prices on P7 guns for those only available outside of CA, versus the few that come up with availability for PPT in CA, are only a smidge lower in the final bidding cost than the latter.

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Originally Posted by Librarian View Post
What compelling interest has any level of government in knowing what guns are owned by civilians? (Those owned by government should be inventoried and tracked, for exactly the same reasons computers and desks and chairs are tracked: responsible care of public property.)

If some level of government had that information, what would they do with it? How would having that info benefit public safety? How would it benefit law enforcement?
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  #11  
Old 10-29-2021, 9:11 AM
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Agree that C&R status generally increases price value, except for maybe a few outliers like the S&W Model 10. So many model 10s were produced that C&R status alone doesnt necessarily mean it is more valuable, condition is what determines value.

The P7 is a "cool" gun but for the prices people are asking it's not worth it unless you just got to have one. I'd rather have a Luger or PPK.
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