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National 2nd Amend. Political & Legal Discussion Discuss national gun rights and 2A related political topics here. All advice given is NOT legal counsel.

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  #1  
Old 12-18-2020, 6:00 AM
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Default Why everyone needs to belong to the NRA...regardless of LaPierre's suits...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Paladin View Post
NYSRPA v. Corlett challenges NY’s “proper cause” requirement for a CCW. More at: https://www.nraila.org/articles/2020...-supreme-court

I just heard about this tonight.
Regardless of what you think about LA Pierre's suits, the NRA is the ONLY organization that can resist the democrats national agenda to destroy the 2A. We need to be pragmatic and not cut off our noses to spite our faces. There is NO better more effective alternative. Join the NRA and help vote out LaPierre if you think he needs to go. That is how you change the situation for the better. Not destroying the only effective defender of the 2A under the bus and our 2A rights with it just as the democrat's take the executive branch.

The NRA is more important than ever as we will need a national organization to stand against all the Presidential Executive orders that are surly coming our way... the litigation will be voluminous and expensive.



FAIRFAX, Va. - The National Rifle Association’s Institute for Legislative Action (NRA-ILA) has partnered with the New York State Rifle and Pistol Association (NYSRPA) today to ask the Supreme Court to hear a challenge to New York’s restrictive process for issuing concealed carry licenses.

"As long as New York continues denying law-abiding gun owners their Second Amendment rights, the NRA will continue fighting to protect and expand those rights," said Jason Ouimet, executive director of NRA-ILA.

The case, NYSRPA v. Corlett, challenges New York's requirement for applicants to demonstrate "proper cause" to carry a firearm. While New York routinely employs this arbitrary standard to deny carry permits, the NRA argues that this right should be available to "all 'the people'" instead of a "subset of the people that can distinguish themselves from their fellow Americans” by showing proper cause.

The NRA is the leader in America’s right-to-carry movement having pioneered the effort on legislative and legal fronts since the 1980s. Today, due to its efforts, more than 40 states have what the NRA describes as "shall-issue" laws where states are required to give residents who apply and satisfy prerequisites their requested permits. The NRA is also the national leader in the "constitutional carry" movement where law-abiding residents in 16 states do not require a permit to carry a firearm. This is the second lawsuit the NRA and NYSRPA have brought to the High Court in as many years. The move is just the latest in NRA’s decades-long fight to protect and expand Americans’ right to carry.

“Eventually, these anti-freedom activists will understand that our Second Amendment right to keep and bear arms is fundamental, and it doesn’t vanish when we leave our homes. Until then, we will continue these battles wherever they arise," concluded Ouimet.
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Last edited by OCEquestrian; 12-18-2020 at 6:17 AM..
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  #2  
Old 12-18-2020, 6:55 AM
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Not this again. The NRA can clean-house by Monday and probably land a windfall by the end of the week, but they refuse. I'm a lifetime member and won't give them a dime until such time. I continue to support AzCDL.
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  #3  
Old 12-18-2020, 7:28 AM
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I like Firearms Policy Coalition (FPC)...they seem to have less bureaucracy/less costs than the NRA and really advocate for CA 2A specifically


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Old 12-18-2020, 7:33 AM
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NRA discussions belong in the NRA forum and not tying up other forums. Thank you
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  #5  
Old 12-18-2020, 8:09 AM
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NRA discussions belong in the NRA forum and not tying up other forums. Thank you
This is a about a 2a court case involving the nra, so I think it belongs here.
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  #6  
Old 12-18-2020, 8:24 AM
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Originally Posted by kalifornia.kompliant View Post
I like Firearms Policy Coalition (FPC)...they seem to have less bureaucracy/less costs than the NRA and really advocate for CA 2A specifically


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Advocating is a lot different than actually having the resources and the ability to fund and complete successful litigation.
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  #7  
Old 12-18-2020, 9:43 AM
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OC is dead on from the perspective of logic. Unfortunately the protestant other side will not.....utterly refuses to see it. I'm also a lifer, and no by all that might be holy do I support some of the crap the NRA's done....nowayshapeorform!.................That said, it is more than a truisim that the NRA IS........IS the only dog in the fight that has the teeth to win...more so it is also the dog that all OUR enemies fear, and that is worth something.

Hell yeah I wish to hell we had a Neal Knox or Harlan Carter today.....but we do not and the best course we can all follow until such luminaries appear is to back the singular organization that has the ammunition to do the job.

Fella's, you "kill Wayne" and screw the NRA types really, really need to re-evaluate your stance.

Example, my State, Florida, will skip rope if the NRA really pushes an issue.............and yep, they've screwed up here too....still, mention NRA ands our State Legislature lines up for inspection...quick llike!

Truth be told if it was not for the NRA's influence Florida gun policy would look almost precisely like New York's....or worse, yours!
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  #8  
Old 12-18-2020, 10:09 AM
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Every gun owner should at least be a member of the NRA. That should not be controversial or up to debate at all. Its simply a no brainer.

As for donations, send them to the CRPA. Again send your money to the CRPA!!!! Cannot emphasize that enough.
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  #9  
Old 12-18-2020, 10:53 AM
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If you want for a organization that is 100% inline with you, you will be waiting a long time and the 2A war will be lost. "The enemy of my enemy is my friend!"
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  #10  
Old 12-18-2020, 10:54 AM
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Too many gun owners have excuses as to why they do not belong to the NRA, and then they complain that politicians and laws do not respect or protect 2A.
Not to mention idiot gun owners voting for any democrat.
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  #11  
Old 12-20-2020, 6:23 PM
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Very few shooters who are not NRA members are aware of how New York is persecuting Wayne La Pierre for the unforgivable crime of being great at his job !

A gentle suggestion of how folks should join the NRA, has great results and the more people hear it, the more likely they join when the opportunity is available.

I had planned on upgrading to Patron life at the next convention but did so before the election to further our influence in the presidential election.
As it turned out this election was so corrupt, so dishonest, so obviously fraudulent, that no amount of campaigning or money could have delivered it outright for Trump on election night.

Alexander Hamilton said liberty requires people armed and trained.The NRA is on the forefront in that dept and the brotherhood is 2nd to none.

I predict the lawsuit against the NRA will be gone after Trump resumes his 2nd term.
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  #12  
Old 12-20-2020, 6:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fastattack View Post
Not this again. The NRA can clean-house by Monday and probably land a windfall by the end of the week, but they refuse. I'm a lifetime member and won't give them a dime until such time. I continue to support AzCDL.
Did you vote for the former astonut Mark Kelly for AZ Senator ?
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  #13  
Old 12-20-2020, 6:39 PM
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Agree!
All gun owners should be NRA members regardless if you like all that they are they are the only big dog fighting.
I support them and a few others but the bulk of my money goes to them.
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  #14  
Old 12-22-2020, 8:11 AM
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Watching a corrupt, dishonest, paid communist New York slob, attack our very own hero Wayne La Pierre, is a sales feature for joining the NRA .

Lets begin by encouraging all to join the NRA, even people who longer, or never owned guns.

Years back a city tried to ban guns and it failed. One lady interviewed said, she doesn't own a gun, but feels safe because her neighbor does.

Those are potential NRA members .
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  #15  
Old 12-27-2020, 5:30 PM
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I personally switched all my donations over to CRPA a coupes years ago and don’t feel guilty about it. I had hinky inclinations that the NRA seemed like a sham and all my
Guilt was alleviated when the Lapierre stuff was made public.
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Old 12-27-2020, 6:13 PM
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Originally Posted by deadcoyote View Post
I personally switched all my donations over to CRPA a coupes years ago and don’t feel guilty about it. I had hinky inclinations that the NRA seemed like a sham and all my
Guilt was alleviated when the Lapierre stuff was made public.
With the election of Biden and the possible loss of the senate to the dems, the California battle is about to become national. Wayne Lapierre is not all there is to the NRA and we need to unite to hold the tide. Don't let your pride get in the way of the fight. That is exactly what the dems, Soros, Bloomberg, Harris, the Brady people and all the other enemies of the Constitution and the 2A want .
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Last edited by OCEquestrian; 12-28-2020 at 8:16 AM..
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  #17  
Old 12-28-2020, 7:44 AM
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Damn straight OC............for those of you down on the NRA...consider: Who/what/where is the NRA.......hell, it's me in FLorida, my family and kin in W.Va/Pa./Ca./Ar/./Tx and S.C.........and thats just direct family.....how 'bout all the friends and associates over the years spread out over this whole damn Nation!

OC is right....this is a fight we are all in and if we fracture then we ALL will suffer.

You don't like LP.........hell, VOTE to have him removed, but don't damn all of us to the consequence of killing the NRA...which is all of us, or should be!
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  #18  
Old 12-28-2020, 7:56 AM
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The NRA of today is not the NRA of the past - their primary concern now is their own existance - gun owners are simply the financiers.
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Old 12-28-2020, 8:27 AM
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The NRA of today is not the NRA of the past - their primary concern now is their own existance - gun owners are simply the financiers.
^^^^ from a low post count shill...
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Old 12-28-2020, 8:33 AM
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Did you vote for the former astonut Mark Kelly for AZ Senator ?
With due respect, what an idiotic question. Of course not. I supported the combat A-10 commander and pilot. I think my donations went to better use supporting her rather than the NRA.

What makes us any different from the left if we blindly support a corrupt organization to further a political cause? It is our duty to keep them honest, and so far I haven't seen that. This isn't on the left for demonizing them, that is what they do. It isn't about people like me who seek a transparent accounting. It is on the NRA and their conduct. They get away with their shenanigans because of people like you.
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Old 12-28-2020, 9:19 AM
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OC: Trying to inject reason into these naysayers is like puttin' lipstick on a pig.....get's you nasty and pisses off the porker.
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Old 12-28-2020, 9:48 AM
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Originally Posted by NavCop View Post
The NRA of today is not the NRA of the past - their primary concern now is their own existance - gun owners are simply the financiers.
Are you a NRA member? Or are you a member of the Brady group?

Like them or not, they are the biggest dog in the fight and the only one that the antis really go after. So that, in itself, should give you a clue as the what they stand for.
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Old 12-28-2020, 10:58 AM
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Hellsfirwe MMR..........I'd volunteer to put lipstick on you!
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Old 12-28-2020, 11:04 AM
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OP is right on.
Don't forget that you can give NRA memberships to others. I have only given one but that individual is now a continual renewer.

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Old 12-28-2020, 4:50 PM
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Originally Posted by cbr9290318 View Post
OP is right on.
Don't forget that you can give NRA memberships to others. I have only given one but that individual is now a continual renewer.

Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk
I am a lifetime member and both my dog and my horse are annual members of the NRA, CRPA and the Second Amendment Foundation.
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Old 12-28-2020, 4:53 PM
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Originally Posted by mrrabbit View Post
Funny how anytime posters provide correct analysis of the NRA,

the wagons get circled immediately - and the posters in question slandered as anti-2A or positioned in a false dichotomy.

Typical progressive liberal behavior...

=8-(
Exactly what are YOU doing to defend the 2A other than tearing down the NRA in this forums and colluding with the the anti gun crowd in doing so???
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  #27  
Old 12-28-2020, 6:29 PM
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Originally Posted by mrrabbit View Post
Funny how anytime posters provide correct analysis of the NRA,

the wagons get circled immediately - and the posters in question slandered as anti-2A or positioned in a false dichotomy.

Typical progressive liberal behavior...

=8-(
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Old 12-28-2020, 8:17 PM
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I've actually answered this many times...

How many times are we going to do this? 10, 50, 1000?

Real question is, when are people going to stop being Kool-Aid drinking sheep and actually RESEARCH the organizations they join in order to properly represent them?

NRA is a marksmanship organization. I donate with that understanding - I do not purport the NRA to be something it is not.

The NRA is NOT a 2A rights organization, never has been. That's a fact.

=8-|
LMAO.. Non responsive answer. What a surprise.
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Old 12-29-2020, 7:10 AM
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I've spoken out about Wayne in the past and think he should go. He should go not the whole organization. We are going to be facing a full on assault of our rights for the next several years and we need all the help we can get. To all you NRA haters who smugly sit back and count your $30.00 dues you saved; Think about how small that amount is as the Government starts making every gun you own illegal. Seems pretty short sighted to me. Yes there are problems within the NRA. Five million members is still a pretty effective tool.
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Old 12-29-2020, 7:59 AM
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Originally Posted by mrrabbit View Post
NRA has pretty much gone the same route as so many other charities, non-profits, advocacy organizations, etc.

Creating cushy jobs for well connected people, selling insurance - and only providing at most pennies on the dollar of assistance to anyone.

Pretty hard to find SERIOUS, efficient and narrowly focused organizations nowadays that put 80% of donations into the grassroots organization and the people they serve.

=8-|
I agree. The NRA was founded to promote Marksmanship in the civilian community after the Civil War, by CW Generals who saw wide spread poor marksmanship in combat

The NRA self identified itself as an agency of the US Military when in actuality, it was nothing of the kind. Read the magazine of the period and its emphasis on Civilian Marksmanship. The NRA was established by the military to train civilians in peacetime on marksmanship. Marksmanship was understood to be a skill, something that could not be learned in a 16 week Basic, or months long Advanced Infantry training, and the Military believed in the value of individual marksmanship. Marksmanship, civilian marksmanship, was repudiated in the McNamara era of the 60’s, the NRA expelled from the halls of the Pentagon, but up till then, the attitude of the military towards the NRA was very favorable.

The NRA received major resources from its association with the US Army, Marines, Navy. The military financed the National Matches, which in the 1960’s was worth at least 20% of the total NRA budget.

This is a list of NRA Presidents to 1950.

General Burnside 1871-73, Col William Church 1873-75, Gen Alexander Shaler 1875-1877, Judge N. Stanton 1877-1880, Col Gildersleeve 1880-81, Gen Winfield Hancock 1881-82, Gen Molineux 1882-83, Gen US Grant, 1883-84, Gen P Sheridan 1885-86, Gen George Wingate 1886-1902,Gen B Spencer 1902-07, Gen J Drain 1907-1910, Gen j Bates 1910-1913, Gen C Gaither 1913-15, Col William Libbey 1915-1921, LTC Smith Brookhart (also Senator) 1921-25, Senator F Warren 1925-27, LTC F.M. Waterbury 1927-28, LTC Lewis M. Rumsey 1928-30, Hon Benedict Crowell 1930-32, B Gen G.A. Fraser, 1932-34, , Mr Karl Frederick 1934-36, Adjutant General Ammon B. Critchfield 1936-37, Mr Gustavus D. Pope 1937-39, Col L.W. T Waller 1939-41, LTC N. C. Nash 1941-42, Judge Hilliard Comstock, 1942-44, Lt Comdr Thurman Randle 1944-46, Col Francis Parker 1946-48, Dr Emmet Swanson 1948-49, MGen Merritt A Edson 1949-51.

However, post WW2, the Army walked away from long distance, accurate rifle shooting, and the NRA lost its insider position within the Pentagon. And sold its Office Building which was within walking range of the Pentagon. Since then, the NRA has become simply just another advocacy group, dedicated to maximizing the salaries and perks of its Executive Board. We know that a couple of years ago Wayne was making $2.2 million a year, and was still charging huge, inappropriate, expenses to the NRA, and so were the Board members.

It is because of the corruption of the NRA board, the inability to remove the corrupt leaders, and get honest leadership, which has put the organization at risk of being canceled. Given the Administration change, this will likely happen.

I do know there is only one person left in the Competition Group. Everyone else was sent home in March, and they have not been recalled back. The Competition group is a money maker, Clubs send NRA fees for matches, so Wayne needs someone there to process, collect, the money. It is all about the money. COVID was a good excuse for Wayne to cut the personnel budget and have more money to blow for legal fights. The longer he can draw this out, the more money he gets to take home.

If he had any integrity, he, and the whole board would quit. But, they haven't.

Last edited by slamfire1; 12-29-2020 at 8:02 AM..
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Old 12-29-2020, 8:36 AM
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I agree. The NRA was founded to promote Marksmanship in the civilian community after the Civil War, by CW Generals who saw wide spread poor marksmanship in combat

The NRA self identified itself as an agency of the US Military when in actuality, it was nothing of the kind. Read the magazine of the period and its emphasis on Civilian Marksmanship. The NRA was established by the military to train civilians in peacetime on marksmanship. Marksmanship was understood to be a skill, something that could not be learned in a 16 week Basic, or months long Advanced Infantry training, and the Military believed in the value of individual marksmanship. Marksmanship, civilian marksmanship, was repudiated in the McNamara era of the 60’s, the NRA expelled from the halls of the Pentagon, but up till then, the attitude of the military towards the NRA was very favorable.

The NRA received major resources from its association with the US Army, Marines, Navy. The military financed the National Matches, which in the 1960’s was worth at least 20% of the total NRA budget.

This is a list of NRA Presidents to 1950.

General Burnside 1871-73, Col William Church 1873-75, Gen Alexander Shaler 1875-1877, Judge N. Stanton 1877-1880, Col Gildersleeve 1880-81, Gen Winfield Hancock 1881-82, Gen Molineux 1882-83, Gen US Grant, 1883-84, Gen P Sheridan 1885-86, Gen George Wingate 1886-1902,Gen B Spencer 1902-07, Gen J Drain 1907-1910, Gen j Bates 1910-1913, Gen C Gaither 1913-15, Col William Libbey 1915-1921, LTC Smith Brookhart (also Senator) 1921-25, Senator F Warren 1925-27, LTC F.M. Waterbury 1927-28, LTC Lewis M. Rumsey 1928-30, Hon Benedict Crowell 1930-32, B Gen G.A. Fraser, 1932-34, , Mr Karl Frederick 1934-36, Adjutant General Ammon B. Critchfield 1936-37, Mr Gustavus D. Pope 1937-39, Col L.W. T Waller 1939-41, LTC N. C. Nash 1941-42, Judge Hilliard Comstock, 1942-44, Lt Comdr Thurman Randle 1944-46, Col Francis Parker 1946-48, Dr Emmet Swanson 1948-49, MGen Merritt A Edson 1949-51.

However, post WW2, the Army walked away from long distance, accurate rifle shooting, and the NRA lost its insider position within the Pentagon. And sold its Office Building which was within walking range of the Pentagon. Since then, the NRA has become simply just another advocacy group, dedicated to maximizing the salaries and perks of its Executive Board. We know that a couple of years ago Wayne was making $2.2 million a year, and was still charging huge, inappropriate, expenses to the NRA, and so were the Board members.

It is because of the corruption of the NRA board, the inability to remove the corrupt leaders, and get honest leadership, which has put the organization at risk of being canceled. Given the Administration change, this will likely happen.

I do know there is only one person left in the Competition Group. Everyone else was sent home in March, and they have not been recalled back. The Competition group is a money maker, Clubs send NRA fees for matches, so Wayne needs someone there to process, collect, the money. It is all about the money. COVID was a good excuse for Wayne to cut the personnel budget and have more money to blow for legal fights. The longer he can draw this out, the more money he gets to take home.

If he had any integrity, he, and the whole board would quit. But, they haven't.

Its my belief that WLP is under paid at 2.2 mil a year, because he has brought the NRA to over 5 million members and is very effective at keeping the anti gun faction in USA politics on the losing end.

I know you as a democrat , are actively working towards seeing USA rights under UN control. NRA and Wayne La Pierre has been the biggest obstacle to that plan.

The comments you made are welcome at the New York newspapers, who are at the forefront to disarm all American civilians and to destroy the NRA. Maybe you should post there !
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Old 12-29-2020, 10:29 AM
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Try more lipstick, Mrr.!
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Old 12-29-2020, 11:20 AM
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I know you as a democrat , are actively working towards seeing USA rights under UN control. NRA and Wayne La Pierre has been the biggest obstacle to that plan.

The comments you made are welcome at the New York newspapers, who are at the forefront to disarm all American civilians and to destroy the NRA. Maybe you should post there !
You know nothing about me, but your cancel culture sure shows you as a woke.
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  #34  
Old 12-29-2020, 3:11 PM
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Advocating is a lot different than actually having the resources and the ability to fund and complete successful litigation.
I completely agree. I think what OP is conveying is that the enemy of our enemy is our friend. We don’t have the luxury to pick and choose what groups we like, as there has only been on that has taken on anti-gun law at the federal level. Despite the NRA being ran so backwards, they are still the only ones to have leverage to fight for us.
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Old 12-29-2020, 5:00 PM
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Doesn't this "discussion" belong in the NRA forum and not here? Americans have to learn to stand on their own and not count on organizations full of corruption or not. It would appear no one wants to support this organization so a new one has to come forward that is fully transparent and capable of inciting a renewal in the Constitution and Bill of Rights.
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Old 12-29-2020, 5:08 PM
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It's amazing the number of Calgunners you run in to when faced with the truth, correct representations or analysis - circle the wagons . . .

. . . only to behave exactly the same as the liberal progressives they claim to be fighting against.

It's bizarre...but explainable at the same time.

=8-|
I think the attacks are because the poster is too stupid to understand the issues and cannot think for themselves. The current American culture is not good at discussion of issues. For decades, especially post WW2 with the three networks, our culture is a top down culture. We were taught what to believe, act, behave by manipulating elites. And we were taught that those outside this created culture are enemies. It has worked on controlling society, but those born to this hegemony, lacking the ability to question, parse, examine, the inbreeds can only attack.

I am going to say the clowns at the NRA are the ones destroying the organization. Their bad management, and monetary corruption, has given the enemies of gun rights the opportunity to eliminate the organization.

But you know, the graveyard is full of indispensable men. We are the NRA. When the Top Management Clowns of the NRA retire to their pedophile islands, we can start a different, new organization to represent our Gun Rights. The loss of the NRA is bad, it will hurt, but it is inevitable.

Last edited by slamfire1; 12-29-2020 at 5:12 PM..
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  #37  
Old 12-30-2020, 4:46 AM
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Oxnard_Montalvo Oxnard_Montalvo is offline
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Too many gun owners have excuses as to why they do not belong to the NRA, and then they complain that politicians and laws do not respect or protect 2A.
Not to mention idiot gun owners voting for any democrat.
My 'excuse' as to why I didn't renew my membership is that they continuously sent me 'send it back by x date or you'll be charged' stuff which I HATE. If they stop doing stuff like this they may be able to keep the casual member who renews their membership simply to support the organization but until they realize they are needlessly antagonizing some members simply to make a couple of bucks then I choose to be a non member...
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Old 12-30-2020, 6:26 AM
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My 'excuse' as to why I didn't renew my membership is that they continuously sent me 'send it back by x date or you'll be charged' stuff which I HATE. If they stop doing stuff like this they may be able to keep the casual member who renews their membership simply to support the organization but until they realize they are needlessly antagonizing some members simply to make a couple of bucks then I choose to be a non member...
Ok, I am a life member and opted out of all that and haven't even see anything from them, even the communications to my dog and my horse who are annual members seems pretty light.

What are you doing to fight for the 2A in lieu of NRA membership?
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  #39  
Old 12-30-2020, 6:35 AM
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Sit there and count your thirty saved dollars. Maybe you can use it to buy rabbit pellets and a bag to keep your excuses in. You won't need it for the firearms you used to own. JMO Reads like a gun forum half full of surrender monkeys.
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Old 12-30-2020, 6:56 AM
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Classic worst of two evils or bogey man argument.

Also, how is it fighting for us if they continuously try to destroy the natural exercise of the right in legislatures and the courts in order to get a "win" for greater access to a regulated privilege?

=8-|
So whats the alternative? Complaining?
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