Calguns.net  

Home My iTrader Join the NRA Donate to CGSSA Sponsors CGN Google Search
CA Semiauto Ban(AW)ID Flowchart CA Handgun Ban ID Flowchart CA Shotgun Ban ID Flowchart
Go Back   Calguns.net > SPECIALTY FORUMS > Calgunners in Service
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Mark Forums Read

Calgunners in Service This forum is a place for our active duty and deployed members to share, request and have a bit of home where ever they are.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 03-22-2021, 3:27 PM
Mustard Mustard is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 463
iTrader: 1 / 100%
Default If not aviation, then what?

Last year I joined the CA Army National Guard, under the premise i'd be an officer and branch into aviation. Generally speaking, my recruiter + chain of command at the time didn't discourage me from that idea. The path was described as "go to basic, commission as officer, get into aviation". No aviation specific testing, boards, or physicals between now and commissioning were mentioned.

Months to a year later, I'm beginning to hear from various sources (chain of command and other) that branching aviation at my age is close to impossible (cutoff is 32,i am older than that), and that i should have had tests/ boards/ physicals done.

Despite this new and discouraging perspective, i'd still like to try to get into aviation, and i'd rather be told "no" wherever the buck stops, rather than accept the word of my chain of command.

Does anyone here have experience getting into CAARNG aviation with no prior flight/ military experience, and would you be willing to share that experience with me?

Also, I'd like to open the floor to suggestions besides aviation. Give me the elevator pitch on what other branches have to offer; bonus points for job/ career options with geographic flexibility upon getting out (I.T. for example)
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 03-22-2021, 3:39 PM
Unit74 Unit74 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Georgia-Free America
Posts: 2,266
iTrader: 37 / 100%
Default

You got Rick rolled by the Man. Seriously. When I went through, I had to do all the aviation testing at MEPS up front. I suggest you use the VA benefits after you get your private if you still want to fly. The big green weenie strikes again, sucker. And the jokes on you.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 03-22-2021, 4:58 PM
Mustard Mustard is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 463
iTrader: 1 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Unit74 View Post
You got Rick rolled by the Man. Seriously. When I went through, I had to do all the aviation testing at MEPS up front. I suggest you use the VA benefits after you get your private if you still want to fly. The big green weenie strikes again, sucker. And the jokes on you.
Haha, wondered how long it would take for a reply like that to come through.

Yeah, figured on using benefits for flight school as a backup, even though i'd miss out on the experiences flying for the military
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 03-22-2021, 5:41 PM
M1NM M1NM is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: West Covina
Posts: 6,694
iTrader: 54 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mustard View Post
even though i'd miss out on the experiences flying for the military
Most of those are really bus driver jobs. Very few where the fun in in direct proportion to pounds of fuel burned.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 03-22-2021, 7:24 PM
Oceanbob's Avatar
Oceanbob Oceanbob is offline
I need a LIFE!!
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 11,688
iTrader: 154 / 100%
Default

Age is a factor but having a pilots license with lots of hours and type ratings,
CFII....first class medical certificate then you might get in. The GUB MINT
doesnít want to spend a million training you. (or more)

Plus they donít like it when you bail out of the service to take an airline job...

Bob
__________________
May the Bridges I burn light the way.

Life Is Not About Waiting For The Storm To Pass - Its About Learning To Dance In The Rain.

Fewer people are killed with all rifles each year (323 in 2011) than with shotguns (356), hammers and clubs (496), and hands and feet (728).
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 03-22-2021, 10:23 PM
Mustard Mustard is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 463
iTrader: 1 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Oceanbob View Post
Age is a factor but having a pilots license with lots of hours and type ratings,
CFII....first class medical certificate then you might get in. The GUB MINT
doesnít want to spend a million training you. (or more)

Plus they donít like it when you bail out of the service to take an airline job...

Bob
I see the logic, but I don't see how my age makes me non-flight worth. I could just as easily bail out of the service as a youngin' vs as an old man. But then again, who said the army is a logical place?

Quote:
Originally Posted by sbo80 View Post
The majority of Army aviation is rotary, and a good majority of Army flight crew are Warrant officers, not Commissioned officers. I was the wrong branch, but I've never heard of anyone "ending up" in aviation in the Guard that wasn't already on that track to start - as in had your medicals, testing, OTS scheduled ("Officer basic" is a totally different school than "regular basic"), and flight school scheduled.
Yeah, I was expecting rotary. I agree the aviation track starts somewhere, but I was led to believe that one place it starts was through what I was doing; Warrant Officer was something I was told I should get if I wanted to keep flying instead of getting promoted into a desk once I/d reached O-3.

OTS? Do you mean OCS, as in officer candidate school?

Quote:
Originally Posted by sbo80 View Post
Now there is a waiver for everything, including age, but you'd need some major pull to get one. Such as getting hired/recruited directly by an existing aviation unit that wants to sponsor you through school.
Now we're talking solutions It sounds like networking is my next best option.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 03-22-2021, 7:45 PM
sbo80's Avatar
sbo80 sbo80 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: San Diego
Posts: 1,392
iTrader: 20 / 100%
Default

The majority of Army aviation is rotary, and a good majority of Army flight crew are Warrant officers, not Commissioned officers. I was the wrong branch, but I've never heard of anyone "ending up" in aviation in the Guard that wasn't already on that track to start - as in had your medicals, testing, OTS scheduled ("Officer basic" is a totally different school than "regular basic"), and flight school scheduled. Now there is a waiver for everything, including age, but you'd need some major pull to get one. Such as getting hired/recruited directly by an existing aviation unit that wants to sponsor you through school.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 03-22-2021, 10:32 PM
Snoopy47's Avatar
Snoopy47 Snoopy47 is offline
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 3,008
iTrader: 8 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mustard View Post
The path was described as "go to basic, commission as officer, get into aviation".
Are you at least an OFFICER?

If so count your blessings.

Didn't you have a unit and Branch you were going to go into as an officer. Where did you think you were going to end up? I thought every NG and USAR officer KNOWS what unit they are going into and they are placed in a slot on the Unit Manning Report.

Now, I understand you might not know what I'm talking about, but still, there must have been a unit that was working with your recruiter to get you to OCS. What kind of unit was that? Was it at least an Aviation unit?

************

That all said I'll presume you are a 2LT now and have not gone to BOLC yet. If you did go to BOLC then that's that, that's your branch until you make CPT.

So if you are a 2LT in a unit they have you sitting in a slot, what branch is that slot? I think you have a hard road ahead trying to get into another branch that is outside of your unit. They will be annoyed enough you want to move from your slot before BOLC, but if at least the branch slot you want to go to belongs to your higher commander at least you won't fall off his roster.

*************

Now, what I have observed (in the reserves anyway) is there is no preferred Branch or MOS. The OPTEMPO of you unit is what's going to drive your insanity. There is also a danger of being placed into a position of visibility that carries a lot of operational planning, mission execution and no support to get it done correctly. You'll spend all your time hoping the house of cards doesn't collapse on your watch.

I'm spending my career focus trying to avoid getting crushed while at the same time navigating into positions that are cake, but on paper look good and follow career progression and promotion. However, that carries risk as well because command teams change. The army pulls individuals for mobilizations and you can still find yourself down range completely out of your depth and no where to run.

***********

So if you find yourself in a boring position, but still able to knock out your professional military education required for promotion, able to pass ACFT, and get regular meets the mark evaluations count your blessings.

The only places that are easy to transfer into are usually the ones desperate for company level leadership and have a high OPTEMPO. There you will get chewed up and spit out until the next starry eyed LT rolls out of OCS/BOLC.
__________________
Before there was Polymer there was Accuracy.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 03-22-2021, 10:58 PM
Milsurp1's Avatar
Milsurp1 Milsurp1 is offline
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Location: Not in California
Posts: 2,809
iTrader: 30 / 100%
Default

Are you already commissioned? What slot are you in currently?
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 03-23-2021, 10:45 AM
Mustard Mustard is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 463
iTrader: 1 / 100%
Default

Not currently an officer. Currently in OCS.

I did not/do not have a unit with the NG besides the unit I drilled with twice before I went to basic, and my current OCS class.

Networking: I have one POC I've known for years who's in the NG. Not aviation, but at least I can trust him and his experience. Also there's another officer candidate who is doing the aviation route (successfully), so I can talk to him.

As far as bringing things to the table, I have engineering degrees, and I'm not a PT train wreck like it seems so many others are, and fairly flexible in terms of time commitments.

Honestly, my impression is that there's been very little interaction with me regarding career progression (i.e. scheduling boards, physicals, other foundational stuff) besides 1) go to MEPS 2) go to basic 3) go to OCS. Hand wavy optimism is mostly what I get, and since I don't know the process I trust people who are supposed to (recruiter). I learned the concept of AIT on my own, and only recently have I even heard the term BOLC.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 03-23-2021, 6:35 PM
Snoopy47's Avatar
Snoopy47 Snoopy47 is offline
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 3,008
iTrader: 8 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mustard View Post
Hand wavy optimism is mostly what I get, and since I don't know the process I trust people who are supposed to (recruiter). I learned the concept of AIT on my own, and only recently have I even heard the term BOLC.
Holy Christ.................

OK, I'm USAR and can't say I know NG, but I suspect you are on someone's personnel roster.

If you fail out of OCS someone is going to have to account for that. Who is that commander that cares if you pass OCS or not?

If you drilled with a unit previously, and you got PAID while with that unit, and you SIGNED an attendance roster that had a printed space with a line next to your name to sign you didn't hand jam your name THEN YOU ARE ON THEIR BOOKS that is your unit.

You need to find a NG officer mentor. I'm not that guy because I'm USAR.

ASAP

I'm am guessing once an NG officer gets out of OCS and returns to his unit, that unit will be in a rush to send said 2LT off to BOLC ASAP. Otherwise, a 2LT that goes more than 1.5 years without BOLC misses the 1LT promotion time line, and at 2 years without BOLC they can be kicked out (USAR anyway, maybe the CANG is more lax).

What I'm getting at is I highly doubt you are going to find an aviation path before that deadline for BOLC comes up.

Without BOLC you cannot be deployed. You have no branch or any professional qualifications to call yourself a qualified leader. Yea, you have rank, but you are non deployable without BOLC, and no one is going to waive that. They will kick you out first.

*******
Finally............ if you truly don't have a Branch and slot currently, then you better hustle to find one. I'm betting once you get out of OCS and to a unit it's going to be picked for you.

Commanders are not going to wait for you to float around without completing BOLC.
__________________
Before there was Polymer there was Accuracy.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 03-23-2021, 6:46 PM
Snoopy47's Avatar
Snoopy47 Snoopy47 is offline
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 3,008
iTrader: 8 / 100%
Default

This is a complete failing of your unit.

I must remember to not push this kind of stuff back on the "new guy".

I am the sponsor for a brand new college grad 2LT from ROTC, and he doesn't even have a military ID CAC, nor a military e-mail. So I'm constantly trying to be ahead of this guy's needs because he doesn't know what he needs.

Last thing I want is him showing up to BOLC (oh crap, he doesn't even have a Government Travel Card and he cant get a flight to BOLC without one, so it's just another thing that he needs) without uniforms, without CAC ID and without a Military E-mail.
__________________
Before there was Polymer there was Accuracy.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 03-23-2021, 7:17 PM
kwest10 kwest10 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 577
iTrader: 41 / 100%
Default

Like Unit74 said in so many words...
Get your private pilot lic on VA benies. Get some flight hours and look into CBP AMO (Air Marine Ops). Running surveillance or interdictions all day
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 03-23-2021, 9:04 PM
Mustard Mustard is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 463
iTrader: 1 / 100%
Default

Snoopy47, PM sent.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kwest10 View Post
Like Unit74 said in so many words...
Get your private pilot lic on VA benies. Get some flight hours and look into CBP AMO (Air Marine Ops). Running surveillance or interdictions all day
I can dig it.

In the mean time, I wonder if I should drop out of OCS because why put myself through all the hassle if I don't get my career of choice, or let it play and see where it takes me but take comfort that I'm only in for 5 more years + 2 IRR. I do see some valuable experiences, learning opportunities, and personal development by finishing OCS, but I'm running out of f---s to give about that kind of stuff. I was looking up MOS's yesterday and saw 12D Diver, which sounds cool because I scuba dive, but then I saw some random review by another 12D say "I picked it because I heard it was hard" and without giving it anymore serious thought I was like "nope".
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 03-24-2021, 10:25 AM
Snoopy47's Avatar
Snoopy47 Snoopy47 is offline
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 3,008
iTrader: 8 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mustard View Post
I wonder if I should drop out of OCS......
Don't to that, just don't.

You'll trap yourself. Right now it sounds like you have room to pick from a short list and be an officer. So everything below CW5 is not your problem. If you bail, you will at best be a SPC and everything above SGT will crap on you, especially as a OCS drop out.

You have already locked in a commitment to the NG, if you bail out of OCS then they are not going to be happy, and they are not going to open a path for you to take your time and pick a job that seems to be your liking.

Ironically (and please guys chime in if you disagree), your MOS/BRANCH in the NG/USAR is not going to be what makes or breaks you. You can have the coolest MOS in the world but your unit, mission, and constant rotation for orders can suck balls to the end of the world.

You could be in the lamest of all MOS/Branches and coast all the way up the food chain on easy street.

I sent you a PM.

In general, it sounds like you were sold a bill of goods, and luckily you can deal with the BS of the NG as an officer. All you are going to do by trying to back out of your path now is end up having to deal with the BS as an E4.
__________________
Before there was Polymer there was Accuracy.
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 03-24-2021, 9:23 PM
sbo80's Avatar
sbo80 sbo80 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: San Diego
Posts: 1,392
iTrader: 20 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Snoopy47 View Post
your MOS/BRANCH in the NG/USAR is not going to be what makes or breaks you. You can have the coolest MOS in the world but your unit, mission, and constant rotation for orders can suck balls to the end of the world.
this times 10 million percent. Even fighter pilots are constantly undermanned because not enough stay around. And it's not cause they go to the airlines, that's actually much less common than you'd think.
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 03-25-2021, 5:02 AM
Oxnard_Montalvo Oxnard_Montalvo is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: NorCal
Posts: 898
iTrader: 1 / 100%
Default

When you say 'do something cool' I think you misunderstand the basic function of an officer vs most [E1- E6] enlisted personnel. The enlisted guys and girls are the 'hands on' people, the people who 'tote that barge and lift that bale', the people who actually operate all of the various 'toys' that the military procures. Officers [for the most part] are the managers and planners, the 'behind the scenes' guys and girls who make sure that the unit [no matter what the size] is ready to accomplish whatever mission the unit is assigned. Rarely are they the 'hands on' people who operate the 'toys' that the military has. The obvious exception to this is military aviation where officers operate the aircraft. Sure, I've seen a few officers who would come over and run a bulldozer or an apc for a little while but they were pretty rare. Yes, there are units where officers do whatever the enlisted guys do [Special Forces is a good example] so if you want to do 'something cool' pick wisely because if you don't it will 'suck balls till the end of the world' as Snoopy47 so eloquently put it...
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 03-25-2021, 10:45 AM
Mustard Mustard is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 463
iTrader: 1 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by sbo80 View Post
this times 10 million percent. Even fighter pilots are constantly undermanned because not enough stay around. And it's not cause they go to the airlines, that's actually much less common than you'd think.
Not going to airlines? Leaving for the airlines is the line I've been fed, and read about in the news when people talk pilot shortages. Where do the pilots go, if not a cushy and lucrative airline job?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Oxnard_Montalvo View Post
When you say 'do something cool' I think you misunderstand the basic function of an officer vs most [E1- E6] enlisted personnel. The enlisted guys and girls are the 'hands on' people, the people who 'tote that barge and lift that bale', the people who actually operate all of the various 'toys' that the military procures. Officers [for the most part] are the managers and planners, the 'behind the scenes' guys and girls who make sure that the unit [no matter what the size] is ready to accomplish whatever mission the unit is assigned. Rarely are they the 'hands on' people who operate the 'toys' that the military has. The obvious exception to this is military aviation where officers operate the aircraft.
"Something cool" to me means I am physically operating cool piece of equipment (e.g. helicopter, armor, and to a lesser degree artillery/mortars. That's in order of decreasing coolness; I'm open to someone changing my mind). That's why I wanted to go aviation. I admit I don't have the depth of experience to know which MOS's allow O-1's to get hands on.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wildcat19 View Post
Get your commercial tickets and then fly transport in Asia/Indonesia to build time. The DoD is fast becoming social justice warriors. I'd punch out of the Armed Services (unless you are within reach of retirement - Maybe stay). The majority of Air Warriors I know retire and don't go to the airlines. Flying in the military isn't as glamorous as you may think.
Meaning I would pursue a commercial pilot's license on my own (GI bill), and fly cargo planes full of rubber dog **** out of Hong Kong?

In my civilian job, I mostly work project management. Maybe 1-2 days out of the month do I get to put my hands on and operate equipment. I also work with electronics technicians who solder stuff, make boards and cables, build equipment enclosures, and their job looks way more fun than mine does. I was hoping I could find some semblance of that balance of coolness and responsibility as a butter bar, and we'd see where it took me by the time my contract was up. I hope that helps provide some insight to my intentions.

Thank you all for your points of view. Keep it coming
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 03-27-2021, 11:26 PM
Endless Endless is offline
Banned
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: United States Of America
Posts: 1,899
iTrader: 73 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Snoopy47 View Post
Don't to that, just don't.

You'll trap yourself. Right now it sounds like you have room to pick from a short list and be an officer. So everything below CW5 is not your problem. If you bail, you will at best be a SPC and everything above SGT will crap on you, especially as a OCS drop out.

You have already locked in a commitment to the NG, if you bail out of OCS then they are not going to be happy, and they are not going to open a path for you to take your time and pick a job that seems to be your liking.

Ironically (and please guys chime in if you disagree), your MOS/BRANCH in the NG/USAR is not going to be what makes or breaks you. You can have the coolest MOS in the world but your unit, mission, and constant rotation for orders can suck balls to the end of the world.

You could be in the lamest of all MOS/Branches and coast all the way up the food chain on easy street.

I sent you a PM.

In general, it sounds like you were sold a bill of goods, and luckily you can deal with the BS of the NG as an officer. All you are going to do by trying to back out of your path now is end up having to deal with the BS as an E4.

He can absolutely voluntarily disenroll from OCS. We had a lot of folks do that over the years and it happens. Things come up, folks were lied to or folks just couldn’t take it.

We even had a female disenroll and she lateraled over to Marine Corp OCS and made it through. She became an officer but she dropped out of our service and we didn’t make fun of her. She made a mistake. It happens. She’s retired now and a friend of mine. We served together 20+ years ago. Good people.

But I am talking about full active duty careers, not reserve or California Guard units.

I agree with you snoopy. Seems like this guy is slipping through the cracks.

And anyone is delusional if you think an E6-E9 with entitlements makes nothing. Or CWO2-CWO4 at 30 years. You’re sorely mistaken. Again, this is for full active duty. No reserves.

Last edited by Endless; 03-27-2021 at 11:29 PM..
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 03-24-2021, 1:29 PM
Mustard Mustard is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 463
iTrader: 1 / 100%
Default

Don't quit OCS b/c I'll end up screwing myself worse... yeah I can see that. But I definitely need to have a suitable "why am I here" waiting for me on the other side. In general my requirements are:

-serve country/community/challenge myself
-do something cool
-open up the possibility of second career (outside of engineering) in a growth market, or even a trade
-hopefully not wear out my body while doing it. Being "in" in your late 30s is hell on the joints

Aviation seemed like a cool play to make. Something like IT or cyber warfare sounds like another option. Hell, even carpentry/plumbing would fit the bill, even though there's less glamour in it than being a helo-driver.
Reply With Quote
  #21  
Old 03-25-2021, 10:28 AM
Snoopy47's Avatar
Snoopy47 Snoopy47 is offline
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 3,008
iTrader: 8 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mustard View Post
In general my requirements are:

-serve country/community/challenge myself
-do something cool
-open up the possibility of second career (outside of engineering) in a growth market, or even a trade
-hopefully not wear out my body while doing it. Being "in" in your late 30s is hell on the joints

Aviation seemed like a cool play to make. Something like IT or cyber warfare sounds like another option. Hell, even carpentry/plumbing would fit the bill, even though there's less glamour in it than being a helo-driver.

I think we all got sucked into the Duty to County and the Uniform bling. The reality is we are basically like the DMV but with guns.

Second Career: I had hoped for that. I even got a TS/SCI clearance when I entered as an Intel Analyst. That never opened up. Because well, of the entire intel community of the CIA, DIA, FBI, etc, the military is at the bottom of the food chain and the CIA is taping Harvard grads, not Army idiots that are E4's.

Wearing out the body. Always keep that in the back of your head. I went through basic training at 39. I didn't have an officer path in front of me at the time. The best chance to not jack up your body will be as an officer.

***********
After 2 years I finally could be in a position to kiss the right *****es and start the Direct Commission path. Being an Intel Analyst at the time I thought I would be a Military Intelligence Officer. Sounds Cool right?

Soooo, I didn't get selected and I ended up wasting an entire year.

I had to try again the following year. See, there were only 12 military intel officer vacancies at the time. Those slots go to those coming off active duty, ROTC, or folks that get picked up for OCS. Then at the end of that, Direct Commission positions might get them. That vacancy has to be OPEN the entire 12 months during the application process.

I didn't know that my first attempt. By the second time I applied I picked my branch based on the number of Vacancies. There were TWO HUNDRED Jr Officer vacancies for Logistics in California alone. I knew for a FACT the USAR was NEVER EVER going to fill all of those.

Poof I got it, and here I am finally as a Quartermaster CPT in Logistics, and I-R-O-N-I-C-A-L-L-Y the ORIGINAL PATHWAY I walked into my recruiter with.

**************
But once I signed that contract as an E4 Intel Analyst, stepped off the bus at Basic Training I was hit with a reality of WHAT THE HELL HAVE I GOT MYSELF INTO.

Then I had a period of time of thinking well at least I have a TS/SCI clearance and all the cool jobs I'm going to get when I finish training and get back to my USAR unit.

That never happened. The USAR in those early years derailed more job opportunities then I can count.

Then I get deployed. I find myself as an extra intel analyst no one asked for and get bounced around to a SF team as an additional analyst outside the wire. I find myself pulling guard duty and about crap my pants when a Technical Truck with a 50 cal in the back stops at our gate and two guys in black ski masks dismount with RPG's.

WTF MAN!!!!!!!!!!!! I'm an Intel Analyst with an entire SF team sleeping soundly and I'M THE IDIOT THAT'S GOING TO DO FIRST CONTACT??????

Anyway............. nothing happened (turned out they were AFG military, but those are the guys you never know if they will turn on you).

But every damn morning I had the watch the mosques would fire up the PA's with their morning chants and I would wonder how the F did I end up here in this watch tower with a 249.

*********
Where am I going with this............

The times you are in the weakest position with your military service are the times you just start something new. For me, that was when I was a new Intel Analyst, and the clock started all over again when I became a 2LT.

Next week is my 10th year. Nearly TEN YEARS ago to the day you can find a CalGuns post of mine all starry eyed like the OP with frustrations and hopes.

I'm in the strongest position I have ever been since I joined, and probably ever will be. Come May I could go into the IRR since I will have finally reached 6 years as an officer. Then spend 2 more not drilling and just basically turn my back to it all.

This summer however, I will have completed the Captains Career Course, basically green lighting me for Major. I will be the kind of CPT the USAR wants, one that is filly trained in all aspects of his career level and with no flags for weight or PT.

But I'm also in a position to just TURN MY BACK AND WALK AWAY without having to make my case or plead to a higher authority to release me.

I literally am scared to death of being the rank of MAJ. I'm not scared of MAJs. I'm scare of being one.

I don't indent to walk away from this, and I hope to position myself in my career without stepping on another landmine. But it took 10 years to get there, and while I "think" I might want to go back into Intel, and while I could play that card given the reason above, it could start the clock over again at least another 2 years.

So I have to think about the next move, and the exit door I move to the right if I try and change course.
__________________
Before there was Polymer there was Accuracy.
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 03-25-2021, 10:54 AM
Mustard Mustard is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 463
iTrader: 1 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Snoopy47 View Post
His problem is he's in OCS now, and in weeks will be a 2LT without a Branch or specialization. Until then, he's not deployable. So there's going to be push from all directions from those with other agendas to get that 2LT Branch Qualified and out the door.
Quite a bit more than , actually. More like over a year. Sorry if I gave you that impression. Still, I'd like to have a path forward nailed down before next drill, even if it's just mental gymnastics to convince myself that my dream MOS is still out there.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Snoopy47 View Post
Where am I going with this............

The times you are in the weakest position with your military service are the times you just start something new. For me, that was when I was a new Intel Analyst, and the clock started all over again when I became a 2LT.

Next week is my 10th year. Nearly TEN YEARS ago to the day you can find a CalGuns post of mine all starry eyed like the OP with frustrations and hopes.

I'm in the strongest position I have ever been since I joined, and probably ever will be. Come May I could go into the IRR since I will have finally reached 6 years as an officer. Then spend 2 more not drilling and just basically turn my back to it all.

This summer however, I will have completed the Captains Career Course, basically green lighting me for Major. I will be the kind of CPT the USAR wants, one that is filly trained in all aspects of his career level and with no flags for weight or PT.

But I'm also in a position to just TURN MY BACK AND WALK AWAY without having to make my case or plead to a higher authority to release me.

I literally am scared to death of being the rank of MAJ. I'm not scared of MAJs. I'm scare of being one.

I don't indent to walk away from this, and I hope to position myself in my career without stepping on another landmine. But it took 10 years to get there, and while I "think" I might want to go back into Intel, and while I could play that card given the reason above, it could start the clock over again at least another 2 years.

So I have to think about the next move, and the exit door I move to the right if I try and change course.
Are you me in 6-10 years?
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 03-25-2021, 6:23 PM
Snoopy47's Avatar
Snoopy47 Snoopy47 is offline
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 3,008
iTrader: 8 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mustard View Post
Are you me in 6-10 years?
No, you are me in 6-10 years.

However, you hilariously might still be a LT because the NG only promotes when there are slots to promote into, and from what I hear people fat and happy just stay put.

In the USAR, you either promote (officers at least) or you are out. Officers that don't have any enlisted service time basically need to make it to LTC or they don't make it to the 20 year retirement horizon.

There is a guy in my unit that jumped from the NG into the USAR. He is NINE YEARS!!!!!!!!!! time in grade as a LT, but he'll finally make CPT now.

I made CPT in 5.5 years after I commissioned in the USAR.
__________________
Before there was Polymer there was Accuracy.

Last edited by Snoopy47; 03-25-2021 at 6:30 PM..
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 03-25-2021, 6:35 PM
Snoopy47's Avatar
Snoopy47 Snoopy47 is offline
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 3,008
iTrader: 8 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mustard View Post
More like over a year. Sorry if I gave you that impression.
I thought OCS was 12 weeks, and Basic was 9. Where does a "year" come into play? If you add BOLC at around 16 weeks then your still around 40 give or take a few weeks between classes.

I thought the process was 9 weeks Basic, then 12 weeks OCS right after that. Then you are sent home to your unit, and they look for a BOLC school for you (this is where you want to pick your branch if you can).
__________________
Before there was Polymer there was Accuracy.
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 03-25-2021, 6:59 PM
Mustard Mustard is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 463
iTrader: 1 / 100%
Default

@Snoopy47
PM sent
Reply With Quote
  #26  
Old 03-26-2021, 12:44 AM
Lonestargrizzly's Avatar
Lonestargrizzly Lonestargrizzly is offline
CGN/CGSSA Contributor
CGN Contributor
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Posts: 6,207
iTrader: 20 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Snoopy47 View Post
I think we all got sucked into the Duty to County and the Uniform bling. The reality is we are basically like the DMV but with guns.

Second Career: I had hoped for that. I even got a TS/SCI clearance when I entered as an Intel Analyst. That never opened up. Because well, of the entire intel community of the CIA, DIA, FBI, etc, the military is at the bottom of the food chain and the CIA is taping Harvard grads, not Army idiots that are E4's.

Wearing out the body. Always keep that in the back of your head. I went through basic training at 39. I didn't have an officer path in front of me at the time. The best chance to not jack up your body will be as an officer.

***********
After 2 years I finally could be in a position to kiss the right *****es and start the Direct Commission path. Being an Intel Analyst at the time I thought I would be a Military Intelligence Officer. Sounds Cool right?

Soooo, I didn't get selected and I ended up wasting an entire year.

I had to try again the following year. See, there were only 12 military intel officer vacancies at the time. Those slots go to those coming off active duty, ROTC, or folks that get picked up for OCS. Then at the end of that, Direct Commission positions might get them. That vacancy has to be OPEN the entire 12 months during the application process.

I didn't know that my first attempt. By the second time I applied I picked my branch based on the number of Vacancies. There were TWO HUNDRED Jr Officer vacancies for Logistics in California alone. I knew for a FACT the USAR was NEVER EVER going to fill all of those.

Poof I got it, and here I am finally as a Quartermaster CPT in Logistics, and I-R-O-N-I-C-A-L-L-Y the ORIGINAL PATHWAY I walked into my recruiter with.

**************
But once I signed that contract as an E4 Intel Analyst, stepped off the bus at Basic Training I was hit with a reality of WHAT THE HELL HAVE I GOT MYSELF INTO.

Then I had a period of time of thinking well at least I have a TS/SCI clearance and all the cool jobs I'm going to get when I finish training and get back to my USAR unit.

That never happened. The USAR in those early years derailed more job opportunities then I can count.

Then I get deployed. I find myself as an extra intel analyst no one asked for and get bounced around to a SF team as an additional analyst outside the wire. I find myself pulling guard duty and about crap my pants when a Technical Truck with a 50 cal in the back stops at our gate and two guys in black ski masks dismount with RPG's.

WTF MAN!!!!!!!!!!!! I'm an Intel Analyst with an entire SF team sleeping soundly and I'M THE IDIOT THAT'S GOING TO DO FIRST CONTACT??????

Anyway............. nothing happened (turned out they were AFG military, but those are the guys you never know if they will turn on you).

But every damn morning I had the watch the mosques would fire up the PA's with their morning chants and I would wonder how the F did I end up here in this watch tower with a 249.

*********
Where am I going with this............

The times you are in the weakest position with your military service are the times you just start something new. For me, that was when I was a new Intel Analyst, and the clock started all over again when I became a 2LT.

Next week is my 10th year. Nearly TEN YEARS ago to the day you can find a CalGuns post of mine all starry eyed like the OP with frustrations and hopes.

I'm in the strongest position I have ever been since I joined, and probably ever will be. Come May I could go into the IRR since I will have finally reached 6 years as an officer. Then spend 2 more not drilling and just basically turn my back to it all.

This summer however, I will have completed the Captains Career Course, basically green lighting me for Major. I will be the kind of CPT the USAR wants, one that is filly trained in all aspects of his career level and with no flags for weight or PT.

But I'm also in a position to just TURN MY BACK AND WALK AWAY without having to make my case or plead to a higher authority to release me.

I literally am scared to death of being the rank of MAJ. I'm not scared of MAJs. I'm scare of being one.

I don't indent to walk away from this, and I hope to position myself in my career without stepping on another landmine. But it took 10 years to get there, and while I "think" I might want to go back into Intel, and while I could play that card given the reason above, it could start the clock over again at least another 2 years.

So I have to think about the next move, and the exit door I move to the right if I try and change course.
With one year in my advice to OP is: just finish OCS.

My advice to Sir Snoopy: just make Major. You obviously arenít a failure or a dirtbag or unqualified. If you are confident that you can serve your troops, doesnít it worry you that by going IRR, the troops that you could serve may not get the level of service that you can provide? I mean you were a company commander as a 1LT, now youíre a Captain, Id imagine that youre still at Company level. You know how many lives you effect, and Im sure that youíve effected them positively. Imagine being able to effect more lives in a positive way?

Sent from a PFC that hopes to OCS some day.
Reply With Quote
  #27  
Old 03-26-2021, 10:09 PM
Snoopy47's Avatar
Snoopy47 Snoopy47 is offline
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 3,008
iTrader: 8 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lonestargrizzly View Post
Sent from a PFC that hopes to OCS some day.
I encourage everyone to reach for OCS or whatever they want to milk out of the USAR. I'm here to help anyone use the system within the rules of the game.

What I've found out is the system will milk everything from you and never intend to give anything back that isn't enforced by the system (regulations) in place.
__________________
Before there was Polymer there was Accuracy.
Reply With Quote
  #28  
Old 03-26-2021, 10:12 PM
Lonestargrizzly's Avatar
Lonestargrizzly Lonestargrizzly is offline
CGN/CGSSA Contributor
CGN Contributor
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Posts: 6,207
iTrader: 20 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Snoopy47 View Post
I encourage everyone to reach for OCS or whatever they want to milk out of the USAR. I'm here to help anyone use the system within the rules of the game.

What I've found out is the system will milk everything from you and never intend to give anything back that isn't enforced by the system (regulations) in place.
I see a bunch of my unit members (E4ís) hating every day that they spend in uniform and doing nothing but complaining about how much they hate being in the Army. But if you ask them, theyre not actually taking advantage of tuition assistance or the GI bill and trying to move themselves to a better position in the organization or in their personal life.
I dont wanna be like that.
Reply With Quote
  #29  
Old 03-24-2021, 7:14 PM
SnWnMe's Avatar
SnWnMe SnWnMe is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: The 951
Posts: 6,836
iTrader: 10 / 100%
Default

What about aviation maintenance?
__________________
Frank Da Tank
Reply With Quote
  #30  
Old 03-24-2021, 7:27 PM
CaliforniaCowboy's Avatar
CaliforniaCowboy CaliforniaCowboy is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 1,383
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

The recruiter will promise you the moon. Then when pressed they will tell you you can "work your way up to it".

I remember back in the day I was talking to the army guys and I had already been doing private pilot training on my own and would have had my license by the time I signed up. I wanted to get into the flight program for helicopters. They told me as long as I passed tests and such it would not be a problem enlisting straight in as a warrant officer and getting trained to fly. I think the cut-off age was (to the best of my memory) 28. But of course, there are always waivers you can try to apply for to get past the age limits.

Unfortunately, this was just after I first injured my back and thought it had healed itself up, I had a relapse and had to give up that idea, No way I would have made it through boot camp having to run and climb and jump, even though I was in amazing physical shape just months earlier. So that never happened. That was just after 9/11 when I was trying to join up and I was just shy of that age cutoff.

I would keep probing and try to find the right guy to contact to get you in. I do not know how it works in the National Guard, isn't there some way you can just fill out an application for the flight program? Hell even if you can not get straight in maybe you could get on a flight crew (Non-Pilot) then make some connections with people there to help get you moved up to some flight training.
__________________
https://thedeplorablepatriot.com/

America is not a melting pot, it is a salad bowl.

"If you are the smartest guy in the room, find some other room to hang out in."

Last edited by CaliforniaCowboy; 03-24-2021 at 7:30 PM..
Reply With Quote
  #31  
Old 03-25-2021, 9:42 AM
Snoopy47's Avatar
Snoopy47 Snoopy47 is offline
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 3,008
iTrader: 8 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by CaliforniaCowboy View Post
I do not know how it works in the National Guard, isn't there some way you can just fill out an application for the flight program?
His problem is he's in OCS now, and in weeks will be a 2LT without a Branch or specialization. Until then, he's not deployable. So there's going to be push from all directions from those with other agendas to get that 2LT Branch Qualified and out the door.
__________________
Before there was Polymer there was Accuracy.
Reply With Quote
  #32  
Old 03-25-2021, 7:38 AM
Wildcat19 Wildcat19 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2019
Posts: 324
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Get your commercial tickets and then fly transport in Asia/Indonesia to build time. The DoD is fast becoming social justice warriors. I'd punch out of the Armed Services (unless you are within reach of retirement - Maybe stay). The majority of Air Warriors I know retire and don't go to the airlines. Flying in the military isn't as glamorous as you may think.
__________________
Member NRA, CRPA, GOA.
Reply With Quote
  #33  
Old 03-27-2021, 4:27 PM
flyusarmy flyusarmy is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: San Diego
Posts: 5
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

If you want aviation - don't give up on the idea at this point if you still have a year of OCS to work on it.

I would start with making some contacts with possible units who would take you. I believe your geographical choices are Los Alamitos, Fresno, Stockton, or Sacramento. Go in-person to a unit during a drill weekend and meet some pilots and the commander and do some politicking for a position in the unit.

And they will have the best gouge as to the probability of an age waiver. I do personally know of a person who received one, but it wasn't recently. Also, I'd recommend you complete the administrative requirements of completing a Class I flight physical and taking the AFAST to show you will be qualified.

As an aside - I'd recommend perhaps taking a civilian introductory flight lesson. In an airplane is probably fine to get the idea of it at a much cheaper cost than in a helicopter. But if you have not had any exposure to being a pilot - I think take one lesson to see if you think you are going to like and want it before you expend too much time and effort on getting there in the Army.

Good luck

Last edited by flyusarmy; 03-27-2021 at 8:20 PM..
Reply With Quote
  #34  
Old 04-05-2021, 4:26 AM
CrazyCobraManTim's Avatar
CrazyCobraManTim CrazyCobraManTim is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: The Lone Star State
Posts: 775
iTrader: 35 / 100%
Default

Mustard - are you at SLO, Benning or SD for accelerated OCS?

And no - don't ring that bell unless something in your life requires it. Get your bars. Rolling back to enlisted isn't a death kiss, but a percentage of SNCO's and officers may privately look at a DOR as mission failure.

I liked the suggestion of going Army Maintenance Officer - while simultaneously pursuing your VA benefits for a pilot's license (even if it is initially for fixed wing - not a lot of those in the USA / CAARNG).

I have a master aviator I can ping for more S2. He occasionally runs the field at Los Al. Perhaps Chief Murph knows a trick or two with 50+ years in uniform for the USA, USAR and CAARNG (yup - that's a Vietnam to Iraq timeline before medical sidelined him). This guy has more years in uniform on God's green earth than I do simply on this earth (and I'm passed the 1/2 century mark).
Reply With Quote
  #35  
Old 04-09-2021, 3:49 PM
RANDO's Avatar
RANDO RANDO is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: 000000
Posts: 2,480
iTrader: 39 / 100%
Default

Go into the coast guard make e-5 then go into the armyís helicopter pilot program. A little over 10 years ago there was a program just for that
Reply With Quote
  #36  
Old 04-21-2021, 11:19 AM
riserdive riserdive is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 27
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Just for clarification.. GI Bill is fractionally available for people with partial Active Duty Time. Traditional Guard/Reserve.

The 100% GI Bill benefit requires 36 month cumulative (not continuous) Federal service. 90 Aggregate days still qualifies for a 40% benefit.

ADOS-CO, ADOS-RC, ADT, ADTS Counts. AT and IDT do not. State Active Duty (ESAD) and ADSW do not count (pretty sure ESAD or Title 32 counter drug stuff doesn't count towards retirement either, but that's another discussion). With deployments being very scare, it could easily take someone 15-20 years to reach the 36 months Active Federal Service mark (if ever).
Reply With Quote
  #37  
Old 06-25-2021, 6:00 PM
Che762x39's Avatar
Che762x39 Che762x39 is offline
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 3,794
iTrader: 1 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mustard View Post
Last year I joined the CA Army National Guard, under the premise i'd be an officer and branch into aviation.
When I was in the CA Army Guard the recruiter was upfront and said no way for Aviation, Infantry, Armor or Artillery. I was offered Logistics but I passed on that
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



All times are GMT -8. The time now is 6:49 AM.




Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Proudly hosted by GeoVario the Premier 2A host.
Calguns.net, the 'Calguns' name and all associated variants and logos are ® Trademark and © Copyright 2002-2021, Calguns.net an Incorporated Company All Rights Reserved.
All opinions, statements and remarks made by Calguns.net on this web site and elsewhere are solely attributable to Calguns.net.



Seams2SewBySusy

Tactical Pants Tactical Boots Military Boots 5.11 Tactical