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  #2841  
Old 02-04-2019, 8:52 PM
Throwawayifyoureugly Throwawayifyoureugly is offline
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[QUOTE=ar15barrels;22623576]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cmagic07 View Post

If your self built handgun was built before 2014, it needed to FIRST be built as a compliant single shot and could then be converted to a semi-auto before the 2014 change of regulations.
Which was 12/31/2014, correct?

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  #2842  
Old 02-04-2019, 10:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ar15barrels View Post
AR's and AK's were not "initially designed as a semi-auto pistol".
That's why they can be built as a single shot pistol.
The wording definetly causes a problem for all the glock and sig handgun builders though.

The wording "initially designed as a semiautomatic pistol" was to stop all the shops from selling off-roster semi-auto handguns by simply converting them to single shot DURING DROS with a drop-in sub-caliber barrel liner.
If you start out with an 80% receiver and put a single shot upper on it it was originally manufactured as single shot.

They made it so you couldn’t go from a semi auto to a single shot.
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  #2843  
Old 02-04-2019, 10:09 PM
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I checked today and have the featureless rifle showing as “Firearm recorded.”

Still waiting on the pistol receivers to go through. All were completed on the same day.
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  #2844  
Old 02-04-2019, 11:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Throwawayifyoureugly View Post
Which was 12/31/2014, correct?
I don't remember the exact date off the top of my head.
Go look it up in one of the SSE threads.
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  #2845  
Old 02-04-2019, 11:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by G1500 View Post
If you start out with an 80% receiver and put a single shot upper on it it was originally manufactured as single shot.
"manufactured" and "designed" are different things.

Quote:
Originally Posted by G1500 View Post
They made it so you couldn’t go from a semi auto to a single shot.
I already said that.
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  #2846  
Old 02-05-2019, 7:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ar15barrels View Post
"manufactured" and "designed" are different things.



I already said that.
Here is the actual text:
Quote:
THE PEOPLE OF THE STATE OF CALIFORNIA DO ENACT AS FOLLOWS:

SECTION 1. Section 32100 of the Penal Code is amended to read:
32100. (a) Article 4 (commencing with Section 31900) and Article 5 (commencing with Section 32000) shall not apply to a single-action revolver that has at least a five-cartridge capacity with a barrel length of not less than three inches, and meets any of the following specifications:

(1) Was originally manufactured prior to 1900 and is a curio or relic, as defined in Section 478.11 of Title 27 of the Code of Federal Regulations.

(2) Has an overall length measured parallel to the barrel of at least seven and one-half inches when the handle, frame or receiver, and barrel are assembled.

(3) Has an overall length measured parallel to the barrel of at least seven and one-half inches when the handle, frame or receiver, and barrel are assembled and that is currently approved for importation into the United States pursuant to the provisions of paragraph (3) of subsection (d) of Section 925 of Title 18 of the United States Code.

(b) Article 4 (commencing with Section 31900) and Article 5 (commencing with Section 32000) shall not apply to a single-shot pistol with a break top or bolt action and a barrel length of not less than six inches and that has an overall length of at least 10½ inches when the handle, frame or receiver, and barrel are assembled. However, Article 4 (commencing with Section 31900) and Article 5 (commencing with Section 32000) shall apply to a semiautomatic pistol that has been temporarily or permanently altered so that it will not fire in a semiautomatic mode.
The bold section is where it changed. If you take a semiautomatic pistol and make it single shot like before, that is prohibited.

If you make a receiver/frame and put a dimensionally complaint single-shot pistol with a break top or bolt action to begin with it has not been temporarily or permanently modified, the FMBUS Originally manufactured it in exempt condition.
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  #2847  
Old 02-05-2019, 8:40 AM
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You gotta love our laws in CA.

A semiautomatic pistol that has been temporarily or permanently altered so it cannot fire in semi-automatic mode is to be treated like a semiautomatic for the purposes of some laws. But then also, a semiautomatic gun, that's had the action disassembled, is not semiautomatic for the purposes of other laws.

Making a semiautomatic pistol, and then turning into a single shot? Well, what you've done there is you've made a semi-automatic that's not semiautomatic but is treated like a semiautomatic and also not treated like a semiautomatic.

God forbid you make it semiautomatic again... Then you've made a semi-automatic that's not semiautomatic but is treated like a semiautomatic and also not treated like a semiautomatic into a semiautomatic that's treated like a semiautomatic that was made out of a gun that was both semiautomatic and not semiautomatic. Got it?

And then you sell it to your neighbor, and it becomes just "semiautomatic" from that point on.

Last edited by cockedandglocked; 02-05-2019 at 8:49 AM..
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  #2848  
Old 02-05-2019, 9:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cockedandglocked View Post
You gotta love our laws in CA.

A semiautomatic pistol that has been temporarily or permanently altered so it cannot fire in semi-automatic mode is to be treated like a semiautomatic for the purposes of some laws. But then also, a semiautomatic gun, that's had the action disassembled, is not semiautomatic for the purposes of other laws.

Making a semiautomatic pistol, and then turning into a single shot? Well, what you've done there is you've made a semi-automatic that's not semiautomatic but is treated like a semiautomatic and also not treated like a semiautomatic.

God forbid you make it semiautomatic again... Then you've made a semi-automatic that's not semiautomatic but is treated like a semiautomatic and also not treated like a semiautomatic into a semiautomatic that's treated like a semiautomatic that was made out of a gun that was both semiautomatic and not semiautomatic. Got it?

And then you sell it to your neighbor, and it becomes just "semiautomatic" from that point on.
You see, this the point where it goes fully semiautomatic...
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  #2849  
Old 02-05-2019, 12:38 PM
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I guess I will remove the remaining 20% of the handgun when I’m in Nevada next month.
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  #2850  
Old 02-06-2019, 3:22 PM
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After almost a year I finally got my approval letters. Registered 4 AR lower receivers. Application submitted March of 2018.
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  #2851  
Old 02-08-2019, 7:59 AM
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^^Unbelievable. Dear god.
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  #2852  
Old 02-08-2019, 9:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iDmac View Post
After almost a year I finally got my approval letters. Registered 4 AR lower receivers. Application submitted March of 2018.
Wow. Submitted mine (snail mail NOT CFARS) in February 2018 and had letters end of May.
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  #2853  
Old 02-08-2019, 9:53 AM
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I submitted mine last February 2018 and I just got a response asking for the same exact pictures required for RAW registration.

These are NOT RAWs but featureless builds. Is there a way around this?
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  #2854  
Old 02-08-2019, 11:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by swiftone View Post
I submitted mine last February 2018 and I just got a response asking for the same exact pictures required for RAW registration.

These are NOT RAWs but featureless builds. Is there a way around this?
Simply reply back, "Current penal codes and regulations do not require me to submit photos for these registrations."

To my knowledge, everyone who has said that has had their apps approved without issue.
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  #2855  
Old 02-08-2019, 12:00 PM
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Has anyone registered an AR pistol after July 1st using the USNA process since they require photos?
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  #2856  
Old 02-14-2019, 3:55 PM
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So a newly built p80 glock that has first been built as a bolt action (using the inlander arms bolt action and extended barrel) shouldn't have any problem with registering it? The registration was filled out as a frame only, single shot.
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  #2857  
Old 02-14-2019, 5:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cubankid View Post
So a newly built p80 glock that has first been built as a bolt action (using the inlander arms bolt action and extended barrel) shouldn't have any problem with registering it?
The registration was filled out as a frame only, single shot.
That's correct.
Keep it as a single shot and it's legal.
It's only a problem if you want it to be semi-auto.
A single shot converted to semi-auto after 2014 is an unsafe handgun.
Converting a single shot to a semi-auto after 2014 is a no-go unless you get it drop tested (3 samples) and it has a loaded chamber indicator, magazine disconnect and microstamping.
After you have all that, you can get it on the roster as a safe handgun.

Last edited by ar15barrels; 02-14-2019 at 5:17 PM..
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  #2858  
Old 02-14-2019, 9:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ar15barrels View Post
That's correct.
Keep it as a single shot and it's legal.
It's only a problem if you want it to be semi-auto.
A single shot converted to semi-auto after 2014 is an unsafe handgun.
Converting a single shot to a semi-auto after 2014 is a no-go unless you get it drop tested (3 samples) and it has a loaded chamber indicator, magazine disconnect and microstamping.
After you have all that, you can get it on the roster as a safe handgun.
And if you applied and given a number to have engraved on an AR pistol built in 2015 or 16 that you stated you built as a single shot and then later converted in the same year, should you...

A: say good bye to your dog and have the pistol ready to fork over?

B: break everything down, strip it all nice and clean and sell off the short barrel, so you can give them a pretty piece of metal with your name on it?

C: get a 16" barrel or greater and convert it to a rifle, hoping to keep your build thus voiding all the hard work and fees you went thru to get a pistol to begin with?



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  #2859  
Old 02-14-2019, 10:03 PM
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So should be good if following Quiet’s note and keeping it single shot on Ar pistol after 2018?
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  #2860  
Old 02-18-2019, 7:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Strykeback View Post
And if you applied and given a number to have engraved on an AR pistol built in 2015 or 16 that you stated you built as a single shot and then later converted in the same year, should you...

A: say good bye to your dog and have the pistol ready to fork over?

B: break everything down, strip it all nice and clean and sell off the short barrel, so you can give them a pretty piece of metal with your name on it?

C: get a 16" barrel or greater and convert it to a rifle, hoping to keep your build thus voiding all the hard work and fees you went thru to get a pistol to begin with?
I manufactured mine in 2014, but CFARS remains pending so I went w/ B: stripped down (save for bolt catch), stored outside the safe, and upper in storage - not on premises.

I thought about going with C, but if they show up for confiscation, they're still gonna take it despite conversion attempts (revert to single shot or rifle config). This is just my opinion - not confirmed.
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  #2861  
Old 02-18-2019, 11:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TriggerHappy86 View Post
I manufactured mine in 2014, but CFARS remains pending so I went w/ B: stripped down (save for bolt catch), stored outside the safe, and upper in storage - not on premises.



I thought about going with C, but if they show up for confiscation, they're still gonna take it despite conversion attempts (revert to single shot or rifle config). This is just my opinion - not confirmed.
I decided on B as well after a few others agreeing that's safest though comments of leaving the pistol buffer tube on might be a good idea so they don't try to create an option of an sbr.

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  #2862  
Old 02-25-2019, 2:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by swiftone View Post
I submitted mine last February 2018 and I just got a response asking for the same exact pictures required for RAW registration.

These are NOT RAWs but featureless builds. Is there a way around this?
Quote:
Originally Posted by cockedandglocked View Post
Simply reply back, "Current penal codes and regulations do not require me to submit photos for these registrations."

To my knowledge, everyone who has said that has had their apps approved without issue.
I did this (thank you cockedandglocked) and my letters arrived this afternoon approved.

Edit - I just checked and it was exactly 365 days from the time I submitted the request to the letters arriving. Granted I could had been more proactive last summer, but got busy and forgot about them.
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  #2863  
Old 02-26-2019, 8:13 AM
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A year??? Dear god, what a farce. DOJ is really looking out for us all, aren't they? I feel SO much safer now!!
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  #2864  
Old 03-13-2019, 6:46 PM
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can a 80% lower destined for a AR rifle be built TODAY in CA?

thanks.
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  #2865  
Old 03-13-2019, 7:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenne View Post
can a 80% lower destined for a AR rifle be built TODAY in CA?

thanks.
Yes, but you have to go through the DOJ serial process and get it engraved within a time period. It must be built featureless.
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  #2866  
Old 03-13-2019, 9:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Discogodfather View Post
Yes, but you have to go through the DOJ serial process and get it engraved within a time period. It must be built featureless.
It can also be built with a fixed magazine.

Finishing an 80% in a compliant manner is considerably more expensive than purchasing and DROSing a 100% receiver.
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  #2867  
Old 03-14-2019, 7:27 AM
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Engraved?? does this mean no polymer frames, it has to be aluminum!

thanks.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Discogodfather View Post
Yes, but you have to go through the DOJ serial process and get it engraved within a time period. It must be built featureless.
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  #2868  
Old 03-14-2019, 11:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenne View Post
Engraved?? does this mean no polymer frames, it has to be aluminum!

thanks.
Essentially yes, see here for the current requirements and process:
https://oag.ca.gov/system/files/atta...umer-alert.pdf <-PDF Download from CA DOJ
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  #2869  
Old 03-14-2019, 11:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenne View Post
Engraved?? does this mean no polymer frames, it has to be aluminum!
It could be steel or aluminum or any other engravable metal like brass, bronze or copper.
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  #2870  
Old 03-15-2019, 8:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ar15barrels View Post
It can also be built with a fixed magazine.

Finishing an 80% in a compliant manner is considerably more expensive than purchasing and DROSing a 100% receiver.
^^This.
I replaced my old 80% unserialized lower with a dros'd 100% one and converted to featureless. Painless.

There was a time when you could get finished lowers for like $40. I don't think you can get numbers stamped for that.

I'm really happy with the way mine turned out - have a couple of them.
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  #2871  
Old 03-15-2019, 9:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Browneye View Post
There was a time when you could get finished lowers for like $40.
I bought several 100% lowers in 2016 for $30 each with free shipping.

They can still be had for $35 if you wait for them to come back in stock at Classic.
Or they are in-stock for $40 at primary arms.

Last edited by ar15barrels; 03-15-2019 at 9:39 AM..
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  #2872  
Old 03-16-2019, 11:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by swiftone View Post
I submitted mine last February 2018 and I just got a response asking for the same exact pictures required for RAW registration.

These are NOT RAWs but featureless builds. Is there a way around this?
Here is my timeline and what I did:

6/29/18 Submit several FORs

12/4/18 Received requests to select caliber on ARs, confirm receiver only on all entered as receiver only, and requests for photographs on everything I submitted.

2/4/19 Confirmed receiver only where necessary and entered the following comment / reported an issue including SN & CRIS # for all photo requests: "RE: CRIS Number: _______________ Firearm serial number _______. This firearm is featureless and does not require photographs per current regulations. Please provide the memorandum authorizing your picture request or justification based on current policy. Thank You."

3/15/19 Received approval letters for everything.
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  #2873  
Old 03-17-2019, 2:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ar15barrels View Post
It can also be built with a fixed magazine.

Finishing an 80% in a compliant manner is considerably more expensive than purchasing and DROSing a 100% receiver.
And no incentive now since registering is a must, featureless or not.
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  #2874  
Old 03-17-2019, 2:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ar15barrels View Post
That's correct.
Keep it as a single shot and it's legal.
It's only a problem if you want it to be semi-auto.
A single shot converted to semi-auto after 2014 is an unsafe handgun.
Converting a single shot to a semi-auto after 2014 is a no-go unless you get it drop tested (3 samples) and it has a loaded chamber indicator, magazine disconnect and microstamping.
After you have all that, you can get it on the roster as a safe handgun.
Same goes for a 1911 build? Seen a lot be built since 2014.
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  #2875  
Old 03-17-2019, 3:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DS94901 View Post
Here is my timeline and what I did:

6/29/18 Submit several FORs

12/4/18 Received requests to select caliber on ARs, confirm receiver only on all entered as receiver only, and requests for photographs on everything I submitted.

2/4/19 Confirmed receiver only where necessary and entered the following comment / reported an issue including SN & CRIS # for all photo requests: "RE: CRIS Number: _______________ Firearm serial number _______. This firearm is featureless and does not require photographs per current regulations. Please provide the memorandum authorizing your picture request or justification based on current policy. Thank You."

3/15/19 Received approval letters for everything.
Got my approval letters early March. I submitted mine late June. Got letters in November stating what’s been said before, asking for photos and stating incomplete.

I started freaking out but was too busy with work and wedding stuff to do anything. I didn’t respond and got my approvals 3 months after the ‘incomplete’ letters.
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  #2876  
Old 03-17-2019, 7:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Psychbiker View Post
Same goes for a 1911 build?
Seen a lot be built since 2014.
That's correct.
People routinely exceed speed limits and jaywalk too, but it's still illegal.
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  #2877  
Old 03-17-2019, 8:08 PM
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Default Fixed mag relaod practices

Hey guys new to this thread and clearly there is a lot here. Apologies in advance if this has been covered in some fashion - I feel like these laws and features are chaining all the time. My understanding is that fixed magazine ARs can be reloaded by partially taking down the rifle. Ive seen this put into "range" practice with extended take-down pins and modified bad levers.

My questions on the subject:

Is the partial take-down reload the accepted method?

Do all fixed mag kits allow this?

Does the fixed mag option fulfill the featureless requirement on its own?

And finally, I am not trying to get anyone to indict themselves, but is the fixed magazine installation reversible should the laws change in future?
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  #2878  
Old 03-17-2019, 8:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lavaspit View Post
Is the partial take-down reload the accepted method?
Accepted by who? Law enforcement? Legislators? Public opinion?
There is no legal decisions or official documentation say it's legal.
Laws only define what is illegal.

It's only legal based on a plain language reading of the law that's it's not illegal.
That's about as much as you will get anymore.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lavaspit View Post
Do all fixed mag kits allow this?
No.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lavaspit View Post
Does the fixed mag option fulfill the featureless requirement on its own?
Fixed magazine and featureless are methods of being legal.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lavaspit View Post
is the fixed magazine installation reversible should the laws change in future?
Most are.
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Old 03-18-2019, 2:18 PM
Lavaspit Lavaspit is offline
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Thanks AR15Barrels.

I think I meant accepted by those of us that have to deal with fixed mags and want to train, but also law enforcement in terms of is being able to drop the mag at all.
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