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Centerfire Rifles - Manually Operated Lever action, bolt action or other non gas operated centerfire rifles.

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  #1  
Old 09-09-2019, 12:14 PM
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Default Missing Handgun Calibers in Lever Action Rifles

I have a Stainless Rossi 92 in .454 Casull which I think is a powerful caliber for a handy lever action carbine. They did not make very many of these and I was lucky back in 2012 to find a new one which I purchased.

I think this would be an excellent hunting round if more models were made available in this caliber. Marlin 94, Winchester 92, one of the Henry models, etc. I am surprised that this isn't the case. An added benefit would be the ability to chamber and shoot .45 Colt.

Another handgun cartridge that I think would be excellent in a lever action would be the .357 Maximum. This was short lived cartridge in a couple of revolvers (Ruger Blackhawk for one) but it could be revived if there were lever actions chambered in it. A rifle chambered in .357 Maximum could also shoot .357 Magnum as well as .38 Special.

Just my thoughts.

Dan
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Old 09-09-2019, 12:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bergmen View Post
I have a Stainless Rossi 92 in .454 Casull which I think is a powerful caliber for a handy lever action carbine. They did not make very many of these and I was lucky back in 2012 to find a new one which I purchased.

I think this would be an excellent hunting round if more models were made available in this caliber. Marlin 94, Winchester 92, one of the Henry models, etc. I am surprised that this isn't the case. An added benefit would be the ability to chamber and shoot .45 Colt.

Another handgun cartridge that I think would be excellent in a lever action would be the .357 Maximum. This was short lived cartridge in a couple of revolvers (Ruger Blackhawk for one) but it could be revived if there were lever actions chambered in it. A rifle chambered in .357 Maximum could also shoot .357 Magnum as well as .38 Special.

Just my thoughts.

Dan
35 remington trumps 357 max and there are 35 remington lever guns.
Taking it up a couple steps, just use a 45-70 instead of a 454.
There are lots of 45-70 lever guns.
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Old 09-09-2019, 12:43 PM
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I like the .357 Magnum of my lever gun because I pair it with my GP-100 so the ammo is interchangeable.
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Old 09-09-2019, 12:49 PM
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How about a box magazine fed lever-action in 10mm Auto?
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Old 09-09-2019, 12:49 PM
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https://www.bighornarmory.com/rifles/

https://www.bighornarmory.com/produc...0a-454-casull/

Saw one of their rifles behind the glass displays outside a Cabela’s gun room.

Absolutely gorgeous! Killer wood and nicely executed metalwork.

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Old 09-09-2019, 1:01 PM
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Originally Posted by elSquid View Post
https://www.bighornarmory.com/rifles/

https://www.bighornarmory.com/produc...0a-454-casull/

Saw one of their rifles behind the glass displays outside a Cabela’s gun room.

Absolutely gorgeous! Killer wood and nicely executed metalwork.

They’re not cheap, but if you have the means...

— Michael
Giant money but they have the right idea. I neglected to mention several other handgun calibers that they are chambering their levers in (.500 S&W, 460 S&W, a couple of Linebaugh calibers, etc.).

My Rossi is a companion to my two .454 Casull revolvers so that is a component to my position.

Dan
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Old 09-09-2019, 1:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ar15barrels View Post
35 remington trumps 357 max and there are 35 remington lever guns.
Taking it up a couple steps, just use a 45-70 instead of a 454.
There are lots of 45-70 lever guns.
Very true. On of the things I did not mention in my original post is the ability to have companion handguns to go with the levers. I have two .454 Casull single actions that are companions to the Rossi.

I also have a couple of .45 Colt SA revolvers that are companions to my Marlin model 94 in .45 Colt.

I have not purchased a lever in .357 to go with my GP100. Still searching for the right one...

Dan
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Old 09-09-2019, 1:13 PM
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It would be nice to have a 45acp to go with the 1911.

I thought I read here some time back that there was a company that could do a 45acp conversion...

Edit - Found one article. Looks like they do action work and replace the barrel.
https://www.rangerpointprecision.com...W-45ACP-357SIG

Last edited by RNE228; 09-09-2019 at 1:34 PM..
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Old 09-09-2019, 1:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Beetle Bailey View Post
How about a box magazine fed lever-action in 10mm Auto?
Why?
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Old 09-09-2019, 1:19 PM
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Why?
No real practical reason, other than being able to shoot .40 S&W and 10mm Auto in a carbine. Maybe make it take Glock mags
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Old 09-09-2019, 4:56 PM
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I think I'd buy a Henry in .327 if they make one with a side loader.
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Old 09-12-2019, 4:15 PM
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^^ this. I already almost got the big boy steel in 327. Then I had my heart set on a color case-hardened version which they haven't released in 327.....yet. If they released a side loading, case hardened carbine in 327 they wouldn't be able to take my money fast enough
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Old 09-12-2019, 6:18 PM
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I’ve always wished someone would make a reliable, lightweight semi auto .357 carbine with detachable magazines. It would do anything I’d ever need for home and pest control and take deer and hogs inside 100 yards.
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Old 09-12-2019, 6:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Beetle Bailey View Post
How about a box magazine fed lever-action in 10mm Auto?



Awwwwww YEAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH...






Although... sadly... it DOESN'T come in LEVER-action.
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Old 09-13-2019, 8:06 AM
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When is a 9mm lever gun coming out? Seems the AR market is full of them. It's a cheap round to shoot.
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Old 09-13-2019, 8:13 AM
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Originally Posted by Jimi Jah View Post
When is a 9mm lever gun coming out?
When they put a rim on a 9mm cartridge to make it function in a tube magazine.
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Old 09-13-2019, 9:20 AM
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The mega calibers won't show up in either the Marlin or Henry rifles and only a custom built 1892 like the Bighorn can be built strong enough to contain those cartridges.

The Marlin Action is good to about 45,000 psi. same with the Henry. The .454 is a 65,000 psi cartridge!

The reason why the Bighorn can take the mega calibers is because it is a beefed up 1892 action made out of 17-4 PH Stainless Steel with is much stronger than Cro Moly.

Randy
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Old 09-13-2019, 9:23 AM
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Any idea how these folks did 45acp without a rim?
https://www.rangerpointprecision.com...W-45ACP-357SIG

Quote:
Originally Posted by ar15barrels View Post
When they put a rim on a 9mm cartridge to make it function in a tube magazine.
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Old 09-13-2019, 10:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by W.R.Buchanan View Post
The mega calibers won't show up in either the Marlin or Henry rifles and only a custom built 1892 like the Bighorn can be built strong enough to contain those cartridges.

The Marlin Action is good to about 45,000 psi. same with the Henry. The .454 is a 65,000 psi cartridge!

The reason why the Bighorn can take the mega calibers is because it is a beefed up 1892 action made out of 17-4 PH Stainless Steel with is much stronger than Cro Moly.

Randy
My Rossi is a '92 action (stainless) and plenty strong enough for the .454. No more expensive to manufacture than a '92 in .45 Colt. The bolt lockup in a '92 is extremely strong by design (a shortened version of the 1886).

So, Winchester should offer their 1892 in .454 Casull in my opinion (and Rossi should restart the manufacturing of the .454 in their current lineup).

Dan
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Old 09-13-2019, 2:58 PM
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Any idea how these folks did 45acp without a rim?
https://www.rangerpointprecision.com...W-45ACP-357SIG
Nope.
They must have figured out how to have a double shell stop though so they can trip one of them and set the other one against the case body so it will snap into the extractor groove before the cartridge escapes the magazine.

It's notable that they do NOT offer a 9mm though.
That's probably due to the tapered case shape of a 9mm vs a 10mm or 45 with it's straight case body.
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Old 09-13-2019, 5:33 PM
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Yeah, unfortunately they discontinued the MP5/10. One of the problems was short service life due to the 10mm cartridge being too powerful. Besides, that dumb thing doesn't even take Glock mags.

Quote:
Originally Posted by The War Wagon View Post
Awwwwww YEAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH...






Although... sadly... it DOESN'T come in LEVER-action.
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Old 09-14-2019, 8:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ar15barrels View Post
35 remington trumps 357 max and there are 35 remington lever guns.
I have a new AR upper in .350 Legend. Shoots great, 50 cents per round. Straight case, easy reloading. It's a bit long for a lever gun.
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Old 09-14-2019, 8:04 AM
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Originally Posted by Den60 View Post
I like the .357 Magnum of my lever gun because I pair it with my GP-100 so the ammo is interchangeable.
For non-hunting use that makes sense, however, as I recently realized it doesn’t translate well for hunting.

The darn lead free requirement kills the benefit of that combo. Lead free hunting ammunition just doesn’t perform well out a short barrel.

Furthermore, we can now carry lead ammunition in our handgun while rifle hunting but only if the rifle cannot accept that handgun cartridge.

I suppose the exception “might” be a newer miroku made Winchester which is stamped “357 mag only” and your handgun is a 38 sp?
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Old 09-14-2019, 8:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Beetle Bailey View Post
No real practical reason, other than being able to shoot .40 S&W and 10mm Auto in a carbine. Maybe make it take Glock mags
Just get Ruger to resurrect the 99/44 in the spirit of the PC Carbine - ditch the take down capability and viola - Glock magazine toting semiautomatic.
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Old 09-14-2019, 8:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RNE228 View Post
Any idea how these folks did 45acp without a rim?
https://www.rangerpointprecision.com...W-45ACP-357SIG
Lots of lever cartridges didn’t have rims, .35 Rem for instance. And I think the Rem 141 came in .30 Rem; isn’t there a bunch based on the .284 brass?
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Old 09-14-2019, 8:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smittty View Post
For non-hunting use that makes sense, however, as I recently realized it doesn’t translate well for hunting.

The darn lead free requirement kills the benefit of that combo. Lead free hunting ammunition just doesn’t perform well out a short barrel.

Furthermore, we can now carry lead ammunition in our handgun while rifle hunting but only if the rifle cannot accept that handgun cartridge.

I suppose the exception “might” be a newer miroku made Winchester which is stamped “357 mag only” and your handgun is a 38 sp?
If you're forced to use a .357 revolver in a defensive situation, won't it be almost entirely about shot placement? Whether you get enough FPS to maximize copper expansion doesn't seem likely to me to be the deciding issue.
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Old 09-14-2019, 9:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimi Jah View Post
I have a new AR upper in .350 Legend. Shoots great, 50 cents per round. Straight case, easy reloading. It's a bit long for a lever gun.
Do you load the magazine tube through a side gate in the reciever or do you slide the rod out the front and load the tube through a port at the front of the magazine tube?
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Old 09-14-2019, 10:19 AM
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I guess that's true. Hadn't thought about rifle cartridges that way.

250 and 300 Savage doesn't. 308 doesnt. 223 and 30-06 doesn't. All are used in Sav 99, Win 88, Win 1895, Browning BLR.

300 Sav in Sav 99 is my favorite lever. Have also shot Browning BLR in 223.

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Lots of lever cartridges didn’t have rims, .35 Rem for instance. And I think the Rem 141 came in .30 Rem; isn’t there a bunch based on the .284 brass?
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Old 09-14-2019, 12:26 PM
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I guess that's true. Hadn't thought about rifle cartridges that way.

250 and 300 Savage doesn't. 308 doesnt. 223 and 30-06 doesn't. All are used in Sav 99, Win 88, Win 1895, Browning BLR.

300 Sav in Sav 99 is my favorite lever. Have also shot Browning BLR in 223.
25 and 30 remington lever actions have special spiral magazines to keep the bullets from setting off primers.
250 and 300 savage use rotary magazines.
308, 30-06and 223 lever actions use box magazines.
None of these fit the typical straight tube with loading gate magazine pattern than people think of when talking about lever actions.
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Old 09-14-2019, 12:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jwalt View Post
If you're forced to use a .357 revolver in a defensive situation, won't it be almost entirely about shot placement? Whether you get enough FPS to maximize copper expansion doesn't seem likely to me to be the deciding issue.
Earlier this year I read a study that found that it takes 5 concentrated shots (from a handgun) to stop a bear and I think that included grizzly, and it was regardless of cartridge as long as it was 9mm and up.

So, according to whom ever that "expert" was then absolutely shot placement x5 is important. Multiple shots spread out wasn't effective.

Who carries a handgun while long gun hunting is another question?

Last edited by smittty; 09-14-2019 at 12:33 PM..
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Old 09-14-2019, 12:32 PM
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Originally Posted by plumbum View Post
Lots of lever cartridges didn’t have rims, .35 Rem for instance. And I think the Rem 141 came in .30 Rem; isn’t there a bunch based on the .284 brass?
For purely fun at the range, I have often wished for a 9mm lever gun. I guess it could also serve as a home defense gun.

I would likely buy one if it was affordable.
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Old 09-14-2019, 2:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smittty View Post
Earlier this year I read a study that found that it takes 5 concentrated shots (from a handgun) to stop a bear and I think that included grizzly, and it was regardless of cartridge as long as it was 9mm and up.

So, according to whom ever that "expert" was then absolutely shot placement x5 is important. Multiple shots spread out wasn't effective.

Who carries a handgun while long gun hunting is another question?
If I had to deal with an angry grizz, I think I'd be looking for penetration over expansion.
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Old 09-14-2019, 4:12 PM
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Quote:
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If I had to deal with an angry grizz, I think I'd be looking for penetration over expansion.
5 shots same hole!
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Old 09-15-2019, 3:20 PM
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357 and 38spl are close; 0.355 vs 0.357

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Originally Posted by smittty View Post
For purely fun at the range, I have often wished for a 9mm lever gun. I guess it could also serve as a home defense gun.

I would likely buy one if it was affordable.
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Old 09-15-2019, 4:25 PM
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Why not pick up a Marlin 1894 and a revolver in .41 mag?
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Last edited by Trapper; 09-15-2019 at 4:29 PM..
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Old 09-15-2019, 6:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bergmen View Post
I have a Stainless Rossi 92 in .454 Casull which I think is a powerful caliber for a handy lever action carbine. They did not make very many of these and I was lucky back in 2012 to find a new one which I purchased.
There's two of them on GB right now, a little pricey tho. I like that Rossi did the top tube load on these guns like the Henry's...I don't thing Braztech will make any more of these.

There's also a Rossi .480 Ruger on GB. They only made 100 of those,
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Old 09-15-2019, 9:37 PM
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marlin 62 uses a rimless cartridge 30 carbine
I wonder if one could be modified to 9mm pistol cartridge
with a 20 inch barrel and full length mag tube it would hold lots of ammo

Last edited by john myers; 09-15-2019 at 9:43 PM..
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Old 09-15-2019, 10:38 PM
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Old 09-16-2019, 7:17 AM
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Interesting; I had never heard of the Marlin 62. Had to look that up.

Quote:
Originally Posted by john myers View Post
marlin 62 uses a rimless cartridge 30 carbine
I wonder if one could be modified to 9mm pistol cartridge
with a 20 inch barrel and full length mag tube it would hold lots of ammo
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Old 09-18-2019, 7:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ar15barrels View Post
25 and 30 remington lever actions have special spiral magazines to keep the bullets from setting off primers.
250 and 300 savage use rotary magazines.
308, 30-06and 223 lever actions use box magazines.
None of these fit the typical straight tube with loading gate magazine pattern than people think of when talking about lever actions.
I have a Browning 92 in .44 Magnum, it uses standard center fire .44 Mag.
I had a Winchester 92 in 30-30, it didn't have a spiral magazine.

OP, look for a .44 Mag; you can get lever action specific cartridges (hollow point/plastic insert) from Hornady, works well in mine.
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