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Centerfire Rifles - Manually Operated Lever action, bolt action or other non gas operated centerfire rifles.

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  #1  
Old 08-28-2019, 5:47 PM
dave7739 dave7739 is offline
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Default "best" renaissance round for both a handgun an carbine?

Looking to purchase ammo for both a lever carbine and revolver. New to the community so I am asking the experienced to suggest ammo that will work in both, rifle and revolver, both will most likely be used at the range. If I go hunting with the rifle I will buy hunting rounds, for home defense I will buy HD rounds(live in a condo). What would the team suggest as a range round? BTW .357 is what I'm considering. I understand it's going to be a compromise but what are the opinions?(Please don't suggest .38sp, I know I can get +p rounds for HD). I am looking to purchase one type of ammo in bulk to use for both weapons.(bulk=500rds)
Dave
PS. Also what are my money saving options in So Cal? I see lots of .45/9mm but not much .357 on sale. I do not, nor intend to reload in the near future
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Old 08-28-2019, 6:00 PM
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LAX Ammo is a good source for both practice, target and hunting .357 Magnum ammunition.

However, a word about plated, as opposed to, jacketed, bullets. Plated bullets are just that; lead bullets with a thin copper alloy plating, which will shed at velocities faster than 1200-1250 fps, which is the beginning of Magnum velocities.

So.

If you buy "Factory New" (new brass casings) or "Reloads" from LAX Ammo in bulk .357 for *handgun* practice, it is less expensive than ammo using jacketed bullets. It is loaded with a propellant charge just below true "Magnum" velocities, which will be FINE in a .357 handgun.

But in a lever rifle barrel, those bullet speeds may increase beyond 1250-ish Feet Per Second (fps) and foul the bore with bullet plating, eliminating accuracy until the bore is scrubbed clean.

Therefore... use plated bullet bulk ammo to your heart's content, but only in a handgun (7-1/2" barrel or shorter) and prepare to spend a little more on commercially-loaded name brand ammo that uses a good jacketed bullet for your .357 carbine/rifle.

Winchester white box .357 -or- Federal "American Eagle" (red/black box) .357 semi-jacketed soft points are good to go for any carbine or rifle.

Use a cartridge that has a visible roll crip at the brass neck/bullet intersection, so that when loaded end-to-end in a tubular magazine, there will be no bullet setback (a bullet pushed farther into the brass casing can elevate combustion pressures to perhaps an unsafe level).

Off the top of my head, there you go. You will find that .357 in a carbine or rifle is a SUPERB cartridge! and suitable for hunting deer-sized game or smaller.

Good luck!
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Old 08-28-2019, 6:03 PM
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Agh... California hunting regs require non-lead projectiles... you may confidently use BARNES pure copper bullet-loaded cartridges available at LAX Ammo.

If you do use a pure copper bullet in a bore that has been shooting jacketed bullets, the bore must be thoroughly cleaned beforehand, as pure copper and the copper alloy of a jacketed bullet do not play well together.
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Old 08-28-2019, 6:15 PM
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OP, what do you plan to hunt? .357 is a versatile round for many things, but it's marginal for hunting. For serious hunting, most people consider .44 Magnum at the bottom of the pile, and that makes for not the most versatile handgun. You can use .44 Special for HD, but the gun will still be big and heavy with only 6 bullets.

Since you can't hunt with lead in CA, Lehigh Defense bullets may be the only reasonable stuff you should use.
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Old 08-28-2019, 6:36 PM
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45 long colt.
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Old 08-28-2019, 7:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dave7739 View Post
Looking to purchase ammo for both a lever carbine and revolver. New to the community so I am asking the experienced to suggest ammo that will work in both, rifle and revolver, both will most likely be used at the range. If I go hunting with the rifle I will buy hunting rounds, for home defense I will buy HD rounds(live in a condo). What would the team suggest as a range round? BTW .357 is what I'm considering. I understand it's going to be a compromise but what are the opinions?(Please don't suggest .38sp, I know I can get +p rounds for HD). I am looking to purchase one type of ammo in bulk to use for both weapons.(bulk=500rds)
Dave
PS. Also what are my money saving options in So Cal? I see lots of .45/9mm but not much .357 on sale. I do not, nor intend to reload in the near future
I have setups as you are talking about in 357, 41 and 44.
I would go 357 because it's nicer to shoot in a pistol than the bigger ones and I end up shooting more in the pistol than the carbine.
357 also gives you the 38 special option for plinking when you don't want full power.
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Old 08-28-2019, 8:52 PM
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Glock 20 and a hi-point carbine in 10mm!
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Old 08-28-2019, 10:27 PM
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If you really plan to hunt, then .44 mag. But if you will likely only shoot at the range, then .357 mag will be much more economical.
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Old 08-28-2019, 10:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sigstroker View Post
OP, what do you plan to hunt? .357 is a versatile round for many things, but it's marginal for hunting. For serious hunting, most people consider .44 Magnum at the bottom of the pile, and that makes for not the most versatile handgun. You can use .44 Special for HD, but the gun will still be big and heavy with only 6 bullets.

Since you can't hunt with lead in CA, Lehigh Defense bullets may be the only reasonable stuff you should use.
Excellent advice above.
44 magnum has much more energy and is a legitimate hunting round in a carbine, assuming you are within 120 yards or so.
44 special will be excellent for home defense in your condo. Your post specified a revolver so we can assume that you're okay with only 6 rounds. Additionally, statistics show that the great majority of armed conflicts are settled with less than 6, and speed loaders or moon clips will enable you to reload fairly quickly.
The only drawback to 44 is the cost of the ammunition.
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Old 08-29-2019, 5:03 AM
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You're getting some good advice from the above. I'd go with .357 as ammo is readily available and the the least expensive. Not to mention just plain easier to shoot. If you take the rifle hunting, Barnes Vortex ammo should do. It's 140gr all copper XPB HP bullet is pretty stout. I'm sure there are others, but, make sure those are on an "approved" Ca. legal list of bullets/ammo to use. I'm thinking the .357 would be your best best for what you're asking. My opinion.

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Add: Federal .357 mag ammo[American Eagle brand] can be bought at Turner's for $21.00 a box of 50 when they are on sale. Good ammo. 158gr JSP.

Last edited by pennstater; 08-29-2019 at 5:06 AM..
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Old 08-29-2019, 5:27 PM
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Default Pistol/Carbine Round

My vote is 357. Great in a lever and multiple wheel choices. Reload 357 to save money and increase load options.

Second choice would be 45 Colt. Ditto reload your own.
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Old 08-29-2019, 6:17 PM
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I really don't plan on hunting with a .357 it just threw that in because I didn't want to get a list of specialized hunting ammo. The ammo is gong to be for a very expensive set of paper punchers.(range use) I was looking for ammo that will be the best all around for both(if there is such a thing). I do appreciate the many responses. Thanks for all the expertise on this site, but I'm waiting for someone to tell me "go out and buy a case of XXXX in XXX grain" at xxx because these are the best prices in so Cal. When I used to shoot my M1A there was a link to the cheapest prices on the forum.
No disrespect to anyone who responded,
thanks'
Dave
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Old 08-29-2019, 7:33 PM
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Quote:
I'm waiting for someone to tell me "go out and buy a case of XXXX in XXX grain" at xxx because these are the best prices in so Cal.
I alluded to this very thing when I mentioned LAX Ammo. What bullet weight you and/or your gun may prefer remains to be seen. I also mentioned two or three different commercial brands.

Only remember the plated bullet speed limit of approx. 1250 fps, which limits their use in carbine-length barrels or longer.
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Old 08-29-2019, 9:46 PM
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A real .357 Magnum load is likely to exceed 1250 in a 4 inch revolver.

If the revolver (or automatic) is going to be used for HD, you're going to want Magnum loads. That's a big advantage a .44 has. .44 Special with lead semiwadcutters is a very effective, yet mild to shoot, load. Can't say that about .357. Not only is .38 much less effective, but they still have a lot of flash and blast. I used to keep a Model 29 with .44 Special equivalent loads for HD for many years.

But you are 99.99% never going to have to use anything for self defense, and since you don't reload, that .357 and .38 Special is going to be cheaper and easier to find than .44 ammo, is a big deal.
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Old 08-30-2019, 4:38 AM
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The 357 magnum is marginal for hunting and most bullets for it are designed to perform at handgun speeds. Shoot a 357 magnum through a 16.5” barrel and you’ll see higher velocities. 110 grain bullets at 2000 FPS and 158 grain bullets at 1700 FPS. If you can find a 180 grain lead free expanding bullet it should have no problem taking down whatever hogs California have at 100 yards and below. The Lehigh Xtreme solid copper bullets will probably do the job, but it seems California hunting requires expanding lead free bullets.
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Old 08-30-2019, 7:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dave7739 View Post
I really don't plan on hunting with a .357 it just threw that in because I didn't want to get a list of specialized hunting ammo. The ammo is gong to be for a very expensive set of paper punchers.(range use) I was looking for ammo that will be the best all around for both(if there is such a thing). I do appreciate the many responses. Thanks for all the expertise on this site, but I'm waiting for someone to tell me "go out and buy a case of XXXX in XXX grain" at xxx because these are the best prices in so Cal. When I used to shoot my M1A there was a link to the cheapest prices on the forum.
No disrespect to anyone who responded,
thanks'
Dave
38 special is going to be the best price for range ammo.
Probably American Eagle if you don't want to use LAX reloads.
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Old 08-30-2019, 7:39 AM
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Don't rule out Walmart, I've scored .357 magnum there in the past.
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Old 08-30-2019, 9:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dave7739 View Post
Looking to purchase ammo for both a lever carbine and revolver. New to the community .
IMO, 357 is hard to beat but I'm not sure what your experience is with guns. I suggest you start with 22LR. You can get yourself a nice Henry H001 and Ruger Wrangler for $500.00 + tax and DROS.


Quote:
Originally Posted by dave7739 View Post
I see lots of .45/9mm but not much .357 on sale. I do not, nor intend to reload in the near future
The 45/9mm are a different animal. Their different type of cartridge than lever gun use (rimmed)

If your dead set on a .357, I'd go with a Marlin 94 or a Henry Steel Big Boy. They're very well made guns and simple to clean.


Back to the OP, any ammo you find should work. Flat nose being the best/safest
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Old 08-30-2019, 9:38 PM
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Quote:
A real .357 Magnum load is likely to exceed 1250 in a 4 inch revolver.

I agree, and a real .357 Magnum load will also use a jacketed bullet, with the resulting increase in cost.

LAX Ammo builds their bulk Magnum loads to more leisurely, target ammo velocities rather than top-shelf hunting or self defense loads.
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