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Concealed Carry Discussion General discussion regarding CCW/LTC in California

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  #1  
Old 08-09-2022, 7:30 PM
CAT112 CAT112 is offline
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Default Close calls and CCW philosophy

Hello all,

This is to serve as a small reminder of keeping your heads up and situational switches on. I’m sure that everyone here doesn’t need a reminder of this, but it’s good to be reminded. Just in these two days alone, I had 5 near vehicle accidents (not your average bumper bender, I’m talking totaled probably not getting out of the car bad) and thank God they never connected. However, two of those incidents lead to me being tailed for a while and I made several extra turns and stops to lose the tails. Then, I had several neighborhood brawls in which neighbors ran to get help. Troubling times indeed.

Now, I don’t intend this to be a “scary world” or “always carry a gun” type of post, nor is it to be a justification/rant post. Rather, I pose a question. With many notable individual exercising their rights to self defense, would you do the same in CA? If, in worse case scenario, You had to deploy lethal force, is it just assumed that your already considering the plea deal from the DA’s cronies? I just feel that CCW in CA saves lives but at the sacrifice of yours.

Side note: I may have played my hand, but I’d much rather have saved lives, especially of those I Love, than be a victim, but being in CA forces some to really consider these outcomes.

Stay cool, calm and safe out there.
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  #2  
Old 08-09-2022, 7:57 PM
mk2dave mk2dave is offline
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I don't understand your question.

"With many notable individual exercising their rights to self defense, would you do the same in CA? If, in worse case scenario, You had to deploy lethal force, is it just assumed that your already considering the plea deal from the DA’s cronies? I just feel that CCW in CA saves lives but at the sacrifice of yours."

How do you define "would I exercise my right to self defense"? I don't know specifically what you mean be this, but yes?

Assuming a plea deal? ABSOLUTELY not. Why would I assume a plea deal??? Education and training help eliminate bad shoots. If it's not a bad shoot, then why consider a plea deal?

Your post is very vague to me, like you are suggesting something that maybe I'm just not grasping.
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Old 08-09-2022, 9:06 PM
CAT112 CAT112 is offline
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I apologize, I did kinda write this while amped up.

I just notice that individuals who I come across feel that specifically in CA, whenever there is a defensive shoot, we are on automatically guilty (in the eyes of the DA) no matter how “good” of a shoot or training. I do agree that training is an easy way to avoid the court room.

To take clarify hopefully clarify ,how would being the good samaratian play out for someone in CA? I’m just comparing hypotheticals; what if Eli Dickens did what he did in CA?

Recent events just have me pondering…
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  #4  
Old 08-09-2022, 9:51 PM
Brother_Hesekiel Brother_Hesekiel is online now
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I'm not a good Samaritan. I carry a gun to protect my life and that of my loved one next to me. It's a last defense tool.

I would not have emptied a 10-round magazine in a crowded mall at a person 40 yards away. If I did that and hurt, or, God forbid, kill an innocent bystander, I'd go to prison. That's not how I plan to retire.

If I walk at night on the bike path and see a woman being raped, I'd interfere, for sure. But whenever I draw my gun, it has to be a 100% situation, not less. I have to be 100% sure that it is justified, 100% sure that I'll hit my target and nothing else, and 100% sure there is no other, less lethal way to do this.

We did the Eli Dickens drill at an IDPA match past Sunday. I had 7 good hits, so 3 bullets didn't hit the bad guy well enough. Had Eli Dickens shot 1 innocent bystander, the anti-gunners would have a field day to argue against civilians carrying a gun.
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Old 08-09-2022, 10:09 PM
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Several companies sell CCW legal protection plans. They also provide in great detail when you should and should not use that firearm. Most of them have info on youtube. Whether you have a CCW or not, you can still buy this "insurance". It's cheap considering what you could be up against in a defensive shooting.
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  #6  
Old 08-10-2022, 9:30 AM
mk2dave mk2dave is offline
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OP, thank you for the clarity. Specific county DA's aside, you're right, there seems to be an uphill legal battle. Insurance helps. Training helps. Perspective helps. I agree with Brother H, I'm not here to play Capt. Save Everybody. I'm protecting me and mine. And while I don't think we can ever be 100%, we need to realize that the ***** will roll down hill and we are at the bottom.

One thing that I think helps is putting myself in situations I see on the news. Smash and grabs, SD, good, bad shoots; all with the idea that by giving it forethought, I'll make the best decision if the SHTF. "The body won't go where the mind hasn't been."
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  #7  
Old 08-10-2022, 6:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CAT112 View Post
Hello all,

This is to serve as a small reminder of keeping your heads up and situational switches on. I’m sure that everyone here doesn’t need a reminder of this, but it’s good to be reminded. Just in these two days alone, I had 5 near vehicle accidents (not your average bumper bender, I’m talking totaled probably not getting out of the car bad) and thank God they never connected. However, two of those incidents lead to me being tailed for a while and I made several extra turns and stops to lose the tails. Then, I had several neighborhood brawls in which neighbors ran to get help. Troubling times indeed.

Now, I don’t intend this to be a “scary world” or “always carry a gun” type of post, nor is it to be a justification/rant post. Rather, I pose a question. With many notable individual exercising their rights to self defense, would you do the same in CA? If, in worse case scenario, You had to deploy lethal force, is it just assumed that your already considering the plea deal from the DA’s cronies? I just feel that CCW in CA saves lives but at the sacrifice of yours.

Side note: I may have played my hand, but I’d much rather have saved lives, especially of those I Love, than be a victim, but being in CA forces some to really consider these outcomes.

Stay cool, calm and safe out there.
Looks like Rob Bonta is using another alias.
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  #8  
Old 08-12-2022, 11:02 AM
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I took a few things away from this post:

1). You live in the heart of Oakland or;
2). You live within the patrol area of LAPD’s 77th division or;
3). You live within the patrol area of LA Sheriff’s Compton or Century station’s patrol areas.

Conclusion: Move. Now.
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  #9  
Old 08-12-2022, 12:38 PM
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I live in a rural county. About 5-6 years ago a pot grower, who was a felon, shot and killed a pot thief *outside* his home and the DA didn't bring charges. It's just my *opinion* that LE and DA in my county want to let you off if you're defending yourself, or even your property. I don't remember if he was brought up weapons charges, but I believe so.

Another incident comes to mind where a home owner shot and injured someone in the process of hopping his fence after making credible threats, 100' from the house. Also, no charges.

I have no insider knowledge. I read these stories in our local paper. Just another perspective.

Everything above was from memory, but I found the article. I can't find the one from the fence jumoer.

https://www.lakeconews.com/component...ting-continues

According to CDCR he's not in a CA prison.

Last edited by ArtP88; 08-12-2022 at 1:28 PM..
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  #10  
Old 08-12-2022, 1:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CAT112 View Post
I apologize, I did kinda write this while amped up.

I just notice that individuals who I come across feel that specifically in CA, whenever there is a defensive shoot, we are on automatically guilty (in the eyes of the DA) no matter how “good” of a shoot or training. I do agree that training is an easy way to avoid the court room.

To take clarify hopefully clarify ,how would being the good samaratian play out for someone in CA? I’m just comparing hypotheticals; what if Eli Dickens did what he did in CA?

Recent events just have me pondering…
this is why you should carry a full coverage ccw insurance. you life should worth more than law sues
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  #11  
Old 08-12-2022, 2:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CAT112 View Post
I apologize, I did kinda write this while amped up.

I just notice that individuals who I come across feel that specifically in CA, whenever there is a defensive shoot, we are on automatically guilty (in the eyes of the DA) no matter how “good” of a shoot or training. I do agree that training is an easy way to avoid the court room.

To take clarify hopefully clarify ,how would being the good samaratian play out for someone in CA? I’m just comparing hypotheticals; what if Eli Dickens did what he did in CA?

Recent events just have me pondering…
It is the duty of police and the legal structure to maintain order and uphold the law.

If a call comes into the fire department someone saying "I think this building next door is on fire but I'm not sure, I smell smoke but I'm not 100% sure where it's coming from..." do you think the FD says "Ok dude, whatever, call us back when you're sure" - ? No... the fire department will assume there is a fire when in doubt, and will roll on the scene to determine if they're needed. Once there, they are not going anywhere until they are convinced there is no fire requiring their services.

Police and prosecutors are in kind of the same boat. If a call comes in saying "there's trouble here", they roll on the scene to make a determination. Once there, if there IS in fact trouble, they have to try to determine who caused it and whether that requires them to act. If the "scene" they roll into contains a dead body, then questions of accountability come into play. Now, while the court has to assume you are "innocent until proven guilty" the cops have to assume that anyone present that they can lay hands on, is potentially guilty until they can determine the liklihood of that. You find someone over a corps with blood all over them and a butcher knife in their hand... well, what would you think? Let him run off somewhere until he can be "proven" guilty? No... you make the reasonable assumption, there's a body, there's a weapon, and there's someone who looks like they very possibly may have done it. You have to be cuffed & stuffed, and get held while investigators check things out and determine if the cop's initiall assessment holds water or not. If that evidence says, "yeah, it's a reasonable assumption he did it" then unless the prosecutor thinks no jury in the world would buy into his presentation of evidence, he will probably take it to trial. Once at trial, he'll try to get the best (read, biggest) crime it's possible to nail you with, provided that doesn't consume too many resources (man-hours and money). Sometimes that means a plea deal, makes his job easier. Most people who are guilty or have lousy representation (in other words, common people) will take the deal, it's usually a lot less expensive in the short term.

That ends up in practical terms meaning a two tier justice system. Ones who can afford decent lawyers and fight for their rights, and those who can make the prosecution's job easier and cop a plea, guilty or not.

Not sure this is really anyone's "fault" though there is no shortage of fingers to point. It's just the nature of how things are, which is a natural result of just how people are.
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  #12  
Old 08-20-2022, 8:25 AM
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Good insurance + great lawyer. Not a criminal defense lawyer. Someone who specializes in use of force and has defended law enforcement when use of force has threatened their jobs.

The law is the law. California is no different when it comes to the particular D.A. who decides to prosecute a case.
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Old 08-20-2022, 9:33 AM
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Based off the first paragraph it seems you may need to tone down the way you're driving if you're involved in that many close calls, in that time frame.

If you're getting into "several neighborhood brawls", you may need to take a good long look at some de-escalation techniques, or just plain learn to walk away. If these "brawls" don't involve you to start with stay out of it, no good is going to come from you stepping into something between others.
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Old 08-20-2022, 10:55 AM
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Originally Posted by P5Ret View Post
Based off the first paragraph it seems you may need to tone down the way you're driving if you're involved in that many close calls, in that time frame.

If you're getting into "several neighborhood brawls", you may need to take a good long look at some de-escalation techniques, or just plain learn to walk away. If these "brawls" don't involve you to start with stay out of it, no good is going to come from you stepping into something between others.
What he said.^^^^^^

Additionally, a non-lethal may be an option. Pepper spray perhaps. Something to bridge the gap in the case that avoidance isn't possible. Not in place of a lethal option, but in addition to.
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Old 08-20-2022, 11:23 AM
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Originally Posted by P5Ret View Post
Based off the first paragraph it seems you may need to tone down the way you're driving if you're involved in that many close calls, in that time frame.

If you're getting into "several neighborhood brawls", you may need to take a good long look at some de-escalation techniques, or just plain learn to walk away. If these "brawls" don't involve you to start with stay out of it, no good is going to come from you stepping into something between others.
^^^^^^^ What he said. OP, are you a crack head? Five close calls driving with two hot pursuits and "several neighborhood brawls" in two days? Dude, something is wrong in your life, and your internal debate over using firearms is not your biggest concern. You need to focus on first things first. Unless, as alluded to earlier, you are an avatar for Bonta or some crusading social justice warrior journalist here as an agent provacateur. In which case, go fish someplace else please.
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Old 08-21-2022, 4:44 PM
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^^^^^^^ What he said. OP, are you a crack head? Five close calls driving with two hot pursuits and "several neighborhood brawls" in two days? Dude, something is wrong in your life, and your internal debate over using firearms is not your biggest concern. You need to focus on first things first. Unless, as alluded to earlier, you are an avatar for Bonta or some crusading social justice warrior journalist here as an agent provacateur. In which case, go fish someplace else please.

I didn't want to bring up anger management but really that's hitting the nail on the head.

Don't get into those situations because a gun is not going to save you. I think all of us here only wish people to use self defense in real danger, not aggression.
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Old 08-22-2022, 6:38 AM
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Looks like Rob Bonta is using another alias.
If only that were true. Read some of the stuff that goes on here and there is a pattern of wannbeism, everyone is out to get me and how do I do the simple things in life I did before but now need a collective to tell me since I carry a gun.

With some of the way out things the anti-2nd people could read this stuff and run back to create new restrictions and laws and say to themselves, yeah, we really need to do something about this stuff.

Serious, where is the thinking? Its like watching some video and then the do you get involved nonsense. Would you get involved or even think about it if you weren't carrying a gun? Then why think about it now? That right there should tell anyone that more than a few people think carrying a gun gives them some reason to get into other people's business.

This Op though, has all the right stuff, being followed, enough near misses to qualify for at least an honorable mention in the Ronin car chase scenes, and the hero wannabe all rolled into one.

Its not unique, read of the stuff going on. From needing help to use the toilet to this stuff it's like you start carrying and all of a sudden it's regression time to day care.

The sad part? There are probably more than a few who read the thread post and think - "yeah, me too!"




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Old 08-22-2022, 11:33 AM
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you are in no obligation to stick around after the shooting, it's a dangerous situation and you are within your rights to run away. in fact you can run so far away that you end up back home, develop amnesia from the ptsd and forget it ever happened
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