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| Survival and Preparations Long and short term survival and 'prepping'. |
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#1
05-28-2023, 12:51 AM
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Interesting Thoughts - 28 Inconvenient Truths About TEOTWAWKI
I was surfing YouTube (can't sleep at the moment) and I found a video with some interesting thoughts. I don't know anything about the guy, but I thought his list provoked a certain level of thought.
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#2
05-28-2023, 4:51 AM
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We’re ALL GOING TO DIE! Can’t somebody do something?!?!?!?!
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#3
05-28-2023, 8:34 AM
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On number four, I don’t talk about prepping, at least I don’t bring up the subject. But quite often it’s brought up to me. There are at least five or six people probably more whose stated plan for their family is to come and mooch off of me in the time of need. That’s not going to end well.
I do have a network of very close friends that I can trust my life to. We don’t discuss propping. It’s just understood.
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We’re ALL GOING TO DIE! Can’t somebody do something?!?!?!?!
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#4
05-28-2023, 9:28 AM
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Have you read the book- one second after?
Well written book on an EMP strike.
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Rule 1- ALL GUNS ARE ALWAYS LOADED Rule 2 -NEVER LET THE MUZZLE COVER ANYTHING YOU ARE NOT PREPARED TO DESTROY (including your hands and legs) Rule 3 -KEEP YOUR FINGER OFF THE TRIGGER UNTIL YOUR SIGHTS ARE ON THE TARGET Rule 4 -BE SURE OF YOUR TARGET AND WHAT IS BEYOND IT (thanks to Jeff Cooper)
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#5
05-28-2023, 11:33 AM
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There will be plenty of time to read it after SHTF Oh wait?..
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We’re ALL GOING TO DIE! Can’t somebody do something?!?!?!?!
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#6
05-29-2023, 11:13 PM
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But the best series is Families First: A Post-Apocalyptic Next World Series Volume 1 thru 7 I only read vol 1 & 2 so far. Amazon.
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 -ΙΧΘΥΣ <>< Last edited by TrailerparkTrash; 05-29-2023 at 11:15 PM..
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#7
06-01-2023, 11:41 PM
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Found the original post that the video is referring to...link to it at the bottom. Keep in mind, this is just someone's opinions. Also, these are not my points, just posting something from the interwebs...so you dont have to watch the video.
1. Not everyone will survive. Ouch. 2. For many, circumstances will trump preparedness. 3. Preparedness will cost money. There's no way around it. 4. If you talk about preparedness, you'll be ridiculed. If you keep your mouth shut, you?ll miss out on establishing a support system that is 100% necessary to survival. 5. A rural retreat wont save you. The federal government has you in their crosshairs, as does the United Nations. 6. Stored food runs out, eventually. 7. Even the best prepared survivalist Navy Seal can be brought down by an infected ingrown toenail. 8. You probably aren't tough enough for what's coming, but then again, you might surprise yourself. Some who survive, long-term, might not be the ones you expect. 9. Gold and silver may be useless if a world currency is established. Their use may even be criminalized. 10. In a time of plenty, it's impossible to imagine the reality of true scarcity. 11. Survival is easy for armchair quarterbacks. 12. Most survivalists and preppers are overly optimistic when it comes to how much food store, what scenarios to plan for, and their ability to survive off the grid. 13. TEOTWAWKI will change the way you and your children and grandchildren live. Forever. 14. The minute you bug out, your chances of reaching your retreat destination are slim. 15. You're kidding yourself if you think your hidden caches won't be found by others, eventually. Or, alternatively, you'll forget where you hid them. As proof, how many ?buried treasures? have been lost to history in spite of maps indicating their locations? 16. You won't know if you're ready for TEOTWAWKI until you're in the middle of it. After that, it will be a case of day to day survival. 17. Ultimately, a too-powerful government will be the biggest threat to your survival ? either a totalitarian government or smaller fiefdoms where 'might makes right.' 18. Life will become cheap. 19. Free time will become a thing of the past. 20. Wondering how you might survive the early days after an EMP attack? Download my free report here. 21. There's nothing wrong with preparing for natural disasters, but if you're not ready for a collapse of the American economy or similar worst case scenario, you're not ready. 22. Coming tough times will threaten even the best of marriages and other close relationships. 23. Growing your own food is a bigger challenge than you ever thought possible. 24. A green garden can be spotted from miles away, depending on where you live, thus endangering your food source and your family. Savvy, desperate people will be able to easily identify the plants found in the typical backyard garden. 25. Dealing with human waste and trash will become your new part-time job. 26. You'll discover exactly what you're capable of when your family is threatened. 27. Formerly strong and capable people will escape their new reality through booze, drugs, and/or suicide. 28. Protecting and nurturing close family ties will become one of the most important things you can do. 29. Those who can accept and adapt will find survival easier than those who hold on to the past or have unrealistic expectations of the future. https://www.forumsforums.com/threads...otwawki.74974/
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All things being equal... Last edited by TheChief; 06-02-2023 at 11:01 AM..
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#8
06-02-2023, 1:41 AM
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What I found interesting is the opinion(s) seem to have a basis in reality over the overly optimistic 'talking points' typically pushed. It's kinda like his #28 and your #29... Quote:
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It's something even the Bible speaks to. For instance, in Matthew 24:16 - 18... Quote:
It's about being reliant on your knowledge, your skills, and your ability to adapt rather than on 'things.' Remember, the best, most comprehensive battle plan is generally thrown overboard when the first shot is fired. It's just like the old expression: "You live out of your pack, fight with what's on your belt, but survive with what's in your pockets." It's a major aspect of 'prepping' that is too often overlooked. Too many people 'stockpile' without taking the time to learn how to use what they've stockpiled, realize how transient what they've stockpiled is, or understand that, at some point, you're going to run out and need to be able to acquire more. As regards that last point, "when and what" become the overriding focus. Food stuffs? Water? Ammunition? Knowledge? It goes back to one of the old definitions of a genius... A genius isn't someone who knows all the answers. A genius is someone who knows how to find the answers. Even if you have the best garden in the World, at some point, each year, you start anew. In the meantime, you have to keep things prepped and maintained and while a certain redundancy is involved, there is always something unique to learn or do or remember. It's kinda summed up with: "There's always one more thing." To me, that's the point of 'prepping' or whatever they choose to call it. It provides a potential 'cushion' and is not and end unto itself. That's what 'the list' seems to be reminding people of. At least that's how I see it.
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#9
06-02-2023, 5:06 PM
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Kind of a generic list but nobody knows what TEOTWAWKI will mean. Anything short of a nuke event can be survivable, but there are levels of surviving for everyone. I would bet most people living in a city/suburb can't survive more than a few days without a Starbucks or the internet.
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#10
06-02-2023, 10:47 PM
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Consider the list... Not everyone is going to survive, whether they've 'prepped' or not. The toughest, most knowledgeable 'prepper' can take the 'hit' (being nuke, tsunami, whatever) nose on and not survive. "Preparedness," whether as purveyed now or in a more generic way will ultimately mean a commitment of resources, be it time or money or both and more. Yet, it's about more than simply throwing money at it and expecting to survive. "Prepping" is a two-edged sword, socially, and that means you need to be circumspect in terms of both your presentation and who you present it to. For instance, from the link provided by TheChief... Quote:
As I said... Quote:
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#11
06-03-2023, 4:38 AM
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1. Not everyone will survive. Ouch. Darwinism in action. Proof that survival of the fittest is real,
2. For many, circumstances will trump preparedness. No military attack plan survives the first 30s seconds of contact with the enemy, Absolutely no differences in the two. You can make all the plans you want, but there will always be Murphy's Law to screw it up. 3. Preparedness will cost money. There's no way around it. 4. If you talk about preparedness, you'll be ridiculed. If you keep your mouth shut, you?ll miss out on establishing a support system that is 100% necessary to survival. I was raised in a Religion/Cult that firmly believes in a terrible time coming. Though, their belief is that it will be for only a short time. Plus, we were literally told to NOT makes any kind of preps. I don't agree. But, we were taught that our own people would be our own worst enemies. Which I agree with. As I see many of them getting angry and turning people in to the authorities if stuff isn't shared, or their ideas not gone along with. I'm no longer a part of that group. 5. A rural retreat wont save you. The federal government has you in their crosshairs, as does the United Nations. I've heard that there's not a place in the US that doesn't have some kind of a road to within 20 miles it. That makes it very difficult to really stay hidden. The Fed Government may have bigger fish to fry for a while anyway.
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#12
06-03-2023, 6:51 AM
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"Plus, we were literally told to NOT makes any kind of preps. I don't agree..." That about sums up my take on the piece except to say that the overarching point is not to become overly secure in the thought "I have prepped" and not have or acknowledge the necessity of 'contingency thinking.' Of course, such thinking, it seems to me, is precisely the basis for 'prepping.'
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#13
06-03-2023, 8:10 AM
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This is one of the best threads I've ever read on here. Some great food for thought and it's causing me to further evaluate my own plans and thoughts on preparation.
One of the sticking points which I've tried to make it clear to everyone I know as well is stockpiling supplies for months or years (lol) and holing up in one location is a death sentence. It really is only a matter of time until your location and your stash would be discovered, and once that happens, it's only a matter of time until you lose the survival game. Oh you've got 5 to 10 close friends all armed to the teeth, half of which have military grade sniper skills? That's nice, the group of desperate rovers planning to take you out are 50 strong, and they have effective tactics as well, maybe even heavy armor, truck mounted ordinance, a freaking tank or helicopter, etc. No matter how many people you have to help defend your space, there will ALWAYS be another group much bigger and better equipped, not excluding our own gov thugs. So what's the alternative? Staying on the move? That's when it's crucial to be able to adapt to the situation and really know your way around the environment, know how to identify plants and food, know how to address any injuries, know how to stay the hell out of sight, etc. Even then, as good as you might be, many people in that situation would be so desperate and dangerous they would just kill you on sight, if you didn't see them first, just to take your stuff. As was said in one of the bullet points, life would be cheap. That's damn right. Survival instinct would enable people to do things otherwise unimaginable. Something else to consider, it's it just yourself or would you have a family in tow? It's much easier for a loner to survive on the move than having to drag a wife and kids along, as stealth would be out the window, and you'd need much more resources to sustain everybody. I wouldn't foresee anybody in that situation lasting long. It would be a **** situation all the way around and the majority would not stand a chance in a prolonged TEOTWAWKI world. Last edited by MrFancyPants; 06-03-2023 at 8:15 AM..
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#14
06-05-2023, 12:48 AM
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To my way of thinking, you should, simultaneously, be prepared for both contingencies. However, each requires a different thought process. Bugging-out... to where? Those who think they're simply going to wander around the forest/hills/wastelands and survive are deluding themselves in today's world. Such is why, generally speaking, most advise that if your plan is to 'bug-out,' then you need to have someplace to bug-out to. It also requires a mode of transporting yourself that is reliable, innocuous, yet capable of dealing with exigencies. Let's be realistic. Few are going to have a "Landmaster" waiting to roll.  Bugging-in? That puts one into Hillary Clinton territory of: "It takes a village." It's one thing to be in a small, rural community where you already know your neighbors and are more likely to provide aid to one another. It's something different, in many respects, to live in an urban neighborhood apartment complex. Either way, you will likely discover a certain 'survival in numbers' mindset takes hold and you will have to be ready and willing to adapt to what that portends. You might find yourself having to share resources and, in all likelihood, being dependent on others for certain types of resources. That's not an entirely 'bad' thing in that such is how civilization was able to develop in that it allowed individuals to play to their strengths and make a more meaningful contribution to the group. However, it also means that "you" may find that someone else has been empowered to make the decisions and, while you may not agree with all the decisions, you will likely be outnumbered and to remain a part of the 'community,' you will be expected to comply or be 'expelled.' There is no 'superior' answer. Neither is 'everyone' in a position to effectively prep for both scenarios. Yet, both scenarios involve, to one degree or another, dependence (sooner or later) on other people. Think you're going to bug-out to a place and find yourself welcomed if you're not considered 'part of the community' if it's TEOTWAWKI? You might want to give that some additional thought. Think you're going to bug-in and survive as a rugged individualist who can indefinitely remain 'isolated' from other survivors? You might want to give that some additional thought as well. Either way, part of your 'prepping' will, inevitably, have to include contingencies for dealing with others; albeit, in all types of circumstances. What was the 2nd thing listed to know about TEOTWAWKI? That... For many, circumstances will trump preparedness?
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#15
06-05-2023, 4:19 AM
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I agree with TrappedinCalifornia. Bugging in or bugging out depends on the circumstances.
If bugging out, you need to have a place to go. Otherwise, the people in the place you end up in may look at you as an "invader". You're a stranger, and not to be trusted. Especially if you start looking for handouts. Bugging in will depend on the type of crisis, and the time of year. I live in the Central Valley. So, a loss of power for extended time in the summer will be close to unbearable, since one will also lose water. One needs to have plans for multiple scenarios, and be flexible with those plans, No plans survives the first 30 seconds of contact with the enemy. 
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#16
06-05-2023, 11:11 AM
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My takeaway from this interesting thread as well as current economic conditions is that skilled trades are as valuable (or more) than resource stockpiling. A roving group of theoretical raiders would simply kill Joe Schmoe for his 200lbs of freeze dried mashed potatoes, but if he was a gunsmith or CNC machinist he could bring sustained value
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#17
06-05-2023, 12:10 PM
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But, your point is a legitimate part of the discussion in terms of contingencies for dealing with others. For instance... 25 Skills You Can Trade After SHTF
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#18
06-06-2023, 5:42 AM
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In reality, nobody will know how to survive the actual end of the world as we know it until you're there...
Prepping might get you and yours thru an "event" like an earthquake or riot or maybe a pandemic, but the end of the world is an entirely different situation... Good luck my friends...
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#19
06-06-2023, 7:05 AM
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Why do people joke about this kind of thing? When people tell me this, I make a mental note to turn them away at the gate unless they bring something to the table, usually they don?t.
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#20
06-06-2023, 2:40 PM
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#21
06-06-2023, 7:33 PM
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If you haven't seen it or seen it in awhile, the full episode can be watched free... Here. It's just the sort of thing which creates a quandary many can't bring themselves to face, let alone resolve. Even Serling himself couldn't see himself living in the aftermath...
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#22
06-07-2023, 3:28 AM
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The religion/cult I was raised in teaches that one is not supposed to "prepare", we are instead to trust that God will take care of us. My belief is that God gave me a brain, and expects me to use it. I no longer am part of that religion/cult.
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#23
06-07-2023, 10:10 PM
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  I take it as roughly akin to what we're discussing. It's one thing to 'prep' as best one can as a 'cushion' against a variety of eventualities. It's something else to become overly focused and/or dependent upon "One Thing" that they forget things like "circumstances will trump preparedness" and "Most survivalists and preppers are overly optimistic when it comes to how much food store, what scenarios to plan for, and their ability to survive off the grid." Put another way, it's like most self-defense situations. The 'faith' you should have and the 'preparation' you should take is to avoid such a situation to begin with. If avoidance isn't possible, explore your alternatives. Then, if your diligence fails, have faith that God will provide an 'out' or accept that His plan was that this was 'your time' as you had no more left to do in this Life. Just don't expect that God's default will always be to feed you using ravens as he did Elijah or that the barrel of meal wasted not, neither did the cruse of oil fail (see 1 King 17 if you're unfamiliar with the reference). While it is a good thing to have faith that He can do it. It's not necessarily a 'bad' thing to be prepared, just in case God had other priorities at that moment.
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#24
06-08-2023, 4:18 AM
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We were also told to constantly work scenarios out in our heads, or talk about them if we have a partner, and try to figure out ways of dealing with things before they happen. Which is what threads like this are good for.
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#25
06-08-2023, 7:13 AM
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Interesting thread. I don?t expect the end off the world but all my prep is at home. Plenty of extras, food, weapons, medicine, medical stuff.
We are prepared for an earthquake sort of event, where we Bug out Inside our home. I?am too old to hike out anywhere and don?t plan on driving anywhere. I don?t expect anything to last more than a few weeks. The wife and I will feed you. We split our time between Here and Bangkok. We have no weapons in Bangkok but plenty of food. This conversation doesn?t happen in Thailand anyway. My adult kids and grandkids in my area do have a 30 day food/water/medical kit supply and all have guns and training to use them. But like me, don?t prep as a hobby. Be well Bob
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May the Bridges I burn light the way. Life Is Not About Waiting For The Storm To Pass - Its About Learning To Dance In The Rain. Fewer people are killed with all rifles each year (323 in 2011) than with shotguns (356), hammers and clubs (496), and hands and feet (728).
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#26
06-08-2023, 10:24 AM
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I AM NOT SUGGESTING THIS AS A SURVIVAL PLAN
Anyone know where I can the State/Fed plan for SHTF/TEOTWAWKI? I found my city plan and have volunteered in some of their exercises. But I think it would be a good read to see what the gov will attempt.
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#27
06-08-2023, 12:09 PM
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The simple fact is that State/Federal Governments cannot be 'everywhere' at once nor can those levels of Government afford to keep supplies handy and ready to distribute in any meaningful manner. Think about the COVID response and how disjointed it was among the States, how there was a dearth of supplies to be distributed, etc. and the time it took to even 'gear up' certain industries to produce PPE for even Government actors to use, let alone the population-at-large. Even then, 'gaps' were discovered in the training and protocols in terms of simply how workers should don such PPE. In both instances, communication, on a macro scale, was still functional. Yet, on a local level, communication between State/Federal agencies and local entities was an on-going "work in progress." There's also the fact that State/Federal agencies are each tasked with their own niches/concerns. As an example, here is the Federal DOJ's GUIDANCE TO STATE AND LOCAL GOVERNMENTS AND OTHER FEDERALLY ASSISTED RECIPIENTS ENGAGED IN EMERGENCY PREPAREDNESS, RESPONSE, MITIGATION, AND RECOVERY ACTIVITIES ON COMPLIANCE WITH TITLE VI OF THE CIVIL RIGHTS ACT OF 1964. What's the emphasis? Quote:
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In fact, they wanted to know how I even knew about the exercise and were 'shocked' when I told them. I was told any further inquiries should be directed to the Pentagon and was then informed that they were not at liberty to discuss it. True story. The bottom line is that there are so many possibilities related to TEOTWAWKI, that no, single 'guide' or 'manual' or agency can be expected to cover them all. As an indication, here is the California Governor's Office of Emergency Services... Catastrophic Planning. On that page, you will find links to... Catastrophic Incident Base Plan; Southern California Catastrophic Earthquake Plan, 2022; Northern California Catastrophic Flood Response Plan; Bay Area Earthquake Plan; and Cascadia Subduction Zone - Earthquake and Tsunami Response Plan. Do those represent the only scenarios which could lead to TEOTWAWKI? I'll let you be the judge. But, in direct answer to your query, that's a place to start.
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#29
06-08-2023, 9:59 PM
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However IIRC "Boat People" had over 90% survival in rickety boats on open ocean. IMO simple low cost drones will be extremely important to avoid all sorts of trouble either on the move or when trouble is no the move, and I'm not much worried about "used against you". If someone has equip to zone in on your drone controller figure you are outclassed and might as well join Negin, but for 99.99% of encounters getting drone recon info will be the deciding factor. You could likely find massive caches of ammo and even guns, and those would still be around in 10 years, but a functioning $300 drone is not going to be found, much less downloads from DJI in China.
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#30
06-09-2023, 10:49 AM
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I'm afraid me and my wife are too old t go the 'survival route'.
I've got bad knees and my wife has a multitude of issues and is too used to the good life to go 'stone age'. Of course I will do what I can to defend us and keep us going for as long as possible. It will be a matter of time before the authorities (if there are any left) or roving bands of brigands get to and overwhelm us. Go down fighting as they say. Nevertheless, I will be rooting for whomever can to survive the holocaust and lead good people into the new brave world and stave off the evil wherever it is.
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#31
06-14-2023, 6:11 AM
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In keeping with it being a 'gun forum'...
Short and Long Versions... The point is that TEOTWAWKI is defined differently by each individual. Some strongly advise against any semi-auto while others, such as Harrell, recommend them at some level. Still others claim their semi-auto rifle should be sufficiently powerful to take a deer; but, that might just depend on where you are located, not to mention what's available to supplement the pot. It's why I started this thread. Everyone needs to determine for themselves how they choose to define TEOTWAWKI and what they are capable of financially, physically, et al. in terms of adapting to and surviving it. Then they need to think about the list provided in the OP and Post #7. Then pick your likeliest scenarios, all the while understanding that "improvise, adapt, and overcome" is an expression for a reason and that most of the videos, books, magazines, etc. on the subject are there to capture dollars and views, not necessarily to provide a cohesive, 'follow this if...' strategy. Remember, survival is easy for armchair quarterbacks and, ultimately, how you prepare and what you prepare for may not be TEOTWAWKI scenario which plays out for you. Which is why most survivalists and preppers are overly optimistic when it comes to how much food store, what scenarios to plan for, and their ability to survive off the grid. Put succinctly, the person or persons who will survive don't necessarily have 'the most gear/supplies' stashed away. Those who survive will be the ones who can adapt by making what they have work and can 'get or make more' if it's called for. It's one of the reasons why, in the book Earth Abides (1949), the hero, Isherwood Williams, wanted to preserve the library so that the accumulated knowledge of mankind was not lost and could be used. What he discovered is that it didn't take long before no one could read what was in there and they had fallen back on the idea that 'experience is the best teacher.' In other words, as I said before, 'prepping' provides a cushion which allows one to survive; but, it is not necessarily a valid, long-term plan for 'rebuilding' what has ended. It's kinda why I like the end of Blast From The Past... It's something that didn't make any of the list versions I've seen, to wit... Don't spend so much time, energy, and resources on how you will survive the future and forget to live in the present.
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