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  #1  
Old 05-14-2019, 7:11 AM
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Default DOJ recently confused on Intrafamilial Transfers

So we've been doing interstate intrafamilial transfers since...forever basically. We've been doing the 1-30 exemption for them as soon as we found out it was valid to do that. Our first 5-10 no issues.

The last 3 or so CA DOJ seems to be completely confused as to what we're doing. They are telling us to re-DROS as C&Rs. They are asking for COEs. My latest one today the person reaching out to told me to cancel and re-DROS them as "Intrafamilial Transfers". I told them I'd love to do that (sent DES screenshot) if there was an option for it.

Have any of you that process these had DOJ recently out in the past 1-2 months completely confused on the type of transaction? Each time DOJ is telling me to cancel and re-do. I tell them no and why. I've not had any issues with my rebuttals, but don't understand why they are only recently confused.

This latest one they are telling me on their side it says "C&R" as the type of transaction even though the screenshot I sent them shows I selected "Exempt Handgun". I have no idea how effed up the backend system is. It's quite possible all these records are getting put into the backend differently then what you are seeing on your DES screens if the transaction type is being screwed up.
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Old 05-14-2019, 9:08 AM
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We do a lot. Never had the problems you’re describing.
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Old 05-14-2019, 9:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by acespawnshop View Post
We do a lot. Never had the problems youíre describing.
The person today said she was new...maybe I'm getting all the newbies..
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Old 05-14-2019, 12:18 PM
BONECUTTER BONECUTTER is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ugimports View Post
So we've been doing interstate intrafamilial transfers since...forever basically. We've been doing the 1-30 exemption for them as soon as we found out it was valid to do that.
Did you find something in the PC showing this is legal or based on conversations/correspondence with CADOJ?

In the PC I do not see any exemption when going though a dealer.

Quote:
27535.
(a) No person shall make an application to purchase more than one handgun within any 30-day period.

(b) Subdivision (a) shall not apply to any of the following:

(1) Any law enforcement agency.

(2) Any agency duly authorized to perform law enforcement duties.

(3) Any state or local correctional facility.

(4) Any private security company licensed to do business in California.

(5) Any person who is properly identified as a full-time paid peace officer, as defined in Chapter 4.5 (commencing with Section 830) of Title 3 of Part 2, and who is authorized to, and does carry a firearm during the course and scope of employment as a peace officer.

(6) Any motion picture, television, or video production company or entertainment or theatrical company whose production by its nature involves the use of a firearm.

(7) Any person who may, pursuant to Article 2 (commencing with Section 27600), Article 3 (commencing with Section 27650), or Article 4 (commencing with Section 27700), claim an exemption from the waiting period set forth in Section 27540. (More LEO exemptions for Agencies/ Importers)

(8) Any transaction conducted through a licensed firearms dealer pursuant to Chapter 5 (commencing with Section 28050). (PPT's)

(9) Any person who is licensed as a collector pursuant to Chapter 44 (commencing with Section 921) of Title 18 of the United States Code and the regulations issued pursuant thereto, and has a current certificate of eligibility issued by the Department of Justice pursuant to Article 1 (commencing with Section 26700) of Chapter 2.

(10) The exchange of a handgun where the dealer purchased that firearm from the person seeking the exchange within the 30-day period immediately preceding the date of exchange or replacement.

(11) The replacement of a handgun when the personís handgun was lost or stolen, and the person reported that firearm lost or stolen pursuant to Section 25250 prior to the completion of the application to purchase the replacement handgun.

(12) The return of any handgun to its owner.

(13) A community college that is certified by the Commission on Peace Officer Standards and Training to present the law enforcement academy basic course or other commission-certified law enforcement training.
I feel like you call DOJ and they are getting Owlaws confused with what the dealer is required to do. They give wrong advise all the time.

Just like they tell people all the time that their parent out of state can just ship them the firearm and they can oplaw it, cause they don't care about federal law.
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  #5  
Old 05-14-2019, 12:52 PM
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Reference here: https://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/....php?t=1058641

On Nov 26 2018 I received this from my DOJ rep:
Quote:
Interfamilial transfers are exempt from the 1 handgun in 30 days law.

DROS as Exempt Handgun, type Operation of Law in the Comments field, and select the 30-day Restriction Exemption.
In response to my email of:
Quote:
Are out of state intrafamily transfers exempt from the 1 handgun per 30 days rule?

If yes, how do I process the DROS for those?

We occasionally have customers that are gifted 2-3 handguns from their parents/kids and have been processing them over the course of multiple months. I just read that another FFL in Southern California was told there was a procedure to DROS these as 1-in-30 exempt and I wanted to confirm the steps for future transactions.
So I've been going on the instructions I was given.

We put the following in our comments:
SB 15 EXEMPT - 27870PC INTRAFAMILY TRANSFER, 12133PC ROSTER EXEMPT; OPERATION OF LAW 1-IN-30 EXEMPT
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Last edited by ugimports; 05-14-2019 at 12:54 PM.. Reason: added comments
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  #6  
Old 05-14-2019, 1:15 PM
kingransom kingransom is online now
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Call the doj 5 times and ask the same question to 5 different agents, you'll receive 5 different answers. The majority of them don't have an fn clue.. sadly, if you follow their instructions you may potentially find yourself in trouble down the road with zero recourse against them for providing erroneous information
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  #7  
Old 05-14-2019, 1:19 PM
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Originally Posted by kingransom View Post
Call the doj 5 times and ask the same question to 5 different agents, you'll receive 5 different answers. The majority of them don't have an fn clue.. sadly, if you follow their instructions you may potentially find yourself in trouble down the road with zero recourse against them for providing erroneous information
I didn't call, thanks. The people on the phone will not provide anything in writing. I have something in writing that has worked since November 2018.
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  #8  
Old 05-14-2019, 1:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ugimports View Post

On Nov 26 2018 I received this from my DOJ rep:

Interfamilial transfers are exempt from the 1 handgun in 30 days law.
This is correct.

Quote:
DROS as Exempt Handgun, type Operation of Law in the Comments field, and select the 30-day Restriction Exemption.
This seems like made up Mumbo Jumbo. The Oplaw form has its own PC

27875 & 27920 under the "Exceptions to the Requirement of Using a Dealer for a Private Party Firearms Transaction" Section.

Section B is for importing into the state that we know is not legally unless the firearm is specifically willed to the person.

But the DROS 1 in 30 is different. "No person shall make an application to purchase more than one handgun within any 30-day period."

Unless A, B, C, D, ect.

I feel you are just getting people who didn't understand the question and tried to come up with an answer.
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  #9  
Old 05-14-2019, 2:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BONECUTTER View Post
This is correct.



This seems like made up Mumbo Jumbo. The Oplaw form has its own PC

27875 & 27920 under the "Exceptions to the Requirement of Using a Dealer for a Private Party Firearms Transaction" Section.

Section B is for importing into the state that we know is not legally unless the firearm is specifically willed to the person.

But the DROS 1 in 30 is different. "No person shall make an application to purchase more than one handgun within any 30-day period."

Unless A, B, C, D, ect.

I feel you are just getting people who didn't understand the question and tried to come up with an answer.
My rep has no problem telling me No or I don't know. She has done it with other questions in the past. So I doubt she would give me made up instructions and would just come up with an answer. It's possible though. The person I contacted isn't a random person that you get when you call. All of us are assigned a rep with CA DOJ. That is who I contacted. I didn't keep emailing some random info@doj.gov until I got an answer I wanted. I emailed a specific named person when I asked the question.

I've emailed her other things where she told me she had to go check or wasn't sure. I don't see why she wouldn't have done so this time if she wasn't sure.

ETA: I'll add that the person who processed the DROS today that prompted my post was new. She was communicating with her supervisor on the back end. After I provided information on why I believe the transaction to be 1-30 exempt they accepted it. So if they are all confused then I guess my customers benefit. At some point in the future if they tell me they had it all wrong, I'll stop. For now I'm following the directions I was given and they seem to process them ok. Honestly, I make more money if the customer has to come back every month for 3-6 months. Doing it all at once saves money for the customer and time though.
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Last edited by ugimports; 05-14-2019 at 2:06 PM..
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  #10  
Old 05-14-2019, 2:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BONECUTTER View Post
...
Just like they tell people all the time that their parent out of state can just ship them the firearm and they can oplaw it, cause they don't care about federal law.
What I was told by the CA DOJ is that they got the information from the Sacramento BATF. There was other bad info as well, so it may not be their fault.
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