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  #1  
Old 03-27-2023, 7:18 PM
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FalconLair FalconLair is offline
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Default Step dad passed, left my sister his guns

My mom passed in 2018, her then husband remained in the house until his passing last month - in his trust he listed my sister as his sole beneficiary to everything his had, ALL possessions, as outlined in the trust, not much itemization

although NOT specifically mentioned in the trust, he had 5 guns he owned - she wants to transfer them into her name but we are not positive about CA laws regarding her being a beneficiary to his belongings, namely the guns

he didn't really have much at time of death, some furnishings, a 4 year old Ford truck, tools, table machinery and the guns - the house belongs to me, my brother and sister

she asked me what she can do about transferring the guns, I'm not sure where she stands under CA laws, told her I'd post up and see the replies, maybe somebody here has been through it and can relate the experience

thx
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  #2  
Old 03-27-2023, 7:20 PM
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I think she can just take them. That's what people I know did in the same situation.
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Old 03-27-2023, 7:24 PM
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Librarian had a good post in the laws forum section on how intrafamilial transfers work with a nice guide. Check there.

https://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/...8&postcount=10
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Old 03-27-2023, 7:27 PM
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I think she can just take them. That's what people I know did in the same situation.
She already has them, she's concerned about legalities plus she's not even sure if he bought them in California and went through the process or brought them with him when he moved to California from Oregon over 15 years ago
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Old 03-27-2023, 7:29 PM
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Last time I checked, i think it?s 19.00 to the DoJ and that?s for a good amount of guns per application/notice.
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  #6  
Old 03-27-2023, 7:29 PM
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Librarian had a good post in the laws forum section on how intrafamilial transfers work with a nice guide. Check there.

https://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/...8&postcount=10
step dad I'm sure intrafamilial doesn't apply
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Old 03-27-2023, 7:50 PM
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I?m pretty sure she just has to submit a form and $19 to transfer them into her name
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Old 03-27-2023, 9:40 PM
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Fill out this form 5 times, check "Estate Executor" as to where you got them, send them all in with a $19 check. Done.
https://oag.ca.gov/sites/all/files/a...orms/oplaw.pdf
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Old 03-27-2023, 10:29 PM
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Fill out this form 5 times, check "Estate Executor" as to where you got them, send them all in with a $19 check. Done.
https://oag.ca.gov/sites/all/files/a...orms/oplaw.pdf
But OP referred to a trust, which would not have an executor but a trustee and we do not know who the trustee is. Nor do we know if the firearms are trust property. OP said "ALL possessions, as outlined in the trust" but who on this forum knows what that means? Sister needs to contact the attorney who prepared the trust to ascertain her options.
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Old 03-27-2023, 11:08 PM
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That’s sexist in all the wrong ways.
Gun BURN on the boys in the family.

Lol
Just joking…
















On the square.
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  #11  
Old 03-27-2023, 11:09 PM
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But OP referred to a trust, which would not have an executor but a trustee and we do not know who the trustee is. Nor do we know if the firearms are trust property. OP said "ALL possessions, as outlined in the trust" but who on this forum knows what that means? Sister needs to contact the attorney who prepared the trust to ascertain her options.
my bad, should've mentioned that my sister is both trustee and beneficiary of his trust - I've somewhat concluded that ALL possessions would include his firearms, we just didn't know if firearms could be legally passed through a trust even if said firearms aren't specifically named

being California I wasn't really sure what the law would be or how a legal transfer would be done

I'm just hoping that there isn't some horsesh** laws in place that prevents her from keeping the guns
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Old 03-28-2023, 6:09 AM
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Originally Posted by FalconLair View Post
my bad, should've mentioned that my sister is both trustee and beneficiary of his trust - I've somewhat concluded that ALL possessions would include his firearms, we just didn't know if firearms could be legally passed through a trust even if said firearms aren't specifically named

being California I wasn't really sure what the law would be or how a legal transfer would be done

I'm just hoping that there isn't some horsesh** laws in place that prevents her from keeping the guns
I'm not the trust expert on this forum but see no reason why the guns could not be trust property. My understanding is that normally there is what is called a pour over will that transfers all property not in the trust to the trust upon the trustor's death.
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Old 03-28-2023, 9:14 AM
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I believe Librarian recently posted that in such a situation, where the intrfamiliar exception to the use of a FFL does not fly since this is a step-father, the trustee just does a PPT as the transferor and the transferee.
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Old 03-28-2023, 12:02 PM
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Personally, I'd just take them and not do any paperwork.
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Old 03-28-2023, 1:26 PM
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I'm not the trust expert on this forum but see no reason why the guns could not be trust property. My understanding is that normally there is what is called a pour over will that transfers all property not in the trust to the trust upon the trustor's death.
Yes, pour over, even after death is contained in the trust
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Old 03-29-2023, 5:09 PM
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I don't recall if assets subject to a pour-over become subject to distribution outside of probate under the trust, or if they first must be probated wheher by a so-called summary probate. My gut tells me without probate. They pour over into the trust at moment of death. I could be wrong.

Just took a peek at a paper hanger's web site and it says I am correct. Brownie points for me, but no brownies or Girl Scout Cookies.

Last edited by Chewy65; 03-29-2023 at 5:13 PM..
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Old 04-04-2023, 7:42 PM
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Originally Posted by Chewy65 View Post
I don't recall if assets subject to a pour-over become subject to distribution outside of probate under the trust, or if they first must be probated wheher by a so-called summary probate. My gut tells me without probate. They pour over into the trust at moment of death. I could be wrong.

Just took a peek at a paper hanger's web site and it says I am correct. Brownie points for me, but no brownies or Girl Scout Cookies.
Depends on the assets and their value. Typically, in California, they won't have to be probated if the assets are less than $184,500.
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Old 04-04-2023, 7:57 PM
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Can we assume the the decedent was a resident of California, and the property is located within California?
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Old 04-04-2023, 8:09 PM
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It's not a problem
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Old 04-04-2023, 8:35 PM
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So the law here can get pretty hairy. And by that I mean confusing. Really confusing.

I'm actually an attorney, and estate planning/probate are part of my practice.

There are certain exceptions to the usual laws for intra-familial transfer of firearms. There are also some exceptions for "operation of law" transfers. DOJ uses the same form for both.

Inheritance of firearms are always "operation of law", but are not necessarily "intra-familial", and based on what the DOJ has said (but not on any law or caselaw) the DOJ does not consider step-parents/children "immediate family members" for purposes of intra-familial transfers.

HOWEVER operation of law transfers do NOT need to go through an FFL.

See CA Penal Code ? 27920 https://codes.findlaw.com/ca/penal-code/pen-sect-27920/

Also see CA Penal Code ? 16990 https://codes.findlaw.com/ca/penal-c...ect-16990.html

Also see this DOJ statement: https://oag.ca.gov/firearms/online-r...earms%20dealer.

BUT, things may get a bit more interesting if the decedent and the property in question is located out State. It's not a situation that has actually come up for me in a long time, but it may make the situation more complicated. The last time I dealt with that particular question was over a decade ago, and I'd have to brush up on what has changed, which I'm guessing is a wee bit (sigh).

Note:
1) The transferee must have a valid FSC (easy to get, take you 5 minutes).
2) The type of weapons involved may have particular requirements. (e.g., registered assault weapons, etc.)
3) The transferee must not be a person prohibited from owning firearms

ALSO NOTE: THIS IS NOT LEGAL ADVICE. I AM NOT YOUR ATTORNEY. I AM NOT ADVISING YOU TO TAKE OR NOT TAKE A PARTICULAR COURSE OF ACTION.

I HIGHLY RECOMMEND THAT YOU RETAIN COMPETENT LEGAL COUNSEL TO ADVISE YOU INSTEAD OF RELYING ON RANDOM ADVICE IN A FORUM.
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