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  #1  
Old 07-14-2020, 1:29 PM
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Default Dispostion of C&R for Non-Licensee and Acquisition Questions

Do we still have to go through an FFL01 and file the 4473?

Also when we Acquire a Firearm that was shipped by a family member to our FFL03 how do we file it if hey are also an FFL03?

Also what do we put for color for a wood stock and blued barrel Rifle?
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Old 07-14-2020, 2:09 PM
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You will need to include much more detail on each of those separate questions. Type of gun, state you reside in, state that the person sending you the gun resides in, if sender and recipient are both CA residents whether a direct family relationship exists, etc.
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Old 07-14-2020, 2:16 PM
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It is a FN Mauser manufactured in 1948. Bolt action in state CA transaction. I know I can do the intrafamilial transfer but would prefer to use my FFL03 on it.
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Old 07-14-2020, 2:27 PM
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Unless some local law (which should be preempted) prohibits it, any seller in California can directly transfer the FN Mauser (50 years old) to someone who holds both a current C&R FFL and a current COE. The acquisition is logged into the buyer’s bound book and the buyer then submits the in-state acquisition form to the California DoJ.
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Old 07-14-2020, 2:47 PM
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Originally Posted by Milsurp1 View Post
Unless some local law (which should be preempted) prohibits it, any seller in California can directly transfer the FN Mauser (50 years old) to someone who holds both a current C&R FFL and a current COE. The acquisition is logged into the buyer’s bound book and the buyer then submits the in-state acquisition form to the California DoJ.
Thanks. What do I log for Color for a wood stock and blued barrel?
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Old 07-14-2020, 3:41 PM
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When we FFL03 dispose can we do it without going to an FFL01 if its from our own collection.?

Authorized:
May acquire and dispose of curios or relics at any location.
May dispose of curios and relics to a licensee or a nonlicensee residing in the same State, who is not otherwise prohibited by the GCA, and to any other Federal firearms licensee in any State.
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Old 07-14-2020, 3:42 PM
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Depends on whether the buyer has a C&R and COE or is parent/grandparent/ or adult son / grandson.
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Old 07-14-2020, 3:50 PM
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Originally Posted by Milsurp1 View Post
Depends on whether the buyer has a C&R and COE or is parent/grandparent/ or adult son / grandson.
This would be to a non-licensee who is not a family member. Thanks for your time.
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Old 07-14-2020, 3:52 PM
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Then it has to go through an FFL dealer.
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Old 07-14-2020, 10:08 PM
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Assuming you have a valid C&R 03-FFL and valid COE...

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Originally Posted by CartridgeCalls View Post
Do we still have to go through an FFL01 and file the 4473?
If you are selling the C&R firearm within CA, then it must be transferred through a CA FFL dealer. [PC 27545]
Exemption to this: if the C&R firearm is a C&R long gun and the buyer has a valid C&R 03-FFL and valid COE, then it can be done via cash & carry type transfer. [PC 27966]

If you are selling the C&R firearm in another State, then it must be transferred to a person with a valid C&R 03-FFL or transferred through a FFL dealer in that State. [18 USC 922(a)(3)&(5)]

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Originally Posted by CartridgeCalls View Post
Also when we Acquire a Firearm that was shipped by a family member to our FFL03 how do we file it if hey are also an FFL03?
If the immediate family member is a CA resident and the C&R firearm is a C&R handgun, then submit a "Report of Intra-Familial Firearm Transaction" within 30 days of receiving the firearm. [PC 27875(a)]

If the immediate family member is a CA resident and the C&R firearm is a C&R long gun, then submit either a "Collector In-State Acquisition of Curio or Relic Long Gun Report" or a "Report of Intra-Familial Firearm Transaction" within 30 days of receiving the firearm. [PC 27875(a) and 27966]

If the family member is not an immediate family member and is a CA resident and the C&R firearm is a C&R handgun, then the transfer must be done through a CA FFL dealer. [PC 27545]

If the family member is not an immediate family member and is a CA resident and the C&R firearm is a C&R long gun, then submit either a "Collector In-State Acquisition of Curio or Relic Long Gun Report" within 30 days of receiving the firearm. [PC 27966]

If the family member is not a CA resident and the C&R firearm is being imported into CA, then it must be transferred through a CA FFL dealer. [PC 27585(a)]
Exemption to this: if you physically leave CA, acquire the C&R firearm while out-of-state, bring the C&R firearm back to CA, and submit a "Curio or Relic Firearm Report" within 5 days of returning to CA. [PC 27585(b)(1) and 27565]
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  #11  
Old 07-15-2020, 6:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Quiet View Post
Assuming you have a valid C&R 03-FFL and valid COE...



If you are selling the C&R firearm within CA, then it must be transferred through a CA FFL dealer. [PC 27545]
Exemption to this: if the C&R firearm is a C&R long gun and the buyer has a valid C&R 03-FFL and valid COE, then it can be done via cash & carry type transfer. [PC 27966]

If you are selling the C&R firearm in another State, then it must be transferred to a person with a valid C&R 03-FFL or transferred through a FFL dealer in that State. [18 USC 922(a)(3)&(5)]


If the immediate family member is a CA resident and the C&R firearm is a C&R handgun, then submit a "Report of Intra-Familial Firearm Transaction" within 30 days of receiving the firearm. [PC 27875(a)]

If the immediate family member is a CA resident and the C&R firearm is a C&R long gun, then submit either a "Collector In-State Acquisition of Curio or Relic Long Gun Report" or a "Report of Intra-Familial Firearm Transaction" within 30 days of receiving the firearm. [PC 27875(a) and 27966]

If the family member is not an immediate family member and is a CA resident and the C&R firearm is a C&R handgun, then the transfer must be done through a CA FFL dealer. [PC 27545]

If the family member is not an immediate family member and is a CA resident and the C&R firearm is a C&R long gun, then submit either a "Collector In-State Acquisition of Curio or Relic Long Gun Report" within 30 days of receiving the firearm. [PC 27966]

If the family member is not a CA resident and the C&R firearm is being imported into CA, then it must be transferred through a CA FFL dealer. [PC 27585(a)]
Exemption to this: if you physically leave CA, acquire the C&R firearm while out-of-state, bring the C&R firearm back to CA, and submit a "Curio or Relic Firearm Report" within 5 days of returning to CA. [PC 27585(b)(1) and 27565]
Thanks for the clarification. I didn't realize there was a different form for "Curio or Relic Firearm Report" and "Collector In-State Acquisition of Curio or Relic Long Gun Report". I just filed a rifle through the CRIS on the COE DOJ website yesterday.
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  #12  
Old 07-15-2020, 10:52 AM
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After Acquiring the rifle and putting it in the books and on the CRIS through DOJ how long do I have to wait to dispose of it?
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Old 07-15-2020, 12:48 PM
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Originally Posted by CartridgeCalls View Post
Thanks. What do I log for Color for a wood stock and blued barrel?
There isn't a Federal requirement to list the color of a firearm in your Federally required bound book.

If you acquire a C&R firearm from another C&R holder, youlist the persons C&R license number as who you acquired it from. You should also receive a copy of their C&R FFL license for your records.
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Old 07-15-2020, 12:51 PM
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Thanks. What do I log for Color for a wood stock and blued barrel?
If you are inquiring about what color to use on a 4473, that would be the color of the receiver.
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What you believe and what is true in real life in the real world aren't necessarily the same thing. And what you believe doesn't change what is true in real life in the real world.
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Old 07-15-2020, 1:09 PM
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Originally Posted by CartridgeCalls View Post
It is a FN Mauser manufactured in 1948. Bolt action in state CA transaction. I know I can do the intrafamilial transfer but would prefer to use my FFL03 on it.
Either way you still have to log it into your C&R bound book.
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What you believe and what is true in real life in the real world aren't necessarily the same thing. And what you believe doesn't change what is true in real life in the real world.
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Old 07-15-2020, 1:12 PM
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After Acquiring the rifle and putting it in the books and on the CRIS through DOJ how long do I have to wait to dispose of it?
Why did you acquire it?

If you acquired it with the internet to transfer it to another person, you have violated Federal law. It's unlawful to use your C&R license to buy firearms for others.
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What you believe and what is true in real life in the real world aren't necessarily the same thing. And what you believe doesn't change what is true in real life in the real world.
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Old 07-16-2020, 5:24 AM
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I purchased it but after closer inspection noticed it was not int he shape I wanted it. I did not buy it for the intent of selling it.
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Old 07-16-2020, 5:45 AM
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I purchased it but after closer inspection noticed it was not int he shape I wanted it. I did not buy it for the intent of selling it.
There aren't any restrictions on time held in your collection. But I wouldn't make a habit of disposing as soon as you acquire.

That would look like you were buying and selling and not collecting.
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Old 07-16-2020, 6:35 AM
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Quote:
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Thanks. What do I log for Color for a wood stock and blued barrel?
Logically, brown for wood and blued for the barrel.
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Old 07-18-2020, 6:14 AM
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Thanks everyone
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Old 07-20-2020, 7:13 AM
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When disposing to a non licensee at FFL01 (Turners) in my book for my disposition do I put turners and address or FFL number or PPT and name of recipient and address?

Turners would not provide rheir ffl information
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Old 07-22-2020, 5:18 AM
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As an FFL03 are we still limited to the 6 DROS per year for log guns?
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Old 07-22-2020, 6:27 AM
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When disposing to a non licensee at FFL01 (Turners) in my book for my disposition do I put turners and address or FFL number or PPT and name of recipient and address?

Turners would not provide rheir ffl information
Turners. Just use the business name and address.

You are not disposing of it to the person. You are disposing of it to Turner's , who then transferred it to the person.
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Old 07-22-2020, 6:29 AM
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As an FFL03 are we still limited to the 6 DROS per year for log guns?
Federally you are not limited. If state law has a limit on transfers you have to obey state laws.

Having a federal C&R license doesn't exempt you from all state laws.
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Old 07-22-2020, 10:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CartridgeCalls View Post
As an FFL03 are we still limited to the 6 DROS per year for log guns?
Federally you are not limited. If state law has a limit on transfers you have to obey state laws.

Having a federal C&R license doesn't exempt you from all state laws.
Having a valid C&R 03-FFL and valid COE does not exempt you from CA laws limiting how many transaction you can legally perform in CA.

Still limited to: [PC 26520]
1. less than six transactions per calendar year. [PC 16730(a)(1)]
2. no more than 50 firearms total per calendar year. [PC 16730(a)(2)]

However, transfers of C&R firearms, from a person with a valid C&R 03-FFL and valid COE, to CA FFL dealers are exempt from the limit amounts. [PC 26585]
^Selling C&R firearms to a CA FFL dealer.
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Last edited by Quiet; 07-23-2020 at 6:42 AM..
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Old 07-23-2020, 6:06 AM
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Thanks for the clarification. If we transfer from FFL03+COE to FFL03+COE it will not count either for C&R rifles only or am I misreading the text?
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Old 07-23-2020, 6:41 AM
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Thanks for the clarification. If we transfer from FFL03+COE to FFL03+COE it will not count either for C&R rifles only or am I misreading the text?
If done in CA, transfers to a person with a valid C&R 03-FFL counts towards your limit.

If done in another State, transfers to a person with a valid C&R 03-FFL does not count toward your limit.

In CA, as a person with a valid C&R 03-FFL and valid COE, selling C&R firearms to a CA FFL dealer does not count toward your limit.
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  #28  
Old 01-28-2021, 5:27 AM
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Is it legal to buy a rifle while on vacation using you FFL03+COE and then ship it directly to yourself?
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Old 01-28-2021, 7:17 AM
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I don't see why it would be a problem. You are allowed to acquire outside the state. You have 5 days after importing to file the form. It will ask the date you acquired it and the date it entered CA. It doesn't ask, and the PC doesn't mention "how" it comes into CA - whether driving it in, flying it in, or mailing it in. I'd be careful not to think that makes a loophole allowing you to buy a rifle, say on gunbroker, and have them ship it to you, claiming you "acquired it" out of state by the action of buying it. The intent of the way the PC is written clearly means you physically are in the other state when you acquire.
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Old 01-29-2021, 5:30 AM
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I don't see why it would be a problem. You are allowed to acquire outside the state. You have 5 days after importing to file the form. It will ask the date you acquired it and the date it entered CA. It doesn't ask, and the PC doesn't mention "how" it comes into CA - whether driving it in, flying it in, or mailing it in. I'd be careful not to think that makes a loophole allowing you to buy a rifle, say on gunbroker, and have them ship it to you, claiming you "acquired it" out of state by the action of buying it. The intent of the way the PC is written clearly means you physically are in the other state when you acquire.
thanks for the clarification.

What do I do with firearms that no no serial number? Do I just enter NSN on the form to file?
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Old 01-30-2021, 5:58 AM
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Yes "NSN" is the appropriate entry for C&R firearms which have no serial number.
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