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Centerfire Rifles - Semiautomatic or Gas Operated Centerfire rifles, carbines and other gas operated rifles.

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  #81  
Old 02-15-2020, 1:13 PM
Ki6vsm Ki6vsm is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nodnarb77 View Post
Interesting article. But like what was said in the articles last paragraph, it's not so much the "caliber" as it is the "bullet".
*Disclaimer; I've never used 5.56 on humans and I hope that I never have to. So the following are my opinions based on shooting, reloading, and popping the occasional coyote with various 223 loads over the years.
FMJ/ball rounds are far less lethal than anything that expands, whether that means soft, hollow, ballistic, whatever.
It's pretty common knowledge that the 62gr M855 is not an ideal round for soft targets. The steel penetrator, that was designed to pop Ivans body armor, over stabilizes the round and negates the tumbling. Making through and through wounds more common.
The 55gr XM193 was designed for 20" 1/12 twist barrels moving at ~3000+fps in order to induce yaw. But, when fired out of the more common 16" 1/7,8,or 9 twist barrels it becomes over stabilized, and again, negates tumbling.
The MK262 77gr OTM has a cult-like following and has a solid reputation as to it's lethality downrange.

Me personally, I try to stay stocked up on Hornady 75gr bthp bullets. With 8208 XBR powder they fly around 2600ish fps from my 16" 1/7 rifles. Accurate, and heavy enough to be a great do-all round for this caliber. They're moderately priced enough (~$75/500. Way cheaper than 77smk) so that I can load up on them and actually shoot them without feeling too guilty about the cost.
I also like Hornady's 55gr cannelured soft point bullets. Loaded with H335 powder these fly around 2800ish fps and are even cheaper (~$75/1000) to reload. This is a great plinking round that packs enough *** to be considered for HD.
*Disclaimer; democrats being considered human is a debatable topic.
*Disclaimer; I'm only joking about the dems.
I'd mentioned the M855 earlier here being actually designed for use in 1:9 barrels. They perform better (fly straighter) out of that twist rate, but then the DOD decided to go with 1:7 for tracer compatibly. Perhaps at 1:9 the SS109 bullets would yaw a bit after impact. Hard to say. I might look to see if anyone's done a test of the M855 ammo on ballistic jell using a 1:9 barrel. That twist used to be very common in comm'l spec AR-15s, e.g. older Bushmaster ARs.

I'm with you on the Hornady HPBT bullets. They'd probably behave like SMKs terminally and are less money to buy. I like the 68 and 75 gr HPBTs. I've never bought soft points for loading in 5.56mm ammo, but I may want to try it on targets. See how it flies.


.

Last edited by Ki6vsm; 02-16-2020 at 10:31 AM..
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  #82  
Old 02-16-2020, 8:07 AM
Ki6vsm Ki6vsm is offline
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Five-year old video testing various US military ammo on ballistic soap blocks:

https://www.full30.com/watch/ODMz/m8...her-556mm-ammo

All tests were at close range. 9mm Baretta and a rifle. The AR had a 14.5" barrel with 1:7 twist, so it mimics the ballistics of a service M4 I recon'.
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  #83  
Old 02-16-2020, 10:23 AM
loademup loademup is offline
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55 gr, 62 gr FMJ 5.56...whatever is cheapest at the time. Also a lot of old Norinco .223 Remington I bought in the 1990's. The tin cans and paper I shoot don't seem to care.
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  #84  
Old 02-16-2020, 5:32 PM
ScottsBad ScottsBad is offline
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50 grain ballistic tip, piles of Federal and clone M193, more piles of Federal and clone M855, and something more than 1000 rounds of Mk262 clones IMI and CBC. I'd like to have some Federal Fusion to test out. But I won't need any ammo for a few years...

I've found the Mk262 clones to be far more accurate than the M193 or M855.

One of the biggest problem I've encountered is shift in POI when changing from say, Federal M193 to something like Wolf Gold or PMC M193. Its OK for practice though.
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  #85  
Old 02-16-2020, 5:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogerbutthead View Post
I am pretty sure those medically trained members of those small teams are armed. They were in the Vietnam War and I would think the same is still true.
I know they're currently armed with M9s. I'm not sure if they've been equipped with M4s/M16s. I was an 0311. I don't remember my docs having M16s, but it's been a long time too. I'll be sure to ask the next one I see.

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  #86  
Old 02-16-2020, 5:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Ki6vsm View Post
Actually, velocity related to barrel length was addressed. See post #45.
Not really. That post barely scratched the surface.

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  #87  
Old 02-16-2020, 8:38 PM
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Xm193 & xm855
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  #88  
Old 02-16-2020, 8:44 PM
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Anyone have experience with Hornady's Frontier line? I'm interested to try their 62, 68 & 75 grain stuff.
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  #89  
Old 02-16-2020, 9:09 PM
akjunkie akjunkie is offline
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Lake City or IMI M193, 55gr.
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  #90  
Old 02-16-2020, 10:06 PM
Ki6vsm Ki6vsm is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Transient View Post
Not really. That post barely scratched the surface.

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Maybe. I re-read your post a couple of times. I confess I don't know what "getting up to speed faster" actually means for a bullet. Accelerates more quickly in the barrel I guess? That would make sense for a lighter bullet, all other things being equal.

BTW, I think Force actually = Mass x Acceleration. Not Mass x Velocity. (I think you said 'weight x speed'.) But in all honesty, it's been so long since I was in a physics class I recall this formula too:

Kinetic Energy = 1/2 Mass x (Velocity squared)

But I'll be darned if I know what the practical differences are between force and KE.

EDIT: I did some reading. Mass x Velocity = Momentum.

That's all I have to say about it. LOL I will let someone else explain it if they care to, these three things that all seem kinda related to what happens when bullets hit stuff: Force, momentum, and kinetic energy.

.

Last edited by Ki6vsm; 02-17-2020 at 6:01 AM..
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  #91  
Old 02-17-2020, 9:26 AM
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Brass CASED ONLY, for starters.


Range ammo:

PMC Bronze, Wolf Gold (both are low-powered, FYI), Fiocchi, Remington/UMC and some M193 bulk - all 55gr.



Home defense ammo:

Federal M193, M855, M856 (6th round in ALL my business mags, is a M856 round - so I know that when I hit the tracer, a mag change is forthcoming!)
Winchester Q3131



Vest/Chest rig/battlebelt ammo:

Privi Match 69gr. & 75gr. JHP's
Hornady 75gr. Black/Match/Superperformance Match JHP's


I have some other oddball stuff floating around in one of my 40mm cans, including pre-Q3131 Winchester, Georgia Arms "canned heat," Norinco, Hunting Shack of MT, Ultramax reloads, & some other factory reloaded stuff, the mfgs. of whom I can't even remember! I still have some reloads a buddy of mine & I worked up in anticipation of Y2K (we reloaded 40k of 9mm, .40, .45, 10mm, .223 & .30 carbine, in the 2 years leading up to it)!

That's gonna end up as range ammo, or bottom-of-the-barrel/last-stand ammo some day. Got 12k of the GOOD stuff to work my way through, first.
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  #92  
Old 02-17-2020, 10:21 AM
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M193 is a great plinker and defense round if that’s all is available.
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