Request for Recipe (.308), also info to share

[StoneTower]

Originally Posted by GunNut

I have an Armalite AR10/20''barrel A2. A friend gave me 500 nato brass 7.62x51. I've been loading it for about .35 ea.
Then I discoverd the 7.62X54R CZ Steel case,corrosive berdain primed. I just wanted the bullets. Got a few and pulled them down. they are a 147gr. bullet with 46.2gr. of a stick powder..? Looked like a modern smokless powder. Ammo was made in 1986. So, I started with 42gr of this mystery powder and worked up to 43gr using the same bullets. Thats as far as I'm going. I'm about to run out of case space and they are as hot or a little hotter than federal factory loads. So now I'm loading my 7.62x51 "308" for about .21 ea.

Have you checked the bullet diameter? 7.62 Russian calibers are usually .311 rather than .308. It has to do with measuring to the lands rather than the groves. You may be resizing your bullets and doing God knows what to your barrel. Better check those bullets.

David

[Jicko]

I am looking for a couple of large rifle magnum primers for testing purpose.

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/s....php?p=2256291

[xibunkrlilkidsx]

Originally Posted by Alanski56

My favorite recipe for my Savage 10-FP HS Precision is:

-168 grain Sierra Matchking
-43.0 grains Hodgdon BL-C2
-Lapua .308 brass
-CCI bechrest Primers

What would be a good place to start reloading 175gf SMK with blc2. My Lyman reloading manual doesnt have BLC2 powder listed with the 175 SMK. It has 45 grain max listed in the 168 SMK chart. and randalls post, which has been very useful. thank you. shows 45.2 . Start right about 43gr and move up from there until i start seeing problems?

Hodgdon BL-C2 94.4 45.2 2.9

[GunNut]

Originally Posted by StoneTower

Have you checked the bullet diameter? 7.62 Russian calibers are usually .311 rather than .308. It has to do with measuring to the lands rather than the groves. You may be resizing your bullets and doing God knows what to your barrel. Better check those bullets.

David

Hummmm! Maybe that's why they hold such a tight group. The only problem I have right now is the powder is really nasty! I can only get about 250 rounds out before I have to clean the chamber in my AR10. Thanks for the heads up.

[GunNut]

OH! the 7.62R's measure .310 when pulled. after a heavy taper crimp in nato brass they measure .308 and .310 behind the crimp.

[johnsta]

Anyone have any good recipe's for a 26" Rem 700P?

Its seems loads that approach high levels of pressure do not work for it as well. I have had success with 41.5 grains of Varget with 168smk but I am afraid that the velocity is a little slow for longer range accuracy...

Any ideas?

[xibunkrlilkidsx]

^ im going to start developing my own for my Rem700 varmit. im lookign at using Reloader 15 and BLc2 with 175gr SMK

what do you trim your cases down to. My loading book says max 2.015 OAl and to trim to 2.005.

Im was going through my cases and they are all measuring around 2.020. after 1 firing.

[GunNut]

I trim my case's to the book MIN! They stratch everytime fired and formed. This should give you 2 or 3 reloads before triming is needed. Do Not let them get to long! Big problems there!

[Jicko]

What powder is in FGMM 175SMK? I took one apart last night, it doesn't look like RL15 nor Varget..... it is a longer stick powder.... 42.0gr..... anyone knows??

Is it IMR 4895???? (is H4895 the SAME powder??)

[ar15barrels]

Originally Posted by Jicko

What powder is in FGMM 175SMK? I took one apart last night, it doesn't look like RL15 nor Varget..... it is a longer stick powder.... 42.0gr..... anyone knows??

It's probably not a cannister powder.

Ammo companies load with powders that are enough different from lot-to-lot that they simply develop the load for THAT lot of powder.
These powders are known as non-cannister powders.

Cannister powders are what's sold to reloaders.
Cannister powders are kept more consistent from lot-to-lot so that the same loads can be used with different lots.

I would probably try 4064 with the 175's.

[Slash2]

...is a new to me Savage 99E in .308 with a 20" barrel, 100 new Remington cases, Winchester LR primers, 1lb of IMR 4064, 100 Hornady 165gr SST's and 50 Hornady 165gr GMX (Gilded metal) bullets.

What I need is a good hunting recipe.

[Gnzrme]

Ok, I bought a Redding Big Boss II press, Redding Type S Match Bushing 3-Die Neck Sizer Set, some Lapua 155 gr Scenar's, and SMK's 168's. Have some RE15 and 4895 to use, a few FGMM's and some primmers...Did I get the right dies and I still need a shellholder. What bushing do I get...

[Gnzrme]

tried to pick up some SMK's 175's and Nosler custom bullets, but they were sold out...I got special pricing for the 4th/July and I placed the order at 5pm Pacific time yesterday and the order has already shipped!!!! Gosh I love MidwayUSA!!

[rksimple]

Originally Posted by Gnzrme

Ok, I bought a Redding Big Boss II press, Redding Type S Match Bushing 3-Die Neck Sizer Set, some Lapua 155 gr Scenar's, and SMK's 168's. Have some RE15 and 4895 to use, a few FGMM's and some primmers...Did I get the right dies and I still need a shellholder. What bushing do I get...

I'm partial to the FL bushing dies. I don't neck size.

[Gnzrme]

Originally Posted by rksimple

I'm partial to the FL bushing dies. I don't neck size.

will they work though....

[rksimple]

Originally Posted by Gnzrme

will they work though....

A set of Lee dies will "work." Just depends on what you want to do.

[Darklyte27]

i ot 175s but no 168s for my garand, so i got 155s for now.

[Gnzrme]

I want to make the smallest groups I can with a remy rifle out to 1k.

[rksimple]

Originally Posted by Gnzrme

I want to make the smallest groups I can with a remy rifle out to 1k.

The main difference in neck sizing vs. FL sizing in most all but benchrest rifles is reliability. The difference in accuracy is minimal. When only bumping .001-.002, brass life is nary a concern either.

[Gnzrme]

I thought that you would get better accuracy or consistency out of neck sizing vs full length sizing since your once fired in your own gun is now fire-formed to your bbl and will fit more consistantly.I.E. more accuracy...no?

[rksimple]

Originally Posted by Gnzrme

I thought that you would get better accuracy or consistency out of neck sizing vs full length sizing since your once fired in your own gun is now fire-formed to your bbl and will fit more consistantly.I.E. more accuracy...no?

Thats the theory. I've noticed no difference in my rifles. And reliability trumps any marginal/theoretical gain in accuracy.

[Nom de Guerre]

Originally Posted by rksimple

Thats the theory. I've noticed no difference in my rifles. And reliability trumps any marginal/theoretical gain in accuracy.

I'm in agreement here. I used to just neck size, but now I use a Redding FL/neck bushing sizing die. It does both body and neck sizing steps as well as de-primes your brass in one stroke of the press.

I used to use the 3 die set that you have, and it certainly works fine, but the all in one die saves time if you are planning on FL sizing too.

When I only neck sized, I found that after about 3 - 4 reloads without FL sizing, my rounds were getting a bit sticky to chamber.

In any case, I FL/neck size and also trim the OAL every re-load now.

[ar15barrels]

Originally Posted by Gnzrme

I thought that you would get better accuracy or consistency out of neck sizing vs full length sizing since your once fired in your own gun is now fire-formed to your bbl and will fit more consistantly.I.E. more accuracy...no?

This is true if you are sizing ALL of the neck while full length sizing.
The redding bushing full length die leaves some of the neck un-sized.
This un-sized donut tends to center the round in the chamber better than a normal full-length-sized case.

[Slash2]

What are your powder choices for a 20" barrel with a 1:12 twist shooting 150 grain SMK's and Barnes 150 gr, Tipped TSX'S?

I'm getting about 200 FPS below published data with IMR 4064 and Varget. BLC(2) has been recommended as a faster powder, better for shorter barrels, what are your choices for 20 inchers?

[L8Apex619]

Originally Posted by Slash2

What are your powder choices for a 20" barrel with a 1:12 twist shooting 150 grain SMK's and Barnes 150 gr, Tipped TSX'S?

I'm getting about 200 FPS below published data with IMR 4064 and Varget. BLC(2) has been recommended as a faster powder, better for shorter barrels, what are your choices for 20 inchers?

How close are you to the published max loads with the 4064 and/or Varget? If you still got room to spare, just bump it up...

Otherwise, here's a list of commerical powder ranked by burn rate.

FWIW, Sierra suggests a MV of 2700 FPS for their (150 grain) accuracy load using N140, which as per the above chart ranks just below the 4064. BLC-2 ranks right around the same as 748, both of which (according to the chart) burn faster than Varget or 4064.

[Slash2]

Originally Posted by L8Apex619

How close are you to the published max loads with the 4064 and/or Varget? If you still got room to spare, just bump it up...

Otherwise, here's a list of commerical powder ranked by burn rate.

FWIW, Sierra suggests a MV of 2700 FPS for their (150 grain) accuracy load using N140, which as per the above chart ranks just below the 4064. BLC-2 ranks right around the same as 748, both of which (according to the chart) burn faster than Varget or 4064.

I've tried each of the top three loads Sierra suggests for the 150 SMK using Varget, 4064 and now BLC(2), and they all shoot around 200FPS slower than the published data in my 20" Rem. 700 VTR. I've gone a little past their max loads, till i started to see some pressure signs, but i didn't gain that much.

I guess that's just the way it is, which for the SMK's is no big deal because I'm just punching paper, but I had wanted to use Hornady's GMX bullets for hunting, however it looks like they like higher velocities to really open up and I think 2500FPS might be a little slow.

Looks like Barnes for my lead free killing.

[L8Apex619]

IIRC, the data published by Sierra was based on a 26" barrel (for .308). That should equate to a loss of just under 150 FPS out of a 20" barrel:



Using their load data, it looks like it would take an extra 2.4 grains of BLC-2 to make up that difference... which should put you right around 47.6 grains - almost a full grain under Sierra's published max load. How much BLC2 are you loading?




ETA: How far (from your rifle) is your chrono?



.

[Slash2]

Originally Posted by L8Apex619

IIRC, the data published by Sierra was based on a 26" barrel (for .308). That should equate to a loss of just under 150 FPS out of a 20" barrel:



Using their load data, it looks like it would take an extra 2.4 grains of BLC-2 to make up that difference... which should put you right around 47.6 grains - almost a full grain under Sierra's published max load. How much BLC2 are you loading?




ETA: How far (from your rifle) is your chrono?



.

At Sierra's max load for BLC(2) of 48.4 I was hitting 2650 fps with the chronny at 10 ft from the muzzle, 250 fps below their data. I went up to 49 grs, hit about 2700 fps, but started getting pressure signs so I stopped. However I was seating the bullet to my max magazine length of 2.835" to minimize the jump, that probably accounts for the lower velocity.

Since I've gone back to the published OALs, which actually has improved my groups, but I haven't chrony'd those loads yet, I'm guessing the fps is probably closer to the 150 fps below mark now.

[Darklyte27]

I shot 40 rds today,
15 WCC with 42.5 gr of RE15
10 Igman and 15 FC with 43 gr of RE15

Case 2.015
Primer CCI # 200
Bullet 175 SMK
COAL 2.815

Temps were about 75 when I started 920am and about 90 when I finished 1215pm

Savage 10FLP shot alright and with avg 2636 FPS with 42.5 gr RE15
shots were in the upper right and some were right on target, I was not shooting my best i guess, plus I think the last time I zeroed the rifle was with 42 gr of varget.

The Igman brass and the FC brass with 43 gr
shot about 2.5-3 inches higher of course.
groups were higher right and then hit the black dot.
So today was off. I did get an avg of 2707 with 43 gr
Low 2685, High 2731, ES 46.06 SD 16.27

Next time im going to load up only 43 gr and try to keep better records..

[Jicko]

With a few new kids on the block, let's look for more recipes!

----------------------------------------
<Project 1>

Mk 316 Mod 0!!!! (M118LR's replacement)
http://www.dtic.mil/ndia/2009infantr...ioniii8524.pdf
- 175SMK
- less temperature sensitive (moving away from RL15)

----------------------------------------
<Project 2>

155 SMK "2156"
- seems very promising

[Jicko]

As for project 1,

<Project 1>

Mk 316 Mod 0!!!! (M118LR's replacement)
http://www.dtic.mil/ndia/2009infantr...ioniii8524.pdf
- 175SMK
- less temperature sensitive (moving away from RL15)

I want some powder suggestion!!

Here is what i know:
- 40.2gr of ?? powder (looks like 1/3 longer than varget)
- 2735fps out of a 26" barrel
- 2580fps out of a 20" barrel
- SD <15fps!
- 175SMK
- FED210M

So, WHAT powder is less temperature sensitive and will give THAT velocity, with only 40gr!?!?

[Darklyte27]

I bet its a modded Varget, longer stick to burn better?

[Jicko]

Originally Posted by Darklyte27

I bet its a modded Varget, longer stick to burn better?

From an insider, it is a common, off the shelf, not "new", powder...

So I just need to know which powder fits that profile!

[wutzu]

Anybody have a good recipe for 155SMK with Win 748?

[Linus]

Does anyone use AA2520 for their 308 match rounds? How does this powder compare to RL15 accuracy wise? I'm trying to find a substitute for RL15 since I can't find it in stock anywhere.

[tools2teach]

I can't seem to find Data on a 308 with M80 Mil. Spec 145gr FMJBT using Varget powder. Can someone chime in? I'm new to reloading by the way.

[tools2teach]

anyone? I need a recommended starting load for 308.

[BlackRifleFan]

Originally Posted by tools2teach

I can't seem to find Data on a 308 with M80 Mil. Spec 145gr FMJBT using Varget powder. Can someone chime in? I'm new to reloading by the way.

44 gr of Varget is a good place to start. With Winchester 147 gr I got about 2670 fps out of a 20" barrel when temp was about 105 degrees. M80 is about 2770 fps. I have never gone hotter because I moved away from Varget for 147gr bullet, does not meter too good on the progressive press.

[shadowofnight]

Originally Posted by Jicko

As for project 1,



I want some powder suggestion!!

Here is what i know:
- 40.2gr of ?? powder (looks like 1/3 longer than varget)
- 2735fps out of a 26" barrel
- 2580fps out of a 20" barrel
- SD <15fps!
- 175SMK
- FED210M

So, WHAT powder is less temperature sensitive and will give THAT velocity, with only 40gr!?!?

My Varget ( And Benchmark ) has been growing spiderwebs and hearing sounds of crickets ever since I got my bulk order of IMR 8208 XBR from Powder Valley.

In my 20" 308 , I am getting 2620 with 175 gr Berger VLD's and 42.3 gr of the XBR with awesome groups. After buying a few 1 pounders and experimenting....I went ahead with the 8 pounders.

Give the XBR a try......its extremely temperature insensitive ( Prob the best out there at the moment ) and as a side bonus flows through a powder measure like butter.

[SDJim]

If someone with Quick Load has the time could you please run 3 simulations.
Sierra 155 (2156) and Berger 175 VLD & Berger 155.5 Barrel is 30", 1:12", The only powders I'm interested in are IMR 4895, VARGET, V140 & V150

Thanks, SDJim