Baptism

[eta34]

^Huh? The salvation of those individuals had absolutely nothing to do with the baptism you facilitated. Who was this guy and on what Biblical basis did he assert his statement that these people weren’t saved?

[Dezrat]

Originally Posted by eta34

^Huh? The salvation of those individuals had absolutely nothing to do with the baptism you facilitated. Who was this guy and on what Biblical basis did he assert his statement that these people weren’t saved?

I referred him to Mat 28:19 but he wasn't phased. Just illustrating how far into the weeds some people get. I believe he was saved, but it's always actually heartbreaking to think about what miserable walks legalists must have. Especially ones out in the weeds with their legalism. I won't even go into the sprinkled vs poured vs dunked debates and how dogmatic some get about those. He was a newcomer to the Fellowship. Didn't last long, when he heard I was a "eternal security type" he was out of there.

[Kokopelli]

Matthew 28:18-20

Then Jesus came to them and said, “All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age.”

That really settles it.

[Dezrat]

Originally Posted by Kokopelli

Matthew 28:18-20

Then Jesus came to them and said, “All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age.”

That really settles it.

Yup, he was all LOUDLY hung up with Acts 2:38. I'm pretty sure the Acts 2:38 formula works equally as well.... Ah the joys of legalism...

[ZapThyCat]

I'm not the judge. I know of a story of a person that was driving to get baptized, got into a car accident, and died. God knows. I don't.

That being said... I wouldn't want to risk it. "To him that knows to do good, and does it not, to him it is sin"

[Garand Hunter]

Acts ch 2 vs 38.....commonly known as " Jesus Only " believers. That is another issue altogether ! Take a look at Romans ch 10vs 9-13. Baptism is not mentioned.

Psalm 1

[Dezrat]

Originally Posted by Garand Hunter

Acts ch 2 vs 38.....commonly known as " Jesus Only " believers. That is another issue altogether ! Take a look at Romans ch 10vs 9-13. Baptism is not mentioned.

Psalm 1

Always goes back to by Grace alone, through Faith alone. Pretty uncomplicated.
I posted my original tidbit just to show how in the weeds people can get. Not only salvation depending on the Baptism, but the Baptism also needing to be the correct "formula".

[ZapThyCat]

Originally Posted by Garand Hunter

Acts ch 2 vs 38.....commonly known as " Jesus Only " believers. That is another issue altogether ! Take a look at Romans ch 10vs 9-13. Baptism is not mentioned.

All the fullness of the Godhead dwells in Jesus. It's not "Jesus only". Only one Name where we are saved. Jesus' name baptism is the only Biblical baptism, that's the only way that they did it in the Bible.

[Lumpia is sarap!®]

Baptism is pretty important from the sects of the Old Testament and during Jesus’ days. I encourage all to study it out biblically. What I recall from scriptures: Jesus was baptized, the disciples were baptizing, Cornelius and the Ethiopian eunuch had amazing baptism testimonies, etc.

I was invited to church during my college days, studied the Bible with brothers who answered most of my questions through the Bible, repented of my sins, committed myself to Jesus and got baptized on 12/11/94. Heaven awaits me and the Holy Spirit has been guiding me since.

[colossians323]

Originally Posted by Barang

i know it's not a requirement and some people were in a condition where they are not able to do so like robert and the thief at the cross. but my question is about those who are able, why are they not following Jesus' example? if our Lord get baptized, shouldn't we do the same as His follower?

Thats actually like asking;

Why do most who claim the name of Christ not know what they believe and why they believe it?

I dare say the majority of Christians do not read his word or pray without ceasing.

The Churches reaction to the governments reaction during covid was quite telling where the faith of the Church lies

[Darto]

Verses should be read in context
Acts 2

36 Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made the same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ. 37 Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do? 38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost. 39 For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.

40 And with many other words did he testify and exhort, saying, Save yourselves from this untoward generation. 41 Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls. 42 And they continued stedfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship, and in breaking of bread, and in prayers. 43 And fear came upon every soul: and many wonders and signs were done by the apostles.

44 And all that believed were together, and had all things common;45 And sold their possessions and goods, and parted them to all men, as every man had need. 46 And they, continuing daily with one accord in the temple, and breaking bread from house to house, did eat their meat with gladness and singleness of heart, 47 Praising God, and having favour with all the people. And the Lord added to the church daily such as should be saved.

Here Paul was also teaching about holding goods in common. Some took advantage of this and Pual gave advice about what to do about them


2 Thess 3:6

6 In the name of the Lord Jesus Christ, we command you, brothers and sisters, to keep away from every believer who is idle and disruptive and does not live according to the teaching[a] you received from us. 7 For you yourselves know how you ought to follow our example. We were not idle when we were with you, 8 nor did we eat anyone’s food without paying for it. On the contrary, we worked night and day, laboring and toiling so that we would not be a burden to any of you. 9 We did this, not because we do not have the right to such help, but in order to offer ourselves as a model for you to imitate. 10 For even when we were with you, we gave you this rule: “The one who is unwilling to work shall not eat.”
11 We hear that some among you are idle and disruptive. They are not busy; they are busybodies. 12 Such people we command and urge in the Lord Jesus Christ to settle down and earn the food they eat. 13 And as for you, brothers and sisters, never tire of doing what is good.

Paul says the Church should not give things, not even food, to anyone who will not work to earn what is being given to them. The church was not feed the freeloaders who wanted to join a goods held in common society and were not willing to work for this aid. It was to be workfare, not welfare.

[ZapThyCat]

If you are serving God because you're afraid of hell or want to go to heaven, your religion is yourself. Do not ask "what is the minimum I need to get to heaven".
Ask yourself, "What should I do to glorify God?"

If that is your goal, it won't matter "to get to heaven", but your goal will be instead to please God, and you'll get baptized in Jesus name (as the Bible says). Then the question to this thread is moot.

[Barang]

Originally Posted by colossians323

The Churches reaction to the governments reaction during covid was quite telling where the faith of the Church lies

i was surprised that more churches chose to follow julius caesar and also heard some (don't know how many) were saying that, "if you love your neighbor, you should get vaxed! and then i was reminded of what Jesus said, "When I return, will I find faith?"

[Garand Hunter]

Not sure how the responders to this forum will see concerning what I did during the china bug at the local church I attended in east contra costa. I refused to watch church online, and refused to go to outside services ( which newscum opened and closed more than once ) and only went back to church attendance when the pastor decided to open up and stay open. When I returned the communion services brought out a new to me method of using a cup of grape juice with a wafer sealed on top of the grape juice. Nothing doing ! Its opened up and for real communion again period with me. I got used to taking communion by myself when in Germany sept '65 to apr '67 in the army.

Psalm 1

[Dirtlaw]

It refreshes me to see men of faith on this board. Thank you for serving God's purpose!

[colossians323]

Originally Posted by Barang

i was surprised that most churches chose to follow julius caesar and also heard some (don't know how many) were saying that, "if you love your neighbor, you should get vaxed! and then i was reminded of what Jesus said, "When I return, will I find faith?"

FIFY

Made me sad too.

I remember when they were saying that about the vax and masks, and I challenged all who said that.

What was more important, showing leadership of not being afraid of death (it was conquered on the cross). Showing people that you know where you are going, or hiding your face from the masses and showing your fear?

I taught many a person to leave their comfort zone and go in the store without their masks. No one needed to argue with the store owner about rights, but it gave people courage when they did it and there were no repercussions.

I also would express to people personal responsibility. Aren't we responsible for ourselves?

If you fear death more than you fear God you are doing it wrong.
We opened up a house church in NV and were out of luck in California, most of the brothers and sisters from California were too afraid.

But as the poster above said. Thank God for his faithful!

[fast54vw]

If you want to be water baptized come to Costa Mesa, we are doing baptisms this Sunday at my church

[Garand Hunter]

People who went to stores in Contra Costa were met with Joe/Suzy arse holes employees who wanted to play God often ! Anybody remember when newscum declare NO CHANTING while in church inside or outside ?

Psalm 1

[smokycuh]

Definitely if you have believed in the Lord Jesus and received him in your heart you are saved!


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[vipertom1970]

The answer: just remember the sinner on the cross next to Jesus.

[Garand Hunter]

Correct.

Psalm 1

[Barang]

Originally Posted by vipertom1970

The answer: just remember the sinner on the cross next to Jesus.

this excuse kept repeated a lot as if a default answer. the rest of us who's not on the cross (like the thief) must get baptize if you truly love and understand what Jesus died for. obedience to Him is a mark of faith in action not just a mere word.

[Kokopelli]

Anyone following must understand that though we are to be baptized, it is not a requirement for salvation. We are saved by faith, not by our righteous deeds.

Romans 10:9 “that if you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you will be saved.”

GTG

[Wordupmybrotha]

^^^yep

[Garand Hunter]

Yep X 2 !

Psalm 1

[ZapThyCat]

Originally Posted by smokycuh

Definitely if you have believed in the Lord Jesus and received him in your heart you are saved!

Nobody, at all, is "saved" until the pearly gates close behind them. The Bible constantly refers to those that "shall be heirs of salvation", future tense. Those of us, down here, are not "saved", past tense. Too many people think they are "saved" and since you can't lose salvation, they can do whatever they want and not be lost.

[1911RONIN]

Originally Posted by ZapThyCat

Nobody, at all, is "saved" until the pearly gates close behind them. The Bible constantly refers to those that "shall be heirs of salvation", future tense. Those of us, down here, are not "saved", past tense. Too many people think they are "saved" and since you can't lose salvation, they can do whatever they want and not be lost.

Not at all biblical.

The Kingdom of God is a present-future concept, as is salvation. Beginning now and proceeding to full realization in the future.


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[Barang]

Originally Posted by ZapThyCat

Nobody, at all, is "saved" until the pearly gates close behind them. The Bible constantly refers to those that "shall be heirs of salvation", future tense. Those of us, down here, are not "saved", past tense.

John 15:4-6 nkjv
4 Abide in Me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, unless it abides in the vine, neither can you, unless you abide in Me.

5 ?I am the vine, you are the branches. He who abides in Me, and I in him, bears much fruit; for without Me you can do nothing.
6 If anyone does not abide in Me, he is cast out as a branch and is withered; and they gather them and throw them into the fire, and they are burned.

Too many people think they are "saved" and since you can't lose salvation, they can do whatever they want and not be lost.

Hebrews 10:26-27 nkjv
26 For if we sin willfully after we have received the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins,
27 but a certain fearful expectation of judgment, and fiery indignation which will devour the adversaries.

need more sermons about behavior than grace. once a person is saved, growing in knowledge and sanctification are essential in become more like Christ mindset.