Local FFL charged $75 for private party transfer!

[Geekmode]

Myself (buyer) and the seller met at a local FFL in EDH and the owner charged me a flat $75 to complete the transaction. I brought to his attention that by law he cannot charge me more than $10 + DROIS fee. He responded that it is his “admin fee”. Is this legal? Very shady. I called other dealers and they said they’ve never heard of anyone doing that.

[blkside]

I know a couple places that charge 150 but you walk in and out in minutes...

[spddrcr]

Originally Posted by Geekmode

Myself (buyer) and the seller met at a local FFL in EDH and the owner charged me a flat $75 to complete the transaction. I brought to his attention that by law he cannot charge me more than $10 + DROIS fee. He responded that it is his “admin fee”. Is this legal? Very shady. I called other dealers and they said they’ve never heard of anyone doing that.

Definitely not legal and you should out the business here so others don't get scammed.

[Garv]

No it is not legal, but not much enforcement these days.

What annoys me more is the "admin fees" quote/lie.

Who is it?

[sfe187]

See another thread/whine on PPT fees. Why didn't you call or research ahead? and why did you proceed with it?? Nobody to blame but yourself.

[buster1960]

Take him to small claims court.

[anthracite]

Originally Posted by sfe187

See another thread/whine on PPT fees. Why didn't you call or research ahead? and why did you proceed with it?? Nobody to blame but yourself.

Definitely sucks, but considering you both met there without researching First it is what it is.

Now, if the FFL told you a different amount ahead of time that’d be a different story.

Consider it a lesson learned. I had a similar incident with my first out of state transfer.

[spegull03]

Yeah I found that out too when I brought a buyer there. But on the other hand we walked in and were done in 15 min instead of standing in line for hours or driving all over town just to find a shop only does 5 PPT’s a day and you are #6.

[Thoughts]

Originally Posted by sfe187

Why didn't you call or research ahead? and why did you proceed with it??

Okay, so now an FFL can ignore the law and it's the customer's fault? I suppose if they decided to practice credit card fraud it'd be his fault for not asking in advance?

[93chipper]

They are only allowed to charge 37.19 plus 10.00 per gun on the transfer unless it’s a gun show then they can charge more

[CSACANNONEER]

The $10 is the "administrative fee" they are allowed to charge. It does NOT have to be that much but, by law, it can't be more than $10.

[five.five-six]

Possible solutions:

Go somewhere else?

Fork over $150K to open a lease and TI work, then another $100K for inventory and hire a bunch of people for $20-30K/month with rent and utilities and start your own gun shop and you could charge $5.00 for transfer if you like.


Grab your cell phone and dial 9-wah-wah

[jemswirl]

Which store so we can avoid?

[Pharmboy]

This happened to me too (on top of the$47.50 DROS) and it really stings. I have done PPTs at the Laguna Niguel FFL before, and waited 3 hrs to start the paperwork. I didn't know about their new fee until I paid. I asked when this changed and the cashier stated they emailed a notification out, then pointed to a piece of paper taped to the front of the desk that stated "extra fees maybe added to PPTs". Will definitely go elsewhere next time, for PPTs, firearms, and ammo purchases.
The store later stopped doing PPTs, which I feel they should have done from the beginning, if they were stretched thin.

[five.five-six]

I would much rather pay an extra $65 than sit around for 2-3 hrs waiting my turn. Much rather.

[IronsightsRifleman]

Several FFL01s in the LA area have said they are no longer doing PPTs (many of them are so bold as to have it written on their web sites) while others are charging high fees. I've permanently stopped doing any business with them, but that leaves very few LGSs left. I know that this isn't a money maker for them, but it's a service they must perform and should do so to support the community. Performing PPTs at the legally prescribed rate is a condition of their license and the penalty is license forfeiture. But DOJ won't do anything about it because their goal is to impede transfers.

[REH]

Originally Posted by 9mmCabinetguy

Possible solutions:

Go somewhere else?

Fork over $150K to open a lease and TI work, then another $100K for inventory and hire a bunch of people for $20-30K/month with rent and utilities and start your own gun shop and you could charge $5.00 for transfer if you like.


Grab your cell phone and dial 9-wah-wah

[not-fishing]

$75 ??? Small Change.

At least it's going to a business that's doing something.

Have you ever been around with the ATF has horsewhipped the Dealer for "moral improvement"?

The DMV takes it's pound of flesh from me every year for something that would cost less than a quarter what Ca DMV demands.

[Sequencer60]

Originally Posted by sfe187

See another thread/whine on PPT fees. Why didn't you call or research ahead? and why did you proceed with it?? Nobody to blame but yourself.

Shouldn't have to research something that is supposed to be the same absolutely everywhere. $37.19 to the DOJ and $10 to the FFL, end of story. Out the store.

[bugsy714]

Originally Posted by Sequencer60

Shouldn't have to research something that is supposed to be the same absolutely everywhere. $37.19 to the DOJ and $10 to the FFL, end of story. Out the store.

My thoughts exactly we don’t get to arbitrarily change how we abide by the law so why should they? I would document it in file a complaint with DOJ


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[warbird]

I would file a complaint with DOJ if it were me. Because the transaction involves a federally licensed firearm you might check with BATF. Gun shops ask for our support and then do something like this. Any gun shop that supports this kind of behavior should be boycotted and whenever possible use DOJ or BATF against these shops. If a shop owner wants to invest that much money and then go out and rip everyone off he should lose his investment.

[M1NM]

The state has what it wants. A reduced number of transfers. When I leave this state I'll be selling all my unregistered off roster guns - out of my trunk.

[Rakso]

Originally Posted by Geekmode

Myself (buyer) and the seller met at a local FFL in EDH and the owner charged me a flat $75 to complete the transaction. I brought to his attention that by law he cannot charge me more than $10 + DROIS fee. He responded that it is his “admin fee”. Is this legal? Very shady. I called other dealers and they said they’ve never heard of anyone doing that.

Never go back. Google review the place.

[cgseanp1]

Originally Posted by anthracite

Definitely sucks, but considering you both met there without researching First it is what it is.

Now, if the FFL told you a different amount ahead of time that’d be a different story.

Consider it a lesson learned. I had a similar incident with my first out of state transfer.

Sure, because he should have to research something that is a legally set at $10.

And for what it’s worth, I’d be ok if the PPT fee was raised to $20 or $25. I hate paying more, but I realize PPTs end up costing the shop money and that sucks.


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[-hanko]

Originally Posted by cgseanp1

Sure, because he should have to research something that is a legally set at $10.

And for what it’s worth, I’d be ok if the PPT fee was raised to $20 or $25. I hate paying more, but I realize PPTs end up costing the shop money and that sucks.

You might also want to realize that most licensees were in favor of the charge as what they thought would be a new profit center.

Analogous to trainers in Oklahoma who have been and are against constitutional carry.

[cgseanp1]

Originally Posted by -hanko

You might also want to realize that most licensees were in favor of the charge as what they thought would be a new profit center.

Analogous to trainers in Oklahoma who have been and are against constitutional carry.

They thought $10 would be profitable? Or am I misunderstanding?


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[bohoki]

Originally Posted by cgseanp1

They thought $10 would be profitable? Or am I misunderstanding?


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it shouldn't take them a half an hour so that is paying their employee $20 an hour for a public service i wish jury duty paid as well

[bugsy714]

Originally Posted by bohoki

it shouldn't take them a half an hour so that is paying their employee $20 an hour for a public service i wish jury duty paid as well

Not sure if it takes any additional time past the initial transaction and the pick up but I’m pretty sure it’s a break even for the employees time but not for the cost of being open tape deal


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[cgseanp1]

Originally Posted by bohoki

it shouldn't take them a half an hour so that is paying their employee $20 an hour for a public service i wish jury duty paid as well

Well I’d assume there’s more involved than just the time it takes for initial and pick up.


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[9mmContagion]

Originally Posted by spegull03

Yeah I found that out too when I brought a buyer there. But on the other hand we walked in and were done in 15 min instead of standing in line for hours or driving all over town just to find a shop only does 5 PPT’s a day and you are #6.

I’d pay $40 to jump to the front of a line and it only take 15 min. Time is money! Quitcherbichin!!!

[REH]

I processed 5 private party transfers today. 3 said they called all over town and no one would do them. This is a break even deal at best for the dealer. It's not just the initial DROS, safe handling test, logging in and out of the A&D book, filing the DROS and 4473. Why do it at all? I thought this would bring people into the shop. Maybe pick up a few customers along the way. I found out this is more of pipe dream. People will forget you and head over to Turners or some where else. I will continue to do PPT but not with the hope of picking up a few customers. Forgot to add, my return customers say I have very completive pricing. So with that said take out a loan for a few hundred thousand and open your own shop and find out what it is like on the other side of the counter.

[9mmContagion]

Originally Posted by REH

I processed 5 private party transfers today. 3 said they called all over town and no one would do them. This is a break even deal at best for the dealer. It's not just the initial DROS, safe handling test, logging in and out of the A&D book, filing the DROS and 4473. Why do it at all? I thought this would bring people into the shop. Maybe pick up a few customers along the way. I found out this is more of pipe dream. People will forget you and head over to Turners or some where else. I will continue to do PPT but not with the hope of picking up a few customers. Forgot to add, my return customers say I have very completive pricing. So with that said take out a loan for a few hundred thousand and open your own shop and find out what it is like on the other side of the counter.

Exactly! I’ll be honest, I rarely buy anything from random shops I do a PPT at. I am not a good example as my BIL owns a shop. But I know both sides. Dealers get screwed on PPT no matter what. A lot of time and money for no return. As stated above, I don’t mind spending an extra $40 if it means I’m not waiting in a line.

[Sequencer60]

Originally Posted by REH

I processed 5 private party transfers today. 3 said they called all over town and no one would do them. This is a break even deal at best for the dealer. It's not just the initial DROS, safe handling test, logging in and out of the A&D book, filing the DROS and 4473. Why do it at all? I thought this would bring people into the shop. Maybe pick up a few customers along the way. I found out this is more of pipe dream. People will forget you and head over to Turners or some where else. I will continue to do PPT but not with the hope of picking up a few customers. Forgot to add, my return customers say I have very completive pricing. So with that said take out a loan for a few hundred thousand and open your own shop and find out what it is like on the other side of the counter.

For what it's worth, almost every time I am the seller in a PPT, I make a point of buying SOMETHING from the FFL. With cash in hand, it's the least I can do.

[REH]

Originally Posted by cgseanp1

They thought $10 would be profitable? Or am I misunderstanding?


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You really believe that to be true? You really believe the dealers had ANY input on the dollar amount?

[cgseanp1]

Did you miss the part that I was asking a question??? I was responding to someone else.

Did you also miss the part that I said I’d be ok with that PPT fee getting raised so it wasn’t such a waste of time for the FFL?


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[Bastard]

the FFL is in the wrong and can not change the fees just because he doesn't like them it is all part of doing business & while many FFLs are limiting times or restricting PPTs altogether... that being said, the fees were obviously paid so at this point you don't really have any recourse legally speaking... yes you can report him to DOJ, which is a DB move but then again so is overcharging for a PPT.

what you can do, and I recommend doing, after you pick up the firearm of course - put the FFL on blast, name him, call him out... post on here, on Facebook - in groups, on your profile and on the FFL's FB page - leave harsh yelp and google reviews and don't let up find new ways to get the word out to others to avoid him

[dvs762]

it can take 30 minutes or more for a ppt and we can only charge 10 plus dros. 10 per gun. so all these cities want the min wage at 15 or more. the shop loses an employee for 30 or 40 minutes and makes about 5 dollars..this is why nobody wants to do these

by law its 10 per gun plus dros fees. period. not sure about gun shows..but you need to figure in the ffl needs to secure the ppt guns by some way and that can cost so there may be extra fees for that allowed. i dont do shows..so no idea..

[edgerly779]

Out the ffl so someone can have a chat with them. Otherwise don't whine on here. You screwed up by not asking a simple question. I walked out on a ppt dros because marshall academy down here asked for 87 bucks for the fees. Clueless broad behind the counter. Down here we a bunch of ffls that do not overcharge or need an appointment.

[deephouse]

I only use appt only FFLs now. In and out in 10-15 minutes and completely one-on-one transaction. There is no added charge.

I would leave a bad review and then let that take its course.

[ar15robert]

dealers get the shaft and state makes money not doing anything.IMO if i went to do a ppt and offered quicker service as in little wait for a suggested 20-30 dollar "tip" id probably be happy to do so.