Randall's "match ammo is too expensive" list.

[Darklyte27]

so i got my redding S dies today.. what does it mean when you drop in your bushing in, to adjust the pin so it touches it? the pins screw or the upper one?..

[ar15barrels]

Originally Posted by Darklyte27

so i got my redding S dies today.. what does it mean when you drop in your bushing in, to adjust the pin so it touches it? the pins screw or the upper one?..

I never read the instructions, but you adjust the amount of neck sizing before you adjust the decapping pin protrusion from the die.

So, if you were to drop the bushing into the die body and then thread the decapping assembly back into the die body until it touched the bushing, that would be holding the bushing ALL the way down in the die and sizing the whole neck.
You probably only want to size about 3/4 of the neck so you leave a small doughnut of the neck un-sized to center the case in the chamber.
In that case, back the decapping assembly about 3/4 of a turn back out.
Now take a look at how much decapping pin is sticking out of the bottom of the die.
You need about 1/4" showing below the bottom of the die.
If you have less than 1/4" protruding, make a note of how much more you need and remove the whole decapping assembly from the die body.
Now loosen the lock nut and un-screw the decapping rod the neccessary amount.
Lock the locknut again and re-install the decapping assembly into the original position (backed off 3/4 turn from touching the bushing) and verify that there is enough decapping pin protrusion now.

[Darklyte27]

thanks randall, after playing around with it i got it..

just reloaded 5 rds, the bullet seater is right on.

[Hans Gruber]

Want to give out a big THANKS to Randall for helping me put these together:



Time to take the wife out to brunch and then hit the range!

[Gnzrme]

they look pretty!! Post an accuracy report....

[Hans Gruber]

Range report here:

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/s....php?p=2274728

Here's a preview:

[ar15barrels]

Originally Posted by Hans Gruber

if that's 100yds, you need to correct 1/4 minute up and 1/4 minute left.

[Hans Gruber]

Originally Posted by ar15barrels

if that's 100yds, you need to correct 1/4 minute up and 1/4 minute left.

I was shooting for groups man!

I guess that this proves that going from 0 to making match ammo isn't that far. Bells and whistles are nice and all, but you can get there very easily if you take your time and listen to good advice.

[ar15barrels]

Originally Posted by Hans Gruber

I was shooting for groups man!

When you shoot for groups, adjust the point of impact away from your aiming point so the group does not obliterate the aiming point.
Just remember to adjust the scope back to it's zero for when you want to hit what you aim at.

[Hans Gruber]

Quick question about the Redding resizing die. Should I have my die adjusted (screwed down) to have the bushing hit the whole neck or halfway down or ? What would you suggest? I'd like to not wear out my brass prematurely.

My first batch I resized (pretty much) the whole neck but I just want to know what the experts have to say.

[ar15barrels]

Originally Posted by Hans Gruber

Quick question about the Redding resizing die. Should I have my die adjusted (screwed down) to have the bushing hit the whole neck or halfway down or ? What would you suggest?

The die body adjusts separately from the neck bushing.
Adjust the die body for about 0.002" headspace.

I adjust the neck bushing to hit about 2/3 to 3/4 of the neck length.
This leaves a small donut un-sized at the shoulder/neck junction.
This un-sized donut will center the loaded round in the chamber, promoting better alignment of the bullet with the throat.

[Timberwolf]

Originally Posted by Hans Gruber

Quick question about the Redding resizing die. Should I have my die adjusted (screwed down) to have the bushing hit the whole neck or halfway down or ? What would you suggest? I'd like to not wear out my brass prematurely.

My first batch I resized (pretty much) the whole neck but I just want to know what the experts have to say.

It depends on what that rifle/load combination likes. There is no right or wrong answer. Try adjusting the bushing up first to 3/4 of the neck the 1/2 and see how accuracy and your ES/SD are effected.

Also if you only size part of the neck I recommend you fully size your neck every 3rd or 4th loading to keep from developing a donut.

[Hans Gruber]

Cool, thanks guys. I'll pull out my 10 pieces of odd brass to test out different settings to see what I get.

[Hans Gruber]

A couple of notes after my attempts and prepping .223 cases last night for those of you thinking about jumping in using the "budget" list that Randall posted.

1. The Lee trimmer is probably a tremendous waste of time. I couldn't get it to quite work right and it didn't trim very precisely. Get yourself a better trimmer. I got a Forster that worked great on .308 but am missing a pilot for .223 at the moment.

2. The deburr/chamfer tool that comes with the Lee press set doesn't like to work too well with .223. Maybe it's just that I was mangling the case mouths with the Lee trimmer beyond repair, but it just didn't work very well at all.

I have to admit, I'm already considering one of those RCBS motorized case prep stations...

[Timberwolf]

Get the RCBS prep station - its a plug and play and is great. I've had one on my bench for more years that I care to remember. There are numerous tricks of the trade. But the one main thing I suggest is the RCBS starter set, add a digital scale, the Lyman trimmers that use a drill and go from there.

Randall, this is in all honesty one of the best threads I've ever read. Your statement about low-volume reloading for match-grade ammo with bolt actions was clear, and your two categories (gooder and cheaper) makes it really easy to understand.

I've never thought I had the money, time, or skill to get into reloading, but your post really has me thinking now! Thanks again!

[Hans Gruber]

Originally Posted by workinwifdakids

I've never thought I had the money, time, or skill to get into reloading, but your post really has me thinking now! Thanks again!

I was in the exact same boat but I finally came to the following conclusion:

"If you love to shoot and you own an accurate rifle, it's the only way to go."

That is of course unless you're independently wealthy and don't mind paying $1.85 a round for the "good stuff" that's not even as good as what you can make for $0.45 a round.

[Butthead]

Randall - Any issues with running "match" rounds through an AR-10? I will be reloading for my Tikka as well but I wont be shooting it as much as the AR-10. What about using my Lee .50 press or do I really need another press on my workbench. How about annealing. I did not see it mentioned here.

[ar15barrels]

Originally Posted by Butthead

Randall - Any issues with running "match" rounds through an AR-10? I will be reloading for my Tikka as well but I wont be shooting it as much as the AR-10. What about using my Lee .50 press or do I really need another press on my workbench. How about annealing. I did not see it mentioned here.

Loading for a semi-auto is differnt than loading for a bolt gun.
You need to be more aware of sizing the brass enough that it will reliably chamber with only the force the bolt carrier has to offer.
With a manually operated bolt, you have a lot more camming power to make a long round fit.

I would not partially neck size for a semi auto.
I want more bullet pull to combat bullet setback during feeding.
I would want plastic tipped of FMJ bullets to combat bullet tip damage during feeding.

Your Lee 50 press will work fine for loading 308.
It should have come with the proper 7/8-14 reducer bushing.

Annealing is not necessary for many firings.

[Dog959]

What is the availability of a 18" or 19" SPR barrel w/ bolt in 6.5 Grendel?

[Timberwolf]

Originally Posted by Dog959

What is the availability of a 18" or 19" SPR barrel w/ bolt in 6.5 Grendel?

Believe this may be in the wrong thread.

[Dr Rocket]

Can I just begin loading brand new Lapua or Norma brass or does it need resizing?

[freakshow10mm]

You should size your brass. It will have tolerances of manufacturing that might be on the high side.

[DirtRacer151]

What would be the recommended full length sizing die for semi 308? Redding type S dies in standard or small base? Seems like the small base might shrink the brass down a little more for easier feeding but reduce brass life. Not sure i like less brass life but at the cost of feeding reliability it might be worth it? Thoughts?

[ar15barrels]

Originally Posted by DirtRacer151

What would be the recommended full length sizing die for semi 308? Redding type S dies in standard or small base? Seems like the small base might shrink the brass down a little more for easier feeding but reduce brass life. Not sure i like less brass life but at the cost of feeding reliability it might be worth it? Thoughts?

I'd have to see/measure one of your fired cases to decide.
If you had a loose chamber, the regular die is fine.
If you have a tighter chamber, you would want the small base die.

[DirtRacer151]

Originally Posted by ar15barrels

I'd have to see/measure one of your fired cases to decide.
If you had a loose chamber, the regular die is fine.
If you have a tighter chamber, you would want the small base die.

Got it.. should i get a fired case w/ the gas plug out so that the case stays in the chamber the whole time for a more accurate reading of my chamber specs?

[rksimple]

Originally Posted by DirtRacer151

Got it.. should i get a fired case w/ the gas plug out so that the case stays in the chamber the whole time for a more accurate reading of my chamber specs?

Shouldn't make enough of a difference to matter.

[DirtRacer151]

Ok I was under the impression the cases in semis are still expanding with less chamber support as they are being extracted.

[rksimple]

Originally Posted by DirtRacer151

Ok I was under the impression the cases in semis are still expanding with less chamber support as they are being extracted.

If the timing is good, this shouldn't be the case.

[ar15barrels]

Originally Posted by DirtRacer151

Ok I was under the impression the cases in semis are still expanding with less chamber support as they are being extracted.

No.
Look at there the gas vent hole is on the M1A.
By the time the bullet gets there, the high pressure portion of the powder's combustion is all done.
All that's left is residual pressure.

[DirtRacer151]

Haha this is a POF. I can almost assure u the timing is NOT good. Ill get a case both ways just for comparison sake anyways. Thanks guys

[xx91x]

I have been evaluating reloading for my new 700p in .308

Is this still a worthwhile idea? Are components available. Have any new reloaders been able to acquire everything from scratch? Has it been a savings? Have powder and bullets been available?

[Darklyte27]

components are coming back, primers and powder is still a bit hard to get, bullets a little hard to get depending on what you want.
the rest i see plenty of.

[xx91x]

are the current prices of powder, primers and bullets still making it a money saving venture?

[ar15barrels]

Originally Posted by xx91x

are the current prices of powder, primers and bullets still making it a money saving venture?

Yes.

Even with powder at $20 a pound, primers at $50/1000 and bullets at $300 per 1000, you are reloading for 48 cents a round instead of buying factory match ammo at $1.50+ a round.

The most valuable part of reloading is something you can't even quantify.
How much is accuracy worth?
When you reload, you can develop a load specific to your gun instead of shooting what the ammo manufacturer decided was the best compromise for many guns.

[Lancear15]

Randall,

What method do you use to apply the Imperial Case Sizing Wax to your cases?

TIA

[ar15barrels]

Originally Posted by Lancear15

What method do you use to apply the Imperial Case Sizing Wax to your cases?

Slide your pointing finger on the wax.
Roll case between two fingers like this:

[rksimple]

Originally Posted by Lancear15

Randall,

What method do you use to apply the Imperial Case Sizing Wax to your cases?

TIA

Fingers.

[ar15barrels]

Originally Posted by rksimple

Fingers.

haha, beat you to it.

[freonr22]

I lubed 1500 cases last night w/ imeprial. two fingers in the can, put on palms, repeated 3x over the batch and grabbed fistfuls of cases squeezing, then tumbled by hand, just a light coat on all in 2-3 minutes so that can has lubed 6000 cases and still have about 25% left