Firearm Safety Certificate - FSC - Ask questions here only

[sully007]

Originally Posted by ke6guj

what am I missing here, why repost the PC I already posted

You missed a whole line after the word hunting.

You can also use last years lic even if expired.


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[sully007]

Originally Posted by Condorguns

But he posted it bigger. LMAO

Does no one read any more?


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[chris]

Originally Posted by G-Man WC

It sounds all jacked up before it got started. The plan was there was no plan.......kind of like the government
was involved.
-g

if these morons ever had a plan this must be it.

[Condorguns]

Originally Posted by dfletcher

Am I to take from the above that my "FFL collector with COE" wouldn't exempt me when purchasing a C & R eligible rifle? This of course makes no sense but - well, do I even have to finish .....?

I believe they made it handguns only because you don't need a 01ffl for c&r long guns with a c&r license and coe. I could be mistaken, I am not a c&r licence holder.

[Condorguns]

Originally Posted by sully007

Does no one read any more?


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I guess not, it looks like the same pc to me?

[sully007]

Originally Posted by Condorguns

I guess not, it looks like the same pc to me?

So when you read both side by side, they read the same word for word? Wow this country is in big trouble.


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[a510flip]

Originally Posted by ke6guj

31700. (a) The following persons, properly identified, are exempted
from the firearm safety certificate requirement in subdivision (a)
of Section 31615:

(c) A person, validly identified, who has been issued a valid
hunting license that is unexpired or that was issued for the hunting
season immediately preceding the calendar year in which the person
takes title of possession of a firearm is exempt from the firearm
safety certificate requirement in subdivision (a) of Section 31615,
except as to handguns.



26860. (a) Except as authorized by the department, commencing
January 1, 2015, a firearms dealer shall not deliver a long gun
unless the recipient performs a safe handling demonstration with that
long gun.
(g) An individual who is exempt from the requirements of
subdivision (a) of Section 31615, pursuant to Section 31700, is also
exempt from performing the safe handling demonstration.

So I picked up my shotgun today with my hunting license exemption, but they would not release it without a safe handling demo. I asked the manager to check the regulations and he shrugged me off and stated I still had to show him how to put a gunlock on and eject a dummy she'll and sign a safe handling affidavit....


Daryle

[high_revs]

For those that want to laminate, just to go wally world, office depot, etc. I believe it was 3m that I got and it was sized 2x3. It fit the fsc and hsc perfectly with plenty of room to trim and make it fit the credit card pocket of your wallet.

$6 for a 10 sleeves. ymmv on the price. much better than what i used to do which is have kinkos laminate it for like $5 or $6 a pop.

[sully007]

Originally Posted by high_revs

For those that want to laminate, just to go wally world, office depot, etc. I believe it was 3m that I got and it was sized 2x3. It fit the fsc and hsc perfectly with plenty of room to trim and make it fit the credit card pocket of your wallet.

$6 for a 10 sleeves. ymmv on the price. much better than what i used to do which is have kinkos laminate it for like $5 or $6 a pop.

Kinkos is $1.25 to $1.50 at most. I get it done there all the time for other items. They have a small size for cards now.

[boopiejones]

what a joke. i just took my test and i think it was identical to the handgun test i took last year, right down to the one question i got wrong last time... true or false... a trigger or cable lock is effective at stopping unauthorized people from accessing your firearm. i answered false the first time around, because a cable lock can be broken with bare hands... but apparently it's true...

[mxadam579]

does big5 issue FSC

[JDay]

Originally Posted by mxadam579

does big5 issue FSC

They're required to.

[ke6guj]

Originally Posted by JDay

They're required to.

really? I am aware of no PC/CCR that requires them to issue FSC cards if they don't want. they must have an FSC instructor if they want to deliver any firearms (which Big5 may or may not want to pay to have enough instructors always on hand during business hours) but they don't have to issue any cards if they don't want to. it isn't like the requirement that they must do long gun PPTs since they sell long guns.

[low67vdubinnocal]

Just got my 2014/2015 hunting license with my old 1999/2000 hunting license at Walmart. Russian lady whipped that License out like a pro sports woman. Tried yesterday but the manager couldn't figure it out even when I pointed to the prior hunting license button on the screen. So $46.43 later and only valid for 6 more months I don't have to spend $25.00 and take an easy test to buy my next long gun. Take that DOJ. I showed them how to be stubborn.

[sully007]

Originally Posted by low67vdubinnocal

Just got my 2014/2015 hunting license with my old 1999/2000 hunting license at Walmart. Russian lady whipped that License out like a pro sports woman. Tried yesterday but the manager couldn't figure it out even when I pointed to the prior hunting license button on the screen. So $46.43 later and only valid for 6 more months I don't have to spend $25.00 and take an easy test to buy my next long gun. Take that DOJ. I showed them how to be stubborn.

^1,000

[low67vdubinnocal]

But I'm winning in reverse.

[miuk]

Will a hunting license from another state work? No mention about issuing state in the PC

[Condorguns]

No it has to be a California hunting license.

[ke6guj]

Originally Posted by miuk

Will a hunting license from another state work? No mention about issuing state in the PC

I didn't see anything in the PC that limits it to just CA hunting licenses. I did some quick searches and found non-resident annual hunting licenses in the $20 range.

Originally Posted by Condorguns

No it has to be a California hunting license.

do you have PC or CCR that confirms that?

if you look at the CCW exemption, it specifically refers to being issued per the CA CCW penal code sections, but I don't see that anywhere for the type of hunting license.

[low67vdubinnocal]

I did see In the DFW hand book you can get a CA. Hunting Lic with an out Of State hunting lic. But at $46.44 you wont save any money Over just taking the FSC test.

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[Condorguns]

Originally Posted by ke6guj

I didn't see anything in the PC that limits it to just CA hunting licenses. I did some quick searches and found non-resident annual hunting licenses in the $20 range.

do you have PC or CCR that confirms that?

if you look at the CCW exemption, it specifically refers to being issued per the CA CCW penal code sections, but I don't see that anywhere for the type of hunting license.

When asked DOJ has instructed us that only California Hunting license would be accepted.

[Frisco3Gun]

Got another question here that could use an answer. It is my understanding that if one person wants to loan a firearm to another friend, family member, etc., it is ok assuming they are not prohibited, less than 30 days, etc. etc.

My question is now that HSC's are outdated, must someone acquire an FSC to be lent a handgun?

Does the same apply to long guns? Or are they still exempt from that statute (didn't require hunting license or other before FSC's introduction)?

Any help is appreciated. Can't seem to find a straight answer.

Originally Posted by PC27880

Section 27545 does not apply to the loan of a firearm between persons who are
personally known to each other, if all of the following requirements are
satisfied:
(a) The loan is infrequent, as defined in Section 16730.
(b) The loan is for any lawful purpose.
(c) The loan does not exceed 30 days in duration.
(d) If the firearm is a handgun, the individual being loaned the handgun
shall have a valid handgun safety certificate.

[Librarian]

Originally Posted by Frisco3Gun

My question is now that HSC's are outdated, must someone acquire an FSC to be lent a handgun?

Does the same apply to long guns? Or are they still exempt from that statute (didn't require hunting license or other before FSC's introduction)?

Any help is appreciated. Can't seem to find a straight answer.

Yes, and yes.

PC 31615

31615.
(a) A person shall not do either of the following:

(1) Purchase or receive any firearm, except an antique firearm, without a valid firearm safety certificate, except that in the case of a handgun, an unexpired handgun safety certificate may be used.

To borrow a firearm is necessarily to receive it.

[Tovarish]

Originally Posted by Frisco3Gun

Got another question here that could use an answer. It is my understanding that if one person wants to loan a firearm to another friend, family member, etc., it is ok assuming they are not prohibited, less than 30 days, over 21, etc. etc.

My question is now that HSC's are outdated, must someone acquire an FSC to be lent a handgun?

Does the same apply to long guns? Or are they still exempt from that statute (didn't require hunting license or other before FSC's introduction)?

Any help is appreciated. Can't seem to find a straight answer.

California Penal Code 27880:

27880. Section 27545 does not apply to the loan of a firearm
between persons who are personally known to each other, if all of the
following requirements are satisfied:
(a) The loan is infrequent, as defined in Section 16730.
(b) The loan is for any lawful purpose.
(c) The loan does not exceed 30 days in duration.
(d) Until January 1, 2015, if the firearm is a handgun, the
individual being loaned the firearm shall have a valid handgun safety
certificate. Commencing January 1, 2015, for any firearm, the
individual being loaned the firearm shall have a valid firearm safety
certificate, except that in the case of a handgun, an unexpired
handgun safety certificate may be used.

HSC continues to be valid for any FSC/HSC requirement relating to handguns.

Section 27950 remains unchanged:

27950. Section 27545 does not apply to the loan of a firearm, other
than a handgun, to a licensed hunter for use by that hunter for a
period of time not to exceed the duration of the hunting season for
which the firearm is to be used.

[Frisco3Gun]

I see. Thanks for the quick response Librarian! Seems you learn something new about California gun laws every day.

I forgot to include my other question. Does that mean PC27885 doesn't hold? That is the loan clause relating to 3 days or less (similar statute, but requires (a) The person loaning the firearm is at all times within the presence of
the person being loaned the firearm).

[TonyS]

If you look at page 35 of Ms. Harris's handbook missing is:

Interesting how Ms. Harris 'forgets' to mention that-

Penal Code Section 31700 part

© A person, validly identified, who has been issued a valid
hunting license that is unexpired or that was issued for the hunting
season immediately preceding the calendar year in which the person
takes title of possession of a firearm is exempt from the firearm
safety certificate requirement in subdivision (a) of Section 31615,
except as to handguns.

Can't have criminals (hunters) getting by too easy.

[sully007]

So I guess the next question would be if you are at the gun range and you let someone shoot your gun, is that a loan? Do they need a FSC in order to shoot your gun?

[Papertigers]

So I just went to buy a shotgun at big 5 and didn't know about this new FSC thing. I asked if active military was exempt from it and he said only if you were retired honorably. I just looked up the exemptions when I got home and it says military is exempt. Did I just pay a fee that I didn't have to pay?

[ke6guj]

Originally Posted by Papertigers

So I just went to buy a shotgun at big 5 and didn't know about this new FSC thing. I asked if active military was exempt from it and he said only if you were retired honorably. I just looked up the exemptions when I got home and it says military is exempt. Did I just pay a fee that I didn't have to pay?

here is the exemption.

31700. (a) The following persons, properly identified, are exempted
from the firearm safety certificate requirement in subdivision (a)
of Section 31615:

(10) An active or honorably retired member of the United States
Armed Forces, the National Guard, the Air National Guard, or the
active reserve components of the United States, where individuals in
those organizations are properly identified. For purposes of this
section, proper identification includes the Armed Forces
Identification Card or other written documentation certifying that
the individual is an active or honorably retired member.

sure sounds like you got sold something you didn't need.

[ke6guj]

Originally Posted by sully007

So I guess the next question would be if you are at the gun range and you let someone shoot your gun, is that a loan? Do they need a FSC in order to shoot your gun?

31615. (a) A person shall not do either of the following:
(1) Purchase or receive any firearm, except an antique firearm,
without a valid firearm safety certificate, except that in the case
of a handgun, an unexpired handgun safety certificate may be used.
(2) Sell, deliver, loan, or transfer any firearm, except an
antique firearm, to any person who does not have a valid firearm
safety certificate, except that in the case of a handgun, an
unexpired handgun safety certificate may be used.

31750. Subdivision (a) of Section 31615 does not apply to the loan
of a firearm if all of the following conditions exist:
(a) The person loaning the firearm is at all times within the
presence of the person being loaned the firearm.
(b) The loan is for a lawful purpose.
(c) The loan does not exceed three days in duration.
(d) The individual receiving the firearm is not prohibited by
state or federal law from possessing, receiving, owning, or
purchasing a firearm.
(e) The person loaning the firearm is 18 years of age or older.
(f) The person being loaned the firearm is 18 years of age or
older.

[sully007]

Originally Posted by ke6guj

31615. (a) A person shall not do either of the following:
(1) Purchase or receive any firearm, except an antique firearm,
without a valid firearm safety certificate, except that in the case
of a handgun, an unexpired handgun safety certificate may be used.
(2) Sell, deliver, loan, or transfer any firearm, except an
antique firearm, to any person who does not have a valid firearm
safety certificate, except that in the case of a handgun, an
unexpired handgun safety certificate may be used.

31750. Subdivision (a) of Section 31615 does not apply to the loan
of a firearm if all of the following conditions exist:
(a) The person loaning the firearm is at all times within the
presence of the person being loaned the firearm.
(b) The loan is for a lawful purpose.
(c) The loan does not exceed three days in duration.
(d) The individual receiving the firearm is not prohibited by
state or federal law from possessing, receiving, owning, or
purchasing a firearm.
(e) The person loaning the firearm is 18 years of age or older.
(f) The person being loaned the firearm is 18 years of age or
older.

Thank you

[niko925]

Originally Posted by mxadam579

does big5 issue FSC

Yes they do, just took mine this week

[LeftHand-Fu]

Bought a handgun and a rifle at the same time yesterday, using my HSC for the handgun and hunting license for the rifle. They were DROSed together for a bit of savings, and that caused my FFL to run into a software glitch you may need to know about.

The software pre-filled both forms with my HSC number without first running the automatic check on that number. The FFL proceeded to click on through when he probably shouldn't have (to be fair, like many people who went to SHOT I think he's come back with the flu), and he got stuck because the HSC was on the rifle form...with no way to back out or change it.

He had to call the DOJ support line, and learned they are well aware of this problem, but could only have him start over and this time manually input that field on the rifle form. They promised to refund the first attempt later. Hopefully they will fix this soon. Anyone else run into this?

[Condorguns]

Originally Posted by TargetMaven

Bought a handgun and a rifle at the same time yesterday, using my HSC for the handgun and hunting license for the rifle. They were DROSed together for a bit of savings, and that caused my FFL to run into a software glitch you may need to know about.

The software pre-filled both forms with my HSC number without first running the automatic check on that number. The FFL proceeded to click on through when he probably shouldn't have (to be fair, like many people who went to SHOT I think he's come back with the flu), and he got stuck because the HSC was on the rifle form...with no way to back out or change it.

He had to call the DOJ support line, and learned they are well aware of this problem, but could only have him start over and this time manually input that field on the rifle form. They promised to refund the first attempt later. Hopefully they will fix this soon. Anyone else run into this?

No, but thank you for the heads up!

[Librarian]

Jan 29 2014 - see the 2A Litigation forum for the new suit against CA-DOJ and the implementation of the FSC program.

[Vlad 11]

Originally Posted by Librarian

Jan 29 2014 - see the 2A Litigation forum for the new suit against CA-DOJ and the implementation of the FSC program.

http://calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=1033234

Originally Posted by Vlad 11

enough is enough

someone who wants their first firearm who has no FSC tax certificate and/or has no credit card is simply barred from exercising their constitutional civil rights.

And if you already can show you already own firearms the test serves no purpose ala the second 10 day wait.

Its a top to bottom farce on all levels

When is the lawsuit being filed?

Guess i got my wish 3 days later. Id like to see this challenged on its constitutional merits. But its inception and implementation are equally preposterous

[Beatone]

Originally Posted by Librarian

Jan 29 2014 - see the 2A Litigation forum for the new suit against CA-DOJ and the implementation of the FSC program.

I'm glad to see this.

[sully007]

Originally Posted by Librarian

Jan 29 2014 - see the 2A Litigation forum for the new suit against CA-DOJ and the implementation of the FSC program.

So this will be final in two weeks?

[LeftHand-Fu]

A LGS owner just told me he requires all buyers to perform a safe handling test, including buyers using hunting licenses to purchase rifles. He swore to me that this is a California requirement. He said it was in information the state gave him when the FSC program started. Well, it may well have been in the information they gave him - who knows, right? - but as far as I know it is not true: http://oag.ca.gov/firearms/fscfaqs#a21

I recently saw one of his employees insisting a longtime hunter go through that process with a pile of rifles. The customer was buying those rifles using his hunting license, and he was not exactly happy. I don't know if the guy will be back. I hate to see stores lose business over this state-imposed confusion, especially this one since it's the only truly local store for me. That's why I asked the owner next time I saw him.

Nothing has changed, right? Even under the new "emergency regulations"? Or am I in a parallel universe today? Maybe if I go back there while the place is quieter, I'll try to show him that link. This particular store doesn't do so well on Yelp already...

[low67vdubinnocal]

What store ? My lgs knew the hunting lic rule exactly. Kinda felt bad he bought snap caps in 22/250 and I pulled my 2014/15 hunting lic out. Guess I could have went through it for him just to be nice or not.

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