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  #1  
Old 01-11-2024, 10:29 AM
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V8MERC124 V8MERC124 is offline
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Default Home build from cut receiver pieces

I was wondering something with all the changes to self made firearms and the starting material.
I understand precursor parts regulations. However, how are cut up receiver pieces treated? Like a weld and machine/grind back together type home build. Technically they become precursor parts as you proceed in the process of building. But do they qualify before seeing as they were demilled into multiple pieces like the ATF wanted?? I would think not.

I understand the process to home build is apply for number first, get approved, then you can begin building from not precursor part, then within 30days but no later than 10 days after completion mark the firearm or receiver, then send photos.

So assuming you have been approved for a unique number and begin to make what they now define as a "precursor part" from cut pieces of material or block of material or a tube, this is ok because you have been approved with a number first and the "precursor part" was not obtained/created prior to approval. So you can have a precursor part as it has papers and you have to mark it (considered a firearm now).

Of course you probably dont want to stop here and just proceed to making it a completed receiver and finish into a rifle. If left as a receiver you may need to reapply due to changing its configuration after 30days.

Hopefully you guys can understand my question about cut up pieces or back up the logic in the steps one could take.
Also of course what does "readily converted" truly mean, which I saw they vaguely describe as easy but not necessarily easy lol.

Quote:
(5) ?Readily? means a process, action, or physical state that is fairly or reasonably
efficient, quick, and easy, but not necessarily the most efficient, speediest, or easiest
process, action, or physical state. With respect to the classification of firearm precursor
parts, factors relevant in making this determination include the following:
(A) Time, i.e., how long it takes to finish the process;
(B) Ease, i.e., how difficult it is to do so;
(C) Expertise, i.e., what knowledge and skills are required;
(D) Equipment, i.e., what tools are required;
(E) Parts availability, i.e., whether additional parts are required, and how easily
they can be obtained;
(F) Expense, i.e., how much it costs;
(G) Scope, i.e., the extent to which the subject of the process must be changed to
finish it; and
(H) Feasibility, i.e., whether the process would damage or destroy the subject of
the process, or cause it to malfunction.
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Last edited by V8MERC124; 01-11-2024 at 10:48 AM.. Reason: edit to clarify steps I mentioned
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Old 01-11-2024, 10:37 AM
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If you make a firearm receiver in CA, it now has to be serialized and registered.
It does not matter if you start with a precursor piece or a shovel as your base material that the receiver is made from.
I would not apply until I was well within the 30 day time window of completion.

Last edited by ar15barrels; 01-11-2024 at 10:40 AM..
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Old 01-11-2024, 10:51 AM
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I think I skipped over the step of beginning building after approval only but I edited that in now.
Serializing and registering I understand that is required.
Quote:
I would not apply until I was well within the 30 day time window of completion.
Isnt approval needed first before starting on a receiver or "precursor part"?
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Old 01-11-2024, 12:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by V8MERC124 View Post
I think I skipped over the step of beginning building after approval only but I edited that in now.
Serializing and registering I understand that is required.

Isnt approval needed first before starting on a receiver or "precursor part"?
Leave some critical steps un-finished so you do NOT complete a receiver without first applying for the serial number.
Then you apply for the serial number for the receiver that you would like to manufacture.
Do not do this until you know you can also finish the complete build for photographs within the 30 day window.
In other words, make sure you have all the parts on-hand so you don't time-out the 30 days waiting for some part to arrive and have to do the process all over to actually complete the firearm.

A tree falls in the woods and nobody is around to hear it, does it actually make a sound?
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Old 01-11-2024, 9:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ar15barrels View Post
Leave some critical steps un-finished so you do NOT complete a receiver without first applying for the serial number.
Then you apply for the serial number for the receiver that you would like to manufacture.
Do not do this until you know you can also finish the complete build for photographs within the 30 day window.
In other words, make sure you have all the parts on-hand so you don't time-out the 30 days waiting for some part to arrive and have to do the process all over to actually complete the firearm.

A tree falls in the woods and nobody is around to hear it, does it actually make a sound?
This makes sense.
I appreciate it
As far as cut up receiver pieces just being a jigsaw puzzle, its a puzzle before its a picture so they shouldn't constitute a precursor part until a certain stage is reached.
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Old 01-21-2024, 3:25 PM
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Per ATF once a machine gun always a machine gun.
At least they viewed it in the late early 90/2k. A lot of reweld M14 receivers had to be turned over to the ATF.
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Old 01-21-2024, 3:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jtv3062 View Post
Per ATF once a machine gun always a machine gun.
At least they viewed it in the late early 90/2k. A lot of reweld M14 receivers had to be turned over to the ATF.
I believe if its demilled per ATF its no longer a gun or machine gun and considered scrap, and not regulated. If you were to build something from scrap it cannot have features of the automatic versions such as the extra holes for auto sears or capable of accepting an open bolt (like on an uzi).
I already know a lot of people weld scrap demilled per atf instructions or add repair sections to fill in gaps. You just have to take some extra steps before final construction to ensure its not full auto capable with swapping in parts.
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Old 02-16-2024, 4:28 PM
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So welding up a demilled uzi receiver into a semi is still ok once you get a number from cfars?I’ve done a sten and suomi from tubes and got numbers on them. I have a uzi kit with overlapping pieces that will make a nice reweld.
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Old 04-01-2024, 7:17 PM
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This might be of interest to the op.
I believe it was MKS rewarded a bunch of demilled M14s with the ATF collecting the inventory and visiting buyers homes. But as stated your friends already do rewelds. Have fun.

https://www.m14forum.com/threads/con...-on-gb.540411/
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Old 04-01-2024, 8:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jtv3062 View Post
This might be of interest to the op.
I believe it was MKS rewarded a bunch of demilled M14s with the ATF collecting the inventory and visiting buyers homes. But as stated your friends already do rewelds. Have fun.

https://www.m14forum.com/threads/con...-on-gb.540411/

Im not sure what it is with the m14?s and why there was an issue with those. But I think the atf may not have like how those were demilled initially maybe? In that they werent demilled enough and technically still classified as machine guns.

Friends? No I wasnt referring to people I know. But I know that people (others in general out there) do rewelds into semi only. So it definitely isnt a new or small thing. Atf is well aware of people doing it.

Still worth your mentioning of the m14 situation for awareness. Thanks for that


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Old 04-02-2024, 7:52 AM
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This was tried many years back with no success. ATF's uterus was severely wounded, and they passed the grief on to citizens with gusto. Besides, when you are done, you still have a welded receiver. Provided all the holes are in the right place, and dimensions are correct, almost any commercial one piece M14 receiver is better.


Thought I might add, MOST of the makers of M14 clone receivers, past and present, are very, very good, but not all the time. ALL of the "good" makers let a few stinkers out the door. Some individually, some entire production runs. How they handle their f&%kup is to be considered. I have had some replace receivers with little of no questions asked. One of the fan boy top dog makers go the extra mile to not own their screwups. I wont mention their name here, but their initials are "LRB".
SOME makes avoid at all cost.

Last edited by kendog4570; 04-03-2024 at 7:35 PM..
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Old 04-08-2024, 12:11 PM
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Jamesob- as far as I can see, yes. I would weld the semi blockers in place before welding the pieces together, and apply for your FMBUS number before beginning work.

-Dave
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