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Centerfire Rifles - Manually Operated Lever action, bolt action or other non gas operated centerfire rifles.

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  #1  
Old 07-26-2020, 10:12 AM
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Default PRS Rifle Weight?



Is this screenshot from Mr Zant correct?
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  #2  
Old 07-26-2020, 1:27 PM
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Old 07-26-2020, 1:50 PM
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looks correct from what Iíve seen

definitely an advantage once you reach about 20lbs
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Old 07-26-2020, 1:51 PM
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Yeah, can't read the screen. Generally PRS rifles average between 18 and 22lbs. The combination of weight, low-recoiling calibers, and effective brakes allow the rifles to remain on target and spot your hits/miss.
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Old 07-27-2020, 7:56 AM
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Sorry about the tiny picture
I tried linking the page and got way too much clutter.

So most PRS rifles weigh more than most Benchrest rifles but you can hunt with a PRS rifle?
Very interesting.
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Old 07-27-2020, 9:50 AM
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PRS type rifles have gotten heavier and heavier. Initially, when there was more prone type shooting and more 308's, the rifles were about 15lbs with conventional fiberglass stocks (think M40A1/M24SWS with mag feed). Then there was more positional shooting stages and the switch to 6/6.5mm the rifles got lighter, in the 12-15lbs range with a 17lb rifle considered heavy with a mix of conventional fiberglass and some chassis. Currently the rifles seem to be back toward the heavier side with rifles going 18-20lbs shooting 6BRA/Dasher all in some chassis, to allow you to set the rifle on a improvised field position.
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Old 07-27-2020, 10:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LynnJr View Post
Sorry about the tiny picture
I tried linking the page and got way too much clutter.

So most PRS rifles weigh more than most Benchrest rifles but you can hunt with a PRS rifle?
Very interesting.
I mean I wouldn't...
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Old 07-27-2020, 11:08 AM
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My rifle is nearly 16lb without any "add-on weights" and that is light these days seems like.
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Old 07-27-2020, 1:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LynnJr View Post
Sorry about the tiny picture
I tried linking the page and got way too much clutter.

So most PRS rifles weigh more than most Benchrest rifles but you can hunt with a PRS rifle?
Very interesting.
don't know anyone who hunts with their PRS match gun.

or not on purpose anyways

think of it more as an F-open gun with a brake and a magazine
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  #10  
Old 07-27-2020, 2:31 PM
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Mine is 23 lbs with the MDT weight kit.

Heavier gun + light recoiling (6mm) caliber = Better to spot your own impacts and misses and make adjustments on-the-clock.
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  #11  
Old 07-27-2020, 4:14 PM
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Does PRS and/or NRL hold any matches in the Bay Area? I think I saw something for Sac Valley.

I signed up for a novice match at Avenal through practiscore, but that all went to sh it after COVID.

Want try again but not sure which one to sign up for. And I'm guessing for Novice pick the "prone"?
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Old 07-27-2020, 4:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DDRH View Post
Does PRS and/or NRL hold any matches in the Bay Area? I think I saw something for Sac Valley.

I signed up for a novice match at Avenal through practiscore, but that all went to sh it after COVID.

Want try again but not sure which one to sign up for. And I'm guessing for Novice pick the "prone"?

there's a few club level PRS style matches within a couple hours of the bay

notable ones:
Sac Valley Steel Match
Avenal Tactical Match(PRS southwest regional series)
Tahema

only Avenal offers a prone division,
and is probably the most beginner friendly.
due to the CoF, par time, and target size/distances

you just missed the July match, which was yesterday
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Old 07-27-2020, 4:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LynnJr View Post


Is this screenshot from Mr Zant correct?


Here is the full size image:


Last edited by jimmykan; 07-27-2020 at 4:54 PM.. Reason: Added the chart that LynnJr was trying to show.
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Old 07-27-2020, 4:50 PM
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Truck axle barrels are back in fashion, eh?

If you don't have to carry the rifle for long, then 18-20 lbs seems alright.

Are there any PRS stages these days that require you to shoot standing, offhand?

I remember seeing Solomon at Angeles, he was doing hold drills with his match rifle.

Like the NRA Highpower drill: "Up. Hold (for what feels like an eternity) ... Down. Rest. Repeat."

Last edited by jimmykan; 07-27-2020 at 5:00 PM..
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  #15  
Old 07-27-2020, 4:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mmlook View Post
there's a few club level PRS style matches within a couple hours of the bay

notable ones:
Sac Valley Steel Match
Avenal Tactical Match(PRS southwest regional series)
Tahema

only Avenal offers a prone division,
and is probably the most beginner friendly.
due to the CoF, par time, and target size/distances

you just missed the July match, which was yesterday
How's the ~roughly 3 mile hike? My lungs and joints aren't so good. Tough to go back to the gym during these times.
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Old 07-27-2020, 5:59 PM
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This sounds like a sport crying out for golf carts.
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  #17  
Old 07-27-2020, 7:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmykan View Post
Truck axle barrels are back in fashion, eh?

If you don't have to carry the rifle for long, then 18-20 lbs seems alright.

Are there any PRS stages these days that require you to shoot standing, offhand?

I remember seeing Solomon at Angeles, he was doing hold drills with his match rifle.

Like the NRA Highpower drill: "Up. Hold (for what feels like an eternity) ... Down. Rest. Repeat."
depends on the match, some require hiking, some dont.

a decent amount of west coast matches have an off hand stage

Quote:
Originally Posted by DDRH View Post
How's the ~roughly 3 mile hike? My lungs and joints aren't so good. Tough to go back to the gym during these times.
the hike is ok, as long as it's not too hot.
go at your own pace,
worst case scenario, it's a 4 mile hike
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Old 07-28-2020, 11:39 AM
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This sounds like a sport crying out for golf carts.
LOL
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Old 07-28-2020, 7:22 PM
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Default PRS Rifle Weight?

Quote:
Originally Posted by LynnJr View Post


Is this screenshot from Mr Zant correct?


Just a few years ago we were shooting 10-16 lbs guns. Just in the last couple of years the guys free recoiling moved down in caliber and way up in weight.

Not everyone is shooting heavy guns. As the PRS guns moved up in weight and down in caliber you do not see many hunting with them.

Some guys are pushing 30lbs it has gotten ridiculous; so much so that some people will not shoot hiking matches like ours.

Now way would I hunt with my 2020 match gun, but I donít hunt next to my truck. I have seen some guys hunt on their farm with their match guns so I guess it depends on who you talk to.

Edited to add: (I see much I said above was already addressed. I missed that post).

But the move all come from the need to self-spot. Originally, you really need good fundamentals to score well with a 308 at 14-16lbs, If you didnít you would not be able to adjust. Now, with these heavier guns an light loads it more about speed and the obstacles have become even more silly, like a swing.

Unfortunately, even very good PRS shooters who are not using traditional fundamentals are surprised when they try to manage a ultra light hunting magnum.

I think Benchrest did a smart thing with weight limits.










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  #20  
Old 07-31-2020, 3:17 PM
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My Surgeon 591SA as it sits below is 16.4 lbs unloaded w/a 26-inch Krieger CM Heavy Palma barrel and A5 stock chambered in 6.5 x 47 Lapua



.

I hunt with several rifles but not the Surgeon, this one is typical, Interarms (M98 Lg. Ring) action, 23-inch #2 contour Shilen CM barrel, B & C Carbelite stock chambered in 7mm-08 Rem., it's 9.6 lbs as it sits below




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Old 08-01-2020, 9:39 AM
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Member Whitemamba just had this one put together.
X-treme titanium action
Carbon wrapped barrel.
Magnesium chassis.
6 Creedmoor.
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Old 08-01-2020, 9:51 AM
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I mean to be fair it's precision rifle... Why would you ever shoot off hand for precision..
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Old 08-01-2020, 1:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LynnJr View Post



Member Whitemamba just had this one put together.
X-treme titanium action
Carbon wrapped barrel.
Magnesium chassis.
6 Creedmoor.
SIG Cross is 6.5-6.8 pounds without any titanium, carbon, or magnesium for $1500.
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Old 08-02-2020, 6:17 PM
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Default PRS Rifle Weight?

Quote:
Originally Posted by sigstroker View Post
SIG Cross is 6.5-6.8 pounds without any titanium, carbon, or magnesium for $1500.


Itís hard to compare without doing an apples to apples capability comparison - I have a Manners CF, CF Proof under 6lbs in the bare with mag (but even the image with the chassis is sans mag) and a 5.8 Tikka with fluted pencil barrel with magazine. The tikka is a different gun after 3 shots than the one with the proof and the one in the image.

Comparing incomplete rifles, or the ones with scopes with no long range features vrs ones equipped with illumination and adjustable turrets is not really the way to do it. We need to first define what the roles sweat spot is and the general performance window.


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Old 08-03-2020, 4:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sigstroker View Post
SIG Cross is 6.5-6.8 pounds without any titanium, carbon, or magnesium for $1500.
SigStroker
The gun your talking about has a 16 inch barrel that is pencil thin to save weight.
The gun in my picture has a 26 inch heavy by CalGuns standards barrel on it and has been shot to 1300 yards so far.
I'm not a chassis guy nor a lightweight guy as I tend to hate recoil but this latest build by Whitemamba has definitely caught my attention. I think the action and barrel blank would surpass the $2000 point and the chassis adds another $1100 with the titanium expanded grip plus the ride to Dave Tooley for the chambering and back so right around $4000?
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Old 08-03-2020, 7:12 AM
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My microscope is out getting a new paint job.
haha
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Old 08-05-2020, 9:59 PM
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I don't understand why people care about other people's rifle weight. Carry whats comfortable to you, don't worry about what others are doing. If 16lbs is comfortable to you, fine. I know a few guys who could probably hump a 30lb rifle around all day in the field if they wanted. Cool, they are in way better shape than me.. I'm fat and out of shape so I don't carry around a 30lb rifle, crazy how that works. The vast majority of rifles I see at matches are in the 18-22lb ballpark which is plenty manageable under most field match conditions, and many of those rifles could shed weight in a hurry if they needed to simply by pulling weight kits off.

You also have to consider the type of activity and the conditions you will be shooting, and adjust accordingly. Bring the right tool for the job. A match like mammoth where rucking/land nav is a huge part of the competition or back country hunting where you MAY take a shot or two the entire trip.. yea dude rock that light weight rifle. Hiking like 2 miles over the course of an entire 8 hour match where the primary goal is to hit a lot of small targets in quick succession, an 18-20lb rifle is pretty manageable for most able bodied individuals. Think you might see heavy elevation changes, pull your weights off and now you are in the 16-18lb range pretty quick.

So can you hunt with a PRS gun? Sure. Would you be bringing the right tool for the job? I guess thats up to you to figure out based on the conditions of the hunt.
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Old 08-06-2020, 12:51 AM
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Just got my rifle back from Rubicon. Thing weighs 23 lbs with optic.
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Old 08-06-2020, 1:13 AM
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Meety Pretty
That is exactly what I do.
For my style of hunting I use a 17 pound Benchrest lightgun capable of sub 4 inch 1000 yard groups.

I have posted about using such guns and each time the weight seems to to be an issue.
I assumed the PRS rifles must have been considerably lighter only to find out they are considerably heavier and getting heavier each year.
They are heavier than F-Class guns as well as they are limited to 22 pounds and a little over 18 pounds.
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Old 08-07-2020, 8:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LynnJr View Post
Meety Pretty
That is exactly what I do.
For my style of hunting I use a 17 pound Benchrest lightgun capable of sub 4 inch 1000 yard groups.

I have posted about using such guns and each time the weight seems to to be an issue.
I assumed the PRS rifles must have been considerably lighter only to find out they are considerably heavier and getting heavier each year.
They are heavier than F-Class guns as well as they are limited to 22 pounds and a little over 18 pounds.
Was it the gun itself or did the questions come from transporting the actual heavy benchrest and heavy bags that help the gun become as capable as you indicate?

I know you mentioned to me that your able to set a bench up next to your truck to hunt. Of course, then all that gear would not matter.
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Old 08-07-2020, 9:45 AM
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Originally Posted by diver160651 View Post
Was it the gun itself or did the questions come from transporting the actual heavy benchrest and heavy bags that help the gun become as capable as you indicate?

I know you mentioned to me that your able to set a bench up next to your truck to hunt. Of course, then all that gear would not matter.
The issue seems to be that few of us can agree on ways to hunt and the tools to use; and some of us are more vocal than others.

Hunting rifle weight threads tend to go in two directions, "light is right" vs. "get to the gym fatty".

Hunting distance threads tend to go in two directions, "don't fire till you see the whites of their eyes" and "If you can reliably take the shot and can carry enough velocity downrange, fire at will".

LynnJr has more than once announced that he hunts with a 17lb rifle and shoots deer at 800+ yards, often with little clarification that he's using a benchrest setup (unless someone asks) and is an accomplished long range shooter and benchrest competitor. This leads other people in the thread to occasionally assume he's taking field position hail mary shots at 800 yards after hiking 20 miles with a 17lb gun and denounce him as a fool.

People occasionally compare PRS to hunting because in both situations shooters are often using improvised rests at targets presented at varying distances. Most of the time these people making these comparisons are neither hunters nor PRS shooters.

So long as it's legal and not detrimental to our wildlife numbers or the safety of others LynnJr should hunt however he chooses. It's not the way I want to hunt, but that doesn't make it wrong.
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Old 08-07-2020, 12:19 PM
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The issue seems to be that few of us can agree on ways to hunt and the tools to use; and some of us are more vocal than others.

Hunting rifle weight threads tend to go in two directions, "light is right" vs. "get to the gym fatty".

Hunting distance threads tend to go in two directions, "don't fire till you see the whites of their eyes" and "If you can reliably take the shot and can carry enough velocity downrange, fire at will".

LynnJr has more than once announced that he hunts with a 17lb rifle and shoots deer at 800+ yards, often with little clarification that he's using a benchrest setup (unless someone asks) and is an accomplished long range shooter and benchrest competitor. This leads other people in the thread to occasionally assume he's taking field position hail mary shots at 800 yards after hiking 20 miles with a 17lb gun and denounce him as a fool.

People occasionally compare PRS to hunting because in both situations shooters are often using improvised rests at targets presented at varying distances. Most of the time these people making these comparisons are neither hunters nor PRS shooters.

So long as it's legal and not detrimental to our wildlife numbers or the safety of others LynnJr should hunt however he chooses. It's not the way I want to hunt, but that doesn't make it wrong.
My opinion is if the hunter is well-practiced and shoots a ton every year, they'll probably be much better able to make a well-placed shot regardless of range. What I saw a lot last year during Elk season was a lot of shooters hearing of the long-range success, talking shots at distances they didn't have wired with gear never intended to guarantee success at the ranges they are trying. I heard 3 guys shooting over 23 rounds when we lost count and several others over the 10 day season empty mags or multiples; wounded and animals due to lack of understanding, skill or practice is not good for anyone.


For clarification, I am not judging how he hunts, he is well-practiced. I use a tripod some people don't like that. I was pointing out that he told me uses other gear to help ensure his accuracy. It doesn't matter if it's heavy if you don't have to pack it, just like some of the PRS guys shooting on their farms.

FWIW My long range hunting set up is about 14lbs INCLUDING the tripod, so I am slogging more gear than a lot of people. But I am able to shoot with much more confidence, much further than I could otherwise. It is the same concept as what Lynn is doing, just a different version. BTW that same gun is used in some PRS matches. My long action actuly weighs a 1/2LBs less that the one I use for pigs and pictured.

Here is from the range yesterday. My actual shooting tripod is the one on the left. I am shooting my hunting gun off my grid glassing head in the image.


BTW glassing like in CO and Wyoming I take really heavy stuff when I glass near the truck.

Anyway, I am off to go move some other gear some hunters hate.. cell cams
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Old 08-07-2020, 8:55 PM
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I hunt with about 6 rifles in my truck which leads to some fun discussions with fish and game.
They always ask me where are the other guys.
What I normally do is drive to my bench which stays in the field year round.
The gun is lugged from 50 yards to maybe 125 yards before sunrise and gets setup.
I watch large bowls from pre-sun-up to around 10 AM.
That is a morning hunt.
If the animals are not moving I will walk the creek edge for a couple miles with a 12 pound 6mm-06 a pair of Leitz 7-50 binoculars and an old Leica 1200 rangefinder.
If I use a 65 pound heavy gun I setup next to the truck on what looks very similar to a varmint bench.
I use it because it offers 360 degrees of rotation and the front rest is very easy to adjust for elevation which helps make any shot look easy.
I scout 1-2 months after the deer season ends and cut any of my trails in early March so come September I don't make any noise getting to my shooting spots.
I will even put a 4x4 post into the ground to shoot off of if the spot is productive.
It's not for everyone but I've taken quite a few bucks over the last 46 years.
If most hunters would spend an honest 3 days with loppers a hand saw and a small chainsaw making a decent trail they would kill a lot more bucks.
I can walk to places in 45 minutes to an hour that would take 3+ hours to get to without a trail.
And you have already scared the deer away crashing through brush to get there.
__________________
Lynn Dragoman, Jr.
Southwest Regional Director
Unlimited Range Shooters Association (URSA)
www.unlimitedrange.org
Not a commercial business.
URSA - Competition starts at 2000 yards!
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