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  #1  
Old 01-13-2021, 9:26 AM
Bolt_Action Bolt_Action is offline
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Default Selling/shipping ammunition out of state?

I have some ammunition to sell, and I can’t figure out how it works if someone buys it out of state. If I have an out of state buyer, am I still restricted to the 500 rounds/month limit? Obviously I wouldn’t be able to do the transfer “face to face,” is this a problem since I’m in CA? How do you ship ammunition? UPS? Do I need to print out some sort of “hazardous material” label and stick it on the outside of the package?
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  #2  
Old 01-13-2021, 9:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bolt_Action View Post
I have some ammunition to sell, and I can’t figure out how it works if someone buys it out of state. If I have an out of state buyer, am I still restricted to the 500 rounds/month limit? Obviously I wouldn’t be able to do the transfer “face to face,” is this a problem since I’m in CA? How do you ship ammunition? UPS? Do I need to print out some sort of “hazardous material” label and stick it on the outside of the package?
Yes, the law says a CA resident without an ammo license can only sell 500. There's nothing there about where you sell it.
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”Benitez 3:29 Thou shall not limit magazine capacity”

Last edited by morrcarr67; 01-14-2021 at 7:53 AM..
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  #3  
Old 01-24-2021, 8:23 PM
Bolt_Action Bolt_Action is offline
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I've recently been told that according to CA PC 30312, there is no legal way for a CA resident to sell ammunition to an out of state buyer, since all ammunition sales by a CA resident have to be processed though a "licensed ammunition vendor." Obviously these vendors can't process the transaction if the buyer lives in another state. If I understand this correctly, the only way I can sell ammunition to an out of state buyer would be to drive outside the state, sell the ammo and ship it, then drive back? Is this for real?
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Old 01-24-2021, 10:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bolt_Action View Post
I've recently been told that according to CA PC 30312, there is no legal way for a CA resident to sell ammunition to an out of state buyer, since all ammunition sales by a CA resident have to be processed though a "licensed ammunition vendor." Obviously these vendors can't process the transaction if the buyer lives in another state. If I understand this correctly, the only way I can sell ammunition to an out of state buyer would be to drive outside the state, sell the ammo and ship it, then drive back? Is this for real?
Here's the Penal Code:
Quote:
30342.

(a) Commencing January 1, 2018, a valid ammunition vendor license shall be required for any person, firm, corporation, or other business enterprise to sell more than 500 rounds of ammunition in any 30-day period.

(b) A violation of this section is a misdemeanor.
Does it look real to you?

As morcarr67 pointed out, no exception for where your buyer may be.

Take the ammo out of state, follow that state's laws, (if any).
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– Declaration of Independence, July 4th, 1776
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  #5  
Old 01-24-2021, 10:16 PM
Bolt_Action Bolt_Action is offline
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But I’m not talking about the 500 round limit. From what I’m seeing here if interpreted in the most restrictive way, I can’t even sell one round of ammunition to an out of state buyer because the buyer can’t be processed by the CA ammunition vendor.
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Old 01-24-2021, 10:42 PM
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"...MORE than 500 rounds of ammunition in any 30-day period...." is the key phrase.

Read it how you like.

It's pretty clear.
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Old 01-24-2021, 10:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by olhunter View Post
"...MORE than 500 rounds of ammunition in any 30-day period...." is the key phrase.

Read it how you like.

It's pretty clear.
That’s the key phrase of PC 30342. It’s pretty clear one person cannot sell more than 500 rounds in 30 days. But I’m now concerned with PC 30312, which states in part that “the sale of ammunition by any party shall be conducted by or processed through a licensed ammunition vendor.” So given that, is it possible for anyone in CA to sell ammunition to anyone outside of CA?
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  #8  
Old 01-24-2021, 11:36 PM
edgerly779 edgerly779 is offline
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If you did ship just put orme-d symbol on box and ship ups ground.
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  #9  
Old 01-25-2021, 12:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bolt_Action View Post
That’s the key phrase of PC 30342. It’s pretty clear one person cannot sell more than 500 rounds in 30 days. But I’m now concerned with PC 30312, which states in part that “the sale of ammunition by any party shall be conducted by or processed through a licensed ammunition vendor.” So given that, is it possible for anyone in CA to sell ammunition to anyone outside of CA?
30312 does say that -
Quote:
30312.

(a) (1) Commencing January 1, 2018, the sale of ammunition by any party shall be conducted by or processed through a licensed ammunition vendor.
As already noted, the work-around is to take yourself and the ammo out of CA and sell, following the rules in the other state. (ETA: to a non-CA buyer, of course)

Quote:
Originally Posted by edgerly779 View Post
If you did ship just put orme-d symbol on box and ship ups ground.
No, ORM-D is now defunct - https://www.phmsa.dot.gov/training/h...rm-d-phase-out
Quote:
After December 31, 2020, hazmat shippers will no longer be able to use the ORM-D Consumer Commodity marking on packages containing limited quantities of low risk hazardous materials. Packages must be marked with the Limited Quantity marking in accordance with the Code of Federal Regulations, Title 49, Section 173.156.
UPS says
Quote:
How to Package Cartridges, Small Arms

Ammunition must be packed in inside boxes, partitioned within a snugly fitting outside box or in metal clips. Cartridges must be properly cushioned and protected from accidental initiation. The inside boxes, partitions or metal clips must be packaged in securely closed outside packaging that will not open during transit. The package may not exceed 66 lb. (30 kg).
and the package is now marked with the oh-so-different
__________________
When a Long Train of Abuses and Usurpations, Pursuing Invariably the Same Object, Evinces a Design to Reduce Them [I.E. the People] Under Absolute Despotism, It Is Their Right, It Is Their Duty, to Throw off Such Government, and to Provide New Guards for Their Future Security.”
– Declaration of Independence, July 4th, 1776
"The object of life is not to be on the side of the majority, but to escape finding oneself in the ranks of the insane."

- Marcus Aurelius
Consider Samizdat; consider some reading material, such as this and that.

Not a lawyer, just Some Guy On The Interwebs.




Last edited by Librarian; 01-25-2021 at 12:41 AM..
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  #10  
Old 01-25-2021, 12:21 AM
edgerly779 edgerly779 is offline
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^^ Don't you have to put diamond symbol on package instead of wording?
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  #11  
Old 01-25-2021, 12:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by edgerly779 View Post
^^ Don't you have to put diamond symbol on package instead of wording?
Yes - you don't see the image I linked?

https://www.ups.com/assets/resources...on_diamond.jpg
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When a Long Train of Abuses and Usurpations, Pursuing Invariably the Same Object, Evinces a Design to Reduce Them [I.E. the People] Under Absolute Despotism, It Is Their Right, It Is Their Duty, to Throw off Such Government, and to Provide New Guards for Their Future Security.”
– Declaration of Independence, July 4th, 1776
"The object of life is not to be on the side of the majority, but to escape finding oneself in the ranks of the insane."

- Marcus Aurelius
Consider Samizdat; consider some reading material, such as this and that.

Not a lawyer, just Some Guy On The Interwebs.



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