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Guns & Money Discussion Re: Pro/Anti 2A Org's 990's & Finances

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  #1  
Old 01-15-2020, 10:05 AM
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Default NRA's push for membership upgrades or other groups

So, I have been getting letters to upgrade my life membership from Patron to Benefactor and they are doing a pretty discount on it. Quite frankly, I am not sure what I get as a Benefactor vs. Patron that is worth doing it, I am thinking of giving my money to other more CA focused groups. Then I read the propaganda from the NRA and I wonder if since it is a election year, maybe a national group is better use of my money.

So what is the advantage of "Benefactor" if anything ?

Where should my money go ? (don't say into your pocket )
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Old 01-15-2020, 11:30 AM
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None that I care about - I think I'm an Endowment Member.
I just considered it giving them $200, but I think I'd be happier if Wayne left.
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Old 01-15-2020, 5:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikeyr View Post
So, I have been getting letters to upgrade my life membership from Patron to Benefactor and they are doing a pretty discount on it. Quite frankly, I am not sure what I get as a Benefactor vs. Patron that is worth doing it, I am thinking of giving my money to other more CA focused groups. Then I read the propaganda from the NRA and I wonder if since it is a election year, maybe a national group is better use of my money.

So what is the advantage of "Benefactor" if anything ?

Where should my money go ? (don't say into your pocket )
If conflicted between donations to Ca and National Pro 2A orgs. Join and give to CRPA.

2 birds with each dollar. Money spent by CRPA on Ca. is money NRA doesn't have to take from the national platform.

WIN..........WIN
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Old 01-16-2020, 10:23 AM
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I too would be happier if Wayne L. left the NRA. Until he does, they will no longer get any money from me (40+ years). I'll support local organizations such as CRPA. It gals me to think that my NRA membership dues don't even come close to paying the food tip for one of his lunches.
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Old 01-16-2020, 11:00 AM
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^^^This. As a Benefactor, the NRA will it be seeing another penny from me until I am satisfied with the leadership. CRPA and SAF are benefitting from the NRA’s stumble.

Rusty Bolts
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Old 01-16-2020, 11:07 AM
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Life member here. Not doing more till some changes are made at the NRA.

NRA has been slip sliding away for many years now.
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Old 01-16-2020, 2:18 PM
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The only groups or organizations that I’m actively donating to right now are the CRPA and FPC. And locally, the SDCGO.

Last edited by Oldboyjun; 01-16-2020 at 2:20 PM..
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Old 01-17-2020, 10:41 AM
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ok, CRPA it is. It looks like moving up from Patron to Benefactor gets me nothing but being able to say I bought buying one sleeve on Wayne's suits.
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Old 01-17-2020, 9:36 PM
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NRA claims a membership pricing of $1500, but, I can upgrade for $350?

Something's wrong with that pricing scheme. Perhaps they'd get a better response if I didn't think this membership is worth $25 and they're up-pricing so they can discount it.

And I don't need another crappy coat from them.
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Old 01-19-2020, 6:22 PM
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I'm a Patron member, have no interest to go higher at this time. I was paying the Annual memberships for four other family members, but the dust-ups at HQ lately put me off that. They lost four members in my family alone.
CRPA and Calguns seem to be more deserving of my financial support.
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  #11  
Old 01-19-2020, 6:43 PM
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What happened with the insurance program?
When I signed up as a life member, free theft coverage to $2500 was included.

Two upgrades later, I ran across something that it was cancelled?
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  #12  
Old 01-19-2020, 6:54 PM
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I am also a Life Member and frequent donor who doesn’t want to see any future donations go to funding Wayne LaPierre’s lifestyle choices or to providing upscale housing for any of his interns. But we can’t allow the NRA to fail. The organization is much bigger — and far more important — than one man.
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Old 01-19-2020, 10:18 PM
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But do not let him or his minions hold the organization hostage. greed and selfish attitudes have no place in defending the second amendment.
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Old 02-04-2020, 10:32 PM
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In my opinion the NRA leadership seems to be more focused on looking out for itself and its financial interests; its a little crazy that Wayne’s paycheck is over 1.5 million a year don’t you think?

My thoughts are your money would be better spent in investing in local chapters of CRPA to combat all the crazy proposed DOJ’s regulations in our state.

Don’t get me wrong we need the NRA, but from where I’m standing I don’t see them doing a whole lot for us here in CA; I feel they look at us as a lost cause in CA, so with that said your money would go a lot further supporting our movement here in California.
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Old 02-04-2020, 11:14 PM
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it would not hurt californians to spend their money on trying to clean up their state and support those that focus on helping in that fight. If it means supporting local groups, lawyers, and ignoring the national groups who might take your money and sacrifice you for "the good" of the nation then so be it. if national organizations start helping then respond in kind once they prove they are here to help you. Get your dollars worth and not some far flung promises that they can't or won't keep. i personally feel local groups and lawyers are better and let them show us where they got help from national groups looking for our money. At this stage we cannot afford shills for national organizations trying to get our money.

Last edited by big red; 02-04-2020 at 11:16 PM..
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Old 02-05-2020, 10:11 AM
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OP here, I have to agree with everyone so far about not giving more money to the NRA, I also am not happy with their leadership and even more unhappy with the fact they are ignoring it and not trying to fix it.

My only real point was that I was thinking with it being a election year that maybe my money should go to the NRA to help fund the fight for the presidency since CA is a lost cause. If it was not a election year than I would have no issues skipping the NRA until after they clean up or at least admit they have a problem.

My money is staying local....
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Old 02-05-2020, 3:41 PM
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I am a Trump supporter and i think he will prevail regardless of so-called organizational backers. As independent free Americans put your money where you think it will do the most good but think of your state first and those inside this state fighting for you that could use your support. Watching other states if fine but they are not funneling money to California to help fund our resistance and that means we have to do it on our own with organizations focused on California and it's draconian laws passed by politicians who happen to be lawyers for the most part. Let's back good independent lawyers who can help us and let's keep our organizations as strong as possible. The nation is going to have to take care of it self while we try to get our house in order.
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Old 02-06-2020, 2:59 PM
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Just a thought. CRPA is an affiliate of the NRA, however they have been doing amazing litigation for us. I'm not a supporter or ever was a member of the NRA. That being said, it is possible donations being made to CRPA could be getting funneled over to NRA.

And I agree we should be donating to local organizations and FPC.
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Old 02-06-2020, 3:04 PM
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Just to give a little bit of context:

https://ballotpedia.org/California_R...ol_Association
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  #20  
Old 02-06-2020, 9:52 PM
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how about stipulating that what you donate has to go where you dictate and to whom or they should return it. That should be simple or am I missing something?
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Old 02-07-2020, 12:27 PM
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how about stipulating that what you donate has to go where you dictate and to whom or they should return it. That should be simple or am I missing something?
That should be an option. Unfortunately, with any "charity" or organization, there are "overhead" costs.

For every dollar that is donated, probably only a fraction of it is translated into meaningful litigation and lawyer fees. The rest goes towards whatever they need to run the organization.
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Old 02-07-2020, 1:39 PM
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I did not mean micro dictate how money is spent once it is received. The only stipulation might be that the organization spend it for the good of California. I would be opposed to donating CRPA if they gave half of everything to the NRA blindly but if CRPA kept all the money to fight for california causes and only gave the NRA or other national organizations some payback for their clear help in our fights then that would be a personal choice i could support. It is the "rest" part i tend to raise questions about when it is national organizations. But for the most part I agree with you.
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Old 02-07-2020, 3:01 PM
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I don't know how it is with gun-rights organizations, but there is a site called charitynavigator that is comprehensive in its detailing of charities. All charities that are tax-exempt and "non-profit" (ie. Red cross etc) have to release their tax records and be transparent. You can even see what their monetary donation intake each year is, how much they spend on overhead, employees, and even how much their ceo's make. It's pretty disgusting looking at certain organizations and how they justify their spending, especially in regards to CEO bonuses. One of the worst was Wounded Warriors. As a vet this pisses me off. But I digress.

There should be a mechanism for ensuring our donations go towards maximum effectiveness. I've donated to FPC a few times and can say with 90% certainty my money is going towards a just cause and is being used well.
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Old 02-07-2020, 3:09 PM
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In my view, the NRA has to undertake a MAJOR overall.

No more lavish executive board party junkets. Performing community service should be a major program. Become more inclusive and make a sincere effort to educate the public on firearms usage. These are just my personal thoughts as a start.

Most important of all is LEADERSHIP. That's what the organization is lacking. Hell make Colion Noir the head, at least he cares about perception, is young and dynamic, and investigates different failed policies like socioeconomic problems in SF (watch his film).
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Old 02-07-2020, 3:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MoBeansMoProbs View Post
I don't know how it is with gun-rights organizations, but there is a site called charitynavigator that is comprehensive in its detailing of charities. All charities that are tax-exempt and "non-profit" (ie. Red cross etc) have to release their tax records and be transparent. You can even see what their monetary donation intake each year is, how much they spend on overhead, employees, and even how much their ceo's make. It's pretty disgusting looking at certain organizations and how they justify their spending, especially in regards to CEO bonuses. One of the worst was Wounded Warriors. As a vet this pisses me off. But I digress.

There should be a mechanism for ensuring our donations go towards maximum effectiveness. I've donated to FPC a few times and can say with 90% certainty my money is going towards a just cause and is being used well.
CRPA isn't a charity, so Charity Navigator won't help.

You should re-look at Wounded Warriors.
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Last edited by Dvrjon; 02-07-2020 at 3:33 PM..
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Old 02-07-2020, 3:45 PM
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Join many organizations

GOA
CRPA

CRPA does a lot for California and black rifle movement
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Old 02-07-2020, 4:46 PM
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CRPA isn't a charity, so Charity Navigator won't help.

You should re-look at Wounded Warriors.
Really? An organization that not only provided diddly squat for vets except a few highly-publicized events, but had major shakes ups internally for throwing parties for their executives?

Do yourself a solid, and look at the charity navigator website. Tell me what you find. Also do some research on all the employment shakeups they had. This happened years ago, and out of either shame or low-profile keeping, they hadn't aired any commercials until last year. Apparently they thought we'd all forget their shameful spending of donations and wait until the heat died down.
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Old 02-07-2020, 4:55 PM
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Originally Posted by hermosabeach View Post
Join many organizations

GOA
CRPA

CRPA does a lot for California and black rifle movement
Totally on board with these groups. The sheer amount of challenges to all of these unconstitutional gun laws brought forth by GOA, CRPA, and FPC are proof of their sincerity.
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  #29  
Old 02-08-2020, 12:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MoBeansMoProbs View Post
[snip] I've donated to FPC a few times and can say with 90% certainty my money is going towards a just cause and is being used well.
While FPC is on my list of orgs I belong and contribute to, the only thing I'm 90% certain of with them is that FPC will send a barrage of emails on a daily basis.
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Old 02-08-2020, 8:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mayor McRifle View Post
I am also a Life Member and frequent donor who doesn’t want to see any future donations go to funding Wayne LaPierre’s lifestyle choices or to providing upscale housing for any of his interns. But we can’t allow the NRA to fail. The organization is much bigger — and far more important — than one man.
Yep the NRA is more than one man. There are probably hundreds of good people who fight the good fight.

Yes join a pro 2A org of your choice. But if the NRA fails the big gorilla in the room will be gone which the anti orgs want. We gun owners may very well be the demise of the Second Amendment.
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  #31  
Old 02-08-2020, 5:06 PM
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When we look at the size and scope of the giants that are against the 2nd amendment and the left wing nuts. We need realize its a battle needing support.
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Old 02-08-2020, 7:27 PM
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We're coming up on an election year.

Despite some stupid statements by Trump about bump stocks and under 21 stuff - it remains the case that we have prospects for (at least!) ONE MORE SUPREME CT NOMINATION plus continuing the slew of Fed court nominations (magistrates, justices & appellate court slots).

The cost to fight the left (Bloomberg money) is rising and NRA spent a lot to get Trump elected last time.

I'd like to see 4 MORE YEARS of the current trend of court appointments.

THAT'S ALL THAT MATTERS.

"OMG no changed regulations though!" - um that's will-o'-the-wisp - and even the most favorable change in regulations can be overridden by a subsequent administration wanting to do more gunrunning or tracking southern area Hispanic semiauto rifle purchases.

"OMG no carry reciprocity" - um, yeah, but we need 60 US Senators plus a well-disposed House on our side to do that. Why tout for that legislation when the votes ain't there?

Fix the goddam courts FIRST. We've had a good start.

Oh - btw, with a revived Supreme Ct (esp with 1+ addl member) we run the chance that we can reduce or eliminate "Chevron doctrine" where opinions of reglatory agencies can run wild over time beyond legislative intent. That can further shape restrictions on ATF and other agencies (public health ones like NiH & CDC) that are trying to play with gun control.
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  #33  
Old 02-11-2020, 5:12 PM
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Thank you Bill for giving vital perspective to the situation.

There are a crap ton of *seriously* upset anti-gunners who will vote for anyone to get rid of Trump. They are motivated.

The battle is live, here and now. You have one tool - your vote. Best use it. The other side is fighting hard for what they believe in. We need to more than match that intensity.

I concur the NRA is imperfect. They are also by far the most powerful and influential pro-gun organization out there.
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Last edited by Experimentalist; 02-11-2020 at 5:15 PM.. Reason: Adding explicit reference to the NRA
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Old 02-11-2020, 5:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bwiese View Post
Oh - btw, with a revived Supreme Ct (esp with 1+ addl member) we run the chance that we can reduce or eliminate "Chevron doctrine" where opinions of reglatory agencies can run wild over time beyond legislative intent. That can further shape restrictions on ATF and other agencies (public health ones like NiH & CDC) that are trying to play with gun control.
Please oh please... And CA DOJ?
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Old 02-19-2020, 12:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bwiese View Post
We're coming up on an election year.

Despite some stupid statements by Trump about bump stocks and under 21 stuff - it remains the case that we have prospects for (at least!) ONE MORE SUPREME CT NOMINATION plus continuing the slew of Fed court nominations (magistrates, justices & appellate court slots).

The cost to fight the left (Bloomberg money) is rising and NRA spent a lot to get Trump elected last time.

I'd like to see 4 MORE YEARS of the current trend of court appointments.

THAT'S ALL THAT MATTERS.

"OMG no changed regulations though!" - um that's will-o'-the-wisp - and even the most favorable change in regulations can be overridden by a subsequent administration wanting to do more gunrunning or tracking southern area Hispanic semiauto rifle purchases.

"OMG no carry reciprocity" - um, yeah, but we need 60 US Senators plus a well-disposed House on our side to do that. Why tout for that legislation when the votes ain't there?

Fix the goddam courts FIRST. We've had a good start.

Oh - btw, with a revived Supreme Ct (esp with 1+ addl member) we run the chance that we can reduce or eliminate "Chevron doctrine" where opinions of reglatory agencies can run wild over time beyond legislative intent. That can further shape restrictions on ATF and other agencies (public health ones like NiH & CDC) that are trying to play with gun control.
We have another tactical advantage (at least in California). The dems are getting close to doing their interstate compact on giving electors to the winner of the popular vote. Between that and being tired of the Dems whining about the majority vote; we may get (and/or maybe encourage) republican turn out (even here in California) since our votes will actually count in the Presidential election.

Last edited by sl0re10; 02-19-2020 at 12:17 PM..
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