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Concealed Carry Discussion General discussion regarding CCW/LTC in California

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  #1  
Old 01-13-2022, 9:13 AM
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Default CCW Putting You at Risk

With the rise in crime involving guns, how do you deal with the thought that if god forbid you're suddenly held a gunpoint during a robbery,
and they see you have a gun too.

My instructor said criminals will shoot because they think you're law enforcement if they find a gun on you.
Just want to hear thoughts from people carrying often and for some time already!

Last edited by Kalashnikov007; 01-13-2022 at 9:16 AM..
  #2  
Old 01-13-2022, 9:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kalashnikov007 View Post
With the rise in crime involving guns, how do you deal with the thought that if god forbid you're suddenly held a gunpoint during a robbery,
and they see you have a gun too.

My instructor said criminals will shoot because they think you're law enforcement if they find a gun on you.
Just want to hear thoughts from people carrying often and for some time already!
[YT]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zTNrNHPxJnM
[/YT]
  #3  
Old 01-13-2022, 10:23 AM
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Proper CCW does not put me at risk. It puts those who would do harm to myself or others at risk.

In the 15 years that I've been carrying nobody has ever seen my gun without me intending to show it to them. Concealed really means concealed.

Even if I were held at gunpoint, I can't imagine being thoroughly searched during a robbery. Maybe ordered to surrender my wallet, watch, and cell phone, at most.

Most criminals are cowards anyway. If they did know I was armed, why would they want to turn a robbery into a murder charge or risk a gunfight they might not win?

I'm not sure exactly what the statistics are, but I suspect I'm more likely to be struck by lightning directly on the left testicle than to be killed as a result of my weapon being unintentionally discovered during a robbery.
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  #4  
Old 01-13-2022, 10:50 AM
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Originally Posted by B yond View Post
Proper CCW does not put me at risk. It puts those who would do harm to myself or others at risk.

In the 15 years that I've been carrying nobody has ever seen my gun without me intending to show it to them. Concealed really means concealed.

Even if I were held at gunpoint, I can't imagine being thoroughly searched during a robbery. Maybe ordered to surrender my wallet, watch, and cell phone, at most.

Most criminals are cowards anyway. If they did know I was armed, why would they want to turn a robbery into a murder charge or risk a gunfight they might not win?

I'm not sure exactly what the statistics are, but I suspect I'm more likely to be struck by lightning directly on the left testicle than to be killed as a result of my weapon being unintentionally discovered during a robbery.
Very true but then again, most criminals don't have much to lose these days so even if they do shoot you and injure you or shoot you and kill you they're gonna go to jail regardless.
  #5  
Old 01-13-2022, 10:55 AM
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Originally Posted by B yond View Post
Proper CCW does not put me at risk. It puts those who would do harm to myself or others at risk.

In the 15 years that I've been carrying nobody has ever seen my gun without me intending to show it to them. Concealed really means concealed.

Even if I were held at gunpoint, I can't imagine being thoroughly searched during a robbery. Maybe ordered to surrender my wallet, watch, and cell phone, at most.

Most criminals are cowards anyway. If they did know I was armed, why would they want to turn a robbery into a murder charge or risk a gunfight they might not win?

I'm not sure exactly what the statistics are, but I suspect I'm more likely to be struck by lightning directly on the left testicle than to be killed as a result of my weapon being unintentionally discovered during a robbery.
Hiding the CCW very well is something to remember. I see a lot of robberies gone bad in LA, with shots fired so criminals will shoot.
  #6  
Old 01-13-2022, 11:11 AM
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Originally Posted by Kalashnikov007 View Post
Hiding the CCW very well is something to remember. I see a lot of robberies gone bad in LA, with shots fired so criminals will shoot.
I'm sure they will, which is part of why I carry.
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  #7  
Old 01-13-2022, 5:22 PM
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Originally Posted by Kalashnikov007 View Post
Hiding the CCW very well is something to remember. I see a lot of robberies gone bad in LA, with shots fired so criminals will shoot.
And what are you doing such that you are in a position to see so many robberies in LA?
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Old 01-15-2022, 9:23 AM
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If someone holds me at gunpoint there's going to be a gunfight and that's the first they will see of my weapon. That's what I carry it for.
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Old 01-15-2022, 10:10 AM
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Originally Posted by B yond View Post
[B]

I'm not sure exactly what the statistics are, but I suspect I'm more likely to be struck by lightning directly on the left testicle than to be killed as a result of my weapon being unintentionally discovered during a robbery.
I am no mathematician but I believe your maths checks out..
  #10  
Old 01-15-2022, 10:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kalashnikov007 View Post
With the rise in crime involving guns, how do you deal with the thought that if god forbid you're suddenly held a gunpoint during a robbery,
and they see you have a gun too.

My instructor said criminals will shoot because they think you're law enforcement if they find a gun on you.
Just want to hear thoughts from people carrying often and for some time already!
This sounds like something a person brainwashed by gun-grabbers would say. Free your mind from that victim mentality. Stand up and do whatever you can to defend yourself and others.
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Old 01-15-2022, 8:15 PM
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Originally Posted by Jeepergeo View Post
And what are you doing such that you are in a position to see so many robberies in LA?
Probably watching the news. LA is Hot in the last 2 months.
  #12  
Old 01-15-2022, 9:11 PM
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What was your instructor's advice in this situation?

Concealed, however, means concealed. The only ways a bad guy is going to figure out you have a gun is if you print like crazy...in which case you need to sort your shh...err...stuff out.

The other way is if the bad guy tries to search you. And if you're in a situation where a bad guy is taking the time during a robbery to search you, the dude is there for a lot more than just a robbery...and you have some decisions to make.

I would suggest you think about what your lines in the sand are. Will you allow yourself to be moved? To be restrained? To be ordered to the ground? To be searched?

Nothing good happens after any of these. And your ability to fight and resist diminishes significantly after each of these. FYI...Statistically your odds of being killed go up to almost 100% if you allow yourself to be moved.

Good luck...and may the odds be ever in your favor!
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  #13  
Old 01-15-2022, 9:19 PM
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Originally Posted by ACfixer View Post
If someone holds me at gunpoint there's going to be a gunfight and that's the first they will see of my weapon. That's what I carry it for.
Agreed. But also something to think about is the LA Sheriff's officer who was off-duty and looking at houses when 3 men approached and attempted to rob him. Shots were fired and he died.
  #14  
Old 01-15-2022, 9:44 PM
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get another instructor. situational awareness and 2seconds of movement can change the world while the Booger has no idea what just hit them. watching tv and films has clouded your brain with untrue reality of fight or die

good luck. or positive good training and decisive action. Roman Centurion - we are already dead because we were born, fight true so you delay the time it happens.
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Old 01-15-2022, 11:03 PM
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That's why you practice El Presidente and Bill Drills.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kalashnikov007 View Post
With the rise in crime involving guns, how do you deal with the thought that if god forbid you're suddenly held a gunpoint during a robbery,
and they see you have a gun too.

My instructor said criminals will shoot because they think you're law enforcement if they find a gun on you.
Just want to hear thoughts from people carrying often and for some time already!
  #16  
Old 01-16-2022, 12:27 AM
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It's all about the training that you do, situational awareness is going to be your best friend in this, constantly being aware of things and people around you everywhere you go. The best thing you can do is have a tactical advantage on whatever perpetrator tries to do harm to you and just be mentally ready whenever it happens, Good Luck.
  #17  
Old 01-16-2022, 6:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kalashnikov007 View Post
With the rise in crime involving guns, how do you deal with the thought that if god forbid you're suddenly held a gunpoint during a robbery, and they see you have a gun too.

My instructor said criminals will shoot because they think you're law enforcement if they find a gun on you.
Just want to hear thoughts from people carrying often and for some time already!
Thinking about it, your instructor may have a point. I don't want to put myself at risk to be shot. Let me sell my carry guns and hope that robbers won't harm me if they don't find a gun on me.
  #18  
Old 01-16-2022, 6:59 AM
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still Rotflmao from the question...
  #19  
Old 01-16-2022, 8:09 AM
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Originally Posted by DentonandSasquatchShow View Post
Agreed. But also something to think about is the LA Sheriff's officer who was off-duty and looking at houses when 3 men approached and attempted to rob him. Shots were fired and he died.
Then that's the day I go. What's he supposed to do, hand over his wallet and let them see his LAPD ID card? Hopefully they scald all four of those suspects with boiling oil, but I assume Newsom will protect them in the name of diversity or something.
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Old 01-16-2022, 8:17 AM
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Originally Posted by SilveradoColt21 View Post
It's all about the training that you do, situational awareness is going to be your best friend in this, constantly being aware of things and people around you everywhere you go. The best thing you can do is have a tactical advantage on whatever perpetrator tries to do harm to you and just be mentally ready whenever it happens, Good Luck.
^^^this right there! This is how I was trained, condition yellow at all times.

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  #21  
Old 01-16-2022, 6:35 PM
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Originally Posted by bergmen View Post
^^^this right there! This is how I was trained, condition yellow at all times.

Dan
Exactly, a great example that I constantly see from driving around is that people use stopping at a light as an excuse to be on their phone and divert their attention away from their surroundings. Before you know it there's a guy with a gun pointed at you telling you to get out of the car, that could have been avoided had that person been aware of their surroundings.
  #22  
Old 01-17-2022, 1:31 AM
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This is the only incident I remember but they were not armed...robbers discovered his Dept. ID/badge

On August 14, 1997, at approximately 9:00 p.m., two unarmed Off-Duty Los Angeles County Sheriff’s Deputies, Shayne York and his fiancée, were at the De’Cut Hair Salon in Buena Park. The two deputies were engaged and had gone to the beauty salon in preparation for a weekend getaway they had planned. Two armed suspects entered the hair salon, and proceeded to rob the salon and its patrons.

Along with the others, Deputy York was ordered to lie facedown on the floor. The suspects went through Deputy York’s wallet and discovered his Sheriff’s badge. Once they found out York was a Deputy Sheriff, one of the gunmen shot him in the back of the head, and the two suspects then fled the scene.

Once dispatch had received the "911" call regarding the crime, Buena Park Police Officers and Orange County Fire Authority personnel were quickly on the scene and began administering first aid to Shayne. As soon as was physically possible, he was transported to Western Medical Center - Trauma Unit - in Santa Ana. Shayne was accompanied by his fiancée who was not injured during the crime.

Later that same evening, a Fullerton Police officer made a traffic stop on a vehicle. Subsequent investigation revealed that the two occupants of the vehicle were possibly involved in the crime. Both suspects were arrested without incident and taken to the Buena Park Police Department for booking.

Buena Park Police Officers had accompanied Shayne and his fiancée to the hospital. At least one uniformed police officer remained with Shayne at all times. Doctors at the hospital were professional, efficient and extremely skilled while they treated Shayne.

Last edited by mike_in_ca; 01-17-2022 at 1:34 AM.. Reason: add
  #23  
Old 01-17-2022, 1:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mike_in_ca View Post
This is the only incident I remember but they were not armed...robbers discovered his Dept. ID/badge

On August 14, 1997, at approximately 9:00 p.m., two unarmed Off-Duty Los Angeles County Sheriff’s Deputies, Shayne York and his fiancée, were at the De’Cut Hair Salon in Buena Park. The two deputies were engaged and had gone to the beauty salon in preparation for a weekend getaway they had planned. Two armed suspects entered the hair salon, and proceeded to rob the salon and its patrons.

Along with the others, Deputy York was ordered to lie facedown on the floor. The suspects went through Deputy York’s wallet and discovered his Sheriff’s badge. Once they found out York was a Deputy Sheriff, one of the gunmen shot him in the back of the head, and the two suspects then fled the scene.

Once dispatch had received the "911" call regarding the crime, Buena Park Police Officers and Orange County Fire Authority personnel were quickly on the scene and began administering first aid to Shayne. As soon as was physically possible, he was transported to Western Medical Center - Trauma Unit - in Santa Ana. Shayne was accompanied by his fiancée who was not injured during the crime.

Later that same evening, a Fullerton Police officer made a traffic stop on a vehicle. Subsequent investigation revealed that the two occupants of the vehicle were possibly involved in the crime. Both suspects were arrested without incident and taken to the Buena Park Police Department for booking.

Buena Park Police Officers had accompanied Shayne and his fiancée to the hospital. At least one uniformed police officer remained with Shayne at all times. Doctors at the hospital were professional, efficient and extremely skilled while they treated Shayne.
It's absolutely crazy to think that somebody will shoot you execution style for being a cop, I would like to think that criminals would avoid murdering cops because a cop well is a cop, I believe it's 10x worse as far as charges go and the severity of it.
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Old 01-17-2022, 6:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SilveradoColt21 View Post
It's absolutely crazy to think that somebody will shoot you execution style for being a cop, I would like to think that criminals would avoid murdering cops because a cop well is a cop, I believe it's 10x worse as far as charges go and the severity of it.
It's time to wake up out of fantasy land if you think that is true.

A good friend was shot and killing on U.S. 101 in 1998. Suspect was arrested within an hour. There has never been a trial. The DA has tried a couple times, but the suspect stops taking his meds every time and is deemed incompetent to stand trial.

Look up what happened to Isaac Espinoza's murderer. Two shining examples of how much more severe cop killers are treated.
  #25  
Old 01-17-2022, 7:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kalashnikov007 View Post
With the rise in crime involving guns, how do you deal with the thought that if god forbid you're suddenly held a gunpoint during a robbery,
and they see you have a gun too.

My instructor said criminals will shoot because they think you're law enforcement if they find a gun on you.
Just want to hear thoughts from people carrying often and for some time already!
Like over penetration causing a hit to an innocent, I’ve never heard of this happening. See my thread linked in my signature line for info on >240 CCW incidents. I stopped updating it and have read about another 5-10 incidents since then.

Doesn’t happen.

Now you focus on serious threats, like being killed by a meteor or lightning strike ….

Last edited by Paladin; 01-17-2022 at 7:47 AM..
  #26  
Old 01-17-2022, 7:46 AM
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Originally Posted by Brother_Hesekiel View Post
Thinking about it, your instructor may have a point. I don't want to put myself at risk to be shot. Let me sell my carry guns and hope that robbers won't harm me if they don't find a gun on me.
And that “instructor” — if they exist — should immediately stop teaching classes that put people at risk. Plus they should testify at legislatures around the nation and share their studies proving this problem exist so states go back to restrictive May or No Issue (after said studies have been published in suitable peer reviewed professional journals).

IOW I’m calling BS on this whole thread. Put a fork in it.
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Old 01-17-2022, 12:12 PM
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Most of the time wearing a seatbelt improves your chances of surviving a crash. It's possible that you could get into a crash where your car bursts into flames, your seatbelt jams, and you burn to death.

That's no reason to stop wearing a seatbelt.
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Old 01-17-2022, 12:23 PM
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That is one of the reasons I prefer AIWB carry.... if for some reason I'm forced down I am on top of my weapon. Sometimes you need to pick your time and place to act.
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Old 01-17-2022, 12:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SilveradoColt21 View Post
It's absolutely crazy to think that somebody will shoot you execution style for being a cop, I would like to think that criminals would avoid murdering cops because a cop well is a cop, I believe it's 10x worse as far as charges go and the severity of it.
When I was LEO I never carried off duty flat badge just my ID card tucked and buried in the back of my wallet.
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Old 01-17-2022, 4:21 PM
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Originally Posted by P5Ret View Post
It's time to wake up out of fantasy land if you think that is true.

A good friend was shot and killing on U.S. 101 in 1998. Suspect was arrested within an hour. There has never been a trial. The DA has tried a couple times, but the suspect stops taking his meds every time and is deemed incompetent to stand trial.

Look up what happened to Isaac Espinoza's murderer. Two shining examples of how much more severe cop killers are treated.
You gave a bad set of examples to backup your point, yes incompetent is often a great excuse for people that commit ANY murder to not stand trial, which we all know is complete BS. Isaac Espinoza's killer got sentenced to two consecutive life sentences without the possibility of parole, so what exactly is your point?
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Old 01-17-2022, 5:03 PM
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Old 01-17-2022, 5:15 PM
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Originally Posted by B yond View Post
Most of the time wearing a seatbelt improves your chances of surviving a crash. It's possible that you could get into a crash where your car bursts into flames, your seatbelt jams, and you burn to death.

That's no reason to stop wearing a seatbelt.
Cutting the belt is what the knife we all carry is for.
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Old 01-17-2022, 5:51 PM
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Originally Posted by B yond View Post

Proper CCW does not put me at risk. It puts those who would do harm to myself or others at risk.

My sentiments as well.

OP is high.
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Old 01-17-2022, 8:16 PM
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Originally Posted by SilveradoColt21 View Post
You gave a bad set of examples to backup your point, yes incompetent is often a great excuse for people that commit ANY murder to not stand trial, which we all know is complete BS. Isaac Espinoza's killer got sentenced to two consecutive life sentences without the possibility of parole, so what exactly is your point?
Maybe you can show me where this comes into play "I believe it's 10x worse as far as charges go and the severity of it"?

Espinoza's killer should have been looking at the death penalty. If you're not smart enough to see the point, that contradicts your belief, well there isn't much anyone can do to help you out.
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Old 01-17-2022, 11:45 PM
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Originally Posted by P5Ret View Post
Maybe you can show me where this comes into play "I believe it's 10x worse as far as charges go and the severity of it"?

Espinoza's killer should have been looking at the death penalty. If you're not smart enough to see the point, that contradicts your belief, well there isn't much anyone can do to help you out.
Na death penalty does people like that favors, gives them the easy way out it's better to let them rot in jail and have to live with it in their daily thoughts with what they've done 24/7, besides do you understand the simple concept of LIFE sentence without parole? He didn't just get a slap on the wrist with 20 years like is often seen in some murder cases, that means there's no possibility he'll ever see the light of day. If this is a hard concept for you to grasp just say it, no need to question another man's intelligence
  #36  
Old 01-18-2022, 5:52 AM
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Na death penalty does people like that favors, gives them the easy way out
Yeah, that’s why they fight against being executed with decades of appeals….

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it's better to let them rot in jail and have to live with it in their daily thoughts with what they've done 24/7
You really believe most of them have consciences?

Quote:
do you understand the simple concept of LIFE sentence without parole?
Do you understand the simple concept of SLAVERY, making the law abiding toil to pay for convicted murderers’ FREE legal representation, housing, meals, medical, dental, rehab, electricity, water, heat or A/C?

Eye for eye, tooth for tooth, life for life…. Justice DEMANDS the “sure & swift” EXECUTION of ALL murderers. EVERYONE who agrees should support the Criminal Justice Legal Foundation (CJLF). Link in my signature line.

/threadjack

Last edited by Paladin; 01-18-2022 at 5:59 AM..
  #37  
Old 01-18-2022, 6:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SilveradoColt21 View Post
… do you understand the simple concept of LIFE sentence without parole? …If this is a hard concept for you to grasp just say it, no need to question another man's intelligence.
Ummmm….P5RET is a retired LEO. Arguably, his decades in the career field provide him with an understanding of these issues which far exceeds yours.

Oh, welcome to CalGuns.
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  #38  
Old 01-18-2022, 8:04 AM
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Funny how threads drift sometimes.

We're done here.
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