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Shotgun discussions Trap, Hunting, Defense and more. A place for enthusiasts to discuss the shotgun.

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  #1  
Old 08-21-2019, 7:20 AM
bajajoaquin bajajoaquin is offline
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Default How Much Difference does 2" Make?

How much difference does 2" Make? (heh heh)

I'm considering a coach gun. The Stoeger is, of course, the lead candidate. However, for no real logical reason, 20" barrels just look too short to me. I came across the Cimarron versions, and they have a 22" model. It looks like that's cylinder, versus the Stoeger's IC and M chokes. A few thoughts/questions:

My impression is that the Stoeger is better quality. Anyone have an opinion here?

How much difference in velocity would the 2" in barrel length make? Is it worth buying a 26" Stoeger (for less money) and lopping off 4"? (I mean, it's possible that I'd buy the 26" version and decide I like it and never do anything to modify it.)

Is IC/M out of a 20" barrel going to pattern better/farther than a 22" cylinder?

I'm not going to hunt with this, shoot skeet with this, or use it for home defense. It's just to blast stuff in the dez. I know logic has nothing to do with it, but I don't want to make something worse than an off-the-shelf option.
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  #2  
Old 08-21-2019, 8:46 AM
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If youíre just getting it for fun, get the 26Ē barreled gun. Good for anything except HD, and looks sweet as well.
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  #3  
Old 08-21-2019, 11:34 AM
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Stoeger delivers a lot of gun for the money and are a great value. It's not clear to me how they do it because the fit and finish are outstanding, and sometimes their wood is amazing...must be the cheap labor in Turkey.

I do believe the coach guns are made in Brazil and not Turkey, so hopefully Brazil can match the Turkish quality. My experience above is based on the guns from Turkey.

Good luck, and I'd not worry about the 2" difference.
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  #4  
Old 08-21-2019, 12:43 PM
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In sporting clays there's an endless debate about 30" barrels vs 32" barrels. I prefer the longer barrels because I like a little more weight up front.

Ymmv
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  #5  
Old 08-21-2019, 1:51 PM
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if it's just a play toy then go short barrel, If your going to use it for any kind of shooting games then longer barrel is necessary.
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  #6  
Old 08-21-2019, 2:56 PM
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Is it true that the Cimmaron SxS coach guns are made in China?
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  #7  
Old 08-21-2019, 2:58 PM
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I read that the Stoeger SxSs are made in Italy. But then Stoeger is owned by Benelli I see.
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Old 08-21-2019, 3:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shovelon View Post
I read that the Stoeger SxSs are made in Italy. But then Stoeger is owned by Benelli I see.
I have a little surprise for you at the next BBB event.
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Old 08-21-2019, 3:08 PM
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you just reminded me about my next purchase

please update with the model you decide to choose. there are a few options available and i wasn't able to make up my mind.
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  #10  
Old 08-21-2019, 3:37 PM
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The question i believe was :"How much difference in velocity would the 2" in barrel length make? "
The answer is : No difference!

Another question was, 20" or 26" for pretty much same price.
If you ask it means you are on the fence and there is no difference for you, meaning buy 26", price comes out cheaper per inch, means better deal.
Anyway you are going to use it ones or maybe twice, then it will be easier to resell it.
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  #11  
Old 08-21-2019, 4:08 PM
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OK! it's gonna be a play toy!! it's not a hd gun!! then 2 inches is not gonna matter!!!! Heck buy the shorty and shoot some stuff.
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  #12  
Old 08-21-2019, 4:11 PM
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Velocity and barrel length when it comes to shotguns is very different than solid projectile firearms.
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  #13  
Old 08-21-2019, 4:32 PM
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I kinda like CZ-USA's coach gun with external hammers. Were I in the market for one, that's the one I'd consider. Kinda pricey though with an MSRP of $968.

https://cz-usa.com/product/cz-hammer...ixed-cyl-bore/
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  #14  
Old 08-21-2019, 5:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fecalguns View Post
I have a little surprise for you at the next BBB event.
Cool!
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Old 08-21-2019, 6:05 PM
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I think Stoeger SxS are made in Brazil.
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  #16  
Old 08-22-2019, 4:25 AM
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Here is an article where they tested velocity of different shotgun loads on different length barrels:

https://www.theboxotruth.com/barrel-...fect-velocity/

He measured barrels from 20" to 36" and every few inch increase in length shows a small increase in projectile velocity.
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Old 08-22-2019, 7:04 AM
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As far as pattern goes, barrels as short as 18" don't begin to spread double-aught buck until after 10 yards. The faster the load, the larger the spread.

This from Cylinder Bore, Improved, and MOD-choked barrels in my two 870s and one 1100; all 18" barrels.

(I have these shotguns' OG 26" and 28" barrels; the guns are in Texas tactical mode for the time being)
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  #18  
Old 08-22-2019, 7:22 AM
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The two stoeger coach guns I had were both made in Brazil. One was 12 ga and the other 20 ga.

Regarding barrel length, it's personal preference.

My Beretta o/u had 30" barrels and the stoeger had 20", and on the trap field, yes I said trap field, both worked just fine.

The guys at the club seemed to get a kick out of seeing the coach gun and I always let people try it.

Everyone was surprised that they were hitting the clays with it, and that's with the same target loads as what you normally use so what does that tell you?
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Old 08-22-2019, 8:01 AM
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Longer barrels = closer to target.

It's a novelty anyways. I'd see what they're using in Cowboy Action.
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  #20  
Old 08-22-2019, 12:59 PM
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I once had a girl friend who was amazed at what a difference 2 inches made.
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  #21  
Old 08-22-2019, 1:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bull Elk View Post
I once had a girl friend who was amazed at what a difference 2 inches made.
Thank you for that. Took long enough (see what I did there?)
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Old 08-22-2019, 1:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tallengnr1 View Post
Here is an article where they tested velocity of different shotgun loads on different length barrels:

https://www.theboxotruth.com/barrel-...fect-velocity/

He measured barrels from 20" to 36" and every few inch increase in length shows a small increase in projectile velocity.
I just came across The Box O Truth for the first time recently. Love the whole concept. I also saw the link to the test on choke and pattern. I haven't read it yet, but the line that it's all about choke and not about barrel length was pretty clear.

Quote:
Originally Posted by smittty View Post
The two stoeger coach guns I had were both made in Brazil. One was 12 ga and the other 20 ga.

Regarding barrel length, it's personal preference.

My Beretta o/u had 30" barrels and the stoeger had 20", and on the trap field, yes I said trap field, both worked just fine.

The guys at the club seemed to get a kick out of seeing the coach gun and I always let people try it.

Everyone was surprised that they were hitting the clays with it, and that's with the same target loads as what you normally use so what does that tell you?
What did you think of 12 vs 20-ga? That's going to be the next issue for me. right now I have 20-ga guns, and I'm a little reluctant to start adding another caliber/gauge to my storage locker.

So it seems that it comes back to aesthetics for me then. Do I want to pay $50 more for what is probably an inferior quality shotgun (but still serviceable), or get the Stoeger in 20" or 26"?
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Old 08-22-2019, 4:08 PM
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Quote:
bajajoaquin

I'm not going to hunt with this, shoot skeet with this, or use it for home defense. It's just to blast stuff in the dez. I know logic has nothing to do with it, but I don't want to make something worse than an off-the-shelf option.
Quote:
So it seems that it comes back to aesthetics for me then. Do I want to pay $50 more for what is probably an inferior quality shotgun (but still serviceable), or get the Stoeger in 20" or 26"?

20" because the shorter, side-by-side break action is the most wicked-looking firearm ever conceived (and partly due to it's elegance [simplicity]).
If you were going to shoot clays with it, you'd want the 26", however the 26" for HD and desert blasting, the *sawed off* effect is nowhere near as pronounced.

On the other hand, since the receiver is so short, the overall length of the 26" gun isn't as long as a rifle with a similar barrel length.

As for the 20 gauge vs. 12, if the 20 gauge is built on a smaller receiver (less mass), then the perceived recoil may be about as pronounced as a 12 gauge, so... and really, 12 does it all with the availability of reduced-recoil rounds, various buck sizes and slug weights.
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Old 08-22-2019, 5:02 PM
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Ten inches, right?

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Old 08-22-2019, 6:00 PM
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Only if youíre British.
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Old 08-22-2019, 7:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trapperjohn View Post
Only if you’re British.
I'm Jewish and I've always used the phrase, give it a Jewish ten inches and held my hand up like that. I think it's funny, my Jewish friends think it's funny, other people not so much

It's a thinly veiled reference to your schmeckle.
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Last edited by ysr_racer; 08-22-2019 at 7:52 PM..
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Old 08-22-2019, 7:37 PM
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It’s why women can’t parallel park... they’ve spent their whole lives being told that’s ten inches.
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Old 08-22-2019, 9:28 PM
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What does it matter? It’s not a long range gun. Does 5% matter? What’s more handy?
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Old 08-22-2019, 9:44 PM
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I always thought the 20” barrels looked too long and wished for a SxS with 18”.

Look out for a Russian Baikal too. Unfortunately the import ban on Russians makes them hard to find. I have one with exposed hammers. It has screw in chokes. I do well shooting clays with it.
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Old 08-23-2019, 8:13 PM
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My wife who is 5 foot nothing tall. And weights a few pounds under 100. Loves her 20 ga, 20", coach gun. And the obsofreak'nlutely "handiest" upland field gun I ever had was a 20" 12 ga coach gun. Both with hammers.

Can't begin to recollect how many hundreds of rabbits, dove, and quail were bagged with it. Carried with hammers back and "broke open". Only took a second to close and mount in one smooth movement. And the short tubes allowed it to be carried one handed, by the pistol grip "broke open" and not drag the barrels in the dirt.

Double triggers allows you to switch hassel free from open first going away shots. And tight first for incomers.

BTW, both were/are Rossi made in Brazil. Mine was choked IC/Mod. Hers is Mod/Full. Both have accounted for solid 40 yd takedowns of dove many times. I upgraded to a Beretta O/U 26" 12 ga. My wife gave me as a gift. And since my cousin just had to have my coach. I sold it to him for the same $75 I paid for it. A month later it was stolen during a burglary.
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Old 08-24-2019, 5:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bajajoaquin View Post
I just came across The Box O Truth for the first time recently. Love the whole concept. I also saw the link to the test on choke and pattern. I haven't read it yet, but the line that it's all about choke and not about barrel length was pretty clear.



What did you think of 12 vs 20-ga? That's going to be the next issue for me. right now I have 20-ga guns, and I'm a little reluctant to start adding another caliber/gauge to my storage locker.

So it seems that it comes back to aesthetics for me then. Do I want to pay $50 more for what is probably an inferior quality shotgun (but still serviceable), or get the Stoeger in 20" or 26"?
I switched to 20 ga and sold all my 12ís. One of the best decisions I ever made!

Both stoegers coach guns I had were great no issues. They are owned by benelli and if you have an issue the gun goes to Benelli.

Iíve sent in my M3020 because it came with a really heavy trigger, 2 weeks later I got it back with 5.5 lb trigger. Iíve since bought two more M3020ís, great shooting super light weight shotguns!!
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