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  #1  
Old 09-16-2021, 6:42 PM
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Default Spousal Transfer - Interstate

I apologize if this is addressed elsewhere. I searched this forum and quickly read through and did a keyword search in Librarian's Interstate transfer among some family members thread and did not find what I was looking for.

I have a few questions about spousal transfer.

First: I understand generally* under both Federal and California law that a husband and wife can give each other firearms, loan firearms, and so forth without any involvement of either the BATF nor the California DOJ. Is this correct?

Second: What about interstate transfer between spouses?

My wife and I own homes in two states (California and Tennessee). My wife has been taking care of her parents full time and in doing so has been living full time in our second home. Her full time residency has been in Tennessee for a couple of years, Tennessee drivers license, vehicle registered in Tennessee, etc.

We have guns at both homes, but right now they are all guns I have purchased myself here in California. Last year when Antifa was going absolutely bonkers I almost sent an AR to my wife without even considering the legal ramifications; after all it is my wife and my home. But is that is that legal? I can argue both sides of the issue and in the end conclude yes.

Detail Question/Scenarios under Question Two
  • If my wife purchases firearms in Tennessee and give them to me here in California, by what mechanism can we now import that gun into California?
    If we have to go through an FFL how does that work since spouse-to-spouse is not addressed in the Intrafamilial Transfer laws?

  • Can give it to me and then ship it to me in our California home, or or ship it to herself care of our California home?
    This is what I would like to do - it is no one's business what we give to one another or what guns we take from one home to another (assuming the guns are legal in both locations.)

  • If I want to send my wife a firearm from California to Tennessee what is the legal mechanism?

  • Do we run the potential of going astray of the straw-purchase laws? If so how might we navigate that path?





*Ignoring registered AWs

**The question as to if my wife will be game to deal with going to an FFL and picking up guns and shipping them to me is another discussion altogether!
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  #2  
Old 09-16-2021, 7:15 PM
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CA may still consider her a resident here due to things like voter registration, bank accounts, filing joint taxes using your CA address, named on cars registered here. Lots of pitfalls trying to leave CA cleanly.
The Feds have no problem with her buying guns there but bringing/sending them to CA may have pitfalls (off roster guns) if CA.gov still thinks of her as a resident. Guns entering CA would need to be registered. If it's truly a gift from her to you where you don't supply the idea/money it's not a straw purchase.

oplaw form - https://oag.ca.gov/sites/all/files/a...orms/oplaw.pdf

Feds don't make distinction of spousal interstate transfer being exempt from FFL involvement - https://www.atf.gov/firearms/qa/whom...arms-under-gca

Last edited by M1NM; 09-16-2021 at 7:28 PM..
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  #3  
Old 09-16-2021, 8:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M1NM View Post
CA may still consider her a resident here due to things like voter registration, bank accounts, filing joint taxes using your CA address, named on cars registered here. Lots of pitfalls trying to leave CA cleanly.
The Feds have no problem with her buying guns there but bringing/sending them to CA may have pitfalls (off roster guns) if CA.gov still thinks of her as a resident.
Thank you!
Her voter registration is in Tennessee.

Her car is registered in Tennessee.

We have some joint accounts based in California and separate accounts both in California and Tennessee.

When I do my taxes I report her (at least on the software) as being in Tennessee but she has no independent source of income so we only file Fed and California. (The software is only asking so it knows if it needs to file in multiple states - my wife is listed on the Federal and California returns the same as she always has... hmm)

This is not a dodge, she is legitimately a Tennessee resident.

Edited to add... California's opinion has no bearing on the State of Tennessee and the Feds and her ability to purchase firearms there. If California did/does consider her a resident it almost makes it easier - no interstate transfer issues since California sees her as a resident in both places.
Quote:
Originally Posted by M1NM View Post


Thank you!

Well don't I feel stupid. I could swear I remember looking into this in the past and that the code did not address spouses. Either my memory is wrong, the law changed, or the form does not match exactly with the law.

Quote:
Originally Posted by M1NM View Post
Feds don't make distinction of spousal interstate transfer being exempt from FFL involvement - https://www.atf.gov/firearms/qa/whom...arms-under-gca
Thank you...

On paper that is what it says, but that does not mean that other laws don't apply. Is it transferring ownership under Federal Law? Legally it is owned by both of us regardless as to who purchases it. If this idea of spousal "transfer" not being legal it would mean I could not put any of "my" owned firearms in our Tennessee home and my wife could not put any of "her" owned firearms in our California home...
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Intra-Familial Firearm Transaction Screenshot.jpg (74.3 KB, 92 views)
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Last edited by Cali-Glock; 09-16-2021 at 8:25 PM..
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  #4  
Old 09-17-2021, 5:35 AM
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Under Federal laws/regulations...

Transfers of firearms between residents of different States must be done through a FFL. [18 USC 922(a)(3),(5)]

There are no intra-familial or spouse exemptions to these Federal laws.
^There is a bequeath exemption, but it requires to giver to be deceased and the receiver to be named as the recipient of the deceased's firearm.

Failure to utilize a FFL equates to a Federal felony for everyone involved with the transfer. [18 USC 924(a)(1)(D)]

Transfer also means transfer of possession.


Therefore...

A firearm transfer from a CA resident spouse to a TN resident spouse must be done through a TN FFL dealer.

A firearm transfer from a TN resident spouse to a CA resident spouse must be done through a CA FFL dealer.

If the CA resident's firearms are stored in a manner that only that person can access or possess the firearms, then the CA resident spouse can store firearms in the TN resident spouse's home without needing to utilize a TN FFL dealer.
If the TN resident's firearms are stored in a manner that only that person can access or possess the firearms, then the TN resident spouse can store firearms in the CA resident spouse's home without needing to utilize a CA FFL dealer.
^If anyone other than the non-resident owner of the firearms can access or possess the firearms, then it is considered an illegal (Federal felony) transfer between residents of different States.



18 USC 922
(a) It shall be unlawful—
(3) for any person, other than a licensed importer, licensed manufacturer, licensed dealer, or licensed collector to transport into or receive in the State where he resides (or if the person is a corporation or other business entity, the State where it maintains a place of business) any firearm purchased or otherwise obtained by such person outside that State, except that this paragraph (A) shall not preclude any person who lawfully acquires a firearm by bequest or intestate succession in a State other than his State of residence from transporting the firearm into or receiving it in that State, if it is lawful for such person to purchase or possess such firearm in that State, (B) shall not apply to the transportation or receipt of a firearm obtained in conformity with subsection (b)(3) of this section, and (C) shall not apply to the transportation of any firearm acquired in any State prior to the effective date of this chapter;
(5) for any person (other than a licensed importer, licensed manufacturer, licensed dealer, or licensed collector) to transfer, sell, trade, give, transport, or deliver any firearm to any person (other than a licensed importer, licensed manufacturer, licensed dealer, or licensed collector) who the transferor knows or has reasonable cause to believe does not reside in (or if the person is a corporation or other business entity, does not maintain a place of business in) the State in which the transferor resides; except that this paragraph shall not apply to (A) the transfer, transportation, or delivery of a firearm made to carry out a bequest of a firearm to, or an acquisition by intestate succession of a firearm by, a person who is permitted to acquire or possess a firearm under the laws of the State of his residence, and (B) the loan or rental of a firearm to any person for temporary use for lawful sporting purposes;

18 USC 924
(a)(1) Except as otherwise provided in this subsection, subsection (b), (c), (f), or (p) of this section, or in section 929, whoever—
(D) willfully violates any other provision of this chapter,
shall be fined under this title, imprisoned not more than five years, or both.
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Last edited by Quiet; 09-17-2021 at 5:43 AM..
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Old 09-17-2021, 6:25 AM
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Quiet is on point.
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Old 09-17-2021, 6:27 AM
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FFL unless she resides here and is resident.
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Old 09-17-2021, 6:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M1NM View Post
CA may still consider her a resident here due to things like voter registration, bank accounts, filing joint taxes using your CA address, named on cars registered here. Lots of pitfalls trying to leave CA cleanly.
The Feds have no problem with her buying guns there but bringing/sending them to CA may have pitfalls (off roster guns) if CA.gov still thinks of her as a resident. Guns entering CA would need to be registered. If it's truly a gift from her to you where you don't supply the idea/money it's not a straw purchase.

oplaw form - https://oag.ca.gov/sites/all/files/a...orms/oplaw.pdf

Feds don't make distinction of spousal interstate transfer being exempt from FFL involvement - https://www.atf.gov/firearms/qa/whom...arms-under-gca
Even if she could be considered a Ca resident by the state, it still has to pass through an FFL dealer in Ca. 27585 CPC requires her to send it to an FFL here before she can take possession of it here. The risks out weight the the gains here, to not get solid legal advise, or to just go the interstate transfer route.

27585. (a) Commencing January 1, 2015, a resident of this state shall not import into this state, bring into this state, or transport into this state, any firearm that the person purchased or otherwise obtained on or after January 1, 2015, from outside of this state unless the person first has that firearm delivered to a dealer in this state for delivery to that resident pursuant to the procedures set forth in Section 27540 and Article 1 (commencing with Section 26700) and Article 2 (commencing with Section 26800) of Chapter 2.
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Old 09-17-2021, 10:40 AM
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Itís simple.

1. A spouse and any vertical relative can Gift you a gun. Doesnít matter on roster or not. No mags over 10 rounds.

2. Important. ‼️ Find a Californistan FFL that knows the law. Find out his charge.
($70 for me at my FFL) tell them a gun is arriving for you.

3. The wife goes to an FFL and inside the gun box she encloses a note with a copy of her out of State drivers license. The notes reads:
I want my husband George Glock to have this GIFT of a Glock 35 Gen 4, serial number 1234567 . She encloses her phone number and your number in California. After it arrives (get tracking)
your FFL calls you and you go in and start the DROS. No sales tax because itís a gift.

Your wife will pay about $30 bucks for shipping to your FFL.
From past experience her FFL will want the website of your FFL.

Bob
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Old 09-17-2021, 12:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oceanbob View Post
1. A spouse and any vertical relative can Gift you a gun. Doesn’t matter on roster or not. No mags over 10 rounds.

2. Important. ‼️ Find a Californistan FFL that knows the law. Find out his charge.
($70 for me at my FFL) tell them a gun is arriving for you.
Adding on...

1.
Needs to be a CA legal firearm and can not include any large capacity magazines.
^No assault weapons, DD, MG, SBR, SBS.

CA legal off-Roster handguns can be legally transferred via out-of-state operation of law (spouse-spouse) gift exemption or intra-familial (grandparent-parent-child-grandchild) gift exemption.


2.
CA FFL dealer can legally charge any amount of money to facilitate these types of transfer.
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Old 09-17-2021, 6:28 PM
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Perfect! - Thank you all!
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