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  #1  
Old 09-22-2019, 5:44 PM
Alpertbrown Alpertbrown is offline
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Default Does this count as a straw purchase?

Asking for a friend

My friend and his father are both legally allowed to and have purchased many firearms in california no problem. The father recently purchased a pistol and came across a very rare pistol for sale. Since the father just purchased a pistol and california has the 30 day period for pistols, does it count as a straw purchase if the father purchases the pistol and has the son dros the pistol then later on doing an intrafamiliar transfer via the online cfars system? The father has been looking for this pistol for a very long time and does not want to lose the chance of owning it. They already asked the dealer if they would hold the pistol if the father pays in full but the dealer is not willing to do so. They thought about going the intrafamiliar transfer route I just mentioned but I advised them it would probably be considered a straw purchase and the dealers wouldent allow it.
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  #2  
Old 09-22-2019, 5:48 PM
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You are allowed to buy guns as gifts for family, he isn't prohibited

I am an FFL in Rancho Cucamonga, vist us at https://www.2azone.com
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  #3  
Old 09-22-2019, 6:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alpertbrown View Post
Asking for a friend

My friend and his father are both legally allowed to and have purchased many firearms in california no problem. The father recently purchased a pistol and came across a very rare pistol for sale. Since the father just purchased a pistol and california has the 30 day period for pistols, does it count as a straw purchase if the father purchases the pistol and has the son dros the pistol then later on doing an intrafamiliar transfer via the online cfars system? The father has been looking for this pistol for a very long time and does not want to lose the chance of owning it. They already asked the dealer if they would hold the pistol if the father pays in full but the dealer is not willing to do so. They thought about going the intrafamiliar transfer route I just mentioned but I advised them it would probably be considered a straw purchase and the dealers wouldent allow it.

First of all the 30-day limit only applies to handguns purchased from dealer inventory, not private or consignment sales (unless in the city of LA).

If this was a true gift then the son could buy it for the father, but if the father is providing the money and the son is doing the paperwork, that is a felony - perjury on the 4473, providing false information to a licensee - aka a straw purchase.
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  #4  
Old 09-22-2019, 7:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alpertbrown View Post
Asking for a friend

My friend and his father are both legally allowed to and have purchased many firearms in california no problem.

The father recently purchased a pistol and came across a very rare pistol for sale.

Since the father just purchased a pistol and california has the 30 day period for pistols, does it count as a straw purchase if the father purchases the pistol and has the son dros the pistol then later on doing an intrafamiliar transfer via the online cfars system?

The father has been looking for this pistol for a very long time and does not want to lose the chance of owning it. They already asked the dealer if they would hold the pistol if the father pays in full but the dealer is not willing to do so. They thought about going the intrafamiliar transfer route I just mentioned but I advised them it would probably be considered a straw purchase and the dealers wouldent allow it.
First, was the recent purchase a PPT ?
-- If yes, the 1-in-30 does not apply (unless in the City of Los Angeles)

If no, would the purchase of the 'very rare pistol' be a PPT?
-- If it is, again the 1-in-30 does not apply.

If the first one was a dealer sale, and the second one would also be a dealer sale, then we have to worry about the 1-in-30.

The son could use his own money to buy the 'very rare pistol', and then give it as a gift to his dad.

But the dad cannot give the son money, with the intent that the son buys the gun and transfers it to the dad.
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  #5  
Old 09-22-2019, 8:02 PM
Alpertbrown Alpertbrown is offline
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Yup looks like I was correct I would buy it myself but I'm not in the market for a cz tso
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  #6  
Old 09-23-2019, 8:20 AM
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This may be a stupid question..., but won't the seller of the CZ hold onto it until the father can actually DROS It assuming he's paid for it (either deposit or in full)?

I do that all the time for customers.

Also, if it's a CZ TSO that is off roster...which means the only way he can legally get is PPT or Consignment.. which are 1-30 exempt..so I'm not sure I understand the issue.

If he's a LEO then he's already 1-30 exempt.
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Old 09-23-2019, 8:54 AM
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Yeah, not seeing how the 1 in 30 applies here.....
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  #8  
Old 09-23-2019, 11:48 AM
mej16489 mej16489 is offline
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If the FFL is cooperative, its also possible to make the purchase but withhold starting DROS until he is out of the 1 in 30 period.

This was quite common for allot of people when SSE1.0 was ending.
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  #9  
Old 09-24-2019, 10:17 PM
Alpertbrown Alpertbrown is offline
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Im mistaken it was a cz ts which I believe is in limited stock or rarely made by cz. This particular ffls owner managed to somehow get a california compliant model in stock for himself. He decided he did not want it anymore and put it up for sale for a ridiculous price. My buddy and his dad just so happened to be in store when it was put up for sale. From what I gather the owner of the store did not want to hold it for them until they could dros it. Even if they paid in full. This thing has since been bought up by one of the ffl owners good buddies.
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  #10  
Old 11-20-2020, 3:38 PM
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Let me ask one more. Mom bought a gun for her son and had it shipped to us. The invoice is in mom's name. Can I DROS to the son? Do I need a note from mom that it's a bona fide gift?
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  #11  
Old 11-20-2020, 3:42 PM
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Did you have any communication with customer before hand? (assuming no). If not, then I'd ask some questions but I would DROS to son and not require a note. The first question I'd pose something like "Oh is this firearm for your mom or was this a gift?"

If the answer was gift I would proceed. They are the ones signing under penalty of purjury.

I just had a similar example..dad purchaesd 2 rifles. 1 for him 1 for daughter. He asked me if the daughter could come and DROS direct since he bought it for her..

I said yes and don't require addtional paperwork from him for that.
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  #12  
Old 11-20-2020, 6:10 PM
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We called mom to let her know that her gun came in and she said that she bought it for her son who would come in to fill out the DROS.
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