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California 2nd Amend. Political Discussion & Activism Discuss gun rights activism and 2A related political topics here. All advice given is NOT legal counsel.

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  #121  
Old 12-16-2018, 12:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Librarian View Post
Those are transfers. However, in-state, there are explicit exemptions for those - and

The point is, trying to game the language and pretend that a transfer is not a transfer is unlikely to be a successful defense.
Ah, I'm guessing that there's a similar exemption for ranges selling ammo to patrons that have no AFS record as well? Otherwise that might put a damper on their business if the "standard" check isn't instant.
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  #122  
Old 12-16-2018, 3:25 PM
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Originally Posted by daninger4995 View Post
Typically when I am paying for my ammo I am already done shopping. Who came up with this?
Gavin Newsom and Liberal (ehem Socialist Democrats) did.
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  #123  
Old 12-16-2018, 4:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AnchorTactical View Post
Ca ha stopped the flow of drugs, ferrets and illegals into the state. They will stop the flow of ammunition as well.
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  #124  
Old 12-16-2018, 4:40 PM
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Originally Posted by ugimports View Post
Ah, I'm guessing that there's a similar exemption for ranges selling ammo to patrons that have no AFS record as well? Otherwise that might put a damper on their business if the "standard" check isn't instant.
Penal Code 30312
(c) Subdivisions (a) and (b) shall not apply to the sale, delivery, or transfer of ammunition to any of the following:
(9) A person who purchases or receives ammunition at a target facility holding a business or other regulatory license, provided that the ammunition is at all times kept within the facility’s premises.
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  #125  
Old 12-16-2018, 6:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Quiet View Post
Penal Code 30312
(c) Subdivisions (a) and (b) shall not apply to the sale, delivery, or transfer of ammunition to any of the following:
(9) A person who purchases or receives ammunition at a target facility holding a business or other regulatory license, provided that the ammunition is at all times kept within the facility’s premises.
What will they do? Count it?
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  #126  
Old 12-16-2018, 6:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Quiet View Post
Penal Code 30312
(c) Subdivisions (a) and (b) shall not apply to the sale, delivery, or transfer of ammunition to any of the following:
(9) A person who purchases or receives ammunition at a target facility holding a business or other regulatory license, provided that the ammunition is at all times kept within the facility’s premises.
Ah there it is..that seems to cover the exemption of an individual giving ammo to their friends at the range too with the "receives" part of the language.
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  #127  
Old 12-16-2018, 6:19 PM
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This is going to destroy out-of-state hunting.

Cousin from Oklahoma: "Wang Lung, I'd like to come out and duck hunt with you."

Wang Lung: "OK, but you can't bring any shells with you, that's illegal."

Cousin from Oklahoma: "LMBFAO you're nuts, really? Well buy me some and I'll use yours."

Wang Lung: "We can't do that, it's illegal. You have to pay a fee and you must be recorded by the State of Kalifornia."

Cousin from Oklahoma: "Nevermind."
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  #128  
Old 12-16-2018, 6:20 PM
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So no "transfers" of ammo on private land where shooting is legal? Or public land where shooting is legal, but that isn't a licensed range facility? Gee, that's not authoritarian overreach, is it?
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  #129  
Old 12-16-2018, 6:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AnchorTactical View Post
Ca ha stopped the flow of drugs, ferrets and illegals into the state. They will stop the flow of ammunition as well.
The laws weren't intended to have any beneficial impact. They were passed to piss off would be lawful gun owners.

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  #130  
Old 12-17-2018, 7:02 AM
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These insidious power drunk corrupt Ca politicians will never be defeated in their gun control crusade.. They have one thing the gun community doesn't have and that's UNITY. Even on this site where most everyone is supposedly pro firearm, members do nothing more than bicker and argue amongst each other over and over what should or shouldn't be acceptable gun control laws. Any law restricting, inhibiting, or prohibiting firearm purchasing and ownership is UNCONSTITUTIONAL. "Those who can't be trusted with a firearm can not be trusted without a keeper"!!! In my opinion of reading the writings of the founders about the second amendment exercising your right to bear arms isn't about having a firearm in your home, hunting, CC, going to the shooting range, collecting ect,ect. Exercising your second amendment right is a 100,000 armed citizens descending on the capitol while they're in session and telling them to repeal these worthless ineffective nonsense unconstitutional laws by the end of the day or every single one of them is terminated and every last one of them goes home in a bodybag! The founders sacrificed their land, fortunes, families Their BLOOD and their LIVES for FREEDOM! If alive today they would be utterly disgraced and ashamed of how we have perverted what they created and what we have become as far as free citizens. Todays men are too comfortable and too unwilling to sacrifice anything to ensure liberty and freedom. Government has grown far beyond its intended purposes, insidiously corrupt and unaccountable to the people. They have deemed themselves leaders instead of representatives made careers out of manipulation, oppression and double standards put power and wealth before the people. Politicians are a sickening disgraceful bunch who have no honor or character and no longer deserve to serve at the will of the people. Just a few thoughts from the background noise in my head... y'all have a nice day now.
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  #131  
Old 12-17-2018, 7:07 AM
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What Privacy/Confidentiality law or policy apply to this information? Is the retailer free to pimp your info out to various vendors (or use it themselves) to ID and market to you? I don't recall seeing any "opt out"...
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  #132  
Old 12-17-2018, 7:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nick View Post
Looks secure, it even got that chip thingie in it. This should work.

Hot damn,you could be driving a tractor trailer with 90 tons of 9mm ammo in it from out of state, but if you showed that ID you'd get sent to the front of the line, allowed to pass quickly through, all while the cops and Ag guys bowed and smiled.
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  #133  
Old 12-17-2018, 7:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kyle1886 View Post
I thought I also read somewhere that if the ammo that you are trying to purchase does not match any arm in the system the transaction is denied.

Is that in another section or did I miss-read something again.

i.e. I don't own a .22 but want to buy some on sale for a later purchase of the arm.

Respectfully
Kyle

...............
It's pretty humorous that you think the state of CA has programmers that have the ability to do that kind of math for their online systems.....
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  #134  
Old 12-17-2018, 7:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by steelbones View Post
These insidious power drunk corrupt Ca politicians will never be defeated in their gun control crusade.. They have one thing the gun community doesn't have and that's UNITY. Even on this site where most everyone is supposedly pro firearm, members do nothing more than bicker and argue amongst each other over and over what should or shouldn't be acceptable gun control laws. Any law restricting, inhibiting, or prohibiting firearm purchasing and ownership is UNCONSTITUTIONAL. "Those who can't be trusted with a firearm can not be trusted without a keeper"!!! In my opinion of reading the writings of the founders about the second amendment exercising your right to bear arms isn't about having a firearm in your home, hunting, CC, going to the shooting range, collecting ect,ect. Exercising your second amendment right is a 100,000 armed citizens descending on the capitol while they're in session and telling them to repeal these worthless ineffective nonsense unconstitutional laws by the end of the day or every single one of them is terminated and every last one of them goes home in a bodybag! The founders sacrificed their land, fortunes, families Their BLOOD and their LIVES for FREEDOM! If alive today they would be utterly disgraced and ashamed of how we have perverted what they created and what we have become as far as free citizens. Todays men are too comfortable and too unwilling to sacrifice anything to ensure liberty and freedom. Government has grown far beyond its intended purposes, insidiously corrupt and unaccountable to the people. They have deemed themselves leaders instead of representatives made careers out of manipulation, oppression and double standards put power and wealth before the people. Politicians are a sickening disgraceful bunch who have no honor or character and no longer deserve to serve at the will of the people. Just a few thoughts from the background noise in my head... y'all have a nice day now.
We pay for the legislature to have unity through our taxes. The legislature also knows any bills they pass to control guns will take a lot of money to overturn in the courts with no guarantee they will be overturned. It is more about money than unity. There is no constitution without money to fight for it in the courts. An armed rebellion will just result in a lot of dead citizens and police with more anti gun laws. People won't rebel if they have a lot to lose. Easier to fight with money. But most money to fight against the gun laws comes from the little people. I don't hear of any pro gun billionaires donating millions to the gun lobby. I only hear of guys like Bloomberg spending billions on influencing elections in various states to elect anti gun politicians.
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  #135  
Old 12-17-2018, 9:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by robertkjjj View Post
...............
It's pretty humorous that you think the state of CA has programmers that have the ability to do that kind of math for their online systems.....
That may be another glitch. It seems that they are a bit slow getting systems up and running "efficiently" in their on given time frames.

I have no illusions that come July, 1st of next year their ammo registry roll out will be akin to the AW registry, only more glitches because there are more ammo buyers than AW registrants to start.

Fortunately what I had read about caliber/firearm was false, for now.

Respectfully
Kyle
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  #136  
Old 12-17-2018, 9:36 AM
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Sad to say, most of us will go quietly into the night.

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  #137  
Old 12-17-2018, 9:55 AM
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Is this a fee or a tax?

Big difference.
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  #138  
Old 12-17-2018, 10:09 AM
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So how does this work with me giving my daughter ammo to use with her rifle (I am going to have her get an FSC and then OPLAW a rifle to her next month).

How does it work with my minor aged daughter on public land (not a range) and letting her shoot my guns?

What about a bunch of folks that meet on public land and we all bring some ammo but share other calibers with each other as they try each others guns? Firearm loans are legal but not the ammo?

What if the other people do not own guns and want to shoot with me on public lands?

These examples need to be addressed and shared (and if PC or DOJ letters are available to print and carry with, that would be great)
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  #139  
Old 12-17-2018, 10:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hinnerk View Post
The laws weren't intended to have any beneficial impact. They were passed to piss off would be lawful gun owners.

Didn't they tell us they were going to make us regret ever wanting to own a gun?

With their new supermajority up there in Sacramento, those people will be going off the deep end. They will make things much worse in the next few years, and the hope is we will be sufficiently cowed that when it comes time to go door-to-door we will meekly acquiesce - just like we always did before.
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  #140  
Old 12-17-2018, 11:00 AM
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Originally Posted by aklon View Post
Didn't they tell us they were going to make us regret ever wanting to own a gun?

With their new supermajority up there in Sacramento, those people will be going off the deep end. They will make things much worse in the next few years, and the hope is we will be sufficiently cowed that when it comes time to go door-to-door we will meekly acquiesce- just like we always did before.
When you have a great many "things" to deal with, deal with them one at a time.

In this case, we and the arms are the "things". We are not generally organized or vocal so we will be plucked off one or two at a time and no one will notice.

They have the patience, time, media, money, and academia generally on their side...and it appears some on this forum to some degree too.

Respectfully
Kyle
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Last edited by Kyle1886; 12-17-2018 at 2:07 PM..
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  #141  
Old 12-17-2018, 12:29 PM
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The Yellow Vest Movement has spread into other countries, methinks the Globalist Marxist twits may find the pendulum swinging in the other direction, sooner than latter.
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  #142  
Old 12-17-2018, 12:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wang Lung View Post
This is going to destroy out-of-state hunting.

Cousin from Oklahoma: "Wang Lung, I'd like to come out and duck hunt with you."

Wang Lung: "OK, but you can't bring any shells with you, that's illegal."

Cousin from Oklahoma: "LMBFAO you're nuts, really? Well buy me some and I'll use yours."

Wang Lung: "We can't do that, it's illegal. You have to pay a fee and you must be recorded by the State of Kalifornia."

Cousin from Oklahoma: "Nevermind."
While you are not wrong about destroying hunting in CA here is where you are wrong:

Wang Lung: "OK, but you can't buy any shells while you are here because you don't have an entry in the AFS and it will cost you $19 and a few days to get one."

Non-residents can bring in as much ammo as they want. They just cant transfer it to a CA resident.

Already too much talk about this stupid unenforceable law.
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  #143  
Old 12-17-2018, 12:41 PM
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Originally Posted by Californio View Post
The Yellow Vest Movement has spread into other countries, methinks the Globalist Marxist twits may find the pendulum swinging in the other direction, sooner than latter.
One can only hope. Regardless it won't be soon enough for my liking.
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  #144  
Old 12-17-2018, 1:13 PM
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Originally Posted by Californio View Post
The Yellow Vest Movement has spread into other countries, methinks the Globalist Marxist twits may find the pendulum swinging in the other direction, sooner than latter.
I wish they had come up with a more neutral color like grey or some such. Even grey with a yellow band...

Yellow makes a great target, even in subdued light. I'm not saying law enforcement would fire on the yellow vests over here, but things happen.

But yes, I hope to see a pendulum swing but doubtful over here.

Respectfully
Kyle
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  #145  
Old 12-17-2018, 1:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aklon View Post
Didn't they tell us they were going to make us regret ever wanting to own a gun?

With their new supermajority up there in Sacramento, those people will be going off the deep end. They will make things much worse in the next few years months, and the hope is we will be sufficiently cowed that when it comes time to go door-to-door we will meekly acquiesce - just like we always did before.
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  #146  
Old 12-17-2018, 2:01 PM
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Until the time comes when EVERY vehicle is stopped and searched thoroughly for contraband you should have no trouble buying out of state and bringing it back home. Damm, what to do with illegals in the trunk?????????????????
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  #147  
Old 12-17-2018, 3:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Kyle1886 View Post
I wish they had come up with a more neutral color like grey or some such. Even grey with a yellow band...

Yellow makes a great target, even in subdued light. I'm not saying law enforcement would fire on the yellow vests over here, but things happen.

But yes, I hope to see a pendulum swing but doubtful over here.

Respectfully
Kyle
the yellow vests came about because of a law in France, and maybe all of Europe, requiring drivers to carry such vests in their vehicles in the even tof a breakdown or accident. The essence of the yellow vest protest, when it began, was that the gas tax (raising prices to over $7 a gallon) were causing a breakdown in the transportation system people need to get to work.
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  #148  
Old 12-17-2018, 3:07 PM
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Originally Posted by TruOil View Post
the yellow vests came about because of a law in France, and maybe all of Europe, requiring drivers to carry such vests in their vehicles in the even tof a breakdown or accident. The essence of the yellow vest protest, when it began, was that the gas tax (raising prices to over $7 a gallon) were causing a breakdown in the transportation system people need to get to work.
Thanks for the origin of the yellow. I knew about the gas tax, never thought about the real reason for the color selection.

Respectfully
Kyle
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  #149  
Old 12-17-2018, 3:24 PM
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Originally Posted by Kyle1886 View Post
Long Live, I ask that in post 69 and have done more reading and I still don't have a solid answer.

I see nothing on "address change or notification of address change". Maybe that part will be on a new form that also requires a DNA sample prior to purchase.

Respectfully
Kyle
Regarding updating your info so it will match for an ammo purchase: https://www.firearmspolicy.org/regulation-watch

Update 22 - 10/5/18: The CA Department of Justice has just released new regulations regarding California Firearms Application Reporting System (CFARS). You can view them here.
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  #150  
Old 12-17-2018, 4:12 PM
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Its a Pain In the *** to get a Bunch of Ffls in Sf Bayarea to do Ppts now. Some Blatantly say they wont do a Ppt.
Can you imagine If they Re forced to Do.paper work on every ammo.transaction. .Store.large quantities of ordered ammo. I see alot of Ffls Not Carrying ammo. Or Chaging a Arm and leg.
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  #151  
Old 12-18-2018, 10:14 AM
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So does this effectively kill one's ability to purchase ammo online from an out-of-state vendor, even if the purchaser possesses a valid COE and C&R FFL?
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  #152  
Old 12-18-2018, 10:27 AM
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You guys need to look at the bright side. With this law coming onto effect there will be no more gun violence. No more mass shootings. Isn't that great?
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  #153  
Old 12-18-2018, 12:01 PM
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So does this effectively kill one's ability to purchase ammo online from an out-of-state vendor, even if the purchaser possesses a valid COE and C&R FFL?
No this is the implementation of the same law that has been in effect for the past year.
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  #154  
Old 12-18-2018, 2:53 PM
Sousuke Sousuke is offline
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I guess I'm still a little confused about the actual system they will be using. They can't use the Federal system so they instead will use a California one. Is this the same system that takes hours if not days to report back?
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  #155  
Old 12-18-2018, 3:30 PM
aBrowningfan aBrowningfan is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dozer wright View Post
Its a Pain In the *** to get a Bunch of Ffls in Sf Bayarea to do Ppts now. Some Blatantly say they wont do a Ppt.
Can you imagine If they Re forced to Do.paper work on every ammo.transaction. .Store.large quantities of ordered ammo. I see alot of Ffls Not Carrying ammo. Or Chaging a Arm and leg.
$ talks and bulls**t walks...
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  #156  
Old 12-19-2018, 12:36 PM
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Dan_Eastvale Dan_Eastvale is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dozer wright View Post
Its a Pain In the *** to get a Bunch of Ffls in Sf Bayarea to do Ppts now. Some Blatantly say they wont do a Ppt.
Can you imagine If they Re forced to Do.paper work on every ammo.transaction. .Store.large quantities of ordered ammo. I see alot of Ffls Not Carrying ammo. Or Chaging a Arm and leg.
In Utah FFLs don't do PPTs. You sell or buy face to face cash and carry. No FFL, no background check. The FFLs seem to do fine without PPTs. I'm thinking they will still do fine in the bay area without PPTs slso.
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  #157  
Old 12-19-2018, 12:45 PM
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ugimports ugimports is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan_Eastvale View Post
In Utah FFLs don't do PPTs. You sell or buy face to face cash and carry. No FFL, no background check. The FFLs seem to do fine without PPTs. I'm thinking they will still do fine in the bay area without PPTs slso.
Not sure if you were ever from CA, but there is no way (legally) in CA for a private seller to sell a firearm to a private buyer locally in CA without doing a PPT. While the FFLs may be fine, the non-FFLs would have no way to legally buy/sell to each other locally.
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  #158  
Old 12-19-2018, 5:53 PM
norcalniro norcalniro is offline
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**And here it is, July 1, 2019, all of a sudden there were no ammo sales.**

Im stocking up now to get a buffer on when/if i need to go through this hassle.
Cant wait to pack up and leave, go back to the Right Coast, and my Free State.
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  #159  
Old 12-19-2018, 6:27 PM
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Dan_Eastvale Dan_Eastvale is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ugimports View Post
Not sure if you were ever from CA, but there is no way (legally) in CA for a private seller to sell a firearm to a private buyer locally in CA without doing a PPT. While the FFLs may be fine, the non-FFLs would have no way to legally buy/sell to each other locally.
I was born and raised in CA. I am saying that there may be no profit incentive for an FFL in the bay area to do a PPT.
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Old 12-19-2018, 6:49 PM
dasrock dasrock is offline
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Time to viva Las Vegas
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