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  #121  
Old 04-10-2019, 5:33 AM
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Originally Posted by CRonRRT View Post
Steps to making 6 happen? I heard about this but wasn't sure how to initiate the discounts.
Individual basis—check each vendor’s website. You’ll either upload docs or e-mail them.
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  #122  
Old 04-15-2019, 7:05 AM
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Originally Posted by rvr350 View Post
Is the $1 coe verification done only when you have ammo shipped to a ffl01? Or everytime, ie when you buy ammo online and have it shipped to your ffl03/coe address?
I've done a couple orders since I got my FFL03/COE and I do not get charged the COE verification fee/tax. And I'll have to do some phone calls, like the C&R's purchased, you may not have to have them shipped to the address listed on your FFL03/COE. Due to restrictions in CA in regards to not being able to ship ammo to an address that is in the CITY of Los Angeles (not the whole county), buddies of mine that know I have the COE/FFL03 ask me if they get the same, can they have the ammo order shipped to a relative's house in Orange County and they pick it up from them. I think I'll look into that today.
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  #123  
Old 04-15-2019, 7:16 AM
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Originally Posted by Spyder View Post
Reading and reading and not seeing the answer, so... :/

I just sent off my FFL app packet to ATF the other day, and am trying to see what needs to be filled out for the Livescan.

I have this form: https://oag.ca.gov/sites/all/files/a...s/bcia8016.pdf

But it is blank. What do I need to fill out on it? The website:
https://oag.ca.gov/firearms/cert-eligibility

says that I need to bring a COMPLETED form to a livescan location, but gives none of the information to complete it.

Do I only need to fill out "Applicant Information", or does the top part get filled out by me as well? (Contributing agency, agency authorized to receive, etc.)?
I was confused about what I needed to fill out and the steps involved. I used this to cut the confusion, made it simple. Worth the little bit of money it cost. It should help you out and hopefully others:

https://buyammoonlineca.ecwid.com/

Not sure if it's still active, but I used a promo code "NRA" to get a discount- 50% off, I think. It's literally step by step, links to every document you need, what blocks on the form to fill out including what to put into those blocks (except the part that asks questions similar to the DROS- you have to answer those honestly, I guess!). "Notes" to answer common questions for each section, the ORDER to do the steps in, links to status of submission, phone #'s, links to all the county Sheriff's (you have to mail a portion of the FFL to your CLEO), etc. It explains everything and makes it simple. I highly recommend it. The section of the document that covers filling out everything is only like 2, maybe 2 1/2 pages of bullet points, so it goes quick. Take care.
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  #124  
Old 04-15-2019, 9:10 AM
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Originally Posted by Jeepix View Post
I've done a couple orders since I got my FFL03/COE and I do not get charged the COE verification fee/tax.
Of course not since it has taken effect yet.
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  #125  
Old 04-15-2019, 9:15 AM
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Originally Posted by kemasa View Post
Of course not since it has taken effect yet.
OMG, it was way too early when I was writing that! You're absolutely right! hahaha

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  #126  
Old 04-15-2019, 9:19 AM
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Originally Posted by Jeepix View Post
Due to restrictions in CA in regards to not being able to ship ammo to an address that is in the CITY of Los Angeles (not the whole county), buddies of mine that know I have the COE/FFL03 ask me if they get the same, can they have the ammo order shipped to a relative's house in Orange County and they pick it up from them. I think I'll look into that today.


No, the ammo can only be shipped to the address listed on your FFL03 license.
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  #127  
Old 04-15-2019, 9:30 AM
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Originally Posted by awiner View Post
No, the ammo can only be shipped to the address listed on your FFL03 license.
Thanks! Looking into that, done!!!

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  #128  
Old 04-15-2019, 10:09 AM
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Originally Posted by sfe187 View Post
Does 03 & COE go hand in hand or can you apply 03 only?
You can apply for the FFL03 only. However, in California the COE is necessary to receive things like ammo or pick up certain firearms in state. (Used to be necessary to receive C&R firearms at your door step but sadly this has been taken away.)

CA DOJ indicates:

https://oag.ca.gov/firearms/cert-eligibility

Short answer, still get them both. You will like the single trip benefits of direct pick up from a private Seller or the expedited one trip benefits of picking up a a firearm from a LGS (Note: my last pickup last week took less than 10 minutes and that was because I stopped to inspect the rifle before finishing the DROS and payment procedures.)
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Last edited by ARFrog; 04-15-2019 at 10:57 AM..
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  #129  
Old 04-16-2019, 2:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by semilin View Post
1. Purchase Ammo
* Purchase ammo online and ship to door
* Purchase ammo out of state and transport to CA


2. Purchase C&R long gun in-state from a non-licensees
* No need to go thru 01-FFL DROS, report within 30 days of possession

3. Purchase C&R long gun or C&R handgun out state and transport to CA
* No need to go thru 01-FFL DROS, report within 5 days of transporting

4. Purchase C&R long gun or C&R handgun from in-state 01-FFL
* DROS, with no 10 days waiting period

5. Purchase C&R handgun or modern handgun from in-state 01-FFL
* DROS, with no 1 in 30 days limitation

6. Discount from online retailers, such as Brownells, Numrich, Century etc




--Please correct me if my understanding is wrong, or anything is missing. Thanks!
So I've been trying to follow along with this. But according to the PC wouldn't #2 & #3 be "yes"? If so can you correct it, as I found your first post to be very nice and clear. If not can you explain as the PC says it's ok.
-------------------------------
Regarding PC 27565, it says "(a) This section applies in the following circumstances:"

(1) A person is licensed as a collector pursuant to Chapter 44 (commencing with Section 921) of Title 18 of the United States Code and the regulations issued pursuant thereto.

(2) The licensed premises of that person are within this state.

(3) The licensed collector acquires, outside of this state, a handgun, and commencing January 1, 2014, any firearm.

(4) The licensed collector takes actual possession of that firearm outside of this state pursuant to the provisions of subsection (j) of Section 923 of Title 18 of the United States Code, as amended by Public Law 104-208, and transports the firearm into this state.

(5) The firearm is a curio or relic, as defined in Section 478.11 of Title 27 of the Code of Federal Regulations.

(b) Within five days of transporting a firearm into this state under the circumstances described in subdivision (a), the licensed collector shall report the acquisition of that firearm to the department in a format prescribed by the department.
-------------------

Does "the following circumstances:" mean all of them, 1-5 need to be met? Or can you pick one from the list? Because if you look at them separetley #5 saying "The firearm is a curio or relic, as defined in Section 478.11 of Title 27 of the Code of Federal Regulations." would suffice to be able to receive shipments from out of state to your door, such as the CMP.

I know this has been talked about many times, I've read many threads on this but yet don't see it so clearly still. I read a lot of different members stating their interpretation of what the PC says. Stores, friends, gun show people, sellers on GunBroker all say different things.

I see posts that say, If you receive a rifle from the CMP at your door you've broken the law, and then there are arguments saying that's not true. So is it ok or not ok?
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  #130  
Old 04-16-2019, 2:28 PM
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Originally Posted by firefly416 View Post
03FFL selling to 03FFL: Cash/carry
Non-03FFL selling to 03FFL: Cash/carry
03FFL selling to Non-03FFL: 01/07 FFL
Non-03FFL selling to Non-03FFL: 01/07 FFL
So if #1 and #2 are IN STATE it can be cash/carry/ship correct?

Say I am 03/COE and I sell to a non 03. We met at a store. Do I give the clerk my ID to sell as a PPT or do I give him my 03?

Last edited by Dooder; 04-16-2019 at 2:30 PM..
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  #131  
Old 04-16-2019, 4:51 PM
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Originally Posted by sfe187 View Post
say you go out of state and buy with 03/coe, you can buy from both ffl and private sale right?
Right. And you only need the 03 out of state.

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  #132  
Old 04-16-2019, 8:38 PM
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Originally Posted by Dooder View Post
So I've been trying to follow along with this. But according to the PC wouldn't #2 & #3 be "yes"? If so can you correct it, as I found your first post to be very nice and clear. If not can you explain as the PC says it's ok.
His post was unclear. He should have said “YES - THERE IS NO NEED TO GO THROUGH A FFL”. Because “NO NEED TO GO THROUGH FFL” becomes something very different with a simple comma: “NO, NEED TO GO THROUGH FFL”. And some readers may be left to wonder which it was...


Quote:
Originally Posted by sfe187 View Post
Couple of more questions:
1. Say I come back from out of state with my purchase and have to report within 5 days, do I upload the purchase info to CFARS or physically mail it in? Link to the form?

2. My purchase was from a private party, comes back as stolen, do I just chalk it up as a loss?
1. Do it online. Paper form here if you must but some people are having problems because they want more info now than the form asks for https://oag.ca.gov/sites/all/files/a...s/curioapp.pdf

2. Probably unless the seller is willing to eat some or all of it


And folks should also note that C&R w/COE means you can buy ammo from private sellers without using a FFL/ammo vendor.

Last edited by SkyHawk; 04-16-2019 at 8:45 PM..
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  #133  
Old 04-16-2019, 10:37 PM
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Originally Posted by sfe187 View Post
I think I have pretty much full understanding of 03 & coe, speed reading past threads here and elsewhere. I notice C&R handguns are not talked a lot. so

On C&R Handguns how to proceed when I'm out of state buying (private sale and storefront)?
Make arrangements in advance if possible. Verify the seller will release to 03 FFL and some may want a copy of your FFL in advance to verify with ATF, because there is no instant check for 03FFL like 01FFL.

Of course you can always roll the dice and walk in on a Saturday out of the blue, maybe get unlucky and the owner / FFL holder isn’t in the shop, and try and cash and carry with your FFL but I don’t advise it.

That’s pretty much it. If you have a willing seller, you give them a signed copy of your FFL, hand over the money and walk out with the gun. No 4473 required. Back when Cabelas in Reno was cool I walked out several times with C&R handguns after providing my FFL in advance of my visit.

If you buy from a private seller, have them write their name & address / DL# in your bound book, or get a photo of their ID or at least look at it and write down the info so you can log it when you get home if you don’t have the book with you. Some may not want to give that info though, but you have to know and log where the gun is coming from, so....
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Last edited by SkyHawk; 04-16-2019 at 10:43 PM..
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  #134  
Old 04-16-2019, 10:53 PM
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Ok thanks Hawk
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  #135  
Old 04-17-2019, 7:19 AM
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Don't know if this is typical or atypical but I submitted the online app for the COE Monday morning 4/15 and it was issued on Tuesday 4/16! Now, if the ATF would be so kind as to process as quickly my FFL 03 app I'd be delighted.
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  #136  
Old 04-17-2019, 7:41 AM
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Originally Posted by ccw-g30 View Post
Don't know if this is typical or atypical but I submitted the online app for the COE Monday morning 4/15 and it was issued on Tuesday 4/16! Now, if the ATF would be so kind as to process as quickly my FFL 03 app I'd be delighted.
..don't know if this is typical now or not. But I remember when it took me five weeks to get mine...and I had to walk a mile through the snow, up hill to get to the mailbox ..and I had to brave paper cuts to open the envelope

Good luck and enjoy OP!
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  #137  
Old 04-17-2019, 8:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ccw-g30 View Post
Don't know if this is typical or atypical but I submitted the online app for the COE Monday morning 4/15 and it was issued on Tuesday 4/16! Now, if the ATF would be so kind as to process as quickly my FFL 03 app I'd be delighted.


COE processing is really quick now. 24-48 hours. The ATF however will take 6-8 weeks.

Last edited by awiner; 04-17-2019 at 9:51 AM..
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  #138  
Old 04-17-2019, 11:48 AM
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Originally Posted by awiner View Post
COE processing is really quick now. 24-48 hours. The ATF however will take 6-8 weeks.
My COE was fast. My FFL was 8 weeks shy of one day. But, we had the gubment shut down. When I called about six weeks into waiting, the voice mail message started with that...and to give them time to catch up!

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  #139  
Old 04-17-2019, 12:29 PM
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Originally Posted by Jeepix View Post
My COE was fast. My FFL was 8 weeks shy of one day. But, we had the gubment shut down. When I called about six weeks into waiting, the voice mail message started with that...and to give them time to catch up!

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My FFL03 took longer than that ... long before the shutdown!

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  #140  
Old 04-17-2019, 12:37 PM
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Originally Posted by Hinnerk View Post
My FFL03 took longer than that ... long before the shutdown!

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I guess I got lucky, then.

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  #141  
Old 04-19-2019, 6:42 AM
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I didn't get a renewal notice last year, and I have been dealing with so many other things lately I haven't used my COE in a couple years.

I checked today and my COE is expired and says I have to re-apply.

Wasn't I supposed to receive a renewal notice at some point? I have for all of the previous years!

Do I really have to go through this entire process again?
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  #142  
Old 04-19-2019, 6:44 AM
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I think you have to log in and check the status. And, yes, you have to go through the whole process again. :^\

Sucks considering it has to do with the 2A!

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  #143  
Old 04-19-2019, 6:45 AM
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You should receive a letter from DOJ for renewal.

Yes, you have to start the process again.
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  #144  
Old 04-19-2019, 6:49 AM
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Originally Posted by seainc View Post
You should receive a letter from DOJ for renewal.

Yes, you have to start the process again.
I didn't, I always start the renewal right away, I have been renewing it for years. I don't even know if the process is the same anymore
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  #145  
Old 04-19-2019, 7:00 AM
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Originally Posted by John Browning View Post
You are exempt from the one in thirty on ALL purchases. The law is clearly written this way but CA DOJ hated it, so they just stopped allowing it. They got sued, they lost, and now you can buy as many handguns at a time as your bank account allows. The law clearly says you must have an (as in any) FFL and COE for 1 in 30 exemption.

It would have been nice had this been in place during the SSE days, but oh well.

NOTE: If you buy more than one in 30, the way the system is set up you have to have the dealer select C&R FFL/COE exempt to buy more than one modern handgun every 30 days. The way the DOJ "fixed" the system will also tell the dealer to go ahead and deliver the handguns. If they are modern, my understanding is that they still have to stay there for 240 hours. I leave them for 10 days at the dealer even though the CA DOJ DROS system says to release them.
Yea, we really got screwed by this one back then. It's great that they fixed the law now that I no longer have / want to buy anything anymore.
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  #146  
Old 04-19-2019, 7:09 AM
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Originally Posted by Justintoxicated View Post
I didn't, I always start the renewal right away, I have been renewing it for years. I don't even know if the process is the same anymore
Get Live Scan, take ATI# and fill out COE form. Mail it in.

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  #147  
Old 04-19-2019, 7:28 AM
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Originally Posted by Justintoxicated View Post
I didn't get a renewal notice last year, and I have been dealing with so many other things lately I haven't used my COE in a couple years.

I checked today and my COE is expired and says I have to re-apply.

Wasn't I supposed to receive a renewal notice at some point? I have for all of the previous years!

Do I really have to go through this entire process again?
I used to receive renewal notices for COE every year, but that stopped in 2016 and my COE expired. Since it was many months before I found out, I had to do another LiveScan and apply for a new COE. After my LiveScan, I went online (CFARS) and applied for a new COE and got it a couple of days later, interestingly, with the same number. Just a more expensive renewal.
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  #148  
Old 04-19-2019, 7:48 AM
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Originally Posted by Justintoxicated View Post
I didn't get a renewal notice last year, and I have been dealing with so many other things lately I haven't used my COE in a couple years.

I checked today and my COE is expired and says I have to re-apply.

Wasn't I supposed to receive a renewal notice at some point? I have for all of the previous years!

Do I really have to go through this entire process again?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeepix View Post
I think you have to log in and check the status. And, yes, you have to go through the whole process again. :^\

Sucks considering it has to do with the 2A!

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Originally Posted by seainc View Post
You should receive a letter from DOJ for renewal.

Yes, you have to start the process again.
Ya’ll will hate this, but, we did this to ourselves. I also missed the renewal date, but was close enough to run it through CFARS and get a late renewal.

We collectively hate the Nanny State for taking actions to “protect” us and infringe upon our rights and free will, but when we don’t renew on time, it’s the State’s fault we failed, because they didn’t intervene and save us.

The expiration date is written on the COE. If we don’t read it and log the calendars for renewal, we’ve screwed up. (This also applies to the FFL03...it expires after 3 years.)

Check your documents, now.
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  #149  
Old 04-19-2019, 7:50 AM
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From what I understand, if you have a CFARS account, it is online, which means no COE renewal notice.
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  #150  
Old 04-19-2019, 9:06 AM
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I suggest add expiration dates of important documents to you smart phone calendar as reminder.
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  #151  
Old 04-19-2019, 3:36 PM
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Originally Posted by kemasa View Post
From what I understand, if you have a CFARS account, it is online, which means no COE renewal notice.
I didn't have a CFARS account until this year. Renewal notice just stopped coming in 2016. C&R FFL renewal notices still come though.
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  #152  
Old 04-19-2019, 4:56 PM
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Originally Posted by kouye View Post
I didn't have a CFARS account until this year. Renewal notice just stopped coming in 2016. C&R FFL renewal notices still come though.
The C&R FFL is the BATF, so they like to let you know when it renews, the CA DOJ doesn't.
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  #153  
Old 04-23-2019, 7:54 PM
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Originally Posted by pterrell View Post
AFAIK, 1 in 30 still will apply for non C&R guns but will not for C&R guns.
Under the circumstances of these certs, a dealer just told me you can DROS more than one modern gun on the same DROS at the same time, thus no 1-in-30. The dealer told me that the problem is that most people dont have unlimited money to buy multiple guns on the same day, they always ask to spread out the purchases over the same month and that cant be done.
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Old 04-24-2019, 6:50 PM
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Does anyone know how to find out who the CLEO is in your area? I don't know if the copy goes to LAPD or LASD...
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Old 04-24-2019, 7:05 PM
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Does anyone know how to find out who the CLEO is in your area? I don't know if the copy goes to LAPD or LASD...
LASD>LAPD

Sheriff is superior to PD.
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  #156  
Old 04-24-2019, 7:23 PM
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Thanks!
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Old 04-24-2019, 7:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Mr.RoDiN View Post
Does anyone know how to find out who the CLEO is in your area? I don't know if the copy goes to LAPD or LASD...
Send to the "lesser" ahole. It's pro forma; they don't get to approve.
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  #158  
Old 04-24-2019, 7:35 PM
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Originally Posted by EM2 View Post
LASD>LAPD

Sheriff is superior to PD.
LAPD would disagree. Territory is important to them.
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Old 04-24-2019, 8:23 PM
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LAPD would disagree. Territory is important to them.
Doesn't really matter what they think.

Sheriff is elected by the people.
Chief of Police is appointed by cronies.
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"The 'Spray and Pray' system advances triumphantly in law enforcement. In a recent case in a southwestern city...a police officer, when threatened with a handgun, emptied his 15 shot pistol at his would-be assailant, achieving two peripheral hits. The citizen was charged with brandishing a firearm, but the cop was not charged with anything, lousy shooting not being a diciplinary offense."
--- Jeff Cooper, June 1990

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Old 04-24-2019, 8:27 PM
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Hmm, looks like LASD is larger than LAPD, by quite a bit.

Quote:
http://www.lapdonline.org/inside_the...basic_view/834
The Chief of Police (COP) is the highest-ranking officer in the Police Department. The COP is appointed by the Mayor, is subject to the approval of the Police Commission and the City Council,...
The Los Angeles Police Department (LAPD) is an organization of approximately 14,000 women and men...
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Los_An...27s_Department
With approximately 18,000 employees,[3] the Los Angeles County Sheriff's Department, officially the County of Los Angeles Sheriff's Department, is the nation's largest sheriff's department. The department's three main responsibilities entail providing patrol services for 153 unincorporated communities of Los Angeles County, California and 42 cities,[4] providing courthouse security for the Superior Court of Los Angeles County, and the housing and transportation of inmates within the county jail system.
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"The 'Spray and Pray' system advances triumphantly in law enforcement. In a recent case in a southwestern city...a police officer, when threatened with a handgun, emptied his 15 shot pistol at his would-be assailant, achieving two peripheral hits. The citizen was charged with brandishing a firearm, but the cop was not charged with anything, lousy shooting not being a diciplinary offense."
--- Jeff Cooper, June 1990

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Originally Posted by EM2
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