3/24/2020 Fresno PD armed suspect shot by CCW holder

[NorCalBusa]

Atta boy. Story has video towards end of arrest.

https://www.yourcentralvalley.com/ne...ok_KSEE24_News

[SkyHawk]

Good shoot - hopefully they keep CCW person's identity concealed:

The suspect sustained a gunshot wound and is described by police as being in a stable condition in the hospital. Investigators add that the suspect is not being cooperative and does have gang ties.

[NorCalBusa]

Originally Posted by SkyHawk

Good shoot - hopefully they keep CCW person's identity concealed:

Gang ties? It was clear he was on his way to bible study at his church- was just running late.

[Big Jake]

Originally Posted by NorCalBusa

Gang ties? It was clear he was on his way to bible study at his church- was just running late.

Stop being racist. It is quite obvious that this fine young man was only trying to go meet with his college guidance counselor to help him with his college application to Harvard. All of those racist cops in Fresno should lose their jobs for harassing this fine young man!

[oakdalecurtis]

This event might sound good at first blush, CCW got a bad guy. Can someone shed some light for me on the tactical wisdom of engaging a bad guy during a shootout with police? Unless you are directly threatened by the perp, I would think that drawing your own CCW gun during such a shoot out, however well intentioned, is a terrible tactical move. You could EASILY be mistaken for a perp and draw police fire also. Any thoughts?

[KINGSFAN IN OC]

I watched that video 3 times, it appears or looks like he was hit twice in the chest. 2 separate blood trails coming down his chest while he was on his way to the gurney.
I'm curious to know what round and caliber was used. That guy was not or appears to not have been subdued by 2 rounds at all. Very alert and combative, possibly on drugs? they said he was initially knocked down but got right back up and ran away and tried to break into apartments.

I'm kinda thinking 2 from a .45 or .40 with defensive ammo he might not be moving around so much....

Almost makes me question my 9mm EDC with +P rounds... is it really enough?

Oakdale the cops said the perp pointed his shotgun at the CCW and he fired in self defense

[robert101]

Just by reading the text, I would not engage in the gun fight if LE is on scene and fully active in the fight. UNLESS, the threat is directed at me and I had no way to escape.

[SkyHawk]

Originally Posted by oakdalecurtis

This event might sound good at first blush, CCW got a bad guy. Can someone shed some light for me on the tactical wisdom of engaging a bad guy during a shootout with police? Unless you are directly threatened by the perp, I would think that drawing your own CCW gun during such a shoot out, however well intentioned, is a terrible tactical move. You could EASILY be mistaken for a perp and draw police fire also. Any thoughts?

Originally Posted by robert101

Just by reading the text, I would not engage in the gun fight if LE is on scene and fully active in the fight. UNLESS, the threat is directed at me and I had no way to escape.

There are some times when....




Sounds like this was one of those times.

[Pupulepeter]

Originally Posted by KINGSFAN IN OC

I watched that video 3 times, it appears or looks like he was hit twice in the chest. 2 separate blood trails coming down his chest while he was on his way to the gurney.
I'm curious to know what round and caliber was used. That guy was not or appears to not have been subdued by 2 rounds at all. Very alert and combative, possibly on drugs? they said he was initially knocked down but got right back up and ran away and tried to break into apartments.

I'm kinda thinking 2 from a .45 or .40 with defensive ammo he might not be moving around so much....

Almost makes me question my 9mm EDC with +P rounds... is it really enough?

Oakdale the cops said the perp pointed his shotgun at the CCW and he fired in self defense

Blood, brain or bone. Otherwise a tenth of an inch isn't really going to matter much. Better plan would have been keep shooting until the threat was no longer present. Either way, good shoot and good on him for being able to protect himself.

[NorCalBusa]

Originally Posted by KINGSFAN IN OC

I watched that video 3 times, it appears or looks like he was hit twice in the chest. 2 separate blood trails coming down his chest while he was on his way to the gurney.
I'm curious to know what round and caliber was used. That guy was not or appears to not have been subdued by 2 rounds at all. Very alert and combative, possibly on drugs? they said he was initially knocked down but got right back up and ran away and tried to break into apartments.

I'm kinda thinking 2 from a .45 or .40 with defensive ammo he might not be moving around so much....

Almost makes me question my 9mm EDC with +P rounds... is it really enough?

Oakdale the cops said the perp pointed his shotgun at the CCW and he fired in self defense

Link to video you mentioned?

[SkyHawk]

Originally Posted by NorCalBusa

Link to video you mentioned?

It is in the original story linked in the OP - turn off your ad blockers or you wont see it.

[NorCalBusa]

Originally Posted by SkyHawk

It is in the original story linked in the OP - turn off your ad blockers or you wont see it.

Turn off ad blockers- woah now! The horror...

[broadside]

The video mentioned the bad guy ran from the police after firing a 12 ga at them. Then he ran towards to two civilians and pointed the shotty at them when one of the civilians pulled his CCW and shot him twice

But it does seem like he was hit twice in the chest and still upright and very aggressive. Hoping it's drugs and the CCW was not carrying a .22 or .25 or something stupid tiny

[Mayor McRifle]

Originally Posted by oakdalecurtis

This event might sound good at first blush, CCW got a bad guy. Can someone shed some light for me on the tactical wisdom of engaging a bad guy during a shootout with police? Unless you are directly threatened by the perp, I would think that drawing your own CCW gun during such a shoot out, however well intentioned, is a terrible tactical move. You could EASILY be mistaken for a perp and draw police fire also. Any thoughts?

If we have to explain, you wouldn’t understand.

[XDJYo]

1:24. Uhhh. Was that a goat?

[SnWnMe]

Originally Posted by oakdalecurtis

This event might sound good at first blush, CCW got a bad guy. Can someone shed some light for me on the tactical wisdom of engaging a bad guy during a shootout with police? Unless you are directly threatened by the perp, I would think that drawing your own CCW gun during such a shoot out, however well intentioned, is a terrible tactical move. You could EASILY be mistaken for a perp and draw police fire also. Any thoughts?

Originally Posted by broadside

The video mentioned the bad guy ran from the police after firing a 12 ga at them. Then he ran towards to two civilians and pointed the shotty at them when one of the civilians pulled his CCW and shot him twice

But it does seem like he was hit twice in the chest and still upright and very aggressive. Hoping it's drugs and the CCW was not carrying a .22 or .25 or something stupid tiny

I think that is the moment when the decision was made. Either way he could be shot by the perp or by a cop so I guess he just figured he may as well go down fighting.

[ccwnewbie]

Originally Posted by oakdalecurtis

This event might sound good at first blush, CCW got a bad guy. Can someone shed some light for me on the tactical wisdom of engaging a bad guy during a shootout with police? Unless you are directly threatened by the perp, I would think that drawing your own CCW gun during such a shoot out, however well intentioned, is a terrible tactical move. You could EASILY be mistaken for a perp and draw police fire also. Any thoughts?

Agree 100 percent here with your thoughts.....But......in this case the suspect did threaten the ccw holder directly and was dealt with accordingly nice job

[oakdalecurtis]

“
Agree 100 percent here with your thoughts.....But......in this case the suspect did threaten the ccw holder directly and was dealt with accordingly nice job”
Not disagreeing, just didn’t see that information in the original article or two short embedded vids...

[Ishooter]

Originally Posted by KINGSFAN IN OC

I watched that video 3 times, it appears or looks like he was hit twice in the chest. 2 separate blood trails coming down his chest while he was on his way to the gurney.
I'm curious to know what round and caliber was used. That guy was not or appears to not have been subdued by 2 rounds at all. Very alert and combative, possibly on drugs? they said he was initially knocked down but got right back up and ran away and tried to break into apartments.

I'm kinda thinking 2 from a .45 or .40 with defensive ammo he might not be moving around so much....

Almost makes me question my 9mm EDC with +P rounds... is it really enough?

Oakdale the cops said the perp pointed his shotgun at the CCW and he fired in self defense

It looks like that his tits are bleeding.

[Mauserguy]

Yeah, that was a goat.

Amazing, the cops and ccw must have been carrying BB guns based on those wounds.
Mauserguy

[boomshaka]

I'd guess this was a combination of a mouse gun AND some meth.

Also, regardless of LE presence...if someone looking like that points a 12 gauge at me, they will be met with a volley of 147gr HST's from behind cover.

I think too many here would be paralyzed by the fear of legal technicalities to actually utilize your training and save your own life.

[IWantAllTheGuns]

Given that he was tackled by police at the end, my guess would be that he was psychologically stopped, which is why the CCW only shot him twice. That is to say, he probably dropped the gun, maybe fell, before getting back up to try to break into the apartments.

I wonder when we'll see it on ASP or similar.

[RLW]

Meth, that's why he has 2 holes in his chest and is acting like its no big deal. This is specifically why you should carry as many rounds as possible. Read a story online about a guy who shot an intruder in his house. Don't remember if it was a 9mm or .40 but he shot the guy 14 times in the chest before he went down. Not shot at him 14 times. Hit him 14 times.

[Pablo5959]

I bet he doesn’t have the nipple to do that again

[XDJYo]

Originally Posted by Pablo5959

I bet he doesn’t have the nipple to do that again

I hear that they can graft a new nipple. Problem is that they take it from you a-hole and invert it.

[starlight]

- excellent news
- fresno and Sheriff Mims are pro2A
- and this is why
- look like he got hit with 22 shorts though... took 2 to the chest and still talking smack

- be sure to send this link to all the anti-california people who think CCW people will go to jail for excersising legal self defense



.

[rudigan]

Originally Posted by boomshaka

I'd guess this was a combination of a mouse gun AND some meth.

Also, regardless of LE presence...if someone looking like that points a 12 gauge at me, they will be met with a volley of 147gr HST's from behind cover.

I think too many here would be paralyzed by the fear of legal technicalities to actually utilize your training and save your own life.

Yep, you're a MAN, we are in awe sir...

[starlight]

Originally Posted by oakdalecurtis

This event might sound good at first blush, CCW got a bad guy. Can someone shed some light for me on the tactical wisdom of engaging a bad guy during a shootout with police? Unless you are directly threatened by the perp, I would think that drawing your own CCW gun during such a shoot out, however well intentioned, is a terrible tactical move. You could EASILY be mistaken for a perp and draw police fire also. Any thoughts?

- ccw person was directly threatened by the criminal
- a shotgun was pointed at him
- it's literally do-or-die time
- ccw acted appropriatley

- no time for 'tactics'
- doesn't matter if police were nearby, the thug pointed a gun at him..

- what would you do staring down the barell of a shotgun in this scenario? wait for the police to catch up to him?











.

[starlight]

Originally Posted by broadside

The video mentioned the bad guy ran from the police after firing a 12 ga at them. Then he ran towards to two civilians and pointed the shotty at them when one of the civilians pulled his CCW and shot him twice

But it does seem like he was hit twice in the chest and still upright and very aggressive. Hoping it's drugs and the CCW was not carrying a .22 or .25 or something stupid tiny

- my guess was a mousegun like you said..

- 22 short or a 25

- even a .32 would have put him down

- criminal is very lucky

- the mouse stopped the threat... but many could argue BARLEY...











.

[starlight]

Originally Posted by XDJYo

1:24. Uhhh. Was that a goat?

- yes

- yes it was











.

[starlight]

Originally Posted by Mauserguy

Yeah, that was a goat.

Amazing, the cops and ccw must have been carrying BB guns based on those wounds.
Mauserguy

- I think the cops missed
- and the badguy took 2 mouse-slugs to the nipps.....
- now taxpayers have to pay for his nipple-transplant surgery...










.

[starlight]

Originally Posted by boomshaka

I think too many here would be paralyzed by the fear of legal technicalities to actually utilize your training and save your own life.

- when it's time
- people will do the right thing
- man had a shotty pointed at him
- he prolly didn't even think, just a primal reaction to save his own life...

- never been a similar situation EXCEPT with wild dogs attacking my children
- I didn't remember thinking..
- happened so quick
- the most basic training took over:

- draw, grip, bury front sight on target, know backdrop, squeeze don't pull, go...

- just happened

[starlight]

Originally Posted by RLW

Meth, that's why he has 2 holes in his chest and is acting like its no big deal. This is specifically why you should carry as many rounds as possible. Read a story online about a guy who shot an intruder in his house. Don't remember if it was a 9mm or .40 but he shot the guy 14 times in the chest before he went down. Not shot at him 14 times. Hit him 14 times.

- what are the numbing effects of meth?
- why don't they feel pain?








.

[EQTrax]

assumed it was a 22 from the wounds, sure wasn't a pair 357 magnum hits. Maybe it was 25 acp

[not-fishing]

Originally Posted by Mayor McRifle

That’s at least half of the members here on Calguns. I hope they’re all reading this thread.

It happened in Fresno and not San Francisco or Berkeley or Alameda where the CCW holder would be treated much differently.

[RLW]

Originally Posted by starlight

- what are the numbing effects of meth?
- why don't they feel pain?


.

Never done meth so I cant say for sure. He also could have been on other drugs. But there are essentially thousands of instances where people were on drugs and were able to endure what would have been really painful without showing any signs of pain whatsoever.

[NorCalEmperor]

wow, KSEE 24 and anchor Stephani! grew up watching her through middle and HS, still at it...

move along nothing to see here, WTF! a goat haha.

good shoot.

[stikman33]

Must have been something small caliber wise. You pause the video and see 2 distinct blood trails. That shot to his left ride (right when viewing the video) is lower pec center mass area. A 9mm with defensive ammo... he wouldn't be walking around yelling at people and the cops having to restrain him. Even the one on his right (left side when viewing) would have likely done lung damage.

[RLW]

Originally Posted by stikman33

Must have been something small caliber wise. You pause the video and see 2 distinct blood trails. That shot to his left ride (right when viewing the video) is lower pec center mass area. A 9mm with defensive ammo... he wouldn't be walking around yelling at people and the cops having to restrain him. Even the one on his right (left side when viewing) would have likely done lung damage.

This is what everyone thinks, but ask anyone who has worked in a trauma hospital and they will tell you that people come in with gunshot wounds like that and they are sitting there having a conversation with you. Not every time of course but its important to know that handguns are not death rays like what you see in the movies.

[trainpilot]

I applaud the citizen’s accurate actions, regardless of caliber. Better a .22 than an empty holster. And I was trained that it can be entirely appropriate to shoot a bad guy in the back if he presents a tangible immediate threat to any innocents. Even though I hate the idea of paying for the bad guy’s medical expenses and (hopefully) long-term incarceration, I’d rather that than pay to support the family of a guy who stood up unarmed to a guy with a shotgun who kicked his door in.