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-   -   WTB Network or Cloud (https://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=1545354)

harbormaster 07-11-2019 8:09 AM

WTB Network or Cloud
 
My employer uses quickbooks pro and the migration to an online quickbooks isn't in the cards it just doesn't seem to have the capacity as that which we use loaded on our server. Our server is old. It needs to be replaced. We use three programs:

Quickbooks
A proprietary database application on Microsoft.net
Office Pro including most of the applications.
That is pretty much it.

We are interested in seeing if we can copy and run the database application to a cloud base program like Azure and then host quickbooks and Office on our desktops.

So I'm in Stockton area and looking for an IT pro to help me save some money and get this done? Anyone here capable? It seems like we're too small an operation for the IT companies around.

Robotron2k84 07-11-2019 8:28 AM

Cloud won't solve your problems. Just buy a new server and migrate.

Cloud is:

Expensive
Time shared
High latency
Slower than on-premises
Harder to manage
Open to additional security vulnerabilities
Requires a VPN to host a DB off-premises
Is really only a benefit if you want to virtualize a whole data-center's worth of equipment for a website or other large application.

Cloud only makes sense in a limited set of circumstances that mostly require very high uptime, flexible capacity and paying for usage-based service (which can get very expensive per month on a DB-sized instance running hot).

Good luck

vino68 07-11-2019 9:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robotron2k84 (Post 23197405)
Cloud won't solve your problems. Just buy a new server and migrate.

Cloud is:

Expensive-- Yes and no.If you Capex vs Opex, maybe. And depends on current spend of your IO.
Time shared- No. You can have reservations and/or create your own VPC.
High latency- Maybe. That depends on your circuit and the peering agreements with your WAN provider.
Slower than on-premises- Possible but depends on your circuit and type of data.
Harder to manage- No, easier for many of us that know what we are doing. AWS has been around for almost 20 years.

Open to additional security vulnerabilities- What isn't.
Requires a VPN to host a DB off-premises- Not necessarily.

Is really only a benefit if you want to virtualize a whole data-center's worth of equipment for a website or other large application. A whole data center is relative. Many startups use AWS or Azure for lower startup Capex expenses. They do not have any where close to what I would consider a "whole data center."

Cloud only makes sense in a limited set of circumstances that mostly require very high uptime, flexible capacity and paying for usage-based service (which can get very expensive per month on a DB-sized instance running hot). This is true to an extent, there are many variables and conditions. Far too broad of a statement.

Good luck

I have made notes in bold bases on experiences.

Robotron2k84 07-11-2019 10:04 AM

Without getting into the weeds too far, I've run (managed and developed) private clouds based on ESX, KVM, Xen, Docker, Kubernetes, Chef, and a whole smattering of third party tech, including virtulized switching and net on net topologies. I've spec'd hardware for running 1000 instances per host and the storage required. I have a bit of experience.

My 30 second read of a single application (a database) migrating to the cloud for supposed cost savings and ease of maintenance doesn't add up for the reasons mentioned.

The cost structure of AWS et al. is cheaper only if you compare it to typical leases for premesis or DC equipment, the accounting necessary and the myriad fees associated with access, transit and maintaining your stack.

If you are on-prem and have a single stack, rarely, if ever do the numbers work out in your favor.

As for security, when you have more technology and products interacting, the exposure goes up geometrically. Do you get indemnification for breaches through the provider's network stack or hypervisor exploit?

As for manageability, I agree, with the right skill set it can be easier, but templatizing server builds and application deployment is not trivial and utterly unnecessary for a single DB.

In the OP's situation, please list the benefits of going to a cloud-based model.

harbormaster 07-11-2019 10:04 AM

^^^^
Learning thank you

Dragunov 07-12-2019 8:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by harbormaster (Post 23197330)
My employer uses quickbooks pro and the migration to an online quickbooks isn't in the cards it just doesn't seem to have the capacity as that which we use loaded on our server. Our server is old. It needs to be replaced. We use three programs:

Quickbooks
A proprietary database application on Microsoft.net
Office Pro including most of the applications.
That is pretty much it.

We are interested in seeing if we can copy and run the database application to a cloud base program like Azure and then host quickbooks and Office on our desktops.

So I'm in Stockton area and looking for an IT pro to help me save some money and get this done? Anyone here capable? It seems like we're too small an operation for the IT companies around.

Lots of good responses here. MHO, is that "The Cloud" is just a fancy term for "Someone ELSE'S computer". Do you REALLY want to trust your data to "someone else's" computer?

I'd think LONG and HARD about that one.

castgold 07-12-2019 8:26 AM

Why not just build a new robust server and sync the data?

Sent from my SM-G965U1 using Tapatalk

the86d 07-15-2019 9:54 AM

The Title of this thread reminds me of all corporate e-mails "subjects" I get from people, either click-bait, half-arseyness, or spam is what they appear to be out the gate. "QuickBooks: cloud or other" might be a better, more functional Title...

There is a reason Title is there, and it isn't for typing vague blankets... :)

anelson 07-15-2019 7:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by harbormaster (Post 23197330)
My employer uses quickbooks pro and the migration to an online quickbooks isn't in the cards it just doesn't seem to have the capacity as that which we use loaded on our server. Our server is old. It needs to be replaced. We use three programs:

Quickbooks
A proprietary database application on Microsoft.net
Office Pro including most of the applications.
That is pretty much it.

We are interested in seeing if we can copy and run the database application to a cloud base program like Azure and then host quickbooks and Office on our desktops.

So I'm in Stockton area and looking for an IT pro to help me save some money and get this done? Anyone here capable? It seems like we're too small an operation for the IT companies around.


I've had a lot of experience migrating ERPs (GreatPlains -> Netsuite, etc). I would recommend getting out of using an "old version of quickbooks" on-prem. You're going to run into issues long-term.

I'm not sure why you couldn't migrate the data to QB Online. You should be able to migrate all the customers/vendors, SOs, etc with batch export/imports. It will definitely take some time / testing.

Some business/operations are tougher to migrate than others.. For example if you're in the business of selling items that don't need fulfillment records (software sales or services for example that don't have serialized inventory) - then it's easier. If it's operationally heavy with serialized items then there's going to be a lot more to move.

You could also, depending on the business, migrate over by moving over the GL totals and not all of the historical data over time. Maybe just the header amounts per month instead of all the individual records from each month for example.

For office, i'd recommend using office365 if you aren't using it already.

For the proprietary DB application, that could be put into a virtual machine or a dedicated machine and kept on-prem. I wouldn't spend money putting it in the cloud -- unless you're needing to provide others access to it remotely (e.g all the people that access that application aren't in the same office/location)

Robotron2k84 07-19-2019 5:10 PM

https://krebsonsecurity.com/2019/07/...omware-attack/

Ransomware takes out QuickBooks cloud hosting provider. Locks customer data.

If you don't have a continuance plan and encrypt your data, this type of event can ruin you and your company. Cloud is not always the answer (and certainly not forced-subscriptions online).

anelson 07-20-2019 4:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robotron2k84 (Post 23224161)
https://krebsonsecurity.com/2019/07/...omware-attack/

Ransomware takes out QuickBooks cloud hosting provider. Locks customer data.

If you don't have a continuance plan and encrypt your data, this type of event can ruin you and your company. Cloud is not always the answer (and certainly not forced-subscriptions online).

Looks like a company hosting "on prem QB", privately - not the official QuickBooks cloud hosted instances. This would be a much bigger deal if it were the actual QB Cloud, rather than a 3rd party.

Robotron2k84 07-20-2019 9:57 AM

To the businesses affected, it is a big deal. The point being that putting your data in someone else's hands is trusting them to execute flawlessly. Always have a continuance plan and make sure that a data breach doesn't compromise you or your clients.


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