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Being called a liar by a new gun shop

Posted 07-20-2012 at 6:21 PM by CSACANNONEER
Updated 07-20-2012 at 6:25 PM by CSACANNONEER

It appears that a thread about a LGS under new ownership has been deleted while I was responding to some guy's (probably the owner) lies about a phone inquiry I made. So, here's my response:

[QUOTE=OldJimmy;8966931]This issue seems to be getting out of control.

1. The lower in question was not manufactured to be a pistol receiver. It was for a long gun. Purchasing it and making into a pistol in California is not legal even for a LEO. It is a short rifle. So the clerk was correct in declining to DROS it as a pistol.[/quote]

OK, You are completely wrong here. Legally, a virgin stripped receiver is niether a long gun nor a handgun. ATF has made this fact completely clear. Even a lower with a stock attached which has never had an upper attached to it can legally be made into a handgun. Do yourself a favor and do a little research about this. Or, keep beinging an ignorant and uneducated gun shop owner.

[quote]2. The LEO in question was in a Border Patrol uniform and was accompanied by two others in suits that he introduced as other Border Patrol Officers. The uniformed officer had identification but the other two did not, making the clerk suspect a straw purchase[/quote]

Did you even ask the other two for ID? If I come in with my wife or a few friends and only one of us wants to buy a firearm that day, are you going to think it's a straw purchase? Of course, if the clerk truely thought it was a straw purchase, he did the right thing. But, will get to the fact that you and/or your clerk is lieing in a couple minutes.

[quote]3. The clerk first told the LEO he needed to check into the transaction before going ahead. The LEO pressed for him to do on the word of the LEO that it is legal. The clerk repeated his first response several times while the LEO continued to press. Finally the clerk asked the LEO to leave.[/quote]

Why would "the clerk" be in the position he is in if he is completely inept and doesn't understand what is legal for him to sell? Sounds like either another lie/excuse or very poor management for allowing an untrained cleck to run the shop.

[quote]4. Later someone called and asked to make an appointment for a private party transfer of an AR15 pistol. The clerk responded that he would first need to check into the legality of it. If it is legal he would do it.[/quote]

This is a complete lie. I was the one who called and I NEVER asked to make an appointment. I asked if I could have a PPT done there. I then inquired about the price and was informed that there was a $75 charge for the shop and a $25 charge for the state. I confirmed that wwe were talking about a PPT by asking if that was the charge when both parties were present to do the transaction and was told that I was correct. I then asked if you needed the gun to be a single shot or could it be a semi auto. At that point, I was informed that it wasn't going to happen there because AFT would not like to see an AR pistol on the books and the shop would have to explain too much to them. (Of course, I know that ATF doesn't have an issue with them. DOJ might but, the untrained clerk did not mention CA DOJ at all) I was explicitly told to "GO SOMEWHERE ELSE".

[quote]The owner has, in fact followed up with ATF and Cal DOJ. Both have said the situation was handled correctly. The store has the right to decline any transaction they suspect might not be legitimat. Even a PPT. Seems like all our rights are yet gone[/quote]

You are right, the store can refuse a suspected straw purchase. Of course, it is ILLEGAL for a FFL to refuse to do a legal PPT or charge more than $35 for doing one.

[quote]Further, the DOJ confirmed that AR 15 pistols, built up from long gun receivers are not legal in California. Also that LEOs may do a PPT with other LEOs using a form they get from Cal DOJ without involving a dealer.[/quote]

Further, DOJ can claim anything. The simple FACT is that there is NO LAW prohibiting this on a state or federal level. But, the OP was asking to have a virtgin receiver DROSed to him as a handgun in the first place. So, your point is moot in the first place.

[quote]Hi Pass Sports LLC is a new business. The owners put a lot of effort, time and money into opening a gun store exercising their 2nd ammendment rights in a state not friendly to them. The last thing they want to do is give big government an excuse to close another gun store! No one is perfect, like all beginners they may make a mistake! [/quote]

That's great. I hope the owner and the clerks learn to read the laws for themselves instead of blindly believing what some misinformed DOJ staffer wants the law to be. Seriously, it sounds like everyone associated with the shop needs to get some legal training FAST. Oh, and I'll suggest that they get some proper customer service training too. The "clerk" who fielded my phone inquiry is either living in his own dillussional reality or is just an outright liar. BTW, I'm not hiding behind a keyboard here. I'm easy to find at many different venues and will say the same thing to his face.

[quote]All of you say you are fighting for your 2nd ammendment rights yet you support someone who appears to want this little gun store to go out of business! Really? Could it be because he also tried to buy the same gun store and failed?[/QUOTE]

No, I would like to see every decent gun store be successful. However, one's who don't have a clue about the legalities of their business and outright lie about customer interactions NEED TO FAIL before they give good gun shops a black eye.

I will reach out and inform you that there is a great new organization called CAL-FFL. I stongly suggest that the owner looks into joining it and taking advantage of the what they have to offer. Who knows, he might learn enough to stay in business and even attract new customers. However, since the story about my phone call was so incorrectly reported here, I highly doubt you'll ever get my business. That's probably OK because, I don't feel the need to support another gun store. I already buy too much as it is. But, I doubt the shop really needs part of the five digits I spend on shooting every year anyway.
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  1. Old Comment
    1stLineGear's Avatar
    Just to clarify I never went in with any intent to buy an AR lower. My two co-workers were interested in buying an AR pistol/or pistol lower. I was just showing them where the shop was. They asked about what documentation was needed so they could buy at a later date.

    I bought an AR lower drosed as a pistol from the previous owner.

    The clerk never asked us to leave. We left on our own.

    Good blog on what happened though.

    Once this blows over I will do a tell all
    Posted 07-25-2012 at 10:08 PM by 1stLineGear 1stLineGear is offline
  2. Old Comment
    freonr22's Avatar
    did it blow over? also csa, what do you really feel?
    Posted 08-18-2012 at 9:18 AM by freonr22 freonr22 is offline

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