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45R
10-27-2014, 7:52 AM
Alright Calgunners,

I'm looking for a progressive press for loading 9mm and .223. I'm considering blue as I have tried both the 550 and 650. Leaning towards the 650 but I don't like that you can't turn off the auto index. :(

Does anyone have a non Dillon Progressive that they love to use that doesn't need to be fiddled with too often?

TIA

45R

PS. Any thought between the 550 vs 650 are also welcome :)

Aidenpeacemaker
10-27-2014, 7:56 AM
I have a xl 650 now ... But I started on a 550 and would recommend it.. cry once. Go blue.. you can find smoking deals in the market place.

gregshin
10-27-2014, 8:06 AM
both presses have their pros and cons as I have both. My high volume is set up on my 650 and i am at least 50% faster on the 650 due to an auto case feeder and auto indexing. why would you turn off the auto index?

you can get a case feed with the 550 but i also like having my powder check die on my 650 so i can keep cranking the rounds out. I then drop my loaded rounds with a EGW chamber check device too.

Mot Mi
10-27-2014, 9:11 AM
Get the 650 and in the future just add a single stage as by them you will have all thr necessary equipment to use the single stage. If not get the 650 and a lee classic turret but I believe that's auto indexinf and I don't know if you can turn it off. You should just get the 650, I habe one and I would not bother with anything else besides that. Go blue or go home. Buy once cry once.

JMP
10-27-2014, 9:59 AM
No, you won't beat a Dillon for progressive reloading. That's what they do. I am not a fan of progressive reloading, so I want a machine that's going to produce a nice big batch without breaking down, then I don't need to fritz around with it for a while.

Dark Mod
10-27-2014, 10:41 AM
I onwed a Hornaldy LNL with all the bells and whistles before moving on to a 650 and 1050 combo.

I like the LNL a lot, but got tired of fiddling with it. If that's a concern of yours, and it outweighs your concern about cost, go with the Dillon.

A few problems I have with the 650 is the priming system, the difficulty in switching calibers, and the price.

Ive never had a 550 but its simplicity negates the difficulty in changing calibers, but so does the fact that you will only be loading 2 calibers.

The fact that you will only be loading 2 calibers also mitigates the price aspect, as a huge portion of the cost is associated with caliber conversions.

I will say this: If you are planning on running a casefeeder, get a 650, if not get the 550. The 650 is spectacular with a casefeeder, but looks uncomfortable to use without one if that makes sense.

CSACANNONEER
10-27-2014, 10:48 AM
I prefer a 550 over a 650. The conversion kits are less expensive, there are far more conversion kits available and it is quicker to change from one cartridge to another.

Divernhunter
10-27-2014, 11:33 AM
I am happy with my 650

maxx03
10-27-2014, 11:47 AM
I prefer a 550 over a 650. The conversion kits are less expensive, there are far more conversion kits available and it is quicker to change from one cartridge to another.
+1 $30.00 dollar difference give or take.

David-K
10-27-2014, 1:20 PM
I have a Hornady Lock n Load AP with a casefeeder. I routinely load 9mm, .40S&W, 10mm, .45ACP, .38SPL, .357MAG AND .44MAG. Changing calibers is very easy and from start to finish takes me about 10 minutes. That does include changing from small to large priming system and any casefeeder adjustments that I might need to make, too

MrElectric03
10-27-2014, 1:23 PM
I'd like to have a 550 to load some calibers but overall I'm very happy with my 650. Caliber change is easy, it has its qwerks to figure out how to overcome but it's a great machine.

Tok36
10-27-2014, 2:11 PM
I have been happy with the 550. Once i learned its ins and outs i do not have to fiddle with it much unless i am changing calibers and with dedicated tool heads/powder funnels this is made easier. I have not been motivated to upgrade, for what i load (1k-1.5k / month) it has been plenty fast for me.

DeskHunter
10-27-2014, 3:19 PM
I know you said that you were considering getting either the 550 or 650, but i strongly recommend looking at the Hornady Lnl AP as well. People are selling entire set-ups on the marketplace with the case feeder for around 475 to 580. You could invest the money that you would have spent on a xL 650 for different shell plates and dies of other calibers, or reloading components. I chose a Lnl AP after months upon months of deliberating and came to the conclusion to go with Hornady. It's a great press that can process many rounds very quickly.

at_liberty
10-27-2014, 3:25 PM
I am not sure what you have in mind with turning off auto index, but if you use only one die on any progressive, every handle pull is a finished, single operation round, once you get a queue going.

BajaJames83
10-27-2014, 3:48 PM
what kind of volume are you looking to get?
300-400 hr is good for the 550 and its so easy to setup and run

John Browning
10-27-2014, 4:03 PM
what kind of volume are you looking to get?
300-400 hr is good for the 550 and its so easy to setup and run

This is the right question.

I had a LNL. It was OK. It had some minor issues. I read about how Dillon will take old cardboard boxes and lawn clippings and turn it into match grade benchrest ammo. I finally picked up a 550. Liked the 550 even less. Bought another LNL.

For me, the LNL is the best machine. I might only load a batch of 300-500 rounds at a time between a caliber swap and probably only load 10,000ish rounds a year at this point. The LNL does plenty fine. I agree with this guys conclusions completely:

http://www.comrace.ca/cmfiles/dillonLeeHornadyComparison.pdf

Cowboy T
10-27-2014, 5:19 PM
For any rifle rounds (the few that I've done), I do those on a Lee Classic Turret Press.

For any handgun rounds, I use the Lee Pro 1000.

All progressive presses, including Dillons and Hornadys, require a bit of maintenance here and there. The Pro 1000 is no exception. It is not built battleship-strong like an RL-550B. But it sure turns out bucketloads of quality ammo for me, mostly .38 Special and .45 Colt, without much trouble.

shinzen
10-27-2014, 5:49 PM
Used the Pro-1000 for pistol, 223, and 7.62x39. Honestly, it does well, but haven't tried blue yet. Also run a classic turret for most of my other rifle ammo. If you keep the primers full and don't use the bullet feeder (unless you're up for some tinkering) it will run just fine on both with no issue. CowboyT's videos were an immense help to get started.

David-K
10-28-2014, 5:37 AM
This is the right question.

I had a LNL. It was OK. It had some minor issues. I read about how Dillon will take old cardboard boxes and lawn clippings and turn it into match grade benchrest ammo. I finally picked up a 550. Liked the 550 even less. Bought another LNL.

For me, the LNL is the best machine. I might only load a batch of 300-500 rounds at a time between a caliber swap and probably only load 10,000ish rounds a year at this point. The LNL does plenty fine. I agree with this guys conclusions completely:

http://www.comrace.ca/cmfiles/dillonLeeHornadyComparison.pdf

Excellent post. I was trying to find that article when I posted up and couldn't find it. It was because of that comparison that I chose the LnL.

at_liberty
10-28-2014, 5:45 AM
I know you said that you were considering getting either the 550 or 650, but i strongly recommend looking at the Hornady Lnl AP as well. People are selling entire set-ups on the marketplace with the case feeder for around 475 to 580. You could invest the money that you would have spent on a xL 650 for different shell plates and dies of other calibers, or reloading components. I chose a Lnl AP after months upon months of deliberating and came to the conclusion to go with Hornady. It's a great press that can process many rounds very quickly.

I use an LnL AP too, but I would qualify that a used one may not include the latest subplate, which is neither free nor cheap. You also will value having the latest versions of shellplates, all intended to relieve a quirk (complaint). Buy the used (maybe) but don't assume the price is all you will have to spend or that it compares directly with a new one. Hornady is rather quiet about upgrades, waiting for you to call, so you have to seek out the LnL community to stay up to date and get support.

kdsd731
10-28-2014, 5:47 AM
I'm very happy with my lnl ap. For me, it did take a lot of tinkering to get dialed in but once it was right it doesn't need much adjustment. I only have to do minor adjustments while doing caliber swaps because I also use the case/pistol bullet/rifle bullet feeders.

9mmepiphany
10-28-2014, 8:46 AM
I've got my LNL AP up and running and you do have to keep on top of the upgrades. They'll provide them, but you'll have to ask for them. You do have to remember to check for tightness every 1k rounds

What sold me on the LNL was the ability to use it as a SS or a Turret as the mood struck me...without having to adjust the dies as I removed or replaced them. The jewel of the LNL is the powder measure and the half rotation of the shell plate.

I'm currently helping a friend rehab a 650 and can understand how it is a solid beast once you get it all set...but I also now understand why it is a bit fussy to set up. Very different design philosophy from the LNL

the86d
10-28-2014, 10:06 AM
Same 2 calibers (9mm and .223), and I started on an XL 650, and I wouldn't trade it for any single-stage experience... :)

I am pseudo-mech.-inclined.

If you don't bring it down all the way (well, most of the way), it doesn't index.

enzo357
10-28-2014, 10:41 AM
Started with a 550, upgraded to a 650. The 650 does a lot of rounds fast. It takes a little longer to change calibers and takes a little more upkeep than my 550. I shoot a lot, so the 650 is well worth it.

CGT80
10-28-2014, 8:13 PM
Go big or go home! Dillon 1050


OK, so you don't have the money for the 1050. My brother is in the same boat. He needs to load 40 s&w and 223. He has decided on the 650. It is made for feeding rifle brass and is auto indexing. He was thinking about a swage tool for the 650, but they have some drawbacks.

I have a 550 and I modified the press to feed 30-06, 30-30, 243, 460 mag, etc. in the casefeeder. It isn't perfect, but it is much better than feeding by hand. I also have a 1050 and Mr. Bulletfeeder to load 9mm, and I just converted the press to load 40 S&W. I would do all my loading on the 1050 if I could afford the conversions and toolheads. The 550 has served me very well, but the 650 would have fit my needs better. I have not used a 650, but have read about the priming system and seen photos and videos of it. It seems like the 550 and 1050 have a better design for priming, but that doesn't mean it won't get the job done.

Go for the 650.

JMP
10-29-2014, 12:26 PM
http://www.comrace.ca/cmfiles/dillonLeeHornadyComparison.pdf

This is probably a pretty fair comparison.

For me, when it comes to reloading, it's really the dies that I focus on. The rest is more controllable by the user. Though you can switch out die brands, I like the Dillon dies far above the other two. Dillon makes, in my opinion, very good dies for pistol shooting. The sizing/decapping die really lasts and punches through the nastiest primers that you'd want to reload for; otherwise, the clip on the top will just bust off and you are still good by just replacing that little clip.

I am biased against Hornady because I find their dies to be tragic, and the manufacturing tolerances used for their bullets and brass is sub-par on the rifle side. Admittedly, I am somewhat of a snob in that respect. What Hornady does well is they make absolutely everything reloading related and provides one-stop shopping for budget/value oriented customers. They do a lot of things okay to decent, but I have yet to find them do anything great.

The best thing Hornady has ever done was come out with the 6.5 CD cartridge, but the Nosler brass that is now available is leagues better. If you shop around, you will see the Nosler and Norma brass all sold out for twice the price. I have not even seen a Norma case for 6.5 CD, but they did start making it this year.

Tom-ADC
10-29-2014, 12:54 PM
I've had a 550 for maybe 20 years, does everything I need, I reload 9MM to 45-70 on it. Just a easy to use press that cranks out quality ammo.

tamalpias
10-29-2014, 4:02 PM
since this thread is still fresh, May I ask how much does it cost to swap calibers on a dillion 650? I noticed a tool head with powder measure and conversion kit is $230 to convert calibers? If that is so then it's a bit pricey to change calibers :-/

Mot Mi
10-29-2014, 4:07 PM
I thought it was 80 dollars for a conversion it or was it 100? I dont know but look on brianenos.com I believe is brians site.

tamalpias
10-29-2014, 4:38 PM
I thought it was 80 dollars for a conversion it or was it 100? I dont know but look on brianenos.com I believe is brians site.

it is 80 for the conversion kit but you will also need the tool head and powder measure if you want to keep things consistent and be able to change out calibers at a decent rate

the86d
10-30-2014, 3:42 AM
since this thread is still fresh, May I ask how much does it cost to swap calibers on a dillion 650? I noticed a tool head with powder measure and conversion kit is $230 to convert calibers? If that is so then it's a bit pricey to change calibers :-/

I estimated, when I bought mine, (if you cannot use any parts you currently have) it would run about $250-$270 (including carbide dies, I think), per caliber. This is including a quick-change, so you never have to swap dies, but you could easily get 400-500 rd/hour pressed if you have the case-feeder, if you are visually inspecting powder drops, and someone else is filling primer tubes (I have yet to receive the vibra-prime, but that may help too).

45R
10-30-2014, 9:24 AM
You guys had me at 650! Thanks for the input everyone! I'm going to order it with both 9mm and .223 kits :)

Mot Mi
10-30-2014, 5:20 PM
You guys had me at 650! Thanks for the input everyone! I'm going to order it with both 9mm and .223 kits :)

Nice! You cant go wrong with the 650 and dillon has a no bs warranty just incase your press blows up. Make sure you get everything even the case feeder but if you cant get it all at once, get it later.

45R
10-31-2014, 6:40 AM
Ordering the case feeder and plates for small pistol and rifle!

9mmepiphany
10-31-2014, 7:28 PM
I just spent the day helping a friend rescue an abused 650. I had a great time and have rehabbed a LNL AP really helped.

I can now understand why folks talk about how solid they are after you get them set up correctly...but half the fun was getting there.

I still prefer the powder (more accurate) and primer (easier to change from Lg to Sm.) handling of the LNL. But I really like the over built drive system...very simple, but not quite as adjustable

MrElectric03
11-01-2014, 7:54 AM
You guys had me at 650! Thanks for the input everyone! I'm going to order it with both 9mm and .223 kits :)

Good choice. Caliber changes can be as expensive as you want to make them. I reload 6 calibers on my 650 and have two powder measures. I keep one setup for my .223 loads and the other I use for all of my pistol loads. If you buy a powder measure for every caliber it's going to get expensive. When I buy for a new caliber I check ebay for the conversion kit, I've bought them for anywhere from $40 shipped to $60 shipped. For anymore than that I'll buy it new. Then I order a tool head and two powder dies from Brian enos(one to,keep,setup for powder measure and the other for the powder check), i susally buy the dies on ebay as well. RCBS carbide for pistol, I like the dillon but they are very pricey even used.