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Fjold
12-23-2007, 11:28 AM
As owners of off-list rifles do we have standing to sue the State since we live under the constant threat of prosecution for the DOJs intentional misinterpretation of the law? Or would someone have to be arrested individually to have standing?

dustoff31
12-23-2007, 12:15 PM
I believe you would have had to be arrested or prosecuted for something to have standing. IIRC, this was an issue with some of the people involved in the Heller case. The court ruled thay didn't have standing because they hadn't been arrested, denied a permit, or whatever it was.

bwiese
12-23-2007, 12:20 PM
No but I think we have a due process - and a taxpayer - right that the chief LE agency must fully clarify its position - "Go..." or "No go..." with reasons.

.22guy
12-23-2007, 12:30 PM
If people can sue on behalf of wild animals and the environment we should be able to sue for a standing on OLL issues.

acousticmood
12-23-2007, 3:24 PM
THere was a thread here not long ago where a lawyer was looking for examples of LEO's going overboard. I think he might have been trying to put together a class action. Do a search for it.

hoffmang
12-23-2007, 4:14 PM
We all probably have standing. I've got particular standing on the OAL letter and another little project I'm up to. It's trivial to get standing when the time comes without getting arrested.

-Gene

aileron
12-23-2007, 5:14 PM
Those shall be some interesting days. :D

leelaw
12-23-2007, 5:28 PM
Apply for CCW and be denied.
Apply to import an AW and be denied.
Get arrested for AW/OLL issues.

There are lots of ways to get real secure standing. IIRC, Heller has standing because he applied to register a handgun when he moved to DC, and was denied. The others in the suit did not have standing because, even though they tried to apply, they did not own a handgun and therefore technically couldn't really apply for registration to then be denied.

Scarecrow Repair
12-23-2007, 7:18 PM
The others in the suit did not have standing because, even though they tried to apply, they did not own a handgun and therefore technically couldn't really apply for registration to then be denied.

I am curious about that. I understand why they didn't have standing, and I understand they might not have wanted to get an illegal gun before applying. But could they have bought a gun in Virginia and kept it in a storage locker or at a friend's house, and then applied for a permit to bring it in? Or would DC residency have made it impossible to buy a gun in the first place? And if so, could they have used that fact to get their standing?

What I am asking is, is there any way they could have gotten standing without breaking the law?

CSDGuy
12-23-2007, 7:26 PM
I am curious about that. I understand why they didn't have standing, and I understand they might not have wanted to get an illegal gun before applying. But could they have bought a gun in Virginia and kept it in a storage locker or at a friend's house, and then applied for a permit to bring it in? Or would DC residency have made it impossible to buy a gun in the first place? And if so, could they have used that fact to get their standing?

What I am asking is, is there any way they could have gotten standing without breaking the law?
My understanding is that they could not have done this as they were DC residents at the time. Therefore, they would have committed a crime by attempting to purchase a handgun "out of state". If they'd purchased a handgun prior to becoming a DC resident and then tried to register it... they'd have the same standing Heller did.

hoffmang
12-23-2007, 7:47 PM
Standing issues in Paker are also under appeal with an Amicus brief from our own Don Kilmer. All the plaintiffs should have and usually would have had standing in Parker but DC has one weird gun related case that lead to the wacky outcome. The good news is that the Ninth Circuit is actually more normal about pre-enforcement standing. However, the first pre-incorporation cases around the 2nd in the 9th are going to have really obvious standing to keep things easy.

-Gene

6172crew
12-23-2007, 7:56 PM
I wonder (as a CCW holder in NV) would I be able to apply for a CCW since I have to pick up my kids at MY house when my ex has a ex-felon drug dealer living with them? I dont have much to loose but I really dont have the $$$.

thekwyjibo
12-24-2007, 6:59 AM
I had an AW that I turned in (It was before I found this site so I was being a good little sheeple), Wouldn't that give me standing? Basically stating that I turned in a weapon that was in violation of an unconstitutional law and I want it back. I know it is probably slag now, given I turned it in a few years ago but I would think that should not matter. Property of mine was taken without due process under a law that is essentially not going to pass a proper constitutional muster. I should be able to sue for damages if worse comes to worse and that simple action could be a wedge to shooting down the law.

I should still have the police report number around here somewhere so it is in their records.

-Russ

hoffmang
12-24-2007, 10:30 AM
The short answer is that surrendering property that you shouldn't have been forced to would certainly give you standing though you'd have to figure out if there is a statute of limitations that is applicable time wise.

-Gene

N6ATF
12-24-2007, 11:42 PM
I had an AW that I turned in ... I know it is probably slag now,

It's probably in one of the gun-grabbing politicians' armories. What's the point of gun-grabbing if not to keep them for yourself?

Hypocrites.