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View Full Version : Nightsight = failed for HD


goldengate
01-27-2012, 10:28 AM
I put a set of Meprolight on my Walther PPQ for home defense and was very disappointed. For home defense, I don't see the advantage of having night sight. I did a trial run around 10pm with all lights off in the house and I cannot see anything but 3 green dots. I don't know if I am aiming at my door or the TV. For sure, I am not going to pull the trigger without identifying the target. I think I am going to mount a TLR flashlight. The only things I like about the nightsights over the factory sights are it is metal and I can find my gun in the dark. Anyone with night sights on their gun want to chime in on the advantages of it for home defense?

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-exqHVM4uZZQ/TyL4OVj6CjI/AAAAAAAAAaE/_zCtRBj3fpw/s640/IMG_1147.jpg

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-Tftnhx4P_lk/TyL4ONTAziI/AAAAAAAAAaQ/RY9rcXHeGUM/s640/IMG_1150.jpg

Montu
01-27-2012, 10:31 AM
what did you expect them to light the room?

I like my night sights for use in low light..not complete darkness...in complete darkness I like being able to see my gun like you mentioned.


I also mounted a tlr1s

1nickatnite1
01-27-2012, 10:32 AM
I don't think night sites are meant for complete darkness. Its more of an aid in ambient light situations. With that said, I have a tlr-1 on my hd gun with NO n/s a it works great. Some ppl just like having them.

thetaxman
01-27-2012, 10:33 AM
Night sights won't help you identify who or what is making the noise at 3am. You must have a light on a HD weapon. If you shoot the drunk neighbor/daughters' boyfriend/friend from work because you couldn't see, then you will go to jail and lose your house in a law suit.

zfields
01-27-2012, 10:33 AM
Duh?

vintagearms
01-27-2012, 10:34 AM
Identify your target is #1. The object of night sights isnt to illuminate your target, just as an aid to see your sights.

Casual_Shooter
01-27-2012, 10:34 AM
Would be interested in hearing what you were expecting.

iron330
01-27-2012, 10:36 AM
I see no reason for night sights other than being able to find your gun in the dark. And that frankly isn't a good reason either. I think Angus Hobdel from CZ said more or less the same thing recently.

Decoligny
01-27-2012, 10:36 AM
I don't have the night sights, but I do know they are not designed for 100% total darkness. They do not allow you to see in the dark. They are designed for low light conditions where you can actually see your target, but would not be able to see your front and rear sights. Hard to shoot center mass if you have nothing to aim with.

Consider putting a couple of "night lights" around the house. This will allow enough illumination to differentiate between an intruder and your coat rack.

An intruder, upon entering a house that is totally dark, will usually use a flashlight in order to see what he is trying to steal. You rarely if ever get an intruder who is wearing night vision goggles, so you will have an illuminated area in which to see your target.

Dynamic
01-27-2012, 10:37 AM
Lol, night sights are not meant to light up the whole room, its good for low light situations or work great with a mounted light.

shooterfpga
01-27-2012, 10:37 AM
Would be interested in hearing what you were expecting.

me too lol. this is the first time ive heard anyone think it was gonna illuminate what youre lookin at.

zfields
01-27-2012, 10:40 AM
me too lol. this is the first time ive heard anyone think it was gonna illuminate what youre lookin at.

Maybe if you put them on backwards :TFH:

goldengate
01-27-2012, 10:40 AM
Well, I was at my local gun store and an employee was like, 'every HD gun must have night sights' and I was seeing all these gun coming out with night sight install from factory. I though it might be worth it to have it on my hd gun. I want to see the real life situation when it might be useful. Seriously, even with low light situation, I don't see how helpful night sights are. I wake up around 6am for work and there was enough sun to light up the room. I took the PPQ out and the night sights are still very visible, but I would still prefer having a mounted flashlight.

MongooseV8
01-27-2012, 10:41 AM
I don't see how both not being able to identify your target AND not having any sight picture is a better option? Use ns for low light conditions. Like outside or your living room since there should be a small amount of light available to identify bad guys. In a cave or the blackness of deep space a tac light would be useful.

Then again try using painted sights in a dark room while using your tac light and let me know how that works for you hehe.

SDM44
01-27-2012, 10:44 AM
what did you expect them to light the room?



LOL, but this is exactly what I was thinking.


Night sights have their purpose, and for me it's for low light situations (where I can still see the area when it's dark), but I wouldn't only use NS in this case.... use a flashlight or something to illuminate the area you intend to shoot at first.

Also, if it is pitch black like you were experiencing, then it's much easier to get a sense of where the gun/muzzle is pointed. Again, you need a light in this situation but at least you're not holding the gun improperly and having it pointed way low or high from where you think it is.


On the flip side, night sights are pretty much useless when you run a weapon-mounted light underneath the muzzle. In pretty much every case, that bright light is going to wash out the tritium glowing, so you're basically left with a silhouette of sight posts (if you go with 3-dot style sights) and you just need to align those up when shooting at that point. You won't be able to use your night sights unless you have the light far off to the side of the gun, or way back behind the gun.

beretta929mm
01-27-2012, 10:45 AM
Then it is time to break out the cash for a night vision goggle :)

goldengate
01-27-2012, 10:51 AM
I thought with ambient light from the street, plus the night sights will be enough to see around my house. I guess I was wrong. I mean I can navigate around the house with all the lights off, but it is hard to ID someone with just ambient lights. My next purchase will be a TLR flashlight.

hefedehefe
01-27-2012, 10:52 AM
Maybe if you put them on backwards :TFH:

:rofl2:

1nickatnite1
01-27-2012, 10:53 AM
great deals on the tlr-1 from botach and amazon i think. if you buy from amazon be sure to click the link through calguns so a % is donated.

shooterfpga
01-27-2012, 10:55 AM
I thought with ambient light from the street, plus the night sights will be enough to see around my house. I guess I was wrong. I mean I can navigate around the house with all the lights off, but it is hard to ID someone with just ambient lights. My next purchase will be a TLR flashlight.

that is a good idea, any flashlight will help. everyone is different and our living situations different as well. while you may have ambient light that you consider good, someone else might have a tad brighter ambient light. our visions are definately not the same either. atleast you found out that your typical situation requires a light.

hefedehefe
01-27-2012, 10:55 AM
http://i196.photobucket.com/albums/aa44/smoothinoc/DSC00538.jpg


OR


http://i196.photobucket.com/albums/aa44/smoothinoc/DSC00536.jpg

:rockon:


Night Sights make your gun do this :31:

MongooseV8
01-27-2012, 10:55 AM
I think ultimately you would rather have them then not. Sure they don't work at all times everywhere but the are still very useful. A light would take care of the rest.

Lovin
01-27-2012, 10:57 AM
This has to be a troll thread.

BigStiCK
01-27-2012, 10:57 AM
This is why it is good to practice how you're going to play. Night sights are neat tools that will aid acquiring & maintaining a good sight picture in certain situations.

Too many people buy "Neato" gear & never actually learn to use it until, God forbid, they need it.

My HD Gun has a nice set of night sights, and right next to the quick access safe it sleeps in rests a VERY bright (& heavy) aluminum bodied LED flashlight/ Club. They go together like peas in a pod:43:

An HD gun is worthless if you cant see, as are night sights. Have a Good quality LED flashlight at the ready near your weapon AND PRACTICE WITH THEM.

You bought the tool, now learn its strengths and limitations.

-Stick
:patriot:

Mana4real
01-27-2012, 10:59 AM
Then it is time to break out the cash for a night vision goggle :)

Stupid comment but I can't help myself.... Modern Warfare 2, the Ultimate pack!! Night vision goggles and you get the game :)... They actually work too!! I have it LOL...

But in all seriousness. I was thinking Tac Light Mounted to the underside of the gun. That's the plan anyways.

PlumDrumnGun
01-27-2012, 10:59 AM
They just look cool because they glow in the dark - I prefer the hi-viz fiber optic myself, but "tritium" sounds so cool, almost nuclear...

SarcoBlaster
01-27-2012, 11:01 AM
Put a light on your gun.

/thread

Mana4real
01-27-2012, 11:02 AM
http://i196.photobucket.com/albums/aa44/smoothinoc/DSC00538.jpg


OR


http://i196.photobucket.com/albums/aa44/smoothinoc/DSC00536.jpg

:rockon:


Night Sights make your gun do this :31:

Great example!! How much was the Tac light and lazer sight combo?

Black Majik
01-27-2012, 11:02 AM
They just look cool because they glow in the dark - I prefer the hi-viz fiber optic myself, but "tritium" sounds so cool, almost nuclear...

How do fiber optic sights work in the dark?

starsnuffer
01-27-2012, 11:07 AM
As ridiculous as this thread is, I gotta give credit to the OP for actually attempting to figure out how he's going to use his HD weapon at night. A lot of people never even bother to practice.

Night sights help you see the sights. This may or may not be useful, given your environment. Most homes are set up in such a way that you're just as well off point shooting then taking the time to line up the sights. . . or you may even have to shoot from a compromised position when you can't extend the weapon to use the sights. That said, night sights aren't going to hurt anything, so they fall into the "why not" category.

It's kind of funny, because my wife said the same thing about one of my Luminox watches. The marks are clearly visible at night, but it doesn't light up the room. I had to explain (and those of you who are married know how that goes) why only being able to see what time it was is all I needed and that I wasn't expecting the watch to light up the room. Not sure if she gets it either.

The best solution is to put sound activated floodlights on your German Shepard. This not only keeps them from barking when they're not supposed to, but it serves as a great way to illuminate your intended target at night without the need for fiddling with gadgets on your gun.

-W

Montu
01-27-2012, 11:16 AM
The best solution is to put sound activated floodlights on your German Shepard. This not only keeps them from barking when they're not supposed to, but it serves as a great way to illuminate your intended target at night without the need for fiddling with gadgets on your gun.

-W

:rofl2:

Lead Waster
01-27-2012, 11:21 AM
Night sights are NOT useless! If you go shooting at the range at Target Masters in Milpitas, you will need those sights to see your gun! A sportlight will help seeing the target!

:p

(I hope their renovations include bullet proof lights...)

paul0660
01-27-2012, 11:25 AM
what did you expect

I got this far.

hefedehefe
01-27-2012, 11:27 AM
Great example!! How much was the Tac light and lazer sight combo?
Thanks, but it's not a combo. The laser came with the gun and the Tac light was $24 :D

sholling
01-27-2012, 11:34 AM
As others have said they aren't for identifying targets or illuminating the room, they're just there to help you to see your sights better in LOW light. There are situations where you can clearly identify your target but getting a sight picture without night sights can take too long. That's all they're for.

I have a weapon light on my nightstand pistol but it's not there for clearing rooms. That's because I don't point a weapon at anything I don't intend to destroy. I have a top quality flashlight in my weak hand. If the threat level is so high that I need a higher state of readiness then it's too high for one person to clear the house and time to call the sheriff.

What I'd like to do is setup a master on switch next to my bed that switches on every light in my house. I already have automatic power failure lights in every room.

Cyphre
01-27-2012, 11:37 AM
Began thinking this was a troll thread as well. All you have to do is read 'find your gun in the dark' in Nutnfancy's voice. :facepalm:

For those with too little experience in not-well-lit ranges, night sights are an immense help where fiber optic or white dot sights are practically unusable. Though some seem fine with black 'combat sights', in a situation where you are pointing at a target that is reflecting light (such as using a handheld or mounted light on targets in the dark) there isn't much of a discernible profile to determine in which direction you are pointing at. In other words, just because you can see your target and it is well-lit, if you are in a dark room, it won't be easy to see your sight picture.

krisjon
01-27-2012, 11:39 AM
<scratching my head, while also grabbing my popcorn>

SDM44
01-27-2012, 11:48 AM
How do fiber optic sights work in the dark?

They don't.

Think of them like a prism, where you need a little bit of light to really make them shine/glow. In a very dark situation, they won't be any better than plastic stock sights.

thetaxman
01-27-2012, 11:48 AM
The best solution is to put sound activated floodlights on your German Shepard. This not only keeps them from barking when they're not supposed to, but it serves as a great way to illuminate your intended target at night without the need for fiddling with gadgets on your gun.

-W

:oji:

I don't think that is a viable option as per PC below unless you are running the dog in restricted lumen mode.


12276.1. (a) Notwithstanding Section 12276, "assault weapon" shall also mean any of the following:
(1) A semiautomatic, centerfire rifle that has the capacity to accept a detachable magazine and any one of the following:
(A) A pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the weapon.
(B) A thumbhole stock.
(C) A folding or telescoping stock.
(D) A grenade launcher or flare launcher.
(E) A flash suppressor.
(F) A forward pistol grip.
(2) A semiautomatic, centerfire rifle that has a fixed magazine with the capacity to accept more than 10 rounds.
(3) A German Shepard dog that has sound or motion activated floodlights attached by a "large lumen capacity light mounting device" as per 12556.1.a.
(4) A semiautomatic pistol that has the capacity to accept a detachable magazine and any one of the following:
(A) A threaded barrel, capable of accepting a flash suppressor, forward handgrip, or silencer.
(B) A second handgrip.
(C) A shroud that is attached to, or partially or completely encircles, the barrel that allows the bearer to fire the weapon without burning his or her hand, except a slide that encloses the barrel.
(D) The capacity to accept a detachable magazine at some location outside of the pistol grip.
(5) A semiautomatic pistol with a fixed magazine that has the capacity to accept more than 10 rounds.
(6) A semiautomatic shotgun that has both of the following:
(A) A folding or telescoping stock.
(B) A pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the weapon, thumbhole stock, or vertical handgrip.
(7) A semiautomatic shotgun that has the ability to accept a detachable magazine.
(8) Any shotgun with a revolving cylinder

negolien
01-27-2012, 11:52 AM
I put a set of Meprolight on my Walther PPQ for home defense and was very disappointed. For home defense, I don't see the advantage of having night sight. I did a trial run around 10pm with all lights off in the house and I cannot see anything but 3 green dots. I don't know if I am aiming at my door or the TV. For sure, I am not going to pull the trigger without identifying the target. I think I am going to mount a TLR flashlight. The only things I like about the nightsights over the factory sights are it is metal and I can find my gun in the dark. Anyone with night sights on their gun want to chime in on the advantages of it for home defense?

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-exqHVM4uZZQ/TyL4OVj6CjI/AAAAAAAAAaE/_zCtRBj3fpw/s640/IMG_1147.jpg

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-Tftnhx4P_lk/TyL4ONTAziI/AAAAAAAAAaQ/RY9rcXHeGUM/s640/IMG_1150.jpg

You thought it was gonna do what exactly? Throw a beacon of green light at your target? :facepalm: I say sell your weapon and buy a baseball bat might be more your speed.

someR1
01-27-2012, 11:56 AM
Then it is time to break out the cash for a night vision goggle :)

this !

goldengate
01-27-2012, 12:05 PM
You thought it was gonna do what exactly? Throw a beacon of green light at your target? :facepalm: I say sell your weapon and buy a baseball bat might be more your speed.

Really? That is your suggestion? You might as well just stay in the sideline with that comment. Like I said, I thought with ambient light around the house, having night sight might help with target acquisition. But instead, it just makes my eyes focus on the green dots and takes it off the target behind it. At least, I tried and know that I need more than night sight on my handgun for home defense.

oldboy
01-27-2012, 12:13 PM
They don't.

Think of them like a prism, where you need a little bit of light to really make them shine/glow. In a very dark situation, they won't be any better than plastic stock sights.
Would you happen to have a picture of fiber-optic sights being used in conjunction with a tac-light in little to no light settings? I've been meaning to experiment with some fiber-optics, but refrained because the night sights give me a pretty good sight picture in the aforementioned circumstances.

StratORcaster
01-27-2012, 12:17 PM
Get a solar lantern.

Shenaniguns
01-27-2012, 12:44 PM
Maybe if you put them on backwards :TFH:


LOL

Black Majik
01-27-2012, 12:52 PM
They just look cool because they glow in the dark - I prefer the hi-viz fiber optic myself, but "tritium" sounds so cool, almost nuclear...
How do fiber optic sights work in the dark?


They don't.

Think of them like a prism, where you need a little bit of light to really make them shine/glow. In a very dark situation, they won't be any better than plastic stock sights.

Precisely. It was more tongue in cheek as the person I responded to mentioned he preferred fiber optics sights over night sights... except FO sights don't work in the dark.

cindynles
01-27-2012, 1:10 PM
How do fiber optic sights work in the dark?

They just look cool because they glow in the dark - I prefer the hi-viz fiber optic myself, but "tritium" sounds so cool, almost nuclear...



TruGlo TFO....... Tritium Fiber Optic.......:p

http://i557.photobucket.com/albums/ss20/cindynles/IMG_0877.jpg
http://i557.photobucket.com/albums/ss20/cindynles/IMG_0878.jpg

With a light of course.......
http://i557.photobucket.com/albums/ss20/cindynles/IMG_0977.jpg

goldengate
01-27-2012, 1:40 PM
TruGlo TFO....... Tritium Fiber Optic.......:p

http://i557.photobucket.com/albums/ss20/cindynles/IMG_0877.jpg
http://i557.photobucket.com/albums/ss20/cindynles/IMG_0878.jpg

With a light of course.......
http://i557.photobucket.com/albums/ss20/cindynles/IMG_0977.jpg

That's really nice. Too bad, Truglo doesn't make one for Walther. That settled it. Going to get a mounted flashlight this weekend.

jrr
01-27-2012, 1:44 PM
Heh... well, yeah a "night sight" isnt gonna make you into batman with the ability to see in the dark. They aren't for no light situations, thats what weapon lights are for. They are Extremely useful for "low light" situations though.

I had to shoot a raccoon in the backyard with a 22 pistol with standard sights. Even at point blank it was extremely difficult to pick up the sights to make a humane kill. And it wasnt even a pitch black room, just low streetlight. Night sights would have made that an easy shot, because you can pick up those three dots under any lighting condition. Thats all they do.

Target identification is absolutely key, use a weapon light for HD.. But even with a light mounted you will have a hell of a time picking up black on black sights in the dark. So even with a light carried or mounted, you should have luminous sights installed on a HD gun that might see low light conditions. My .02c anyways.

eta: reading up a few posts... there is a concern that the glowing sights draw your eyes in the dark, so you focus on the sights not the target. IMHO once you have identified the target as something that needs to be shot, your eyes should be focused on the sights anyways. Always focus on the front sight, so I don't see that as much of a concern.