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b00gym4n
08-02-2010, 7:17 AM
I'm saving up to purchase an Arsenal SGL21 and plan on putting on an Aimpoint red dot sight on the rear to co-witness with my iron sights. Not sure if that made sense, I'm pretty noobish in the rifle game.

My question is.. at what distance should I be zeroing my aimpoint at? This is for when SHTF and just having fun at the range. If I zeroed it in at 50 yards am I supposed to aim higher when I shoot @ 100 yards?

Thanks in advance. (this question was inspired by another post, but i didnt want to bombard his with my own questions)

CSACANNONEER
08-02-2010, 7:25 AM
First, of all, zero your optics at the distance which you are planning to shoot it. It's that easy. It only takes one to two rounds and proper technique to zero optics at ANY distance so, it's always an easy thing to change. Secondly, you are mounting optics on an AK and you will probably be using surplus or imported cheap ammo. So, you should not expect to shoot more precisely than 3-4 moa. I really doubt that you will be a good enough shot to notice any difference between your POI if your gun is zeroed at 50 yards or 100 yards when you are shooting at either distance.

Juice5610
08-02-2010, 8:07 AM
I just bought a SGL-21 and have an aimpoint coming in later this week. What you want to do is put the Ultimak gas tube rail and mount it on that. As for the zero check out the link below. A zero at 50 yards will give you the most use out of a battle rifle. You'll be on target +/- 2" from 0 to 250 yards being dead on at at 50 yards then again at 225 yards. I'll post pics of my SGL-21 when I finish it later this week. Hope this helps

http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=18&t=328143

Edit: My buddies Arsenal SGL-20 was getting 1.05 MOA at 100 yards (USING WOLF) thats more then good for a battle rifle let alone an ak. Remember if you want to shoot sub moa at 100 yards get yourself a AR and make your own ammo that IS NOT what the ak platform was ment for.

b00gym4n
08-02-2010, 8:21 AM
Good info. I heard the ultimak works well, but I really prefer to have my optics on the rear. Do you have any experiences or info on this mount? I heard it was phenomenal, but it could be hype.

Kalinka Optics
http://img697.imageshack.us/img697/2084/hdlpak2302600.jpg
http://i35.tinypic.com/2u4o4kj.jpg
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y36/Snake122/100_2644.jpg

FeuerFrei
08-02-2010, 8:28 AM
Kalinka Optics has it right.
Abso-friggen-lutely great mounts for your commie rail equiped AK type rifle.
Once adjusted it will return/keep zero every time.
My personal experience.

Juice5610
08-02-2010, 8:40 AM
Good info. I heard the ultimak works well, but I really prefer to have my optics on the rear. Do you have any experiences or info on this mount? I heard it was phenomenal, but it could be hype.

Kalinka Optics
http://img697.imageshack.us/img697/2084/hdlpak2302600.jpg
http://i35.tinypic.com/2u4o4kj.jpg
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y36/Snake122/100_2644.jpg

I believe alot of people arent running that kalinka mount because they have broken during classes before. Head on over to warriortalk.com and ask Gabe Saurez (an AK instructor ) about that mount. I believe the problem was that that mount was made so thin(see attachement) so it could sit as low as possible allowing it to cowitness which didnt do any good if you hit the deck and the optic/mount took a direct hit. If your just planning to plink with it then by all means go for it but my AK is now my primary "go to" rifle and I would not trust my life to that mount

b00gym4n
08-02-2010, 8:51 AM
The last thing I want is my optics to break off during a zombie invasion. I'm awaiting forum activation to ask members there. While I'm waiting can you describe to me the type of ultimak you put on your sgl21? I'm not sure which one fits.

Juice5610
08-02-2010, 9:01 AM
I ordered the M1-B after being told it would fit the SGL. Their all sold out. New shipment comes in later this week/early next week.

ar15barrels
08-02-2010, 9:59 AM
http://i703.photobucket.com/albums/ww38/jman_80/keepthatcrapoff.jpg

Juice5610
08-02-2010, 10:06 AM
http://i703.photobucket.com/albums/ww38/jman_80/keepthatcrapoff.jpg

I was waiting for that lol but I will take faster (stable) target aquisition over tradition every day of the week

Juice5610
08-02-2010, 10:19 AM
to the op take a look at these threads

http://www.warriortalk.com/showthread.php?t=60011

http://www.warriortalk.com/showthread.php?t=71569

WebMoskal
08-02-2010, 11:33 AM
I just bought a SGL-21 and have an aimpoint coming in later this week. What you want to do is put the Ultimak gas tube rail and mount it on that. As for the zero check out the link below. A zero at 50 yards will give you the most use out of a battle rifle. You'll be on target +/- 2" from 0 to 250 yards being dead on at at 50 yards then again at 225 yards. I'll post pics of my SGL-21 when I finish it later this week. Hope this helps

http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=18&t=328143

Edit: My buddies Arsenal SGL-20 was getting 1.05 MOA at 100 yards (USING WOLF) thats more then good for a battle rifle let alone an ak. Remember if you want to shoot sub moa at 100 yards get yourself a AR and make your own ammo that IS NOT what the ak platform was ment for.

SGLs 21 and 20 use 7.62x39, what you quote ^^ is for 223

SJgunguy24
08-02-2010, 11:53 AM
I've messed with mounting optics on AK's. IMO the best thing one can do for the AK is change the sights to the HK style sights. Easy to see and work extremly well on AK's. I have changed to those on 2 of my AK's

Juice5610
08-02-2010, 11:55 AM
SGLs 21 and 20 use 7.62x39, what you quote ^^ is for 223

Very true I forgot all about that sorry op

Edit: heres this

http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=386174

Motz
08-02-2010, 12:03 PM
^^^ +1 I would imagine those two different bullets act a little different once they are out of the pipe. Even shooting a heavy heavy 77gr SMK (about the biggest bullet you can get to fit in an AR mag) you can double the weight of a bullet with a 7.62x39. That dammed gravity likes to pull heavy things down faster than lighter things. Trust me you should see my gut...

CSACANNONEER
08-02-2010, 12:17 PM
That dammed gravity likes to pull heavy things down faster than lighter things. Trust me you should see my gut...

FAIL! Gravity has NOTHING to do with mass! Well, there are those aging women but, that's another story. Seriously, aceleration due to gravity is a constant and has nothing to do with mass.

Juice5610
08-02-2010, 12:30 PM
FAIL! Gravity has NOTHING to do with mass! Well, there are those aging women but, that's another story. Seriously, aceleration due to gravity is a constant and has nothing to do with mass.

this its a speed game

SJgunguy24
08-02-2010, 12:32 PM
FAIL! Gravity has NOTHING to do with mass! Well, there are those aging women but, that's another story. Seriously, aceleration due to gravity is a constant and has nothing to do with mass.

I was gonna say something about that but I wanted to find the moon landing video first.
<object width="480" height="385"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/5C5_dOEyAfk&amp;hl=en_US&amp;fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/5C5_dOEyAfk&amp;hl=en_US&amp;fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="480" height="385"></embed></object>

chefdude
08-02-2010, 12:32 PM
Wait!!!! people actually zero in AK's????:p

SJgunguy24
08-02-2010, 12:35 PM
this its a speed game

Velocity, trajectory, and projectile shape and construction are the major factors when it comes to ballsitics. All thing fall at the same constant rate.

Motz
08-02-2010, 12:38 PM
Very true but I figured with the OP being a self proclaimed noobish rifle shooter getting in depth on bullet trajectory and the parabolic curve differences between the two calibers was a little much. I was just trying to point out that that the above link would not necessarily serve the best zero for the particular caliber he was shooting. Thank you for pointing that out. P.S. I wonder if Harrison, Hathcock, Gilliland, ETC only used one or two rounds to zero their optics?

SJgunguy24
08-02-2010, 12:41 PM
Very true but I figured with the OP being a self proclaimed noobish rifle shooter getting in depth on bullet trajectory and the parabolic curve differences between the two calibers was a little much. I was just trying to point out that that the above link would not necessarily serve the best zero for the particular caliber he was shooting. Thank you for pointing that out. P.S. I wonder if Harrison, Hathcock, Gilliland, ETC only used one or two rounds to zero their optics?

I think they had good dope already and could guestimate range well enough to get the job done in 1 shot;)

Motz
08-02-2010, 12:42 PM
Sure... but the first time out (being noobish and all) and with a new AK?

Juice5610
08-02-2010, 12:49 PM
Ok I've searched and I havent found out a direct answer to what the best sight in distance is with an ak and a aimpoint mounted on the ultimak rail, yes it makes a difference as the optic is waaay closer to the cenerline of the bore(as opposed to all the side mounts) leading me to believe the 25 yard zero recommended for the iron sights zero should work just as well for the aimpoint as its only 1/4-1/2 an inch above the bore. Anyone?

SJgunguy24
08-02-2010, 12:54 PM
Sure... but the first time out (being noobish and all) with an AK?


You really won't see the difference between a 556 and a 762X39 until you get out past 200 yards. Unless your hitting an armored target. Then it's very clear as to what will be more effective on a hard target.
The 556 is a people round and really wasn't designed to punch through anything.
The 7.62X39 is kind of "to whom it may concern" round. It will punch through most construction materials short of armor plate and reinforced concrete. If not with the first round within a few rounds, that do to it being so damn heavy when compared to the 556. Now to take a person out, the frag characteristics of the 556 is superior for that task. That is one reason why the Soviets went to the 545 round in the 70's. Not to mention a soldier can carry more of the lighter ammo.

SJgunguy24
08-02-2010, 12:58 PM
Ok I've searched and I havent found out a direct answer to what the best sight in distance is with an ak and a aimpoint mounted on the ultimak rail, yes it makes a difference as the optic is waaay closer to the cenerline of the bore(as opposed to all the side mounts) leading me to believe the 25 yard zero recommended for the iron sights zero should work just as well for the aimpoint as its only 1/4-1/2 an inch above the bore. Anyone?

I run HK sights, but if I were to run optics, this is the system I would use. The Ultimak could fry any optic you mount to it if your shooting a high volume. All the heat sits below the mount and your optic will become the heat sink, not good for the optic.

http://texasweaponsystems.com/
This keep it low, and centered on the gun. IMO the best option on the market for the money.

Juice5610
08-02-2010, 1:01 PM
I run HK sights, but if I were to run optics, this is the system I would use. The Ultimak will fry any optic you mount to it if your shooting a high volume. All the heat sits below the mount and your optic will become the heat sink, not good for the optic.

http://texasweaponsystems.com/
This keep it low, and centered on the gun. IMO the best option on the market for the money.

I beg to differ show me proof that the ultimak will fry an aimpoint micro T-1 (not the eotech the micro T1) There many guys instructing ak47 classes running class 3 fully automatic weapons that run the ultimak rail with a micro T1 perfectly fine. and they all swear by it.

Juice5610
08-02-2010, 1:10 PM
http://www.warriortalk.com/showthread.php?t=64572

I highly doubt that neither you or I put more rounds down range than Gabe Saurez Or James Yeager

SJgunguy24
08-02-2010, 1:13 PM
I beg to differ show me proof that the ultimak will fry an aimpoint micro T-1 (not the eotech the micro T1) There many guys instructing ak47 classes running class 3 fully automatic weapons that run the ultimak rail with a micro T1 perfectly fine. and they all swear by it.

Thats fine, they are entitled to their opinion but for me, I wouldn't run any optic on the gas tube of an AK.

Juice5610
08-02-2010, 1:28 PM
I run HK sights, but if I were to run optics, this is the system I would use. The Ultimak will fry any optic you mount to it if your shooting a high volume. All the heat sits below the mount and your optic will become the heat sink, not good for the optic.

http://texasweaponsystems.com/
This keep it low, and centered on the gun. IMO the best option on the market for the money.

Thats fine, they are entitled to their opinion but for me, I wouldn't run any optic on the gas tube of an AK.

I'm asking about your statement bolded above. Do you have proof to back that statement up? Is it an opinion or a fact? Or is it just a peace of mind thing for you. Wouldnt want to go around spreading FUD on calguns we have plenty of that going on already.

CSACANNONEER
08-02-2010, 1:37 PM
this its a speed game

What does speed have to do with anything?

Wait!!!! people actually zero in AK's????:p

Don't try to go back to the original topic.


P.S. I wonder if Harrison, Hathcock, Gilliland, ETC only used one or two rounds to zero their optics?

No. It should only take an experienced shooter ONE shot to go from an unknown zero to the X-ring. I just doubled it for a newer shooter or one like me who wants a little confirmation.

It's so easy that I even had a 14 year old do it. He started with a rifle that I had just broken 3 clay pigeons (@ 1000 yards) in a row with. The first thing I did was twist both windage and elevation knobs back and forth until he could not have possibly counted clicks. Then, I had him chamber a round, aim at a clay and fire. He got back into the rifle and saw the point of impact. Next, he re-aimed at his original POA. Then, without letting the rifle move at all (I have decent front and rear rests), he adjusted the crosshairs to his POI. Yep, one shot and he was zeroed at 1000 yards. Unfortunately, he missed his second attempt at the bird but, without further adjustment, he broke it on his third try. This works at any distance and, I'm sure all the top shooters that you can name know how to do this. Now, you should be able to do this too. It's so simple even ........... can do it.

BTW, it took me about 4 weekend matches over two years of learning, tweaking ammo and equipment before I was able to hit a clay pigeon at 1000 yards. I was both proud and pissed at him for doing it on his third shot ever at 1000 yards and he started with an unknown zero too!

Juice5610
08-02-2010, 1:39 PM
What does speed have to do with anything?



Don't try to go back to the original topic.




No. It should only take an experienced shooter ONE shot to go from an unknown zero to the X-ring. I just doubled it for a newer shooter or one like me who wants a little confirmation.

It's so easy that I even had a 14 year old do it. He started with a rifle that I had just broken 3 clay pigeons (@ 1000 yards) in a row with. The first thing I did was twist both windage and elevation knobs back and forth until he could not have possibly counted clicks. Then, I had him chamber a round, aim at a clay and fire. He got back into the rifle and saw the point of impact. Next, he re-aimed at his original POA. Then, without letting the rifle move at all (I have decent front and rear rests), he adjusted the crosshairs to his POI. Yep, one shot and he was zeroed at 1000 yards. Unfortunately, he missed his second attempt at the bird but, without further adjustment, he broke it on his third try. This works at any distance and, I'm sure all the top shooters that you can name know how to do this. Now, you should be able to do this too. It's so simple even ........... can do it.

BTW, it took me about 4 weekend matches over two years of learning, tweaking ammo and equipment before I was able to hit a clay pigeon at 1000 yards. I was both proud and pissed at him for doing it on his third shot ever at 1000 yards and he started with an unknown zero too!

Velocity

SJgunguy24
08-02-2010, 1:43 PM
I'm asking about your statement bolded above. Do you have proof to back that statement up? Is it an opinion or a fact? Or is it just a peace of mind thing for you. Wouldnt want to go around spreading FUD on calguns we have plenty of that going on already.

If it makes you feel better then I will amend my post to may, or could, or possibly, or might.

Gennerally I don't post FUD or hearsay. If the Ultimak good enough for Gabe Suarez then I won't question his experiance. Like I said though, I would never run any optic anywhere near a heat source like the gas tube of an AK. The T1 is only rated to 160F per Aimpoints own specs and I know that the gas tube and barrel get way hotter then 160f.

Juice5610
08-02-2010, 1:49 PM
If it makes you feel better then I will amend my post to may, or could, or possibly, or might.

Gennerally I don't post FUD or hearsay. If the Ultimak good enough for Gabe Suarez then I won't question his experiance. Like I said though, I would never run any optic anywhere near a heat source like the gas tube of an AK. The T1 is only rated to 160F per Aimpoints own specs and I know that the gas tube and barrel get way hotter then 160f.

I understand that brother but the problem isnt the optic the problem is the batteries in it. The eotech has the batts on the bottom where as the aimpoint has it ontop of the optic. The optic itself wont fail the batteries/battery contact points will long before the optic itself. But as the saying goes to each there own and I'm very glad you answered in the way yu did instead of cussing at me/calling me names which is the way 99% of the people on forums "settle" their conversations. Speaks volumes of your character.

H2O MAN
08-02-2010, 1:49 PM
The UltiMAK/Aimpoint Micro combo is hands down the very best option
available to AK owners that want to run a red dot and co-witness irons.

As previously mentioned, zero the red dot to the distance you will be shooting and rock on.




.

CSACANNONEER
08-02-2010, 2:01 PM
Velocity

What does "velocity" have to do with gravity. The force of bravity makes all objects accelerate at 32'/sec/sec. So, the velocity due to gravity is constantly changing but, it is the exact same for any object of any mass.

The premise that gravity acts differently on different objects is false and that is a fact.

Juice5610
08-02-2010, 2:07 PM
What does "velocity" have to do with gravity. The force of bravity makes all objects accelerate at 32'/sec/sec. So, the velocity due to gravity is constantly changing but, it is the exact same for any object of any mass.

The premise that gravity acts differently on different objects is false and that is a fact.

Velocity has to do with bullet drop. Your analysing this way too much and taking the thread off topic if you want to school me with the point your inevitably going to make then take it to pms

CSACANNONEER
08-02-2010, 2:52 PM
Velocity has to do with bullet drop. Your analysing this way too much and taking the thread off topic if you want to school me with the point your inevitably going to make then take it to pms

Yes, there are many factors that change bullet drop from one projectile to another. But, gravity is not one of them. Gravity is a constant which does not change with mass or anything else.

H2O MAN
08-02-2010, 3:00 PM
http://i895.photobucket.com/albums/ac160/The_H2O_MAN/T56SHTF-07-2010023.jpg

ZX-10R
08-02-2010, 3:05 PM
25yrds and then shoot whatever distance.

b00gym4n
08-02-2010, 3:23 PM
To Juice. It seems to me that you were right about the durability. However, today they posted on the forum link you provided with this

http://www.kalinkaoptics.com/pk-01v-aimpoint-to-ak-saiga-vepr-centered-side-mount-w-30-mm-heavy-duty-ring-tim-heffron-special-limited-edition-v-3-0.html

Version 3.0? Recreated to defeat any issues it had before? Any feedback on this? I mean if I have no choice I'll go with the ultimak, but I really would like to put a midwest industries hand rail on it and I dont think putting an optics on that would co-witness..

Thanks for the info guys..

Motz
08-02-2010, 3:24 PM
To the OP... You are right about this thread getting off topic. Stories off 1000 yard shots at clay pigeons can sometimes just be 100 yard shots with an extra zero... The best way, in my opinion, to sight in your new gun is this. First really think about at what range you are going to make the majority of your shots. If you are only looking for a SHTF zero, Where do you live? Open country or the concert jungle? Take things like that into consideration. Then decide on what ammo you plan on shooting. Get that shiny new gun and that ammo and head to the range! Set up your target at the distance you decided on earlier and zero that bad boy in!! A little piece of advise being to use some type of a target with MOA grids on it. Really helps narrow things down than some random dirt spot were you thought you hit between you and 1000 yrds. From there just move the target back and forth at varying distances so you know what your hold overs/unders will be. No two guns will shoot the exact the same and you want to know how YOUR gun shoots at these distances with the ammo you decided on. From there have fun and be safe with your new gun.

CSACANNONEER
08-02-2010, 3:45 PM
To the OP... You are right about this thread getting off topic. Stories off 1000 yard shots at clay pigeons can sometimes just be 100 yard shots with an extra zero...

Yep, often times people don't have any clue as to what 1000 yards even looks like. But, in my case, this was at a 1000 yard match. There are seceral other 1000 yard shooters who can varify that we normally use clays to sight in with. If you don't believe it, come to the next FCSA match and see for yourself.

BTW, here's a picture of my stepson at the same match:

http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p43/csacannoneer/FCSAHANDOUT_0001.jpg

Again, just sight your optics at the range you are planning on shooting. It only takes one shot to re-zero at any other distance.

Motz
08-02-2010, 3:58 PM
Hey day you can truly "ZERO" an SLG21 with a red dot at 1000yards in one shot I will kiss you bare @$$.

ar15barrels
08-02-2010, 4:08 PM
FAIL! Gravity has NOTHING to do with mass!
What does speed have to do with anything?
What does "velocity" have to do with gravity.

The effects of gravity are best measured against a time constant.
Heavier bullets generally move slower than lighter bullets fired from the same cartridge/gun.
Therefore the slower bullet spends more TIME getting to the target.
Since it spends more time airborne, it also drops more.

CSACANNONEER
08-02-2010, 4:20 PM
^^^ +1 I would imagine those two different bullets act a little different once they are out of the pipe. Even shooting a heavy heavy 77gr SMK (about the biggest bullet you can get to fit in an AR mag) you can double the weight of a bullet with a 7.62x39. That dammed gravity likes to pull heavy things down faster than lighter things. Trust me you should see my gut...

Yes Randall, you're right about that. but the post I originally responded to stated that: That dammed gravity likes to pull heavy things down faster than lighter things. Trust me you should see my gut... Since he clearly stated that heavier items get pulled down by gravity FASTER than lighter ones, his argument is flawed and contradictory to what you are saying.

Hey day you can truly "ZERO" an SLG21 with a red dot at 1000yards in one shot I will kiss you bare @$$.

Again, zero your optics at the range that you are planning on shooting at. Of course one can zero any optics at any distance but, if the rifle, optics and ammo are not capable of shooting that distance with any amount of precision, it is a waste of time. However, one can still "accurately" zero your choice of rifle and optics at 1000 yards. I'm sure you know the difference between accuracy and precission so, I won't bother to explain the difference to you.

Motz
08-02-2010, 4:58 PM
I think you ride a high high horse sir and maybe you should take your head out the clouds for a second and come back to earth. If you really take issue with a more tongue in cheek comment about my gut than a bullets flight path once it leaves a barrel, a sense of humor should be on the top of your list for your next Midway order. You should feel blessed that you and your step sun have such a natural gift as to be able to sight in a gun @ 1000yrds with one round. For us not so human shooters it sometimes takes a few more so generalized comments as too it only taking 2 are down right silly. But at this point I am going to roll up my pants and wade my way out of this BS, puffy chested I can zero in 2 shots thread and shrink back into my chair and let gravity take back over my mass. To the OP you have my sincerest apologizes for taking it this far. I hope you find an answer to zeroing your AK in the real world...

CSACANNONEER
08-02-2010, 5:07 PM
I think you ride a high high horse sir and maybe you should take your head out the clouds for a second and come back to earth. If you really take issue with a more tongue in cheek comment about my gut than a bullets flight path once it leaves a barrel, a sense of humor should be on the top of your list for your next Midway order. You should feel blessed that you and your step sun have such a natural gift as to be able to sight in a gun @ 1000yrds with one round. For us not so human shooters it sometimes takes a few more so generalized comments as too it only taking 2 are down right silly. But at this point I am going to roll up my pants and wade my way out of this BS, puffy chested I can zero in 2 shots thread and shrink back into my chair and let gravity take back over my mass. To the OP you have my sincerest apologizes for taking it this far. I hope you find an answer to zeroing your AK in the real world...

You're close enough to meet me at Angeles sometime and I will teach you how to zero with one shot. As far as the gut comment goes, I completely understand. As far as the humor part, I was going to post something about gravity and other human parts as well. But, I figured I'd either get banned or every female on this forum would hunt me down and kick my ask. Anyway, the OP is all the way in San Bernadino otherwise I would have invited him to meet me at Angeles (the offer is there though) but, since you are closer, I'm willing to teach you how to zero your optics at any distance with only one shot. Yes, I'm sincere about this and I don't have a problem with your questioning my 1000 yard shooting since, most people really have no clue. BTW, It's really more like 1030-1050 yards since, the clay pigeons are all the way back on the impact berms. I didn't want it to seem like I was exageratting though. So, when do you want to learn how to zero your optics?

sevensix2x51
08-02-2010, 5:25 PM
Yes, there are many factors that change bullet drop from one projectile to another. But, gravity is not one of them. Gravity is a constant which does not change with mass or anything else.

i think he meant velocity of the projectile. if a given projectile is traveling at a given velocity, and gravity is always 9.8m/s^2, a projectile with twice the velocity is only going to drop half as far as the original in a given distance, b/c and all other outside factors aside. i mean, right?

CSACANNONEER
08-02-2010, 5:32 PM
i think he meant velocity of the projectile. if a given projectile is traveling at a given velocity, and gravity is always 9.8m/s^2, a projectile with twice the velocity is only going to drop half as far as the original in a given distance, b/c and all other outside factors aside. i mean, right?

Yep, but he said a heavier projo will drop FASTER than a lighter one.

Juice5610
08-02-2010, 5:41 PM
Come on people really? I have the OP sending me PM's (which I dont mind at all more then happy to help) instead of posting in HIS thread because it has gone so off topic he doesnt even want to bother with it anymore. SAD.

Juice5610
08-02-2010, 5:43 PM
To Juice. It seems to me that you were right about the durability. However, today they posted on the forum link you provided with this

http://www.kalinkaoptics.com/pk-01v-aimpoint-to-ak-saiga-vepr-centered-side-mount-w-30-mm-heavy-duty-ring-tim-heffron-special-limited-edition-v-3-0.html

Version 3.0? Recreated to defeat any issues it had before? Any feedback on this? I mean if I have no choice I'll go with the ultimak, but I really would like to put a midwest industries hand rail on it and I dont think putting an optics on that would co-witness..

Thanks for the info guys..

I dont know anything about the new version as it just came out. If I were you I would wait to see what the people say about it. I already have my ultimak on order and will be sticking to it

SammyL
08-02-2010, 6:58 PM
Don't know if you got the mount for your aimpoint but you might want to look into these. I have one on mines and the sights are anchored down pretty well.

http://store.carolinashooterssupply.com/servlet/-strse-336/Saiga-rifle-AK47-Beryl/Detail