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  #1  
Old 04-19-2014, 5:57 PM
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Default AR-15----> pump conversion kit




This kit consists of 6 pieces that will connect to nearly any AR-15 rifle, and turn it into a manually operated pump rifle. There are no permanent modifications to the upper or barrel or bolt carrier group, so they're still functional as semi auto components once the kit is removed. it's about a 10 minute job to swap it in and out. Some heavy bull barrels will not work with the kit.

The kit is a universal fit- it will work on carbine, mid and rifle length systems. Production pieces are black anodized. The front picatinny sight base is an optional extra. The standard kit will not readily accept a Harris bipod.... there's a required modification for it.


(this whole thing was a venture with Bentwood gunsmithing initially (now defunct), So now I'm on my own with it. PM for details.)

Last edited by CRTguns; 03-07-2016 at 10:11 AM..
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Old 04-19-2014, 6:48 PM
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The pump is mechanically connected to the bolt carrier... so you apply force in both directions. We recommend leaving the buffer and spring onboard. This helps with positive battery, and does not measurably slow down operation. The large pump handle gives a lot more force and control over a 2-finger charge handle.

The pump is 3/8 inch thick plastic, so strong enough for mounting an fpg.

If you have to ask "why would I need to make my AR a pump?"... the suits in Sacramento will tell you why soon enough.

And you can toss the bullet button.

And compete in Manual division in 3-gun.

And shoot ammo that wont cycle a semi-auto.

And totally irrelevant on CALGUNS, but when used with a suppressor, you'll improve sound reduction by 2-3 DB when compared to a conventional semi auto... no secondary back pressure from the breech and no gas vent to atmosphere.

Last edited by CRTguns; 05-25-2014 at 1:46 PM..
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  #3  
Old 04-19-2014, 8:05 PM
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I've been wanting a pistol length pump conversion for a long time...

My plan was to run a .50 beowulf barrel with an OA93 bolt carrier and leave the buffer tube plugged.

Then file my AOW/DD paperwork (federally 50 beowulf is a grey area DD, but by CA law its a-ok since DD's start at .6 inch)

Then mount a forward pistol grip and a "Big 90" snail drum and have a ca legal compact ar aow/dd pistol in .50 beowulf that holds 35 or so rounds.

I was planning on using one of the DPMS pump action ar15 uppers as a base... but this might be a cheaper option if I can just buy a few of the spare parts to roll my own.
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Old 04-19-2014, 8:11 PM
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Old 05-01-2014, 10:21 PM
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Old 05-02-2014, 8:11 AM
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interesting, tagged to see future reviews
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Old 05-22-2014, 4:31 PM
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This is what you get with the basic kit.

Last edited by CRTguns; 03-07-2016 at 10:11 AM..
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Old 05-22-2014, 4:42 PM
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Old 05-22-2014, 4:43 PM
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Old 05-22-2014, 4:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AJAX22 View Post
I've been wanting a pistol length pump conversion for a long time...

My plan was to run a .50 beowulf barrel with an OA93 bolt carrier and leave the buffer tube plugged.

Then file my AOW/DD paperwork (federally 50 beowulf is a grey area DD, but by CA law its a-ok since DD's start at .6 inch)
why would .50 Beau be grey area DD? it is .500 bullet diameter so I assume that the grooves are at .500". its parent case is the .50AE and it isn't DD in a handgun (originally the .50AE was designed around .510" bullets like .50BMG but they specifically redesigned it to be .500" to avoid DD issues).
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  #11  
Old 05-22-2014, 5:03 PM
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Neat!
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Old 05-22-2014, 5:28 PM
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Old 05-22-2014, 6:27 PM
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Not sure how to embed video... here's a link to a vid.

http://s213.photobucket.com/user/crt...b6bff.mp4.html
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Old 05-22-2014, 6:32 PM
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Old 05-23-2014, 9:53 AM
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really cool, i just dont understand what its used for though. is it just to have 100% reliable cycle? or as close to it as possible? or used for rounds that dont cycle ar's? or so you can get rid of the buffer tube? when you fire a round doesnt the bolt want to open and fly back, i guess just holding the pump would stop it from coming backward. what do you guys use these for?
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Old 05-23-2014, 10:18 AM
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Would this work with a 12" pistol upper?
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Old 05-23-2014, 11:02 AM
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Not talking smack or trying to be a douche.... BUT,

Why the **** would anyone want to use these? Can anyone give me some good examples of use besides the "because I can". Thanks.
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Old 05-23-2014, 11:14 AM
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Pump action weapons aren't subject to the same level of stupidity as semi automatic weapons.

I agree Id rather have a semi-auto in a firefight, BUT this gives you the option to not have to go featureless if you like your pistol grip, and not have to do a bullet button.

Im probably not going to buy one, but I am generally curious and I still want to know if this will work on a 12" pistol barrel.
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Old 05-23-2014, 11:15 AM
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Makes the rifle pump-action and not a semi-automatic autoloader.
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Old 05-23-2014, 11:20 AM
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No semi auto, so, no BB. Are pump action, center fire rifles an AW? Can they be made into one? Is there even a classification for them? Any mag retrictions, assuming the owner had the +10 mags prior to the ban?
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Old 05-23-2014, 1:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by geoint View Post
Pump action weapons aren't subject to the same level of stupidity as semi automatic weapons.

I agree Id rather have a semi-auto in a firefight, BUT this gives you the option to not have to go featureless if you like your pistol grip, and not have to do a bullet button.

Im probably not going to buy one, but I am generally curious and I still want to know if this will work on a 12" pistol barrel.
I agree, but doesn't that defeat the purpose of what an AR is? I know the bullet button does also, as well as the 10 round limit, but it I wanted a pump I'd use a shotgun.
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Old 05-23-2014, 1:55 PM
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really cool, i just dont understand what its used for though. is it just to have 100% reliable cycle? or as close to it as possible? or used for rounds that dont cycle ar's? or so you can get rid of the buffer tube? when you fire a round doesnt the bolt want to open and fly back, i guess just holding the pump would stop it from coming backward. what do you guys use these for?
If you pull the trigger before the bolt closes, you get a misfire.
Rapid firing would take practice. Ideally the trigger would not reset until the bolt is completely closed. Without any modifications to the trigger group, the hammer can fall at any time out of battery when you are manually manipulating the bolt.
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Old 05-23-2014, 3:54 PM
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Not trying to be an a-hole, but Why would I do this instead of getting a side-charge upper and block the gas tube?
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  #24  
Old 05-23-2014, 3:58 PM
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I can dig the idea, ingenuity and execution. Well done. I love to see truly new ideas like this. It is not for me, but I can appreciate what you have done. Very cool.
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Old 05-23-2014, 4:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by autoduel View Post
If you pull the trigger before the bolt closes, you get a misfire.
Rapid firing would take practice. Ideally the trigger would not reset until the bolt is completely closed. Without any modifications to the trigger group, the hammer can fall at any time out of battery when you are manually manipulating the bolt.
Any gun will fail to fire if you pull the trigger before the action is closed. Yeah... you can't be spastic with your trigger finger. Nor should you be. I challenge you to have a good clean sight picture while your running the action... you don't pull the trigger till your lined up on your target... and I don't know many people who can hold a sight pic until the rifle becomes still, after the bolt is home. And keep in mind, this upper will close to battery on its own if you just let go of the pump.

If you're riding a bike and push down on both pedals at the same time you don't go anywhere... the point is, and it comes very naturally to most shooters, is muscle control and hand-eye coordination.

We would not be wasting our time nor your if the gun was prone to misfires or failures.

If it's not for you, it's not for you. But many many people have tried it and competed with it and hunted with it and it's very satisfactory.

Video:
http://s213.photobucket.com/user/crt...b6bff.mp4.html

To create a fire control that would maintain an interlock with the bolt would also be expensive and no longer a quick drop in conversion.

Last edited by CRTguns; 05-23-2014 at 8:06 PM..
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Old 05-23-2014, 5:02 PM
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The whole idea is to remove the bullet button so you can shoot faster?

... disable semi auto fire, so you can shoot faster?

I can see the anti gun lobby approving of this, or maybe even promoting it. I dont see this being a legal issue at all.
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Old 05-23-2014, 5:12 PM
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Fascinating!
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Old 05-23-2014, 5:18 PM
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Pump V2

Put a smaller tube on the barrel nut that just slips inside the pump tube. Have it long enough to cover the silver pump rod and the hole. One tube slides inside other and looks much nicer while protecting the rod from damage.
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Old 05-23-2014, 5:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gutz View Post
Not talking smack or trying to be a douche.... BUT,

Why the **** would anyone want to use these? Can anyone give me some good examples of use besides the "because I can". Thanks.
^^^ That
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Old 05-23-2014, 6:37 PM
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interesting - but pricey for what it is and what it accomplishes.

Great timing "For the Dad that has everything"...
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Old 05-23-2014, 7:26 PM
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Originally Posted by TomReloaded View Post
The whole idea is to remove the bullet button so you can shoot faster?

... disable semi auto fire, so you can shoot faster?

I can see the anti gun lobby approving of this, or maybe even promoting it. I dont see this being a legal issue at all.
No. Not intended to shoot faster.

The idea(s) are:

1. Create a viable and competitive rifle for manual division 3-gun
2. Eliminate the criteria for semi-auto function when developing hand loads for, a. hunting or b. suppressed applications, or, c. subsonic or reduced power loads
3. Create an option to keep your rifle when semi-automatics are banned or restricted further.
4. It is much faster than a side charge in that your hands never leave their positions on the rifle.
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Old 05-23-2014, 7:32 PM
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interesting - but pricey for what it is and what it accomplishes.

Great timing "For the Dad that has everything"...
forearms, from basic to new keymods cost up to $400, and for most people, all they do is give you a place to put your hand and hang a backup sight that you'll probably never use.

This lets you keep your rifle when the next governor of CA kills semiautos. And it still does what most forearms do.
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Old 05-23-2014, 7:35 PM
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"3. Create an option to keep your rifle when semi-automatics are banned or restricted further." <<, But why would I want to help some Marxist lawyer have an argument to put in his brief that there now exists a rational basis to ban self defense weapons in "common use"?
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Old 05-23-2014, 7:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gutz View Post
Not talking smack or trying to be a douche.... BUT,

Why the **** would anyone want to use these? Can anyone give me some good examples of use besides the "because I can". Thanks.
I'll try...

-Competition rules (manual division is slim due to lack of good rifle choice)
-hunting laws (there are still a few states that don't allow semis for taking game)
-upcoming assault weapon laws in at least 4 states very soon, and be sure there's more to follow.
-subsonic ammunition that wont cycle a regular semi
-suppressed applications... consider the Noveske Switchblock... the idea is to keep the gun as silent as possible by stopping automatic ejection that makes noise 2 ways, shell casing bouncing around, and the pressure wave that escapes the breach.
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Old 05-23-2014, 7:43 PM
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Old 05-23-2014, 7:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Ehline View Post
"3. Create an option to keep your rifle when semi-automatics are banned or restricted further." <<, But why would I want to help some Marxist lawyer have an argument to put in his brief that there now exists a rational basis to ban self defense weapons in "common use"?
Are you saying that they wont come for your guns if we only have semi-autos? I don't follow your reasoning. There have been pump rifles in existence since 1884. Semis have been around 1885. There have been anti-gun people since... oh I don't know... 1200 AD?

what are you getting at?
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Old 05-23-2014, 7:51 PM
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really cool, i just dont understand what its used for though. is it just to have 100% reliable cycle? or as close to it as possible? or used for rounds that dont cycle ar's? or so you can get rid of the buffer tube? when you fire a round doesnt the bolt want to open and fly back, i guess just holding the pump would stop it from coming backward. what do you guys use these for?
The bolt is locked into the breach during firing. In normal semi function, the gas that bleeds from the barrel makes its way into the carrier in order to force the bolt forward out of the carrier. As it does so, the bolt cams out of engagement and unlocks from the barrel. The forward momentum of the bolt acts to propel the carrier rearward. The bolt cannot move unless the carrier moves first. The carrier is normally moved by gas, with this installed, the carrier is moved by your hand.
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Old 05-23-2014, 7:53 PM
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Originally Posted by geoint View Post
Would this work with a 12" pistol upper?
A short version is coming. Cant say when.
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Old 05-23-2014, 7:55 PM
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Originally Posted by e90bmw View Post
Not trying to be an a-hole, but Why would I do this instead of getting a side-charge upper and block the gas tube?
This is much faster. side charger requires you to move one of your hands from its firing position every time you reload. Your hands never leave firing position.
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Old 05-23-2014, 8:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CRTguns View Post
forearms, from basic to new keymods cost up to $400, and for most people, all they do is give you a place to put your hand and hang a backup sight that you'll probably never use.

This lets you keep your rifle when the next governor of CA kills semiautos. And it still does what most forearms do.
how much does it weigh?
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