Calguns.net  

Home My iTrader Join the NRA Donate to CGSSA Sponsors CGN Google Search
CA Semiauto Ban(AW)ID Flowchart CA Handgun Ban ID Flowchart CA Shotgun Ban ID Flowchart
Go Back   Calguns.net > INTERESTS AND ACTIVITIES > Gunsmithing & How To
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Mark Forums Read

Gunsmithing & How To Pro, Amateur & WECSOG and Tutorials, Guides & OLL Build Instructions

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 12-12-2013, 7:55 AM
stphnman20's Avatar
stphnman20 stphnman20 is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: SCV
Posts: 6,602
iTrader: 26 / 100%
Default Rudius/1911 Rail and barrel seat cut *update*

This tutorial is for those who do not have access to a mill to get the rails cut on their Rudius/1911 frame.

*Update* Barrel seat cut post #32

Completed minus night sights.



Ever since the whole “The era of 80% party is over,” I knew I was SOL on getting my Rudius frame done. I do not have any 1911 (gunsmith) experience so I did not know where to start. At first, I was going to just buy a file and start filing away, using the jig as a guide. After a few hours of filing, I barely scratched the surface. I also checked the file marks and they were way out of spec. So that is another reason to stop. After doing some research, I stumbled on this Dremel table. Then it hit me, I can use this along with a cutting disk to cut the rails. So I bought one.

Total time: 9.5hrs

Tools needed:
Dremel tool
Dremel Router Table - http://www.dremel.com/en-us/Attachme...l.aspx?pid=231
Cutting disk
File (The thickness of the file must be less than .119 http://www.mcmaster.com/#hand-files/=przvjc)
Lapping compound
Caliper
Gloves

The first thing I did was to make guidelines. I did this by using the bottom part of the caliper to get the correct measurement. 0.100 for the top line and 0.219 for the bottom.


REMEMBER, WHEN YOU START CUTTING, YOU WANT TO CUT INSIDE THE LINES!!!
ALSO, DOUBLE CHECK ALL THE SCREWS ON THE TABLE. MAKE SURE THEY ARE ALL TIGHT!


MOST IMPORANTLY, MEASURE MEASURE MEASURE MEASURE MEASURE!!!

The Dremel tool attached to the table can move vertically. There is no way to checking the height so I just eyeballed it. Making sure the cutting disk is well above the line.



Here is a picture of the cut I made. Notice, I did not go deep.


The cut is still within spec.



Since the measurement is within spec, we can go deeper.

Last edited by stphnman20; 12-20-2013 at 9:31 AM..
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 12-12-2013, 7:55 AM
stphnman20's Avatar
stphnman20 stphnman20 is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: SCV
Posts: 6,602
iTrader: 26 / 100%
Default

In this pic, you can see that I put 2 cutting disk together. All this is doing is removing materials in between the lines.




Once you have removed the materials and checked the measurements, start filing. File till you get to the correct measurements. (depths should be 0.0615)


Once you have the correct measurements, it’s time to start lapping.


After almost 8 hours of lapping…



All done!



It is smoooooooooth as butter!!

As you can see, I still don't have my GRIPS!!!!!!


References:
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Screen Shot 2013-05-19 at 1.48.18 PM.jpg (19.9 KB, 230 views)
File Type: jpg Screen Shot 2013-11-25 at 12.50.01 PM.jpg (12.0 KB, 195 views)
Attached Files
File Type: pdf 1911A1_blueprint.pdf (225.6 KB, 252 views)
File Type: pdf 1911_RAIL_PRINT.pdf (28.4 KB, 243 views)
File Type: pdf Ares-Armor-1911-Rudius Jig-Assembly.pdf (274.3 KB, 193 views)

Last edited by stphnman20; 12-12-2013 at 11:09 AM..
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 12-12-2013, 8:16 AM
RamonSJC's Avatar
RamonSJC RamonSJC is offline
CGN/CGSSA Contributor
CGN Contributor
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Monterey County
Posts: 1,402
iTrader: 22 / 100%
Default

Very nice!
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 12-12-2013, 9:06 AM
Beegeezy Beegeezy is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 393
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Verry naass. Ingenuity!
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 12-12-2013, 9:18 AM
ojisan's Avatar
ojisan ojisan is offline
Agent 86
CGN Contributor
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: SFV
Posts: 9,239
iTrader: 41 / 100%
Default

How did you compensate for the cut-off wheels wearing away?
Frequently replacing with new ones?
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lonestargrizzly View Post
Is the lapdance from a donkey? Cuz that's worth it.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 12-12-2013, 9:41 AM
stphnman20's Avatar
stphnman20 stphnman20 is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: SCV
Posts: 6,602
iTrader: 26 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ojisan View Post
How did you compensate for the cut-off wheels wearing away?
Frequently replacing with new ones?
Surprisingly, the disk didn't have that much wear on it.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 12-12-2013, 9:49 AM
Escobar Escobar is offline
Banned
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 559
iTrader: 6 / 100%
Default

How did you get the trigger hole done, and what about the barrel seat?
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 12-12-2013, 10:17 AM
stphnman20's Avatar
stphnman20 stphnman20 is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: SCV
Posts: 6,602
iTrader: 26 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Escobar View Post
How did you get the trigger hole done, and what about the barrel seat?
I have not yet cut the barrel seat. Waiting for the barrel to come in so that I can fit it. Cutting it with a file and Dremel.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 12-12-2013, 10:33 AM
Icypu's Avatar
Icypu Icypu is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: S Pasadena / other state
Posts: 1,177
iTrader: 46 / 100%
Default

Where did you get that slide? Also I used the same lapping compound (valve grinding grease) I got from O'reilly.
__________________
Live a good life
WTS: Gold 1894 Trapper &AAC Blackout Model 7
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 12-12-2013, 10:33 AM
emptybottle151's Avatar
emptybottle151 emptybottle151 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: San Diego South Bay Area
Posts: 1,423
iTrader: 4 / 100%
Default

__________________
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 12-12-2013, 10:36 AM
Beegeezy Beegeezy is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 393
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Looks like the rudii on my table, except my rails are beveled at the end. I'm jealous you have more parts than I do! Haha
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 12-12-2013, 10:52 AM
Mutenri Mutenri is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 604
iTrader: 18 / 100%
Default

Tagged. What's the depth of the slide rail? Also, really interested in seeing you do this for the barrel seat.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 12-12-2013, 10:54 AM
stphnman20's Avatar
stphnman20 stphnman20 is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: SCV
Posts: 6,602
iTrader: 26 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Icypu View Post
Where did you get that slide? Also I used the same lapping compound (valve grinding grease) I got from O'reilly.
I got the slide from sarco. Be advised thou, these para ordance slides do not use standard mil-spec extractors. They use their own PXT extractors.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 12-12-2013, 10:57 AM
stphnman20's Avatar
stphnman20 stphnman20 is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: SCV
Posts: 6,602
iTrader: 26 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mutenri View Post
Tagged. What's the depth of the slide rail? Also, really interested in seeing you do this for the barrel seat.
Depth should be 0.615 on each side.

Once I get my barrel, i'll add what I did on this thread.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 12-12-2013, 11:57 AM
wingnut232's Avatar
wingnut232 wingnut232 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: In the center.....
Posts: 622
iTrader: 1 / 100%
Default

Sweeeeet!
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 12-12-2013, 12:02 PM
FireArms101's Avatar
FireArms101 FireArms101 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Orange County, CA
Posts: 251
iTrader: 6 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by stphnman20 View Post
This tutorial is for those who do not have access to a mill to get the rails cut on their Rudius/1911 frame.
...

Great job! This will be my next build. Thanks for the great pictures.
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 12-12-2013, 2:59 PM
SoCal Gunner's Avatar
SoCal Gunner SoCal Gunner is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Riverside County
Posts: 1,477
iTrader: 10 / 100%
Default

Outstanding!
__________________
.

.

California Reloading Club - IE Section
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 12-12-2013, 4:42 PM
daves100 daves100 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 938
iTrader: 7 / 100%
Default 1911

Very nice
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 12-12-2013, 4:47 PM
ar15barrels's Avatar
ar15barrels ar15barrels is offline
I need a LIFE!!
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Van Nuys
Posts: 38,285
iTrader: 88 / 100%
Default

Wow, that would have been much easier for you to do on my milling machine...
__________________
Randall Rausch

AR work: www.ar15barrels.com
Bolt actions: www.700barrels.com
Foreign Semi Autos: www.akbarrels.com
Glock, XD and M&P pistols, Benelli and Remington shotguns: barrel, sight, trigger and receiver work.
Most work performed while-you-wait, evening and weekend appointments available.
Founding member of the CAPRC
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 12-13-2013, 6:09 AM
stphnman20's Avatar
stphnman20 stphnman20 is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: SCV
Posts: 6,602
iTrader: 26 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ar15barrels View Post
Wow, that would have been much easier for you to do on my milling machine...
Hmmm, I still need my barrel seat cut.
Reply With Quote
  #21  
Old 12-13-2013, 8:39 AM
Beegeezy Beegeezy is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 393
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

I have those same calipers! And dremel...and flashlight...hey wait a minute!
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 12-14-2013, 1:13 PM
wingnut232's Avatar
wingnut232 wingnut232 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: In the center.....
Posts: 622
iTrader: 1 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by stphnman20 View Post
Hmmm, I still need my barrel seat cut.
Does the jig have provisions for the barrel seat cut?
That was one of my concerns with it and Ares never answered me so I passed on the jig. Though, now with the current climate on 80% completion I'm afraid I'll need to get a jig and use my router with a micro mill bit to do the rails.
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 12-14-2013, 5:21 PM
stphnman20's Avatar
stphnman20 stphnman20 is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: SCV
Posts: 6,602
iTrader: 26 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by wingnut232 View Post
Does the jig have provisions for the barrel seat cut?
That was one of my concerns with it and Ares never answered me so I passed on the jig. Though, now with the current climate on 80% completion I'm afraid I'll need to get a jig and use my router with a micro mill bit to do the rails.
No it doesn't.
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 12-14-2013, 5:29 PM
Mutenri Mutenri is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 604
iTrader: 18 / 100%
Default

Huh, just thought of something interesting. If you've cut the slide and nothing else on the Rudius, isn't it now a firearm by legal reckoning? In that case, couldn't you take the non-functional (but still legally a firearm) frame for some "gunsmithing work" by a professional with a mill?

By that train of logic, could you not drill just one hole, say the sear pin or hammer pin hole, to make a gun and take it for some gunsmithing work? Or perhaps just even making a small machine mark where the slide or hole would be.
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 12-14-2013, 8:06 PM
ar15barrels's Avatar
ar15barrels ar15barrels is offline
I need a LIFE!!
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Van Nuys
Posts: 38,285
iTrader: 88 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mutenri View Post
Huh, just thought of something interesting. If you've cut the slide and nothing else on the Rudius, isn't it now a firearm by legal reckoning? In that case, couldn't you take the non-functional (but still legally a firearm) frame for some "gunsmithing work" by a professional with a mill?

By that train of logic, could you not drill just one hole, say the sear pin or hammer pin hole, to make a gun and take it for some gunsmithing work? Or perhaps just even making a small machine mark where the slide or hole would be.

Yes.
"Manufacture" the firearm yourself.
Then have a machine shop fix any other dimensional issues the gun may have.
__________________
Randall Rausch

AR work: www.ar15barrels.com
Bolt actions: www.700barrels.com
Foreign Semi Autos: www.akbarrels.com
Glock, XD and M&P pistols, Benelli and Remington shotguns: barrel, sight, trigger and receiver work.
Most work performed while-you-wait, evening and weekend appointments available.
Founding member of the CAPRC
Reply With Quote
  #26  
Old 12-14-2013, 9:39 PM
Grumpyoldretiredcop's Avatar
Grumpyoldretiredcop Grumpyoldretiredcop is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Escape tunnel successful!
Posts: 5,752
iTrader: 117 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by stphnman20 View Post
I got the slide from sarco. Be advised thou, these para ordance slides do not use standard mil-spec extractors. They use their own PXT extractors.
EGW used to offer a sleeve that will let you use standard extractors. I fitted one to a Para Carry .45; I can't find it on their site now. Probably because Para also offers an oversized extractor to eliminate the PXT extractor (oddly enough, made by EGW).

That is an innovative way to get your Rudius rails cut - well done!
__________________
I'm retired. That's right, retired. I don't want to hear about the cop who stopped you today or how you didn't think you should get a ticket. That just makes me grumpy!
Reply With Quote
  #27  
Old 12-14-2013, 10:02 PM
Mutenri Mutenri is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 604
iTrader: 18 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ar15barrels View Post
Yes.
"Manufacture" the firearm yourself.
Then have a machine shop fix any other dimensional issues the gun may have.
Hmmm...interesting. What if the dimensional issues are, uh, significant?
Reply With Quote
  #28  
Old 12-14-2013, 10:15 PM
johnor johnor is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 21
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Good job, thank you for posting, please keep posting the rest of your build.
Reply With Quote
  #29  
Old 12-15-2013, 6:21 AM
stphnman20's Avatar
stphnman20 stphnman20 is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: SCV
Posts: 6,602
iTrader: 26 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Grumpyoldretiredcop View Post
EGW used to offer a sleeve that will let you use standard extractors. I fitted one to a Para Carry .45; I can't find it on their site now. Probably because Para also offers an oversized extractor to eliminate the PXT extractor (oddly enough, made by EGW).

That is an innovative way to get your Rudius rails cut - well done!
Yea I heard about that sleeve. Found it on Brownells. http://www.brownells.com/handgun-par...prod41021.aspx

How is your extractor holding up with the sleeve in place?
Reply With Quote
  #30  
Old 12-15-2013, 11:54 AM
Grumpyoldretiredcop's Avatar
Grumpyoldretiredcop Grumpyoldretiredcop is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Escape tunnel successful!
Posts: 5,752
iTrader: 117 / 100%
Default

I have since sold the pistol, it fired a couple of hundred rounds while still in my hands, no extractor movement or need to retension. All the sleeve does is reduce the size of the extractor tunnel to standard Series 70 dimensions. I recommend it heartily as I've had nothing but trouble with PXT extractors and nothing but proper function with the sleeve and a standard extractor.
__________________
I'm retired. That's right, retired. I don't want to hear about the cop who stopped you today or how you didn't think you should get a ticket. That just makes me grumpy!
Reply With Quote
  #31  
Old 12-15-2013, 12:54 PM
stphnman20's Avatar
stphnman20 stphnman20 is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: SCV
Posts: 6,602
iTrader: 26 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Grumpyoldretiredcop View Post
I have since sold the pistol, it fired a couple of hundred rounds while still in my hands, no extractor movement or need to retension. All the sleeve does is reduce the size of the extractor tunnel to standard Series 70 dimensions. I recommend it heartily as I've had nothing but trouble with PXT extractors and nothing but proper function with the sleeve and a standard extractor.
Thanks for the input. I'm bidding on the EGW on ebay right now. If I don't win, i'll go the sleeve route.
Reply With Quote
  #32  
Old 12-16-2013, 7:52 PM
stphnman20's Avatar
stphnman20 stphnman20 is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: SCV
Posts: 6,602
iTrader: 26 / 100%
Default Barrel Seat

This is easier than I thought. The only tool I used was a half round file.

Total time: 1.5hrs

At first I thought I could do it with a Dremel grinding stone and/or sanding band.
Both was cutting too much material too fast.


So I just used a half round file. Much better.



Progress




Test Fit


After a few more passes, it's done..




FYI, The file I used was tapered. So I only used the top portion to cut the seat.

Last edited by stphnman20; 12-17-2013 at 8:20 AM..
Reply With Quote
  #33  
Old 12-16-2013, 8:51 PM
Mutenri Mutenri is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 604
iTrader: 18 / 100%
Default

Could you show us what the file looks like, or what model/brand it is so we know what to buy?
Reply With Quote
  #34  
Old 12-16-2013, 9:09 PM
stphnman20's Avatar
stphnman20 stphnman20 is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: SCV
Posts: 6,602
iTrader: 26 / 100%
Default

Bought it at Harbor Freight.
Reply With Quote
  #35  
Old 12-16-2013, 9:35 PM
762shooter 762shooter is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 279
iTrader: 15 / 100%
Default

Excellent work stphnman20!

BTW, that is a half round file.
Reply With Quote
  #36  
Old 12-17-2013, 7:44 AM
stphnman20's Avatar
stphnman20 stphnman20 is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: SCV
Posts: 6,602
iTrader: 26 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by 762shooter View Post
Excellent work stphnman20!

BTW, that is a half round file.
Same difference.
Reply With Quote
  #37  
Old 12-17-2013, 12:02 PM
sactoman sactoman is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Carson city (formerly Sacramento)
Posts: 329
iTrader: 12 / 100%
Default

Good job. I'm sure this will give hope to a lot of Rudius owners.
Reply With Quote
  #38  
Old 12-17-2013, 12:50 PM
coma13's Avatar
coma13 coma13 is offline
‹bermensch
CGN Contributor - Lifetime
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: A farm somewhere.
Posts: 2,073
iTrader: 51 / 100%
Default

Where there is a will, there is a way. Nicely done.
__________________

As in a ruin where violets grow
In moss covered fields
On cold marble stone
Love sometimes steals into a heart...
Reply With Quote
  #39  
Old 12-17-2013, 8:28 PM
Beegeezy Beegeezy is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 393
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by 762shooter View Post
Excellent work stphnman20!

BTW, that is a half round file.
Half round bastard file?
Reply With Quote
  #40  
Old 12-17-2013, 8:38 PM
chozenfew805's Avatar
chozenfew805 chozenfew805 is offline
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Ventura County
Posts: 4,991
iTrader: 51 / 100%
Default

Keep it up OP! Looks sweet
__________________
....I will support and defend The Constitution of The United States of America...

WTS: IMR4064, H335, H322, H4198
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



All times are GMT -8. The time now is 1:48 AM.




Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2016, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Proudly hosted by GeoVario the Premier 2A host.
Calguns.net, the 'Calguns' name and all associated variants and logos are ® Trademark and © Copyright 2002-2016, Calguns.net an Incorporated Company All Rights Reserved.