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California 2nd Amend. Political Discussion & Activism Discuss gun rights activism and 2A related political topics here. All advice given is NOT legal counsel.

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  #41  
Old 09-04-2013, 11:22 AM
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Originally Posted by Nate74 View Post
I've heard it said that when it's time to bury them, it's time to use them.

But it does make me wonder. FD responds to a elderly grandmother having chest pains, grandpa hasn't fired his M1 Carbine for 40 years but still has a 20 round magazine in the closet which the local PD sees. Boom, 89 year old WWII vet arrested for the first time in his life? Would that be enough to enrage the populous?
nope, not in ca...
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  #42  
Old 09-04-2013, 11:34 AM
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Originally Posted by Nate74 View Post
I've heard it said that when it's time to bury them, it's time to use them.

But it does make me wonder. FD responds to a elderly grandmother having chest pains, grandpa hasn't fired his M1 Carbine for 40 years but still has a 20 round magazine in the closet which the local PD sees. Boom, 89 year old WWII vet arrested for the first time in his life? Would that be enough to enrage the populous?
No....

The police would spin it saying he brandished a military assault weapon in their presence, seize the gun, than after trial the gun will disappear into one of the chiefs buddies collections.

There are no gun rights any longer in California. Public acceptance of propaganda stressing guns are bad delete your rights and makes illegal acts permissible. Its all downhill from here.

Sandy hook was the opening they all were waiting for. I bet Biden masturbated while reading the headlines the day after.

The history is all there, just read the rise and fall of the third reich. Now we just need our nationalistic charming furher to take us to the promised land
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  #43  
Old 09-04-2013, 11:37 AM
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Originally Posted by Nate74 View Post
I've heard it said that when it's time to bury them, it's time to use them.

But it does make me wonder. FD responds to a elderly grandmother having chest pains, grandpa hasn't fired his M1 Carbine for 40 years but still has a 20 round magazine in the closet which the local PD sees. Boom, 89 year old WWII vet arrested for the first time in his life? Would that be enough to enrage the populous?
Yes, the majority of the uninformed masses would be outraged that he owned a military weapon at all. They'd consider him a criminal that just took a long time to get caught.

Sounds like I'm exaggerating but the scary part about the whole thing is that I'm not. Get into prolonged discussions (arguments) with rabid antis (the type who are passionate yet uninformed gaslighters) and you'll see what I mean.
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  #44  
Old 09-04-2013, 11:41 AM
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Unfortunately - There will need to be a martyr.

A Patriot who will stand and fight against being disarmed -

And will tragically pay the ultimate sacrifice.

THEN the revenge against these agendas will happen........
I agree...
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  #45  
Old 09-04-2013, 11:50 AM
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Originally Posted by Nate74 View Post
FD responds to a elderly grandmother having chest pains, grandpa hasn't fired his M1 Carbine for 40 years but still has a 20 round magazine in the closet which the local PD sees. Boom, 89 year old WWII vet arrested for the first time in his life? Would that be enough to enrage the populous?
He will be branded as a racist old white guy that intended to go on a shooting spree in a gay nightclub in order to do god's work before his passing. With 10 extra rounds in that military machine gun - he could have left the gay night club and had enough rounds in his "CLIP" left to wipe out a Hispanic neighborhood. The firefighters who turned him over to the brown-coats will be hailed as heroes for taking this monster off the street. Other emergency response personnel will want awards and promotions for doing the same.
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  #46  
Old 09-04-2013, 11:57 AM
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Originally Posted by DannyInSoCal View Post
Unfortunately - There will need to be a martyr.

A Patriot who will stand and fight against being disarmed -

And will tragically pay the ultimate sacrifice.

THEN the revenge against these agendas will happen........
Not quite, this is Commiefornia.

He will be labeled as a terrorist. The sheeple in this state will DEMAND that all guns be confiscated due to this incident.

And....the patriot.... martyr....will be labeled on Calguns as a complete idiot and moron for making a stand. The majority on Calguns will state how he should have just given up his rights and donated to CGF or called politician's offices to complain instead.
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  #47  
Old 09-04-2013, 11:58 AM
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He will be branded as a racist old white guy that intended to go on a shooting spree in a gay nightclub in order to do god's work before his passing. With 10 extra rounds in that military machine gun - he could have left the gay night club and had enough rounds in his "CLIP" left to wipe out a Hispanic neighborhood. The firefighters who turned him over to the brown-coats will be hailed as heroes for taking this monster off the street. Other emergency response personnel will want awards and promotions for doing the same.
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  #48  
Old 09-04-2013, 12:00 PM
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The firefighters who turned him over to the brown-coats will be hailed as heroes for taking this monster off the street.
Just to jump in -- the brown-coats were the rebels. They'd be on our side of the 2A war. (assuming you're making a firefly reference)
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  #49  
Old 09-04-2013, 12:02 PM
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Just to jump in -- the brown-coats were the rebels. They'd be on our side of the 2A war. (assuming you're making a firefly reference)
He might have meant "Brown Shirts." Maybe...
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  #50  
Old 09-04-2013, 12:17 PM
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Just to jump in -- the brown-coats were the rebels. They'd be on our side of the 2A war. (assuming you're making a firefly reference)
Should have read "brown Shirts"
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  #51  
Old 09-04-2013, 12:44 PM
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While we're all very concerned and in many cases outraged over this, I just spoke to my father who's quite excited about all the magazines he's going to be getting soon in the mail...in Arizona.
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  #52  
Old 09-04-2013, 2:09 PM
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Originally Posted by Nate74 View Post
I've heard it said that when it's time to bury them, it's time to use them.

But it does make me wonder. FD responds to a elderly grandmother having chest pains, grandpa hasn't fired his M1 Carbine for 40 years but still has a 20 round magazine in the closet which the local PD sees. Boom, 89 year old WWII vet arrested for the first time in his life? Would that be enough to enrage the populous?
No. Most anti's view ex-military (or currently serving military) as goons who have no real use and are barely capable of human intelligence. If you think I'm exaggerating, just talk to a known anti and point out some other person's distinguished military service...watch their nose crinkle like smelling a bad fart. They would care less about some old vet. These are the same people (and now their children) who jeered the Vietnam vets as baby killers as they stepped off the plane back in the states. A whole generation raised to think this way...it's disturbing.
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  #53  
Old 09-04-2013, 6:18 PM
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Exactly! That's how people are still being arrested for AW's they were supposed to register over ten years ago. Figured no one would know, then one day a neighbor calls about a domestic dispute (real or not), cops arrive to investigate, check the house and felony arrest for non registered AW. There have been so many cases where people for various reasons legal or not had police come into their house. That's why many calgunners advocate following the law. To many accidental felons.
if sb396 becomes law, violation would not be a felony. Other than this I do agree with you comment.
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  #54  
Old 09-04-2013, 10:03 PM
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Explain.
AMENDMENT XIV

Section 1.
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  #55  
Old 09-05-2013, 9:25 AM
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While I agree that it is disturbing (and while I hold members of the military generally high regard), it is also a logical conclusion.

When was the last time the US military fought a war that was seen as justified and fair? Definitely WW2 and the Korean war, but most veterans from those are already gone, and the rest are rapidly leaving. Vietnam was geopolitically a bad idea, badly executed (all I need to say is "My Lai", and the lack of response to it), and for the most part presided over by a justifiably unpopular president (Nixon, who in spite of his claims was actually a crook). Then came the Iranian hostage crisis (incompetence at all levels), Grenada (which made a mockery of international law), Panama (President Bush punishing his former lackey Noriega for a personal squabble over insubordination), and Somalia (the only war where the US force night vision gear was rendered useless by the klieg lights of TV crews, pointing out the absurdity of that particular attack). Then came Kuweit (well started, but not finished), Iraq (pointless, justified by a set of lies, without objective, and needlessly bloody), and finally Afghanistan (in the eyes of the average American, why do we care what goes on in a desolate place in the mountains of Asia, in particular if it actually didn't succeed in its main objective, namely to catch Bin Laden). Was destroying the Afghani government worth about 3000 deaths of American soldiers and contractors? Not to the average American.

Look at the news recently: there were three court martials, including two for multiple murder (one of innocent civilians in a war theatre, the other of fellow soldiers in a camp), with stiff sentences (life without parole in one, death in the other). If the average person who is young enough to not remember WW2 listens to the news, they will come to the logical conclusion that members of the military are either incompetent buffoons, or bloodthirsty deviants. While I don't agree with this conclusion, it is sensible based on easily available news.

The US military and its civilian leadership have made the bed; they now have to sleep in it.
I never heard of the country Kuweit. Anyone else hear about that country I haven't.

I sense your disdain for members of the military in your post and not the conclusion others find.
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  #56  
Old 09-05-2013, 9:29 AM
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I never heard of the country Kuweit. Anyone else hear about that country I haven't.
I think he mispelled it. It's supposed to be Coo'wait, or Cool Whip or something.
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  #57  
Old 09-05-2013, 9:45 AM
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Yes, the majority of the uninformed masses would be outraged that he owned a military weapon at all. They'd consider him a criminal that just took a long time to get caught.

Sounds like I'm exaggerating but the scary part about the whole thing is that I'm not. Get into prolonged discussions (arguments) with rabid antis (the type who are passionate yet uninformed gaslighters) and you'll see what I mean.
they probably wish the cops shot him dead on the spot, so he can't draw on their benefits any longer...
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  #58  
Old 09-05-2013, 10:26 AM
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Chainsaw did you serve in Iraq? Your comment "Iraq (pointless, justified by a set of lies, without objective, and needlessly bloody)" shows ignorance on many levels.

As an Iraq veteran, and Purple Heart recipient ( I still carry dirt/rocks in my face) I love when someone who never even went there spouts off the same comments they heard on msnbc and cnn. We removed a brutal dictator under the premise that he had chemical weapons. When it was determined that he no longer had them (syria probably has some iraqi marked sarin rockets and artillery shells) we had already committed to nation building. Which was the right thing to do. We broke iraq ( by waging an effective war against them) we needed to clean up our mess. And guess what, all the insurgents we killed there, well maybe that prevented attacks on american interests somewhere else. I would do it all over again if I had to. To include getting wounded.. because it was worth it!
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  #59  
Old 09-05-2013, 11:24 AM
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Chainsaw, I suggest that you study your history: http://www.history.army.mil/books/Vi...ntrol/ch01.htm

BTW: Nixon was a paragon of virtue compared to Lyndon Johnson.
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  #60  
Old 09-05-2013, 11:54 AM
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Noonanda, Thanks for a job well done in Iraq, and your appropriate response to Chainsaw's ignorant post.
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  #61  
Old 09-05-2013, 12:00 PM
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A friend of mine used to work for one of the 3-letter agencies (he is in industry now), and he said recently that it is a very good idea for him to hide his professional background. To put it bluntly, once he admits that he used to work for the {National,Central}{Intelligence,Security,Reconnais sance,Geospatial}{Agency,Office}, the date tends to be over. Hard to get laid that way.
He just hasn't figured out how to sell it yet.
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  #62  
Old 09-05-2013, 12:01 PM
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nobody fought when they outlawed nunchucks and ninja stars they just became illegal to own
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  #63  
Old 09-05-2013, 12:20 PM
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Chainsaw let me fix this for you and maybe you will see it through a different lense
"It is, however, the public perception that gun owners in california are dangerous and iresponsible with their guns, especially those veterans as they should be considered potential terrorists. At least with a large fraction of the public in california.

So just because the liberals think something is true makes it so? That is what you are saying about the iraq war. That because the liberal groups and media screamed about it at the top of their lungs it must be true, especially since you were never boots on the ground in either Iraq or Afghanistan. I mean why would the media lie?
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  #64  
Old 09-05-2013, 1:16 PM
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Chainsaw did you serve in Iraq? Your comment "Iraq (pointless, justified by a set of lies, without objective, and needlessly bloody)" shows ignorance on many levels.

As an Iraq veteran, and Purple Heart recipient ( I still carry dirt/rocks in my face) I love when someone who never even went there spouts off the same comments they heard on msnbc and cnn. We removed a brutal dictator under the premise that he had chemical weapons. When it was determined that he no longer had them (syria probably has some iraqi marked sarin rockets and artillery shells) we had already committed to nation building. Which was the right thing to do. We broke iraq ( by waging an effective war against them) we needed to clean up our mess. And guess what, all the insurgents we killed there, well maybe that prevented attacks on american interests somewhere else. I would do it all over again if I had to. To include getting wounded.. because it was worth it!
+1. Hussein spent the better part of 10 years thumbing his nose at international restrictions and killing/gassing his own people.

Read this before you decide that overthrowing him was a bad idea:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_r...ssein%27s_Iraq

The left made up lies and fed them to the public through their media channels all in an effort to discredit Bush, and as a result ended up throwing the entire military under the bus. Hussein was a plague on the entire mid-east, and there would be no hope of political stability while he was in charge. Ironically, it's the same people who advocate our involvement in Egypt, Libya, and now Syria--even though those countries pose far less a threat to their neighbors (and own populations) than did Iraq.

I don't want to hijack the thread though---my point was mainly that the left has indoctrinated the boomers and their children to think that the military is evil and the police/domestic government are good. Most people now have little respect or sympathy toward a vet, and I know of some vets who actively hide their status. I can't blame them.


I think the only thing that will sway opinion in CA is if there are large scale riots and people start to figure out that they cannot buy guns anymore to defend themselves. The gun-grabbers all have a delusion that we live in a 'modern' society and that the police/government will take care of all the baddies, so there is no need to be armed and trained. They believe that the United States is invincible, and would never be invaded (from outside or inside). They have no idea how thin the veil of a civilized world is, or how quickly things will get very ugly once the smallest portion of society breaks down.

When the state finally runs out of money...
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  #65  
Old 09-05-2013, 1:17 PM
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So just because the liberals think something is true makes it so? That is what you are saying about the iraq war. That because the liberal groups and media screamed about it at the top of their lungs it must be true
I think that's his point...perception IS reality. Especially to low-information emotional voters. Truth is irrelevant.
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  #66  
Old 09-05-2013, 1:41 PM
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Chainsaw did you serve in Iraq? Your comment "Iraq (pointless, justified by a set of lies, without objective, and needlessly bloody)" shows ignorance on many levels.

As an Iraq veteran, and Purple Heart recipient ( I still carry dirt/rocks in my face) I love when someone who never even went there spouts off the same comments they heard on msnbc and cnn. We removed a brutal dictator under the premise that he had chemical weapons. When it was determined that he no longer had them (syria probably has some iraqi marked sarin rockets and artillery shells) we had already committed to nation building. Which was the right thing to do. We broke iraq ( by waging an effective war against them) we needed to clean up our mess. And guess what, all the insurgents we killed there, well maybe that prevented attacks on american interests somewhere else. I would do it all over again if I had to. To include getting wounded.. because it was worth it!
Thanks for your service.
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Old 09-05-2013, 1:51 PM
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We'll those are comments that if were said to my face, well we might have a disagreement.
Spit on any veterans lately have you? Liberal Media Perception doesn't make it right, and reality can be painful when it hits you in the mouth.

Edit: While you may not have agreed with the war, to say it was pointless as well as your comments about both Vietnam and also Afghanistan show disrespect to those that sacrificed in one way or another during these wars. Just because the liberal media spins it one way does not make it true, but yet you are propagating that by parroting it. So I bet you support airstrikes in Syria because the president and John Kerry say we should.

Remember "All gave Some, Some gave All"

Last edited by Noonanda; 09-05-2013 at 3:23 PM..
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  #68  
Old 09-05-2013, 2:02 PM
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At what point though, does remaining a "law abiding citizen" as defined by the State begin interfering with your perception of being an American? I think people are finally starting to answer that question as it pertains to them as an individual, which is what we're seeing here.

Not all of us value our lives over our freedom.
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Old 09-05-2013, 2:30 PM
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That would be the Fifth Ammendment. No 5.
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  #70  
Old 09-05-2013, 2:34 PM
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If they ban high capacity magazines I think we should work with a good lawyer to see whether or not it would work to pool our resources and at the deadline have literally thousands of people present at one location to turn in their magazines. Document the heck out of it and prepare for a hellacious lawsuit against the state for an illegal taking as well as on 2A grounds.

I have images of thousands of us showing up at a single police station to turn in our magazines a few hours before the close of business on the mandated day of the Confiscation.

Let the police department know in advance that we will be doing an organized turn-in on that date so that they can arrange to have the resources present to handle the influx.

Seriously, lawyer time is expensive and you don't want to have to have them on-site any longer than is necessary. So if you show up with a group of lawyers 8 hours prior to close of business you are going to have to pay a huge lawyer bill. But if you have people show up to an organizing site earlier in the day, organize everyone and arrange for documentation in a manner earlier prescribed by the lawyers and then meet with the lawyers to ensure that everything will be orderly and then proceed to the turn-in site, it really will take at least hours to get that arranged. One would then hope that the police station will be staffed for the turn-in and process things quickly.

After all, it actually would be more efficient for a police department to centralize the turn-in and documentation process rather than having each and every one of us show up at a different time, different location, and with a different lawyer to try to document the unconstitutional taking and then have thousands of lawsuits.

If Chuck Michel's group were to organize such an event (and I honestly think they and the NRA would be the best organizations for this event/legal action) I'd be willing to drive down to Southern California to do this (and I generally try to stay out of Southern California - no offense intended to those of you who live there).
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  #71  
Old 09-05-2013, 2:56 PM
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I will have more protection from the Law by being a criminal than an honest citizen...

If I had anything to turn in - I would not do it!
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  #72  
Old 09-05-2013, 3:08 PM
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BTW guys, they made it a ticket/infraction... so they can scoop them up as they come across them without filling the jails. There won't be any dramatic cases of poor MOH honorees getting locked up for their Barretta mags. The cops just take 'em and write up a ticket for $100.
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Old 09-05-2013, 3:21 PM
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Originally Posted by jwkincal View Post
BTW guys, they made it a ticket/infraction... so they can scoop them up as they come across them without filling the jails. There won't be any dramatic cases of poor MOH honorees getting locked up for their Barretta mags. The cops just take 'em and write up a ticket for $100.
Hmmmm, I'm at the office right now and can't dig through the text but this was not my understanding. On this one though, I'm pleased to know I was in error.
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Old 09-05-2013, 3:23 PM
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Originally Posted by OleCuss View Post

I have images of thousands of us showing up at a single police station to turn in our magazines a few hours before the close of business on the mandated day of the Confiscation.

Let the police department know in advance that we will be doing an organized turn-in on that date so that they can arrange to have the resources present to handle the influx.
And we should also let them know that we will be staying to witness the destruction of the magazines as required by law. You know, just to be sure that none of them get "lost" on the way to the grinder and perhaps find their way into the hands of thieves or other miscreants.

"(b) Any person who, prior to July 1, 2014, legally possesses a large-capacity magazine shall dispose of that magazine by any of the following means:
(1) Remove the large-capacity magazine from the state.
(2) Prior to July 1, 2014, sell the large-capacity magazine to a licensed firearms dealer.
(3) Destroy the large-capacity magazine.
(4) Surrender the large-capacity magazine to a law enforcement agency for destruction."
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Old 09-05-2013, 3:29 PM
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And we should also let them know that we will be staying to witness the destruction of the magazines as required by law. You know, just to be sure that none of them get "lost" on the way to the grinder and perhaps find their way into the hands of thieves or other miscreants.

"(b) Any person who, prior to July 1, 2014, legally possesses a large-capacity magazine shall dispose of that magazine by any of the following means:
(1) Remove the large-capacity magazine from the state.
(2) Prior to July 1, 2014, sell the large-capacity magazine to a licensed firearms dealer.
(3) Destroy the large-capacity magazine.
(4) Surrender the large-capacity magazine to a law enforcement agency for destruction."


hmm is a corporation or trust a person?
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Old 09-05-2013, 3:30 PM
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Originally Posted by Nate74 View Post
Hmmmm, I'm at the office right now and can't dig through the text but this was not my understanding. On this one though, I'm pleased to know I was in error.

http://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/billNavClient.xhtml?bill_id=201320140SB396


Of course, if the fellow in your scenario had not registered the carbine... he'd be on his way to the graybar hotel.
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Last edited by jwkincal; 09-05-2013 at 3:48 PM..
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Old 09-05-2013, 3:45 PM
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And we should also let them know that we will be staying to witness the destruction of the magazines as required by law. You know, just to be sure that none of them get "lost" on the way to the grinder and perhaps find their way into the hands of thieves or other miscreants.

"(b) Any person who, prior to July 1, 2014, legally possesses a large-capacity magazine shall dispose of that magazine by any of the following means:
(1) Remove the large-capacity magazine from the state.
(2) Prior to July 1, 2014, sell the large-capacity magazine to a licensed firearms dealer.
(3) Destroy the large-capacity magazine.
(4) Surrender the large-capacity magazine to a law enforcement agency for destruction."
I strongly agree.

And I certainly hope that none of us who might possess such magazines will either remove them from the state or destroy them. That would gut the illegal taking argument.

Personally, I've no place out-of-state so I'll not be sending them there. I don't have a licensed firearms dealer whom I believe wants to buy them from me (or to whom I wish to sell them), and I shouldn't be destroying a magazine.

I want a lawyer to assist me in making the case and making the state pay for its perfidy.
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Old 09-05-2013, 5:41 PM
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I think the movie industry should also be made to suffer the same gun laws as us, after all, does the COTUS not guarantee equal protection? Where's the equality?
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Old 09-05-2013, 7:41 PM
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Need some clarification on this issue since I haven't seen anything definitive... is a 20 round PMAG that's been "permanently" blocked to 10 rounds a large capacity mag that needs to be surrendered or not?
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Old 09-05-2013, 7:49 PM
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Originally Posted by 12yak View Post
Need some clarification on this issue since I haven't seen anything definitive... is a 20 round PMAG that's been "permanently" blocked to 10 rounds a large capacity mag that needs to be surrendered or not?

Yes. If the body of the magazine was ever large enough to hold more than 10 rounds, even if it's permanently blocked, it's considered a large capacity magazine under this new law.
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