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Centerfire Rifles - Semiautomatic or Gas Operated Centerfire rifles, carbines and other gas operated rifles.

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  #1  
Old 07-07-2013, 12:49 PM
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Default New AR build recommendation:Midlength or Carbine?

It's been over a year and getting to finish my first AR. Need help selecting an upper.

Got a spikes lower, spikes T2 buffer and lower parts kit.
Looking at spikes complete LE uppers in a 16 inch barrel to finish it off.
Can't decide between their carbine length or midlength gas system.

What would you guys recommend?
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  #2  
Old 07-07-2013, 12:53 PM
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Some say middy some say carbine, I have both and I can't tell the difference, recoil wise. I run h2 buffers and they feel the same to me. The st-2 buffer is very smooth, that being said I have run them in my mid and carbine length 16" and there is no difference to me. Maybe someone will chime in with their thoughts.
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  #3  
Old 07-07-2013, 1:04 PM
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You will not feel the impulse difference. I prefer the mid length because of the extended grip surface area
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Old 07-07-2013, 1:16 PM
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Mid length just looks better with the 16" barrel, proportions wise
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  #5  
Old 07-07-2013, 1:19 PM
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I would add that in addition to the greater grip surface of a middy, you get a slightly longer site radius with it and some would say better functioning because of the longer gas tube.

I'm superficial and just like the look and feel of the middy.
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  #6  
Old 07-07-2013, 1:21 PM
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^^^ All of the above for middy.
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  #7  
Old 07-07-2013, 1:23 PM
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I prefer mid length, slightly less recoil and muzzle rise, longer sight radius, and longer hand guards.

Also, mid length looks better with a 16 inch barrel.
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  #8  
Old 07-07-2013, 1:25 PM
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Carbines with 16" barrels are overgassed and are almost twice as much pressure than a rifle gas.

Mid is closer to the pressure of rifle gas

If you shoot thousands upon thousands of rounds, you may have earlier wear on certain parts with a carbine vs mid

Best reason to go mid is for real estate
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  #9  
Old 07-07-2013, 1:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Munny$hot View Post
You will not feel the impulse difference. I prefer the mid length because of the extended grip surface area
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  #10  
Old 07-07-2013, 1:48 PM
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Mid Length looks better.
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  #11  
Old 07-07-2013, 2:15 PM
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Another vote for middy.
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  #12  
Old 07-07-2013, 2:24 PM
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I hate how 16 inch inch carbines look. If it's got to be 16, then (in my opinion) it's got to be mid-length. Now if you were considering 14.5 as well, that would be a different story.
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  #13  
Old 07-07-2013, 2:31 PM
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why not build your AR for what it was designed for and go with the 20". Yeah everyone has a 16" and 18" but not that many people have 20's. I Have both a 16 and a 20 and I really love the 20.
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  #14  
Old 07-07-2013, 2:40 PM
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You will not notice a difference mid vs carbine. Supposidly the mid will bemore reliable because the dwell time for extraction is more ideal but I have never experienced one way or the other with either. The biggest benifit for the mid is the longer sight radius for iron sights. You can accomplish the same with a free float rail and carbine gas system. So in short, decide which sight system you want to use.
Kevin
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  #15  
Old 07-07-2013, 2:41 PM
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I tend to shoot heavier 77 grain bullets that cycle the action a bit harder than standard 55 or 62 grain ammo. I run mid length on my 16" uppers, but would prefer the longer intermediate length gas system to smooth them out a little. For the ammo I run, mid length would be better suited to a 14.5" barrel.

I'd only go carbine length on the gas system if I were building a short 10" -12" pistol barreled upper, or something really underpowered like a 300 BLK (pistol length gas would be better for the 300)
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  #16  
Old 07-07-2013, 3:19 PM
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The real estate argument assumes you're using drop in handguards.
That aside, I say middy.
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  #17  
Old 07-07-2013, 3:30 PM
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Being we're stuck at 16" barrels mid length.

I started with a carbine but the extra 2" of barrel it really makes the carbine look a bit awkward IMO. Also the mid length system is optimized for 16" barrels being the pressures.

Also offers slightly longer sight radius so that doesn't hurt. Won't make or break your rifle I shot about the same with both my carbine/mid length

Also the other main reason I switch from carbine to mid is because it offers more real estate to fully extent my support arm and lock out for my shooting position.

But as for the "less recoil" I do not feel any noticeable difference shooting my carbine vs middy upper with the same XM193/m855. Neither is a bad option just weight you pros and cons and what you want your rifle for.

Initial Build


Tacticool Phase


Magpul Phase


2nd build (later sold the carbine)



Current set up vv


Everything I listed besides hand guard area isn't noticeable to be 100% honest. That and the cleaner look. Other than those 2 things the carbine was fine
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Last edited by CK_32; 07-07-2013 at 8:17 PM..
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  #18  
Old 07-07-2013, 3:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mossy Man View Post
Carbines with 16" barrels are overgassed and are almost twice as much pressure than a rifle gas.
One advantage of 16 inch carbine length systems is, due to them being over gassed, they do well with the cheap lightly loaded Russian ammo(Tula, Wolf, Brown/Sliver bear).
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  #19  
Old 07-07-2013, 7:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by G21Shooter View Post
One advantage of 16 inch carbine length systems is, due to them being over gassed, they do well with the cheap lightly loaded Russian ammo(Tula, Wolf, Brown/Sliver bear).
That beibg said, mine has eaten every cheap tula ive fed it.
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  #20  
Old 07-07-2013, 7:48 PM
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Mid length all the way!
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  #21  
Old 07-07-2013, 7:51 PM
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Mid for looks. Now that I think about it. I dont even have a mid length rifle.
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  #22  
Old 07-08-2013, 10:06 AM
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Thanks for all the input. I will go with the midlength. I checked with spikes, and my T2 buffer will run just fine with the midlength upper.

Now I just need to find one at a good price.
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  #23  
Old 07-08-2013, 10:17 AM
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not all manufacturers use the same gas port size, so that's another factor to look into.....
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  #24  
Old 07-08-2013, 12:13 PM
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If you get a low profile gas block then the extra real estate/grip surface/sight radius argument is irrelevant.
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  #25  
Old 07-08-2013, 12:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nephrodoc View Post
Thanks for all the input. I will go with the midlength. I checked with spikes, and my T2 buffer will run just fine with the midlength upper.

Now I just need to find one at a good price.
BCM makes some good uppers. Been real happy with the 3 I've had.

Guys are all over the PSA uppers. But I've yet to see a full in detail spec sheet and don't fully believe they are the ONE company that found a way to make high end uppers for low end price.. They are cutting costs some where and no one can fully verify where or how or if they are full spec for cheaper.

But they run so on a budget it's a decent place to look if your interested in going PSA. But again I won't fully reccomend their uppers being I don't not had anyone been able to fully come out with a hard fact spec sheet and how they are selling "top notch" uppers for less.. way less than every other manufacture today. Being I helped run a business and have been around machining for a while it just doesn't happen like that.

So look at BravoCompanyUsa.com when they get uppers in. Or keep an eye on PSA id your on a budget.
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  #26  
Old 07-08-2013, 1:04 PM
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For my first build, I went with a midlength because everything I read online had me believe that it has dramatically less recoil. For my second build, I went with a carbine just to have something different. They're both equal in my experience. The carbine is lighter due to the shorter rail, but it also has less space to place my support hand.
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Old 07-08-2013, 1:31 PM
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Rifle!
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  #28  
Old 07-08-2013, 1:54 PM
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midlength looks good and works for bayonet... carbine is good for using some fake can...
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Old 07-08-2013, 2:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by moneymike View Post
Mid length just looks better with the 16" barrel, proportions wise
Quote:
Originally Posted by Heiko View Post
I would add that in addition to the greater grip surface of a middy, you get a slightly longer site radius with it and some would say better functioning because of the longer gas tube.

I'm superficial and just like the look and feel of the middy.
Quote:
Originally Posted by LAKings22 View Post
Mid Length looks better.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Guapo View Post
Mid length all the way!
I agree with all of the above. Form and function. Just wrapping up my 1st build. Been a long process. I went with a Midlentgh for several reasons. Gas system, real estate, and aesthetics.

I'm 6'4 with arms the length of a Condor's wingspan. When I move my support arm/hand forward on a carbine length handguard, I run out of handguard. For me, a midlentgh is a little more forgiving.

Plus, I personally don't like the look of a carbine. Too much naked barrel for my tastes.

YMMV.
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Old 07-08-2013, 2:38 PM
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Thanks for the input, Primary Arms had them in stock, ordered the spikes midlength upper. My build will be all spikes.

Wow, I got shipping confirmationwithin the hour. Those guys are fast.
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  #31  
Old 07-08-2013, 3:26 PM
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I have both a middy (14.5) and a carbine (16) and the middy seems smoother than the carbine. they also say since most carbine gas systems are over gassed they are more reliable and using low power ammo in a middy may get some cycling issues, never really tested that theory in my middy tho....
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Old 07-08-2013, 3:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CK_32 View Post
BCM makes some good uppers. Been real happy with the 3 I've had.

Guys are all over the PSA uppers. But I've yet to see a full in detail spec sheet and don't fully believe they are the ONE company that found a way to make high end uppers for low end price.. They are cutting costs some where and no one can fully verify where or how or if they are full spec for cheaper.

But they run so on a budget it's a decent place to look if your interested in going PSA. But again I won't fully reccomend their uppers being I don't not had anyone been able to fully come out with a hard fact spec sheet and how they are selling "top notch" uppers for less.. way less than every other manufacture today. Being I helped run a business and have been around machining for a while it just doesn't happen like that.

So look at BravoCompanyUsa.com when they get uppers in. Or keep an eye on PSA id your on a budget.
My guess? QC. They did the math, and figured it would cost less to replace/repair the ones that got through their QC, as opposed to hiring more/better inspectors.

Another guess would be less attention to detail in general, like the chamber on the barrel extension may still be sharp as opposed to being properly deburred or had the edges broken properly, or a parts kit was shipped without a pin or spring or something. This again is a quality issue. Also less people answering phones and e mails helps cut down costs too.

That being said, I have a PSA upper that I bought during last years black Friday sale, and I have been nothing but happy with it. They make good, not great, stuff, and you do get your moneys worth.

I'd say 90% of all people are happy with PSA's actual products, and 90% of all people are unhappy with the CS overall.

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