Calguns.net  

Home My iTrader Join the NRA Donate to CGSSA Sponsors CGN Google Search
CA Semiauto Ban(AW)ID Flowchart CA Handgun Ban ID Flowchart CA Shotgun Ban ID Flowchart
Go Back   Calguns.net > INTERESTS AND ACTIVITIES > Gunsmithing & How To
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Mark Forums Read

Gunsmithing & How To Pro, Amateur & WECSOG and Tutorials, Guides & OLL Build Instructions

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 07-05-2013, 7:50 PM
Nate74's Avatar
Nate74 Nate74 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Southbay of Los Angeles
Posts: 1,095
iTrader: 28 / 100%
Default Anodized 80% Pretty Rough After Machining

Has anybody else had the experience after finishing an anodized 80% AR in a CNC machine, where the anodizing is in pretty rough shape? Like to the point where the aluminum is showing through in some of the areas where the lower was clamped into the CNC? I paid a couple extra bucks on an anodized 80% thinking it'd be good to go with a quick blast of duracoat on the inside, but there are some serious wear areas on the outside... thinking of looking for an anodizer who can strip the original anodizing and refinish the whole thing. I guess I wasted the extra $$ getting an anodized 80%...
__________________
"There's no reason what so ever that a private citizen needs to own a firearm. Just ask the Armenians, Jews, Cambodians, Tutsis (Rwanda), Bosnian Muslims, etc."
- Nate74's Dad

Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 07-05-2013, 11:43 PM
Zartan's Avatar
Zartan Zartan is offline
Resident Leg Humper
CGN Contributor
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Mountain House, Ca
Posts: 6,208
iTrader: 9 / 100%
Default

Unless it was pounded around in hard jaws while indicating the lower into the machine, then maybe ano may wear off. Maybe. I've done a few black ano 80% lowers in the past couple of months with zero blemishes.

Pics would help
__________________
"If he won't walk, walk him...be nice"
-Dalton



WTS: 870 Barrel Clamp/Railed Mount

Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 07-06-2013, 5:25 AM
-hanko's Avatar
-hanko -hanko is online now
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Bay Area & SW Idaho
Posts: 9,154
iTrader: 5 / 100%
Default

The usual process to produce a metal part is to machine completely, prep the surface, and then finish.

Machining an already anodized piece is bass-akwards. Start with metal in-the-white, bead blast, and have it finished by a shop who can certify, in writing, that they meet or exceed the relevant mil-spec.

hth

-hanko
__________________
"Tactical" is like boobs...you can sell anything with it....arf

I never once felt out of place or that people were intolerant...but then again, I didn't ask any dumbass questions ...saxman

“Heaven goes by favor. If it went by merit, you would stay out and your dog would go in.”
Mark Twain
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 07-06-2013, 5:37 AM
VictorFranko's Avatar
VictorFranko VictorFranko is offline
#BlackLabsMatter
CGN Contributor
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: You can not protect the 1st Amendment without the 2nd Amendment........
Posts: 12,125
iTrader: 45 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by -hanko View Post
Machining an already anodized piece is bass-akwards.
Ummm, not if you buy an already anodized 80% lower.

Machining an anodized lower is fine, but it helps to have a proper vise, vise jaws and, oh yeah, it helps if you know what you are doing.

Here's an anodized 80% lower I machined, not a mark on it.








OP, yes, a plater can strip and re-anodize your lower for you, don't panic.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 07-06-2013, 6:27 AM
Nate74's Avatar
Nate74 Nate74 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Southbay of Los Angeles
Posts: 1,095
iTrader: 28 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by VictorFranko View Post


OP, yes, a plater can strip and re-anodize your lower for you, don't panic.
Awesome to hear. Thanks. Now to find an anodizer around me...

Also, that setup looks different than the one that was used on my lowers
__________________
"There's no reason what so ever that a private citizen needs to own a firearm. Just ask the Armenians, Jews, Cambodians, Tutsis (Rwanda), Bosnian Muslims, etc."
- Nate74's Dad

Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 07-06-2013, 7:15 AM
edgerly779 edgerly779 is offline
CGN/CGSSA Contributor
CGN Contributor
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: canoga park, ca
Posts: 5,962
iTrader: 67 / 100%
Default

I used a mill jig and no marks. I have more coming that have already been anodized and am not worried about marks. Clean vice jaws and if needed use pvc jaw protectors that apply even pressure to clamp lower.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 07-06-2013, 7:29 AM
3RDGEARGRNDRR's Avatar
3RDGEARGRNDRR 3RDGEARGRNDRR is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 894
iTrader: 4 / 100%
Default

+1 with my $.02

Quote:
Originally Posted by edgerly779 View Post
I used a mill jig and no marks. I have more coming that have already been anodized and am not worried about marks.
Blow out any debris with an air compressor and wipe down vice jaws and use pvc jaw protectors that apply even pressure to clamp lower.
__________________
CA: Exorcising my 2A rights
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 07-06-2013, 7:35 AM
3RDGEARGRNDRR's Avatar
3RDGEARGRNDRR 3RDGEARGRNDRR is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 894
iTrader: 4 / 100%
Default

Oh. If you are going to use the gun just go ahead and sand down the rough areas and duracoat it. I think they make the self lubricating additive if you want to clean it out easier although personally i have never used it
__________________
CA: Exorcising my 2A rights
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 07-06-2013, 10:26 AM
Nate74's Avatar
Nate74 Nate74 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Southbay of Los Angeles
Posts: 1,095
iTrader: 28 / 100%
Default

Well, I've found a place that will replate it for me for $60 and do the stripping and prep work. Turn around time is only 2 weeks too. Shouldn't have paid the extra for the anodized 80% but will at least end up with a nice finished lower. Thanks guys for your input and thoughts.
__________________
"There's no reason what so ever that a private citizen needs to own a firearm. Just ask the Armenians, Jews, Cambodians, Tutsis (Rwanda), Bosnian Muslims, etc."
- Nate74's Dad

Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 07-06-2013, 10:30 AM
Varg Vikernes's Avatar
Varg Vikernes Varg Vikernes is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Bay Area SF
Posts: 2,070
iTrader: 22 / 100%
Default

Jesus Christ that is a lot of money when you coulda just got a new complete lower for $120 or something
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 07-06-2013, 10:40 AM
Flintlock Tom's Avatar
Flintlock Tom Flintlock Tom is offline
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Klamath Falls, OR
Posts: 2,655
iTrader: 32 / 100%
Default

I have had 5 anodized 80% lowers machined at two different shops and had no unusual wear on the outside.
I think you picked the wrong machine shop.
__________________
"I may be 'preaching to the choir', but the choir can use a reminder every now and then."

Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 07-06-2013, 10:54 AM
12GAUGE's Avatar
12GAUGE 12GAUGE is online now
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 533
iTrader: 36 / 100%
Default

.01Cent of masking tape would of prevented that. No?
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 07-06-2013, 11:34 AM
VictorFranko's Avatar
VictorFranko VictorFranko is offline
#BlackLabsMatter
CGN Contributor
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: You can not protect the 1st Amendment without the 2nd Amendment........
Posts: 12,125
iTrader: 45 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nate74 View Post
Also, that setup looks different than the one that was used on my lowers
Programming CNCs and cutting metal is what I do for a living. I just do these set-ups in a vise and run my program. Many novices or newer professional machinists overcomplicate their set-ups because they don't yet understand the cutting forces that will be applied to their workpiece and they fear the workpiece coming loose.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 12GAUGE View Post
.01Cent of masking tape would of prevented that. No?
You have to be careful using masking tape in milling operations. Masking tape is thick and compresses. The coolant can break down the glue on the tape, the tape can then compress or 'slide', then you get movement of your workpiece, never a good thing while milling. I prefer a simple sheet of paper as protection, when needed. Paper does not compress like tape and there is no glue to break down.
I just clamp a clean lower directly in a clean set of vise jaws, tighten the vise properly and machine away, no paper.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 07-06-2013, 12:15 PM
SOAR79 SOAR79 is offline
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: LA,IE,SD
Posts: 2,987
iTrader: 3 / 100%
Default

where did you machine the lower OP?
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 07-06-2013, 1:13 PM
Nate74's Avatar
Nate74 Nate74 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Southbay of Los Angeles
Posts: 1,095
iTrader: 28 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Varg Vikernes View Post
Jesus Christ that is a lot of money when you coulda just got a new complete lower for $120 or something
You might be missing the point of an 80% build...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Flintlock Tom View Post
I have had 5 anodized 80% lowers machined at two different shops and had no unusual wear on the outside.
I think you picked the wrong machine shop.
The guy has glowing reviews here and elsewhere, so I had no reason to suspect I'd get anything but a pristine product. Really strange as I see the results others have gotten with similar starting points...
__________________
"There's no reason what so ever that a private citizen needs to own a firearm. Just ask the Armenians, Jews, Cambodians, Tutsis (Rwanda), Bosnian Muslims, etc."
- Nate74's Dad

Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 07-06-2013, 8:33 PM
Limited-Ten's Avatar
Limited-Ten Limited-Ten is offline
Vendor/Retailer
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 262
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

With just soft jaws we have not had an issue machining through Type III.
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 07-07-2013, 6:13 AM
Nate74's Avatar
Nate74 Nate74 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Southbay of Los Angeles
Posts: 1,095
iTrader: 28 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Limited-Ten View Post
With just soft jaws we have not had an issue machining through Type III.


It almost looks like there was some vibration and some slight movement of the lower during the machining process...
__________________
"There's no reason what so ever that a private citizen needs to own a firearm. Just ask the Armenians, Jews, Cambodians, Tutsis (Rwanda), Bosnian Muslims, etc."
- Nate74's Dad

Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 07-07-2013, 7:04 AM
VictorFranko's Avatar
VictorFranko VictorFranko is offline
#BlackLabsMatter
CGN Contributor
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: You can not protect the 1st Amendment without the 2nd Amendment........
Posts: 12,125
iTrader: 45 / 100%
Default

Were the vise jaws aluminum?
It looks like you may have a little aluminum build-up from aluminum soft jaws there. If, so, that could clean off with some acetone, a clean rag and some elbow grease. Give it a try before stripping and re-anodizing, you've got nothing to lose..........
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 07-07-2013, 12:42 PM
Nate74's Avatar
Nate74 Nate74 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Southbay of Los Angeles
Posts: 1,095
iTrader: 28 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by VictorFranko View Post
Were the vise jaws aluminum?
It looks like you may have a little aluminum build-up from aluminum soft jaws there. If, so, that could clean off with some acetone, a clean rag and some elbow grease. Give it a try before stripping and re-anodizing, you've got nothing to lose..........
Gave it a shot... with no luck. I appreciate the input though. No idea what the vise jaws were made of honestly... kryptonite maybe?
__________________
"There's no reason what so ever that a private citizen needs to own a firearm. Just ask the Armenians, Jews, Cambodians, Tutsis (Rwanda), Bosnian Muslims, etc."
- Nate74's Dad

Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 07-07-2013, 2:36 PM
bollero's Avatar
bollero bollero is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: NUNYA----
Posts: 1,038
iTrader: 3 / 100%
Default

Don't sweat the little defects if its a shooter.. its going to get banged up hunting sooner or later or u building a Safe queen...?

My Rifles see combat chasing those bunnies and Coyotes around..So there a little rough..
Reply With Quote
  #21  
Old 07-07-2013, 2:38 PM
Nate74's Avatar
Nate74 Nate74 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Southbay of Los Angeles
Posts: 1,095
iTrader: 28 / 100%
Default

Honest wear from usage is fine in my book, but not flaws caused by manufacturing errors. To each his own of course.
__________________
"There's no reason what so ever that a private citizen needs to own a firearm. Just ask the Armenians, Jews, Cambodians, Tutsis (Rwanda), Bosnian Muslims, etc."
- Nate74's Dad

Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 07-07-2013, 2:48 PM
DannyInSoCal's Avatar
DannyInSoCal DannyInSoCal is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Mission Viejo
Posts: 8,006
iTrader: 105 / 100%
Default

Scratched up lower - BFD - It's gonna get scratched up when you use it long enough anyway....
__________________
.
$500 Donation to any Veterans Charity - Plus $500 Gift Card to any gun store: Visit 2nd Amendment Mortgage / www.2AMortgage.com
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 07-07-2013, 2:58 PM
Nate74's Avatar
Nate74 Nate74 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Southbay of Los Angeles
Posts: 1,095
iTrader: 28 / 100%
Default

Maybe not a BFD to you, but I prefer my builds to look nice when I complete them.
__________________
"There's no reason what so ever that a private citizen needs to own a firearm. Just ask the Armenians, Jews, Cambodians, Tutsis (Rwanda), Bosnian Muslims, etc."
- Nate74's Dad

Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 07-07-2013, 3:52 PM
Tactical Lab Tactical Lab is offline
Vendor/Retailer
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 1
iTrader: 1 / 100%
Default

i have used masking tape layed evenly (no overlapping) .... re-measure the width because it will change and then split that difference for the pocket...anodized pieces come out flawless when we did it this way...this was using alluminum jigs in cnc locating on takedown pin holes .....thought about making delron jigs but havent yet
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 07-08-2013, 6:08 AM
Nate74's Avatar
Nate74 Nate74 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Southbay of Los Angeles
Posts: 1,095
iTrader: 28 / 100%
Default

Well one thing is for sure, I won't be doing any more work at that particular shop... I appreciate hearing from the guys with CNC experience.
__________________
"There's no reason what so ever that a private citizen needs to own a firearm. Just ask the Armenians, Jews, Cambodians, Tutsis (Rwanda), Bosnian Muslims, etc."
- Nate74's Dad

Reply With Quote
  #26  
Old 07-08-2013, 1:24 PM
capcitycrawler capcitycrawler is offline
Banned
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Sacramento
Posts: 512
iTrader: 41 / 98%
Default

Try a bluing pen.
Reply With Quote
  #27  
Old 07-08-2013, 6:24 PM
Nate74's Avatar
Nate74 Nate74 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Southbay of Los Angeles
Posts: 1,095
iTrader: 28 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by capcitycrawler View Post
Try a bluing pen.
I gave it a go, but from my reading, bluing only works on steel not aluminum. Taking it into the plating shop tomorrow...
__________________
"There's no reason what so ever that a private citizen needs to own a firearm. Just ask the Armenians, Jews, Cambodians, Tutsis (Rwanda), Bosnian Muslims, etc."
- Nate74's Dad

Reply With Quote
  #28  
Old 07-08-2013, 9:57 PM
ar15barrels's Avatar
ar15barrels ar15barrels is offline
I need a LIFE!!
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Van Nuys
Posts: 38,274
iTrader: 88 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by VictorFranko View Post
Were the vise jaws aluminum?
It looks like you may have a little aluminum build-up from aluminum soft jaws there. If, so, that could clean off with some acetone, a clean rag and some elbow grease. Give it a try before stripping and re-anodizing, you've got nothing to lose..........
This is my guess too.
It's aluminum from the soft jaws, or perhaps the goon loading the fixture did not blow out all the chips that fell off the last part before he clamped in the new part...

I would try wd40 or liquid wrench and see if they help float the aluminum off the outside of the anodizing.
I have real good luck with wd40 taking off the brass marks I leave on barrels from when I clamp them with brass tipped setscrews in my lathe fixtures.
__________________
Randall Rausch

AR work: www.ar15barrels.com
Bolt actions: www.700barrels.com
Foreign Semi Autos: www.akbarrels.com
Glock, XD and M&P pistols, Benelli and Remington shotguns: barrel, sight, trigger and receiver work.
Most work performed while-you-wait, evening and weekend appointments available.
Founding member of the CAPRC
Reply With Quote
  #29  
Old 07-08-2013, 10:00 PM
SB1964's Avatar
SB1964 SB1964 is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: San Diego
Posts: 5,027
iTrader: 38 / 100%
Default

No! I cut my first two QD lowers today, came out great. They mated up to lowers at the shop & I mated them up to known good lowers when I cleaned them up.
__________________
Yes I took the pic, no I didn't go swimming!
Reply With Quote
  #30  
Old 07-09-2013, 5:04 AM
pisarski pisarski is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: costa mesa
Posts: 746
iTrader: 33 / 100%
Default

watch out if you have it striped if they leave it in the striper to long it will make all the pin holes to big and make it look worst than it looks now . at my work we had some parts striped and recoated and we had to trash all of them. just duracoat it.
Reply With Quote
  #31  
Old 07-09-2013, 7:53 AM
Nate74's Avatar
Nate74 Nate74 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Southbay of Los Angeles
Posts: 1,095
iTrader: 28 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ar15barrels View Post
This is my guess too.
It's aluminum from the soft jaws, or perhaps the goon loading the fixture did not blow out all the chips that fell off the last part before he clamped in the new part...

I would try wd40 or liquid wrench and see if they help float the aluminum off the outside of the anodizing.
I have real good luck with wd40 taking off the brass marks I leave on barrels from when I clamp them with brass tipped setscrews in my lathe fixtures.
I actually tried wd40 early on with no luck. The pictures doesn't show it well but in the flesh, you can see this is actually a bunch of scratches in the anodizing.

The more and more comments I see about how others have had good results, the more and more disappointed I am with this machine shop. Seemed like such a good outfit... live and learn I suppose.
__________________
"There's no reason what so ever that a private citizen needs to own a firearm. Just ask the Armenians, Jews, Cambodians, Tutsis (Rwanda), Bosnian Muslims, etc."
- Nate74's Dad

Reply With Quote
  #32  
Old 07-09-2013, 8:51 AM
DanM's Avatar
DanM DanM is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 126
iTrader: 1 / 100%
Default

looks like the black dye was not sealed properly. For sure you are not wearing through the anodize. improperly sealed dye will wear off and can be affected by UV light (turns reddish/purple) at least that's what I see.
__________________
Freedom is not negotiable.
Reply With Quote
  #33  
Old 07-10-2013, 3:34 PM
Nate74's Avatar
Nate74 Nate74 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Southbay of Los Angeles
Posts: 1,095
iTrader: 28 / 100%
Default

Dropped it off at Techplate yesterday so I'll see how it turns out in 10-12 days...
__________________
"There's no reason what so ever that a private citizen needs to own a firearm. Just ask the Armenians, Jews, Cambodians, Tutsis (Rwanda), Bosnian Muslims, etc."
- Nate74's Dad

Reply With Quote
  #34  
Old 07-13-2013, 7:37 AM
capcitycrawler capcitycrawler is offline
Banned
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Sacramento
Posts: 512
iTrader: 41 / 98%
Default

Bluing pen works great on Billet ive fixed worse with it.
Reply With Quote
  #35  
Old 07-16-2013, 1:48 PM
Nate74's Avatar
Nate74 Nate74 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Southbay of Los Angeles
Posts: 1,095
iTrader: 28 / 100%
Default

I think technically bluing is a process that works only on carbon steel. If you have a pen that works on aluminum, I'd be curious the make/model.
__________________
"There's no reason what so ever that a private citizen needs to own a firearm. Just ask the Armenians, Jews, Cambodians, Tutsis (Rwanda), Bosnian Muslims, etc."
- Nate74's Dad

Reply With Quote
  #36  
Old 07-16-2013, 2:22 PM
ar15barrels's Avatar
ar15barrels ar15barrels is offline
I need a LIFE!!
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Van Nuys
Posts: 38,274
iTrader: 88 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nate74 View Post
If you have a pen that works on aluminum, I'd be curious the make/model.
I don't think it comes in a pen form, but here it is in a bottle...

http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/p...ducts_id/23440

I have a bottle and it does not work very well in my experience.
__________________
Randall Rausch

AR work: www.ar15barrels.com
Bolt actions: www.700barrels.com
Foreign Semi Autos: www.akbarrels.com
Glock, XD and M&P pistols, Benelli and Remington shotguns: barrel, sight, trigger and receiver work.
Most work performed while-you-wait, evening and weekend appointments available.
Founding member of the CAPRC
Reply With Quote
  #37  
Old 07-16-2013, 4:58 PM
tal3nt tal3nt is offline
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Orange County
Posts: 3,130
iTrader: 59 / 100%
Default

It's going to get scratched anyhow.
Reply With Quote
  #38  
Old 07-17-2013, 6:33 PM
Nate74's Avatar
Nate74 Nate74 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Southbay of Los Angeles
Posts: 1,095
iTrader: 28 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by tal3nt View Post
It's going to get scratched anyhow.
See post #23...
__________________
"There's no reason what so ever that a private citizen needs to own a firearm. Just ask the Armenians, Jews, Cambodians, Tutsis (Rwanda), Bosnian Muslims, etc."
- Nate74's Dad

Reply With Quote
  #39  
Old 07-17-2013, 6:36 PM
Nate74's Avatar
Nate74 Nate74 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Southbay of Los Angeles
Posts: 1,095
iTrader: 28 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ar15barrels View Post
I don't think it comes in a pen form, but here it is in a bottle...

http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/p...ducts_id/23440

I have a bottle and it does not work very well in my experience.
That's good to know for the future. Thank you. I'll talk with one of the metallurgists at my company about what might turn aluminum black other than anodizing and various paints...
__________________
"There's no reason what so ever that a private citizen needs to own a firearm. Just ask the Armenians, Jews, Cambodians, Tutsis (Rwanda), Bosnian Muslims, etc."
- Nate74's Dad

Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



All times are GMT -8. The time now is 10:25 PM.




Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2016, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Proudly hosted by GeoVario the Premier 2A host.
Calguns.net, the 'Calguns' name and all associated variants and logos are ® Trademark and © Copyright 2002-2016, Calguns.net an Incorporated Company All Rights Reserved.