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California 2nd Amend. Political Discussion & Activism Discuss gun rights activism and 2A related political topics here. All advice given is NOT legal counsel.

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  #1  
Old 04-21-2013, 1:00 PM
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Default This is not right!

All I can think about is this... If there is a terrorist on the loose in my neighborhood, I would definitely be armed while on lockdown in my house. How would I react to this situation? How would these officers react to seeing my weapons? Would they take the firearms? Would I get them back? Why are they frisking people that are NOT the targets of the manhunt?
There is definitely something wrong here. Between this and the Dorner situation it really seems like when **** goes down, the public comes out on the short end of the stick with the police...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2LrbsUVSVl8
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Old 04-21-2013, 1:18 PM
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Your right, this is not right. Assuming that this was somehow the norm without knowing the background as to why this specific house and occupants were handled this way is irresponsible. There is definitely something wrong here when people post a video, with no context or background information, and attempt to say it represents something.
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Old 04-21-2013, 1:21 PM
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Imagine kids sleeping and waking up to that. I'd probably be dead.
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Old 04-21-2013, 1:26 PM
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Coming soon to a town near you.

If an officer kicks in your door and see's you holding a weapon, expect to get shot.
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Old 04-21-2013, 1:27 PM
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It would be nice to know the full story. Was there a reason they raided this house? What was the reason. Did the owner simply refuse to let them in and this was the result? Or did the police really believe the bombers were hiding out there. If they were doing this to every house in the neighborhood I think we would have seen more video. Still a moving video.
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Old 04-21-2013, 2:51 PM
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Originally Posted by teetsjones View Post
It would be nice to know the full story. Was there a reason they raided this house? What was the reason. Did the owner simply refuse to let them in and this was the result? Or did the police really believe the bombers were hiding out there. If they were doing this to every house in the neighborhood I think we would have seen more video. Still a moving video.
SO that would give them a reason to enter my home without my consent at gunpoint? This is bull crap and had my blood pressure up. screw these cowards.
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Old 04-21-2013, 3:00 PM
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On the surface, this looks pretty sketchy. But what happened before the video starts? Did the police have a warrant? I'm not saying it was perfectly legal and the police didn't violate anybody's rights. I'm saying that we shouldn't decide they're a bunch of jackbooted thugs trampling the Constitution until we know the full story.
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Old 04-21-2013, 3:03 PM
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I had some thoughts about this before I saw the video and during the actual events... but it looks like it was confirmed.

I have some real strong feelings about what I'm seeing here.

Its not right. I honestly don't know what I would do or how I would feel if this happened to me.
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Old 04-21-2013, 3:03 PM
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Originally Posted by morfeeis View Post
SO that would give them a reason to enter my home without my consent at gunpoint? This is bull crap and had my blood pressure up. screw these cowards.
NEVER should simply to denying access EVER result in that sort of action. If that was the reason someone has a civil rights case. If there were dangerous people loose in my area I would have my 1911 on my hip my .44 in my shoulder holster, my 12 guage in my hand when I answered the door, unless I saw they were LEO's I dun wanna get shot. I would not allow them in. Obviously I'm not a hostage so there is no need.

Last edited by teetsjones; 04-21-2013 at 3:09 PM..
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Old 04-21-2013, 3:04 PM
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On the surface, this looks pretty sketchy. But what happened before the video starts? Did the police have a warrant? I'm not saying it was perfectly legal and the police didn't violate anybody's rights. I'm saying that we shouldn't decide they're a bunch of jackbooted thugs trampling the Constitution until we know the full story.
I was under the impression they were just going door to door searching homes in a specific neighborhood... at least that's what I understood when listening to the news and police scanner during the event.
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Old 04-21-2013, 4:20 PM
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I really want to know the details of how all this was handled. That video is quite disturbing. Was this the standard protocol for the searches or was this particular house a high risk situation?

I was under the impression that police were asking permission to search homes, not that it was mandatory. And I don't care how grave the situation is, I will never be happy about having automatic weapons pointed at me and my family.
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Old 04-21-2013, 4:24 PM
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People's houses were searched without warrant or consent. New America hooray
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Old 04-21-2013, 4:51 PM
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All the video cameras and social media there are these days and yet if you do a search, this one video, with no context or information offered, is the the only one being posted.
You have a brain, start using it. Remember, if this is all the information that you need to come to a conclusion, then don't be surprised when you get railroaded and are then found guilty by people that think exactly like you, people that are easily led and don't demand more information before coming to a conclusion.
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  #14  
Old 04-21-2013, 4:59 PM
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Would they have kicked in the door if that guy didn't answer? That's the real question.

Boy... this is dangerous stuff.
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Last edited by Luieburger; 04-21-2013 at 5:05 PM..
  #15  
Old 04-21-2013, 5:21 PM
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My issue isn't with them going door to door. My issue is what happens when they're told "Not by the hair of my chinny chin chin!!!!!" This would be my response cus I would be packing as much heat as many of those officers on the street did that day. They wouldn't be too happy when I said "Hold on while I store my guns" and opening the door with gun on hip would go over like a turd in a punch bowl. So is there really a safe way to deal with this situation?
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Old 04-21-2013, 5:26 PM
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Originally Posted by ASTMedic View Post
My issue isn't with them going door to door. My issue is what happens when they're told "Not by the hair of my chinny chin chin!!!!!" This would be my response cus I would be packing as much heat as many of those officers on the street did that day. They wouldn't be too happy when I said "Hold on while I store my guns" and opening the door with gun on hip would go over like a turd in a punch bowl. So is there really a safe way to deal with this situation?
Ding ding ding... My point exactly.
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Old 04-21-2013, 6:23 PM
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Not knowing the full story behind this search I can't judge.

Did they have a reason to target this house?
Did the occupants know the bombers?
The guy who took the video, was his house searched in a similar manner?

I'm not siding with the police but there are just too many unknowns here to make judgement.
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Old 04-21-2013, 6:32 PM
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I've seen several interviews with residents that said they were asked for consent to search the home. And some said they did not ask to or search inside their home, just asked if they had seen the suspect and if everyone was okay.

Sure would be nice to know if that video is really from Watertown MA or a video of a lawful (w/search warrant) raid on a home that is being misrepresented as taking place during the search for the 2nd bomb suspect.

I'm having a hard time believing that they went home to home like this. There's just no way these homeowners wouldn't be all over the news showing how their rights were violated.

It also seems like all of the attention was on this 1 house and not a door to door situation.

If this is indeed what took place in Watertown, it is extremely disturbing and a huge issue.
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Old 04-21-2013, 6:32 PM
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Ever notice the first thing they do is to throw the 4th amendment out the window like it is conditional? This should be most troubling to any American who values his/her freedoms. NY has violated this as a function. I was shocked to learn they are still doing random searches in subways and other public areas even to this day as a result of Sept 11th This is unconstitutional. It reminds me of kindergarten when one kid can cause the whole class to get in trouble! Yet vigilantism and self-policing is frowned upon? WTF? Can't have it both ways. The idiots always win when we "give" up our rights in the name of security. Troubling part is the Boston PD/Mayor both stated "this is to make people feel safe". What a crock!!!!

Last edited by CA-Libertarian; 04-21-2013 at 6:36 PM..
  #20  
Old 04-21-2013, 6:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HOGLEG View Post
Coming soon to a town near you.

If an officer kicks in your door and see's you holding a weapon, expect to get shot.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ASTMedic View Post
My issue isn't with them going door to door. My issue is what happens when they're told "Not by the hair of my chinny chin chin!!!!!" This would be my response cus I would be packing as much heat as many of those officers on the street did that day. They wouldn't be too happy when I said "Hold on while I store my guns" and opening the door with gun on hip would go over like a turd in a punch bowl. So is there really a safe way to deal with this situation?
Essentially, what the proletariat elite (Feinstein, Bloomberg, Schumer, Obama and all these other anticonstitutional pieces of turds) want not just for us, but for the entire country.

Just look at the sh*tstorm of comments in there from this thread:
http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/s...d.php?t=749206
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Last edited by BHPFan; 04-21-2013 at 6:45 PM..
  #21  
Old 04-21-2013, 6:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HOGLEG View Post
Coming soon to a town near you.

If an officer kicks in your door and see's you holding a weapon, expect to get shot.
This is due to the militarization of the police. They even call us (citizens) civilians . They have more liberal rules of engagement than our own service members have against foreign enemy combatants!! This is a travesty. They get to shoot first cause "they are scared" (quit, no one forces them to take the job). Pathetic. You can see this first hand with seemingly wealthy communities getting what amounts to armored tanks. They are supposed to be local community security guards, yet they have granted themselves cart blanch "authority". Funny thing is they have zero responsibility to protect you and when you really need them (L.A and LA for example) they have the right to flee and be "scared". Bunch a hullabaloo!

Last edited by CA-Libertarian; 04-21-2013 at 6:47 PM..
  #22  
Old 04-21-2013, 6:47 PM
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...
Just look at the sh*tstorm of comments in there from the entire nation btw:
http://news.yahoo.com/dianne-feinste...ccmt-container
I don't read these things usually, but I will say it was good to see that she is getting her a*s ripped by people other than militant CALGUNS members.
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Old 04-21-2013, 6:59 PM
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This got me thinking that this all goes back to Terry V. They have taken Terry V to extremism and stretched it into something it was not meant to be. SCOTUS needs a new Terry ruling to quantify what really encompasses a legitimate stop. Their ruling was very specific but yet and still they get away with their own "interpretation" so long as no one has the means to challenge them. They will usually just drop the cases of those who have means while getting over on the majority public in our own name. We The People deserve another Terry ruling to put the public security guards in their place.
  #24  
Old 04-21-2013, 7:04 PM
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They like to use the term "Exigent Circumstance".
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Old 04-21-2013, 7:04 PM
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I stink at youtube links.....
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Old 04-21-2013, 7:09 PM
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so a single video, of a single raid, no context, no proof it was related to the boston bombing and we are supposed to be outraged?

I will tell what was outrageous in that video....the swat officer bottom left on the side walk sweeping the guys on the porch with his rifle. Now that is something to be up set about.

Look. if you had a video of the cops doing this kind of the thing house, after house, after house, on the same street, with proper proof to accompany it that "this is what happened in the search for the bostom bomber", then there might be something to be outraged about.

But I thought we all hold to, believe in innocent till guilty. And that it takes more than a passing accusation to prove guilt. or did I not get the memo that we are now becoming hypocrites too?
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Old 04-21-2013, 7:11 PM
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They like to use the term "Exigent Circumstance".
I am well aware of "hot pursuit". It is of no consequence with regard to violations of the 4th, particularly from those who wish/express no contact. They violate this daily and often as SOP. This is why SCOTUS owes us a further/expanded deceleration. This, I believe, is one of the most pressing issues of our time. They have abused Terry V like no other ruling in history.
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Old 04-21-2013, 7:28 PM
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Well in Yucaipa, San Bernardino county sheriffs are understandable on firearms. Had an armed stand off across from my house. Swat came and got us out and i got a free ride in the swat armored car. Had my glock on me the whole time. My wife let the officers know before opening the door I was armed. She did do a oops and turn on the porch light for a second. They kina didnt like that. Any way they stated they had no problems with the gun and just wanted to escort us to safety. All and all it went well and they were very professional. All things considered I didn't feel any rights trampled and I am way pro rights on this subject.
Just my lil story. Cops can do it right under bad situations.
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Old 04-21-2013, 7:49 PM
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You have a CCW?
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Old 04-21-2013, 7:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CA-Libertarian View Post
I am well aware of "hot pursuit". It is of no consequence with regard to violations of the 4th, particularly from those who wish/express no contact. They violate this daily and often as SOP. This is why SCOTUS owes us a further/expanded deceleration. This, I believe, is one of the most pressing issues of our time. They have abused Terry V like no other ruling in history.
They will still use it as justification for their actions. Especially in regards to this:

Exigency may be determined by: degree of urgency involved; amount of time needed to get a search warrant; whether evidence is about to be removed or destroyed; danger at the site; knowledge of the suspect that police are on his or her trail.
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Old 04-21-2013, 8:35 PM
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They will still use it as justification for their actions. Especially in regards to this:

Exigency may be determined by: degree of urgency involved; amount of time needed to get a search warrant; whether evidence is about to be removed or destroyed; danger at the site; knowledge of the suspect that police are on his or her trail.
This takes well documented and "open/communicated" facts. What happens day-to-day is much more sinister and calculated. They really are out to "get" certain people/populace.
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Old 04-21-2013, 8:39 PM
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You have a CCW? Nope raystonn.
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Old 04-21-2013, 9:11 PM
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Remember the police are there to protect you.
Turn in your weapons, you will not need them.
Think of the children.
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Old 04-21-2013, 10:46 PM
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The Bloomberg trolls are strong in this thread.
Why do I get the feeling that a couple of the poster here are laughing their heads off at how easy it is to manipulate Calguns members and make some here look like complete .
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Old 04-21-2013, 10:48 PM
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I really think that this is a false video. Looks like a drug raid to me. Notice how they are just focusing on the one house? I bet this has nothing to do with the bombings.
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Old 04-21-2013, 10:59 PM
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I really think that this is a false video. Looks like a drug raid to me. Notice how they are just focusing on the one house? I bet this has nothing to do with the bombings.
I sincerely hope that you're correct.
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Old 04-21-2013, 11:13 PM
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I sincerely hope that you're correct.
I believe I am. Did you see how many full grown men they pulled out of that house? Didn't look like your typical family to me. Also, if they were really worried about raiding each house I doubt the cops would let that guy film like that. They would have probably split up and searched his house at the same time.

Last edited by mmayer707; 04-21-2013 at 11:16 PM..
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Old 04-21-2013, 11:25 PM
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I sincerely hope that you're correct.
So you post this as what was happening in Watertown and you don't even know if this video is from the search for the terrorist. Can you be any more irresponsible?

By the way, those do not appear to be Watertown Mass. Trash cans and according to the City of Watertown website, garbage is collected Mon-Thur, so why are all those garbage cans out on the street.
http://www.ci.watertown.ma.us/?nid=333
Attachment 226527
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Last edited by TRICKSTER; 05-03-2015 at 9:04 PM..
  #39  
Old 04-21-2013, 11:44 PM
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Any Leo's here that might give some perspective? How can a private residence and individuals inside be searched without warrant? I'm taken aback by the removal, frisking and hands in the air treatment of non-suspects. How can this be legal.
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Old 04-21-2013, 11:49 PM
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^ Read my posts.....
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