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  #1  
Old 04-12-2013, 7:30 PM
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Default First 100rds of 223 on the 650, having some issues.

First off, I've been reloading 9, 40, 45, 10mm & 9x25 Dillon for the last few years, but this is my first crack at reloading rifle rounds.

Here's my setup:

Stage 1:
Size/Deprime (Dillon Steel)
Trim to 1.75" with Dillon RT1200

Stage 2:
Universal Decap
Powder Drop (24.5gr H335)
Powder Check
Seat Hornady 55gr SP to Cannelure, 2.20"ish (Dillon)
Taper Crimp to .002" under (Dillon)

With that out if the way, almost everything ran as smooth as expected. Here's a list of my problems:

1. The Hornady 55gr SP has a flat base, and falls off the case if I don't hold it all the way into the seating die. I assume that's normal for the flat base bullets, but I'm new to this.

2. The neck sheers off a little sliver of the jacket during the seating process sometimes. I've been told several times told that the Dillon trimmer chamfers the case enough, and that I wouldn't need any additional chamfering, so I'm not sure what's up there.

3. The Dillon Seating Die is leaving a dented ring on the bullet, about half way down the ogive. I've read that it's common for the Dillon seating die to leave a slight ring mark on the bullet, but that this type of dent is a problem. It's not a compressed load, and I'm seating and crimping separately.

4. There were a few bullets that seated crooked like the one in the photo on the right. There were a few that seated so crooked that it crushed in part of the case mouth. I didn't notice either of these issues until I inspected the rounds when I was done.



Any help will be greatly appreciated.
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Old 04-12-2013, 8:02 PM
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My fist guess is that the Dillon sizing die is squeezing your necks in pretty tightly.

Measure the neck diameter of a fired case and then measure after sizing in your Dillon sizing die, which I assume is the die in the RT-1200?

I bet you have a lot of tension there and that seating stem, which can be removed and polished a bit with a Q-tip and metal polish, is having to work hard to seat the bullets and is denting your bullets' noses.

Chris
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Old 04-12-2013, 8:06 PM
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I've only been reloading for a year, but I did have similar issue with 7.62x54r. Went to a bigger expander British 303 and it solved the problem of the tight neck. Definitely want to hear what the pro's say.

Curious, why aren't you seating the bullet lower in the cannelure?
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Old 04-12-2013, 8:23 PM
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I just started loading rifle rounds recently and have no problems with 308 and 30-06. But I have problems with the resizing processes for 223 brass. I get about 3 out of every 10 that will not fit in the chamber checker. At first I thought I had to trim the brass and it still did the same after trimming. It sticks out about 1mm from the chamber checker (bottom of cartridge).
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Old 04-12-2013, 8:32 PM
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You need to chamfer the inside of the neck when setting flat base bullets after using the dillon trimmer
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Old 04-12-2013, 8:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tiller View Post
You need to chamfer the inside of the neck when setting flat base bullets after using the dillon trimmer
Tiller's suggestion gets my vote.

Chrisgarrett made a good point as well, you only need about .001" of neck tension, maybe mic your expander ball.
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Old 04-12-2013, 9:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tiller View Post
You need to chamfer the inside of the neck when setting flat base bullets after using the dillon trimmer
this, sucks when you spent a bunch of money on the set up to only learn its the bullet that screws it up.
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Old 04-12-2013, 9:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tiller View Post
You need to chamfer the inside of the neck when setting flat base bullets after using the dillon trimmer
This. The Dillon trimmer does NOT chamfer or debur the case mouth. This does not present as much of a problem when loading boat-tail pills. But with flat-base bullets like the Hornady 2266, chamfering or flaring is almost a necessity. The Lyman M die might be one solution to your problem. This accomplishes the same task as an expander die for pistol calibers. Either that or chamfer the cases by hand or on a prep station as already suggested.
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Old 04-13-2013, 12:21 AM
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Doesn't the rt1200 put a little neck tension on the neck when trimming?

I assume you are tumbling after stage 1 to remove case lube/burs and is the reason for running the universal decap in stage 2 (cleaning the flash hole of media)? If so....

In stage 2 you can swap out the universal decap for a sizing die but leave it back out enough to only run the expander ball and decap pin through the case (no sizing) to ensure neck tension is good before proceeding.

Last edited by Yerman; 04-13-2013 at 12:24 AM..
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Old 04-13-2013, 6:43 AM
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I would also mic the bullets to make sure they are the correct diameter.
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Old 04-13-2013, 6:44 AM
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Thanks for all the input. The Dillon trimmer does add neck tension, so I'll try to find a Lyman M Die. If I can find one, I'll add it to the 5th position on the sizing/trimming toolhead. In the meantime I'll see if chamfering helps too.
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Old 04-13-2013, 7:19 AM
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never crimp my .223
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Old 04-18-2013, 9:10 PM
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Lyman M-Die solved the problem, thanks for the help everyone. I finally got a chance to shoot the AR I finished building back in January. It's a 16" BCM Middy with a Burris MTAC scope. The first shot was down & left a few inches at 50yds, but once I got it fairly dialed, it grouped pretty well. Not bad for the first time with a new rifle, new optic & new load.



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Old 04-19-2013, 9:26 AM
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Check to see if your trying to crimp,deburr your cases ,lube necks.
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Old 04-19-2013, 9:32 AM
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I had the same experience, with those same bullets. Trying to hold them all the way into the die was a PITA. Im sticking with boat tail. Much easier IMO.
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Old 04-19-2013, 10:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mark501w View Post
Check to see if your trying to crimp,deburr your cases ,lube necks.
I am seating & crimping at 2 different stations, and neither would have any effect on how tight the necks were BEFORE the seating station. Like I said right above your post, the M-Die fixed the problem.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Colt562 View Post
I had the same experience, with those same bullets. Trying to hold them all the way into the die was a PITA. Im sticking with boat tail. Much easier IMO.
After the expander ball of the Dillon sizing die does its job, the Dillon trim die resizes the neck again. I put a Lyman M Die in the size/trim toolhead, and I don't have to hold the bullets anymore. This also stopped the ring around the bullet, which I'm assuming was a result of extra seating pressure caused by the tight necks. Every single one of the 100rds I loaded with the M Die passed in my JP Case Guage, and all 100rds fed, fired & extracted perfectly.
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Old 04-19-2013, 4:16 PM
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Good to hear you found a solution...but the next time you have a problem with the Dillon 650, call Dillon support. They will gladly help you with ANY problem you might have with your reloader.
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Old 04-19-2013, 5:13 PM
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I just figured Dillon is busy enough as it is, and there are plenty of experienced reloaders on here to lean on. Plus, it wasn't a problem with my 650, it was a problem with my reloading process. Thanks again for all the help guys.
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Old 04-20-2013, 12:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tiller View Post
You need to chamfer the inside of the neck when setting flat base bullets after using the dillon trimmer
Yep.
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