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Calguns LEOs LEOs; chat, kibitz and relax. Non-LEOs; have a questions for a cop? Ask it here, in a CIVIL manner.

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  #1  
Old 02-02-2013, 10:41 AM
Just_some_guy Just_some_guy is offline
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Default Guns taken off suspects?

I've always been curious about the weapons that cops take off of criminal suspects. Maybe gang-banger vs. more vanilla burglars, thieves and pot peddlers?

What do you typically see? Hand guns, long guns? Calibers?

What condition?

Do they really know how to operate them, or just typically idiots who learned it all from rap videos?

How many instances would you say the suspect acquired the firearm in compliance with law at a gun shop, through a PPT/FFL transfer in California?

How many turn out as stolen?

Do people generally face weapons charges and prosecution, or does that just get folded in with whatever else it was they were up to?


What about domestic violence cases, divorce, stalkers, etc? Is it at all common that someone threatening his or her ex with a gun went into a gun store, paid retail and waited 10 days in order to carry out a threat or actual violence?
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  #2  
Old 02-02-2013, 12:33 PM
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I've recovered weapons of all descriptions. The really nicer weapons (a Colt Python, a King's custom 1911 and the like) have all been stolen. The cheaper weapons (like the Lorcin .25) are more often legally purchased, usually by a family member of the suspect, and then employed for some nefarious purpose.

In the L.A. riots, a group of gangsters drove a stolen pick-up truck into a gun dealer's warehouse and they got a whole bunch of nickle-plated Lorcin .25's with pink grips. We recovered a whole bunch of those over the next couple of years. Anytime a gangster got caught with one of those ugly guns, we knew exactly where it came from.

Charges are up to the D.A.. The usual strategy is to file everything and then bargain down. The "trading stock" of what goes away is generally determined by the weight of the evidence, or by the collateral effect of the charge. The Mirkarimi caper up in San Francisco is a good example of this. He pled guilty to a charge that would not disqualify him from possessing a weapon.

I don't know of any case where someone went through the ten-day wait and then carried out violence, but in a country of close to 300 million folks, I'm sure there is a story out there. Most DV cases that I've handled, were people have been extremely violent, the violent period last for hours, not days. I have seized weapons under the old 12028.5 section and felt that it was a good thing given the potential for violence at the scene. But when people are violent toward each other for long periods, they really tend to go their separate ways (either by divorcing, moving out, or getting sentenced).

Last edited by RickD427; 02-02-2013 at 12:39 PM..
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Old 02-02-2013, 12:35 PM
CBR_rider CBR_rider is offline
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Last year my district kept track of every gun seized during the year and put up a picture of each firearm. about 80 of us in the district seized over 300 firearms used in crimes. easily 80% of the guns were various handguns, I believe only four of those were "assault weapons:" 3 Tec 22s and a Mac 10. recently stolen guns were in good shape but some of the guns that had been on the street for awhile were pretty beat up.

Most of the long guns were shotguns. "Assault weapons" were few and far between. I don't know the exact number other than it was less than a dozen of all 300 plus guns were actually bought legally and subsequently used in a crime. Most all were reported stolen or unable to track down the owner.

Whenever possible, weapons charges were filed by us(I obviously don't know what the DA did on all cases). As for domestic violence cases, there may have been a case or two where the guns were bought legally but I can only think of one off the top of my head (and the gun was already owned).
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Old 02-04-2013, 12:48 AM
Just_some_guy Just_some_guy is offline
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Thanks for the info. We hear so much in the media and politicians about all the "guns on the streets" that it would be good to know, from first hand sources, what is really going on.

I figured the reality is a lot of low-end handguns that might have been bought legally at some point by a family member, or just no one knows exactly where they came from, and of course the ones just outright stolen.

All of the hoops they make law-abiding people like me jump through to buy a firearm just don't have any bearing on the reality of how guns get on the street.
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  #5  
Old 02-05-2013, 2:41 AM
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LEO here...

I have seized a few pistols from traffic stops, person searches,ect.
one at a DV incident, where the suspect was booked for felony DV and narcotics charges. Search of the house incident to an arrest and other circumstances, a stolen 9mm hand gun from the east coast was seized. DNA and victim statement proved possession. Prior gun related and robbery charges.

Ak47 recovered during a building search of a vacant unit in local housing area., as well as one recovered in a vehicle stop where the passenger was a Parolee At Large.

SKS recovered from a parole search of a subject encountered on a traffic stop in front if his house, when spent casings were located inside vehicle.

One .25 auto pistol was seized at the scene of a single vehicle Hit and run, abandoned vehicle. Didn't notice it right away with all the vehicle debris and fluids. No one in custody.

Guns are out there. I've seen other officers bring AR15s, AKs, ect from vehicle searches, pedestrian stops, and abandoned guns found on streets where a citizen calls in a found gun report.

I recently heard an old WW2 style grenade which was seized by EOD unit, after a person calling it in saw an 8 year old kid running around the apt complex with it. It turned out to be merit when we thought it was bogus. Thankfully it was recovered and no one hurt.
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Old 02-05-2013, 12:49 PM
Just_some_guy Just_some_guy is offline
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I have no doubt guns are out there, not at all.

Zack, in the incidents where you've seized firearms, would you say they were typically stolen, or acquired through other than above board and legal methods?

Kind of a dumb question, but I'm curious what the "bad guys" are carrying mostly and where do they get them?
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Old 02-06-2013, 8:52 PM
CBR_rider CBR_rider is offline
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Bad guys mostly carry handguns in my neck of the woods. Second favorite weapon last year where I worked seemed to be chopped up shotguns. Like I said in my earlier post, the majority were reported stolen. Of the rest, many were simply so old there was nothing in AFIS for them.
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  #8  
Old 02-09-2013, 12:53 AM
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The firearms seized that had a serial number resulted in stolen, and some of the high powered ones didn't have serial numbers or were filed off.

I've only seized one firearm that was legally registered to the party. It was seized for property for safekeeping.

Most if not all the bad guys we deal with have RAP sheets longer than a dictionary, so in most cases when we get one with a gun, I believe the DA goes with an enhancement during the preliminary hearings, unless we confirm it then we book them on the higher one. I just had a case where the jury convicted our custody on a firearm that has him going away for a long time. Testifying for three hours wasn't fun but a bad guy and a gun are off the streets.
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  #9  
Old 02-09-2013, 1:00 AM
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As far as where they get them...they mostly acquire them from residential burglaries, vehicle break ins and mainly crossing state lines. The fist questions in my interview to a victim of a burglary or vehicle break in is was there a gun stolen. Then I try to educate on safely securing a gun to prevent them getting into the wrong hands.

I sometimes see a trend of stolen guns from out of state.

Some of the cases where we use DNA testing on firearms, it comes back inconclusive because so many hands of gone through it.
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Old 02-11-2013, 5:45 PM
IlDuche IlDuche is offline
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We have been having a run of stolen, beat up old revolvers. 6/12 no ago it was Mac-11 style semi autos. Last year it was AK and SKS rifles. Seems to go in waves. Glocks and Ruger pistols are always popular.
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  #11  
Old 02-12-2013, 6:20 PM
ak_in_ca ak_in_ca is offline
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Most of the stuff I have come across has been the low end stuff .25's, .380's ravens hi points etc and the majority of murders ive handled have been the small caliber stuff but we get the occassional AR, AK etc.... Once got a full auto FAL off some nutbucket
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Old 02-16-2013, 5:56 PM
surfish95747 surfish95747 is offline
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Sorry to jump in the middle of a conversation, but, what happens to all the seized guns?
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  #13  
Old 02-16-2013, 7:35 PM
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In California, they get destroyed. Melted down into rebar.
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Old 02-16-2013, 7:50 PM
NORCAL#1 NORCAL#1 is offline
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I have a question what kind of sentences are these people getting? Obviously ever case is different but can you give any kind of good info on this?

Last edited by NORCAL#1; 02-16-2013 at 8:35 PM..
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  #15  
Old 02-16-2013, 9:00 PM
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NorCal, there are too many variables that come into play on sentencing.

It could be anything from a fine and informal probation to long prison sentences.
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Old 02-17-2013, 12:06 PM
surfish95747 surfish95747 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron-Solo View Post
In California, they get destroyed. Melted down into rebar.
Sad.
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  #17  
Old 02-17-2013, 12:26 PM
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This was in interesting article, does it ring true????

http://www.buckeyefirearms.org/node/8579

Nine of the 85 weapons were completely broken and unable to function. 17 more of the guns had limited functionality because of frequent (at least 1 in the first 3 rounds I fired) malfunctions, lack of magazines (5 guns), and other problems like incorrect magazines, and internal parts breakage that lead to inconsistent firing ability.

Caliber and Ammunition

It was quite shocking to me to note that many of the guns we seized were unloaded! Here's the breakdown:

- Unloaded- 24 (28%)

- Less than fully-loaded- 4 (5%)

- Loaded with the wrong caliber ammunition- 2 (2%)

- Loading status unknown- 6 (7%)

- Fully Loaded- 49 (57%)

--------


Out of 85 weapons seized:

- 24 are not loaded

- 2 are not loaded with the correct ammunition

- 9 are completely broken

Combine those facts and you will see that 41% of the weapons we seize from criminals are completely non-functional!
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Last edited by CessnaDriver; 02-17-2013 at 12:29 PM..
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  #18  
Old 02-17-2013, 1:49 PM
CBR_rider CBR_rider is offline
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That article is similar to my experience, yes.
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  #19  
Old 02-18-2013, 10:25 AM
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It is in alll kinds of shape and form. Some are beautiful with engraving, and some are crappy. There is no saying what it looks like. Generally speaking, they carry anything that can have their hands on.
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