Rock Island .22TCM

[colossians323]

Short review here

This gun is awesome...............I want one

[damngato]

That's pretty awesome!

[redhemi]

I wonder how much the 22 ammo will cost?

[SoCal Bob]

Two please

Here is a link to an AmericanHandgunner article: http://www.armscor.com.ph/img/AmericanHandgunnerTCM.pdf
And another from M1911.org: http://ezine.m1911.org/showthread.php?t=150

[colossians323]

Originally Posted by redhemi

I wonder how much the 22 ammo will cost?

Right now it looks like a buck a round. I am sure it will go down after this passes

Looks like less than .50 during normal times

[Kodachrome]

Theres an article about the RI .22TCM in the Jan.20,2013 issue of Shotgun News.
I like how it comes with a 9mm barrel also. Uses the same magazine as the TCM. Uses shortened .223 cases with a 40 grain pill at over 2000 fps.
Decent MSRP $749:
https://us.armscor.com/products/22-t...-micro-mag-9mm
Let us know how it shoots.
Happy Shooting!

[StefanJanowski]

Need

[loosewreck]

That 22 TCM looks pretty sweet!

[JeremyS]

If somebody makes a carbine in 22 TCM, it will be hard for me to avoid picking up a pistol & carbine combo. Especially w/ threaded barrels so I can put the ol' suppressor on

[k1dude]

The video is wrong. It is NOT a 9mm necked down to a .22. Kodachrome got it right - it's a .223 case that has been shortened.

It looks like a great little cartridge and pistol. I know a lot of women that will be interested in this. They will love the low recoil and the fit for smaller hands. And it still packs a wallop.

I suspect the ammo cost will remain high for years. It's a new cartridge and the big ammo companies aren't producing it yet. Other gun companies aren't making guns for it also. So lack of economies of scale will come into play regarding ammo cost.

[Czsp-01-9mm]

a least it comes with the 9mm barrel so that should help with ammo cost and availability well not right now though

[Mickey D]

17 round capacity? Won't be available in USA much longer.

[JeremyS]

Ballistics are nearly the same as this bad boy in my "I escaped from CA" collection, but capacity is half. Plus, .22 WMR is half the price and much easier to find... so... there's that.

[k1dude]

Originally Posted by JeremyS

Ballistics are nearly the same as this bad boy in my "I escaped from CA" collection, but capacity is half. Plus, .22 WMR is half the price and much easier to find... so... there's that.

I envy you for having that gun! Until the insanity began, I was planning on getting my hands on one through out-of-state parents. But now they're impossible to find and the price is in the stratosphere even if you can find one.

[colossians323]

Originally Posted by JeremyS

Ballistics are nearly the same as this bad boy in my "I escaped from CA" collection, but capacity is half. Plus, .22 WMR is half the price and much easier to find... so... there's that.

How does it swap out with a 9mm barrel?
It looks too small to make the swap

[DrewN]

I'm going to SSE a TCM as soon as I get some free cash. I'm a sucker for caliber swaps. Pretty sure you should be able to swap in a .38 Super barrel as well.

[k1dude]

Originally Posted by colossians323

How does it swap out with a 9mm barrel?
It looks too small to make the swap

You're looking at a Kel-Tec PMR in .22 mag. Not a RIA .22 TCM 1911.

[JeremyS]

Yeah, sorry to confuse! Unless you were making a point that the TCM has a big advantage because of the caliber swap capability. I'd agree with you there and I think that's super cool. Like two guns in one! However... they are not cheap ($700+ I believe). If the PMR actually ever sold for normal retail price, it would run about $350 to $375. As is, they're rare as unicorn eggs and priced accordingly.

[tonelar]

What's 22WMR doing out of a 5" barrel 1400fps? I got to light off some Southern Thunder charges (tannerite requiring 2200fps minimum) with a 6" TCM and all I can say is "gimme gimme".

Ammo was $19 per box of 50 last week.

Isn't a 9mm necked down to 5.56 the same thing as a shorty .223?

[JeremyS]

Originally Posted by tonelar

What's 22WMR doing out of a 5" barrel 1400fps?

Yes, you're pretty much spot on. .22 wmr was developed for rifles so it has slower burning powder and doesn't get up to its intended velocity from a pistol. There are rounds that do 1600+ out of the PMR. There are also new rounds designed specifically for shooting out of a pistol, thanks to the popularity of the PMR and various revolvers in 22wmr, and they are supposed to hit even higher velocities. I haven't seen them chronographed though so can't say. But... probably not hitting the 1900 to 2100 that people have measured from the 22 TCM. But it's cheaper and it holds 30 rounds so lol


OR... there's always this round, which actually is a necked-down 9mm:





BTW -- sorry for sort of derailing the thread a little bit here. Only doing it because the TCM has been out for a long time now and has like 1,000 other threads for it on the forum here . Not that I don't like it! I hope to shoot one soon.

[colossians323]

Originally Posted by k1dude

You're looking at a Kel-Tec PMR in .22 mag. Not a RIA .22 TCM 1911.

Thanks, I was making the point that the RIA, had advantages

[JeremyS]

BTW they did release a rifle at SHOT Show in 22 TCM, in case anyone missed that:



https://us.armscor.com/news-and-medi...e-at-shot-show

I'd still like to see a semi-auto carbine chambered for it though.

[Kingofthehill]

Originally Posted by JeremyS

Ballistics are nearly the same as this bad boy in my "I escaped from CA" collection, but capacity is half. Plus, .22 WMR is half the price and much easier to find... so... there's that.

Agreed. I shot the TCM at SHOT show 2012 and although it was cool, my PMR is a far better choice IMO. I would bet the .22 tcm cartridge costs more than the .22 WMR. That being said, i sure do love my FN 5.7 better than both of those other two!

[datsunrdster67]

So does anyone knowing the tcm barrel would fit the 1911 9mm tactical RIA? If that's the case I wouldn't mind buying the barrel and just rock it on my 9mm tac. Thought a single stack I'm sure it will be begun just to blast a few tcm rounds thru it.

[DrewN]

How exactly does .22 WMR come anywhere near .22 TCM or 5.7x28? Kel-Tec have stated that a 40 grain .22 WMR round should reach a velocity of 1230 fps from the 4.3″ barrel of their PMR-30 pistol. This works out to 134.40 ft/lbs of energy. The .22 TCM and 5.7 x 28 are over 2000 fps with a 40 gr., that's something like 345 ft/lps.

[JeremyS]

You're right, I overstated it a bit. However, most chrony results I have seen are putting 40 grain loads like Maxi-Mag in the 1,420 range, and some of the ballistic tip varmint stuff over 1,600. I have yet to see results from the new personal defense .22wmr that is designed for pistol length barrels. Hoping that's getting up even higher.

Also, should be mentioned that most chrony results I've seen for 22tcm out of the RIA 1911 have it in the 1,920 to 2,050 range. YES, definitely a lot faster than 22wmr from a pistol. But, it isn't the 2,200 you see in most of the advertisements and such. You can tell from the giant fireballs that all of the powder isn't burning in the barrel. Still a small fireball compared to the WMR though

I wouldn't really shoot any of them as defensive loads anyway. Except, I do think the PMR30 makes a great B.O.B gun. The gun, fully loaded with 30 rounds plus a spare mag fully loaded with 30 rounds weighs the same amount as a single loaded PMAG. You could carry another 500 rounds in your bag and barely notice. The Five-seveN is great in this way as well, if only the ammo was more available and wasn't so freaking crazy expensive.

The low cost and high availability of the .22 WMR ammo, the huge prevalence of rifles chambered in it, and the 30-round capacity and insanely light weight of the PMR is what made me go this route.

It sounds like a .44 mag with a fireball to match, but no muzzle flip or recoil despite the light weight. Very weird to shoot because of that, and the noise and rapid fire always draws a crowd after you go past 15 rounds and you're still blasting away with no end in sight . Great trigger, btw. Shockingly good.

[DrewN]

Oh, I'm sure I'd love the PMR. Might as well be Monica Belluci's undying lust though, considering I'm in OC. Besides I love the RIAs. What other 1911 will you happily put a file to 5 minutes after you get it home?

[B!ngo]

Yea, the FiveSeven and PS90 are brilliant designs with the 5.7 cartridge. But the architecture/design-center of those 'systems' call for a large number of cartridges 'at the ready' with 20, 30, 50 or more in the magazine, depending on the configuration. Sadly here in CA, 10's the limit. It's why I came close to buying the pair, the PS90 and FiveSeven and then realize that I'd never be able to use the design as it was intended being limited to 10 rounds per mag.
I suspect that if you told the FNH people that you're going to load 10 rounds in each gun and rely on them for HD/SD, they'd give that 'um, you don't get it' kind of look that you get from Belgian natives.
B

Originally Posted by Kingofthehill

Agreed. I shot the TCM at SHOT show 2012 and although it was cool, my PMR is a far better choice IMO. I would bet the .22 tcm cartridge costs more than the .22 WMR. That being said, i sure do love my FN 5.7 better than both of those other two!

[JoeyJ]

Originally Posted by JeremyS

If somebody makes a carbine in 22 TCM, it will be hard for me to avoid picking up a pistol & carbine combo. Especially w/ threaded barrels so I can put the ol' suppressor on

RI showed an bolt action at the shot show, both are now on my must have list. The pistol has been shown to pierce 4mm steel plate, pics attached, against other hand guns and a mini 14 @ 15 meters. The new bolt action has claims of 2800fps

[1911 .45]

I just ordered a few of these 1911's. CAN NOT wait to shoot this baby. I'll post pics and info when they arrive.

Great info on this thread.

[wingnut232]

Does anyone know of a dealer that is doing SSE on these?

[munkeeboi]

i wonder if a standard 1911 9mm barrel will work. If so, any of the FFL's doing 9mm 1911's now can do this as an SSE.

Just picked up a 5.7 and PMR 30 (for about $1100....FOR BOTH!) so I want to get this for the trifecta!