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California 2nd Amend. Political Discussion & Activism Discuss gun rights activism and 2A related political topics here. All advice given is NOT legal counsel.

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  #121  
Old 01-05-2013, 2:27 PM
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Default At some point.......

The Heller 5 is going to get tired of deciding case after case where anti-gun rights politicians have passed clearly unconstitutional laws and just flat out define the extent and limits of the 2nd Amendment right. I just hope they live long enough to do that, because anyone Obama appoints flat out will not care what the constitution says.....
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  #122  
Old 01-05-2013, 2:32 PM
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It will be $1500 soon .... Unfortunately ...
if that's the case, time to dust off the BB guns.
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  #123  
Old 01-05-2013, 5:12 PM
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Originally Posted by vincewarde View Post
The Heller 5 is going to get tired of deciding case after case where anti-gun rights politicians have passed clearly unconstitutional laws and just flat out define the extent and limits of the 2nd Amendment right. I just hope they live long enough to do that, because anyone Obama appoints flat out will not care what the constitution says.....
One of the Heller 5 will exit stage left before they get tired of deciding these cases.

And regardless, there is nothing they can do to prevent these cases from repeatedly coming their way. They have no real power over the lower courts except the U.S. Marshals, and that is a power they absolutely will not exercise here.

Anti-self-defense lower courts will use the excuse that the "fact patterns" of the cases before them differ from those the Supreme Court ruled on previously, and therefore there is "some" "justification" for ruling in the way the Supreme Court made plain they shouldn't. When they do rule in our favor, it will be with a "poison pill" that renders the entire decision unpalatable (e.g., the Heller III ruling that would have turned strict scrutiny into rational basis).


Because it's now only a matter of time before we lose one of the Heller 5 and said loss is replaced with an anti-rights Sotomayor admirer, it's guaranteed that lower courts which defy the Supreme Court now will not only not pay the price for it, but will be rewarded later when the balance on the Supreme Court shifts away from the Constitution.


No, this is a fight we must fight no matter what, but it is a fight we will now lose for sure in the end, thanks to Obama's reelection.
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  #124  
Old 01-05-2013, 5:35 PM
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People should be kind and polite and quiet and let the lawyers fight it when it is over. Reasoning here will just make the bill more an annoyance.
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  #125  
Old 01-06-2013, 8:34 PM
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My post deleted. Is that better?
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  #126  
Old 01-06-2013, 10:57 PM
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Originally Posted by IVC View Post
While AB 962 got injunction based on being vague, the real "meat" behind the challenge to AB 962 was about a state trying to regulate interstate commerce. Should this bill pass, there is a ready lawsuit. This type of challenge has already been successfully applied in other states that tried the same trick with mail order tobacco.

The more these silly bills get introduced, the sooner we'll have some meaningful court precedents on our side which will forever close future attempts of this kind. This works for us.
For those coming late into this thread and needing to display their analysis of it's various shortcomings, the above is good and well-reasoned advice.

The other piece of good advice is please resist the urge to post your analysis and thereby possibly strengthen this piece of legislative drivel into a real threat!

I second the motion made earlier to close this thread and wish that any others like it would be closed as well. We DON'T need to help the enemy with information!
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  #127  
Old 01-07-2013, 4:22 AM
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Just remember that anything posted on a forum is immediately archived in various search engines, deletion doesn't necessarily remove it from the Internet. Do not post anything that shouldn't be read.

The other thing is that sometimes we don't expand our vision beyond the immediate issue. Is the problem ammunition and magazine legislation, or is it something larger? What we are facing is a much larger complex set of factors. By that I refer to the examples of disintegration of Constitutional authority and a decline in economic responsibility among many more. This has been a long gradual process brought about by liberal and socialist undermining of every facet of our government. So what's the answer?

What I see is the need to go beyond Second Amendment issues, gun control, so called assault weapons, etc., to include other background issues that support the opposition. For example, if you examine the supporters of those legislators proposing these measures, you will find major contributors include labor unions. Thus, mounting a permanent campaign for establishing right-to-work laws will eventually bear fruit and divert union funds to fight against the movement. As more states join the right-to-work column, the unions suffer depletion of their strength. A movement to first reform and then prohibit public employee unions would be a direct attack on the root of the problem and further divert the forces of oppression. The war need not be won immediately, nor even the battles, the gain comes in the fight and dissemination of information arguing facts about cost, fairness, and organized criminal aspects of unions. Public attitudes change as the constant drum-roll of factual argument is heard.

Not to suggest that firearms groups must lead this fight, but that firearms civil rights supporters look to those existing organizations already engaged with those issues. If we are to reform government in any meaningful way, we must adopt the same methods as the leftists used to erode the situation to its current condition. The time is ripe, and will be made easier as paychecks diminish, the economy continues to decline, and the cost of a loaf of bread rises over five dollars (it has already in some markets). Something to think about.
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  #128  
Old 01-07-2013, 5:20 PM
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Right now, can I still buy ammo online and have it shipped legally to me in California (assuming my county allows it)?
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  #129  
Old 01-07-2013, 5:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by moisesangulo View Post
Right now, can I still buy ammo online and have it shipped legally to me in California (assuming my county allows it)?
No. Must buy at WalMart
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  #130  
Old 01-07-2013, 5:44 PM
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Originally Posted by Rackatak View Post
No. Must buy at WalMart
That's incorrect. Please don't spread misinformation here.
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  #131  
Old 01-07-2013, 5:56 PM
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Wow, Talk about separated at birth

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  #132  
Old 01-07-2013, 5:56 PM
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I just don't want to order it and then have the bill pass (while it's on its way) and have to return it, not get a refund, and get into trouble.

Thanks.
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  #133  
Old 01-07-2013, 6:08 PM
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Stay silent. Stay vigilant. They can't write bull**** and pass bull**** like this if we don't help them fix their flawed framework.
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  #134  
Old 01-07-2013, 6:21 PM
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Anyone have any talking points I can use when writing my reps?

I'm kind of itching to get on this...

Feel free to pm me if opsec is a concern.
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  #135  
Old 01-07-2013, 6:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by G-Man WC View Post
Wow, Talk about separated at birth

I was thinking more like




Last edited by Vlad 11; 01-31-2013 at 10:46 PM..
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  #136  
Old 01-07-2013, 6:44 PM
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Just a reminder; with a dem supermajority, pretty much all state anti-gun measures will pass without a fight. This means you should NOT comment on them until they are ready to be voted on. Any comments you make can (and will) be used to make the laws either more onerous, or harder to defeat in a lawsuit (or both).
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  #137  
Old 01-08-2013, 2:31 AM
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Mondays bill unveiling says...AB 48 would establish procedures and restrictions on the sale of ammunition comparable to those that currently cover gun sales. The legislation bans kits that convert guns into illegal assault weapons, requires ammunition sellers to be licensed and to report ammunition sales to the Department of Justice, and additionally requires large ammo purchases made over a short time period to be reported to local law enforcement.

Looks like they're going after the bullet button again also.
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  #138  
Old 01-08-2013, 2:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ANGLICO View Post
CA will change the names of the Ag Check Points to Ag and Ammo Check Points!

No doubt they will force OR, NV and AZ to restrict sales of Ammo to people with CA IDs. Or add rules against the importation of AMMO.
California cannot force bordering states to do anything. "can you pretty please enforce our law in your state" ain't gonna happen.

Last edited by luckystrike; 01-08-2013 at 3:00 AM..
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  #139  
Old 01-08-2013, 6:04 AM
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Mods, please lock this thread. Nothing good can come of analyzing this bill for the opposition... we know they have staffers reading calguns.
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The inevitable explosion gets closer and closer, coming in little steps, but closer every day.
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  #140  
Old 01-08-2013, 7:21 AM
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AB 48 is deeply flawed, and should be straightforward to nullify in court.

I will step up my contributions to CalGuns Foundation.
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  #141  
Old 01-08-2013, 7:23 AM
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Let's try another approach . . . .

Quote:
The massacre in Newton, Conn., and other mass shootings have prompted for a call to curb gun violence.

California assembly member Nancy Skinner answered that call with a proposal to restrict ammunition sales in the state.

“2,800 people in California were killed last year by gunfire," Skinner said. "It is easier to buy bullets than cough medicine or alcohol. It should not be that easy. We need to have much more scrutiny when it comes to the purchase of guns."

”Right now you can buy bullets in any store and the sale is not recorded”, James said. "Gun violence will continue unless we control the sale of bullets."

The so-called "bullet bill" would also ban kits to convert ammunition clips into high-capacity magazines. At the same time, this debate goes on some are questioning why a new gun shop is now open for business In Los Gatos.
More: http://www.nbcbayarea.com/news/local...968592.html?dr

It appears that this forum is a great resource for these Ruling Class Princes.
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  #142  
Old 01-08-2013, 7:40 AM
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http://www.californiareport.org/archive/R201301080850/a
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  #143  
Old 01-08-2013, 7:42 AM
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Banning something from out of state is against free trade and commerce laws, no?
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  #144  
Old 01-08-2013, 8:02 AM
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Post up your comments, folks. It's important to maintain a steady voice of calm opposition to this measure.
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  #145  
Old 01-08-2013, 8:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IXMM View Post
if that's the case, time to dust off the BB guns.
Which in the City of LA are already ILLEGAL to shoot in your own backyard!
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  #146  
Old 01-08-2013, 8:31 AM
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Originally Posted by X-NewYawker View Post
Which in the City of LA are already ILLEGAL to shoot in your own backyard!
In most cities that's illegal, Covina, West Covina, San Dimas, and glendora. The only one I've checked that it isn't illegal is in walnut.
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  #147  
Old 01-08-2013, 10:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ANGLICO View Post
The Berkeley Daily Planet
Friday January 04, 2013 - 1000 AM

Editor's note: As this issue is published, we're delighted to learn that on Monday a new bill for the California legislature which does exactly what we've asked in today's editorial will be introduced, as described in the following press release:

OAKLAND, CA – To curb gun violence, mass shootings and the stockpiling of ammunition, State Assemblymember Nancy Skinner (D-Berkeley) and supporters will unveil legislation, AB 48, to establish oversight of California’s ammunition marketplace.

“When will deadly ammunition be viewed as a risk to public safety?” Skinner said. “If common cold medicines, alcohol and tobacco are regulated for their risk to public health and safety, why isn’t ammunition? Assembly Bill 48 will place boundaries on the bullets that have ravaged our communities.”

Assemblymember Skinner and supporters will announce legislation, AB 48, to regulate and tighten ammunition sales in California and ban high-capacity magazines.

This bill will:

•Regulate all ammunition sales,
•Require ammunition purchasers to show identification,
•Require ammunition sellers to be licensed dealers,
•Require ammunition sellers to report sales to the Department of Justice,
Ban kits to convert ammunition clips into high-capacity magazines.

Read the rest: http://berkeleydailyplanet.com/issue...ed-on-Monday--
How does one convert a clip into a magazine? LOL
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  #148  
Old 01-08-2013, 10:36 AM
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Originally Posted by 1stLineGear View Post
How does one...
Silence is golden on this topic.

A.W.D
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  #149  
Old 01-08-2013, 10:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by compulsivegunbuyer View Post
Well, if it passes, it will weed out all the hoarders, paranoid delusionists, and nut cases, and I might actualy be able to go into the store and buy a friggin box of ammo. **** it, I'm gonna support the damn thing.
It is a prelude to a COMPLETE ban---WAKE UP! THEY WILL NOT STOP
THERE. HISTORY HAS PROVEN THIS!
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  #150  
Old 01-08-2013, 10:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Moonshine View Post
Guys please stop giving them ideas... Really please. On a side note the ammo cards are shall issue so while its an inconvenience it's not a show stopper. I'm way more concerned about SB-47!
It doesn't matter if they see what we are thinking. There ideas are
MOST DEFININTELY unconstitutional. Restricting ammo would actually
require repel of the 2nd Amendment. Don't you get it, these liberals REALLY are quite stupid in that they actually think these bans will fly. The won't
be anything more then temporary setbacks before the court rules them
as unconstitutional. But the aggravation of having to deal with it at all is unacceptable. There really will be a special place in Hell reserved
for all these liberals.

Last edited by jmdove; 01-08-2013 at 10:57 AM..
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  #151  
Old 01-08-2013, 12:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by moisesangulo View Post
Right now, can I still buy ammo online and have it shipped legally to me in California (assuming my county allows it)?

Welcome to CalGuns Moises!

Yes, you can buy ammo to your hearts content, no restrictions except in a couple of cities/counties that have local ordinances.

Unfortunately many online retailers are very low on stock due to the Second Great Obama Gun and Ammo Buying Frenzy. There has been an unprecedented tidal wave of sales and orders from panicked gun owners across the nation who fear new State and Federal restrictions on gun and ammo purchases and possession.

Stay tuned for updates on new proposals in Congress and the CA Legislature. As has been said here already, new bills with rare exceptions take effect on the first day of the new year following passage.
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  #152  
Old 01-08-2013, 5:43 PM
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if you don't like these new laws, let your assembly person know. If they get inundated with emails at least they will know why they were booted out of office on the next election!

http://findyourrep.legislature.ca.gov/
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  #153  
Old 01-08-2013, 7:08 PM
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No.
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  #154  
Old 01-08-2013, 7:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1stLineGear View Post
How does one convert a clip into a magazine? LOL
dam good question. i bet some magical elf can do it.
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Quote:
Public Safety Chairman Reggie Jones Sawyer, D-Los Angeles said, “This is California; we don’t pay too much attention to the Constitution,”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z6Dj8tdSC1A
contact the governor
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  #155  
Old 01-08-2013, 11:29 PM
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Cease your speculating and donate to CalGuns Foundation
This fight will be prolonged and expensive
Do your share to help us win it!
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  #156  
Old 01-09-2013, 10:03 AM
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Well the story is public:
http://abclocal.go.com/kabc/story?se...ate&id=8945496
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  #157  
Old 01-09-2013, 12:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by curtisfong View Post
Just a reminder; with a dem supermajority, pretty much all state anti-gun measures will pass without a fight. This means you should NOT comment on them until they are ready to be voted on. Any comments you make can (and will) be used to make the laws either more onerous, or harder to defeat in a lawsuit (or both).
So are we just planning on court challenges for this and other state bills? CGF seems to have been silent so far on action plans at least for this bill. Now that this bill has been proposed and introduced, anyone know what committee it might be in so I can direct calls and correspondence to the appropriate members?

I'm hoping for another well-executed strategy such as what happened with SB249.
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  #158  
Old 01-09-2013, 1:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Wingnut View Post
This bill was likely constructed by a staff of advisors tasked to read this forum.

Illustrating all the shortcomings that are in this legislation as it's currently written gives them a roadmap to revise it. Should it pass, it will get jammed up in court by CGF and other entities. Let's not fight the grabbers' battle for them. Run silent, run deep, folks.
RIGHT? I've said this before... Deconstructing bills and suggesting loopholes or even inadequacies and constitutionally bankrupt segments is doing nothing to help our cause. Providing them with a proofread stream of comments is in no way benefitting us.

I would write my senators but they're the bastards who are pushing the AWB.
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California Honey badger. It makes the laws it wants to make.

“Gun control is like trying to reduce drunk driving by making it tougher for sober people to own cars.” -Unknown

"Remember that it’s far easier to keep the dogs of war at bay, when they’re not barking in your own backyard." -Unknown

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  #159  
Old 01-09-2013, 1:17 PM
PixelBender PixelBender is offline
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Originally Posted by jmdove View Post
It is a prelude to a COMPLETE ban---WAKE UP! THEY WILL NOT STOP
THERE. HISTORY HAS PROVEN THIS!
Open Cary - Pistols: GONE
Open Cary - Long Guns: GONE
Detachable Magazines: GONE
Standard capacity: GONE
LTC: GONE (in the majority of metropolitan regions - places where we need them most)

At what point do we say enough is enough? I wonder where our money goes sometimes, and what of the NRA? The Bay Area keep cranking out more and more libtards to run this country. I'm not a Republican but honestly I would rather have my gun shops instead of weed shops.
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California Honey badger. It makes the laws it wants to make.

“Gun control is like trying to reduce drunk driving by making it tougher for sober people to own cars.” -Unknown

"Remember that it’s far easier to keep the dogs of war at bay, when they’re not barking in your own backyard." -Unknown

CA Bears Target Shooters' on MEETUP
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  #160  
Old 01-09-2013, 3:54 PM
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Ford8N Ford8N is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PixelBender View Post
Open Cary - Pistols: GONE
Open Cary - Long Guns: GONE
Detachable Magazines: GONE
Standard capacity: GONE
LTC: GONE (in the majority of metropolitan regions - places where we need them most)

At what point do we say enough is enough? I wonder where our money goes sometimes, and what of the NRA? The Bay Area keep cranking out more and more libtards to run this country. I'm not a Republican but honestly I would rather have my gun shops instead of weed shops.
That point has happened many years ago. To late now.
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