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  #1  
Old 12-27-2012, 9:08 AM
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Default Vendors that impose restrictions that are not yet legislation?

This is tied into another thread but I wanted to open the discussion wider within the 2A/Legal group. If it does not fit here move it.

Whatís with the vendors that spontaneously decide they are going to preemptively impose there own restrictions before any governmental restrictions or legislation is imposed? If there has been no changes in the law, why do they do it?

Do you all think itís smart business practices considering the political climate or just gutless cowards that really do not support the shooting community?

I no longer buy from Sportsman Guide, CTD and Arsenal because of how they treat CA customers.

Thoughts? Opinions? Diatribes?

Thanks
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  #2  
Old 12-27-2012, 9:40 AM
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support the ones that are not doing that.
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Old 12-27-2012, 9:40 AM
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support the ones that are not doing that.
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  #4  
Old 12-27-2012, 9:52 AM
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Yeah. I get that. I'm trying to understand the logic/mentality behind it.

Thanks
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  #5  
Old 12-27-2012, 10:15 AM
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support the ones that are not doing that.
^^^This, and remember them when this is all over
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"It wasn't a failure of laws," said Amanda Wilcox, who along with her husband, Nick, lobbies for the California chapter of the Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence. "I just don't see how our gun laws could have stopped something like that."
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  #6  
Old 12-27-2012, 10:16 AM
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support the ones that are not doing that.
Here here. Plenty of great vendors that are working with us not against us.

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Yeah. I get that. I'm trying to understand the logic/mentality behind it.

Thanks
It's a pr move. Some of them were named by the media as selling "evil" stuff. Some don't want to be named. It puts a lot of pressure on them.
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  #7  
Old 12-27-2012, 10:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thefitter View Post
If there has been no changes in the law, why do they do it?

Do you all think itís smart business practices considering the political climate or just gutless cowards that really do not support the shooting community?

I no longer buy from Sportsman Guide, CTD and Arsenal because of how they treat CA customers.

Thoughts? Opinions? Diatribes?

Thanks
CYA is probably the main reason, if California is not seen as a large portion of their revenue. In one line you thinking you could say they were prescient because while Sportsman Gude and CTD were doing this, Bloomberg went after several dozen non-New York state gun shops. However, this never actually happened with the mail order business so it turns out they weren't so prescient. Then other mail-order companies stood up to take up the slack.

In the case of CTD, one poster here (it might have been CSACannoneer but I forget) said he talked to them at a SHOT show or something, and they were the kind of non-California gun owner with the "blame-the-victim" haughtiness towards California gun owners that we sometimes see.
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  #8  
Old 12-27-2012, 10:49 AM
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Originally Posted by thefitter View Post
Yeah. I get that. I'm trying to understand the logic/mentality behind it.

Thanks
Well that's the problem, there is no logic involved. There is no laws preventing them from selling us stuff that other vendors sell us. They just won't!!! To understand their mentality would require you to actually ask them, unless they have posted an explanation somewhere and I missed it. As for me, why waste time on outfits like CTD.
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Old 12-27-2012, 11:26 AM
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well, i know i won't be shopping at dick's anymore after they pulled black rifles from their shelves.
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  #10  
Old 12-27-2012, 12:22 PM
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Originally Posted by TomMcC View Post
Well that's the problem, there is no logic involved. There is no laws preventing them from selling us stuff that other vendors sell us. They just won't!!! To understand their mentality would require you to actually ask them, unless they have posted an explanation somewhere and I missed it. As for me, why waste time on outfits like CTD.
I did ask one vendor:

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/s...d.php?t=664515

I know I expect logic in an illogical world.

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  #11  
Old 12-27-2012, 12:55 PM
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Originally Posted by Creeping Incrementalism View Post
...and they were the kind of non-California gun owner with the "blame-the-victim" haughtiness towards California gun owners that we sometimes see.
And we return the favor using the exact same "blame-the-victim" mentality by calling for boycotts of these stores, instead of acknowledging that it is the same CA laws that restrict us that cause them to avoid CA.
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  #12  
Old 12-27-2012, 1:21 PM
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And we return the favor using the exact same "blame-the-victim" mentality by calling for boycotts of these stores, instead of acknowledging that it is the same CA laws that restrict us that cause them to avoid CA.

Pay attention, the issue is that some vendors are implementing their own restrictions without any legal cause, just paranoia.

Nobody is expecting a vendor to break any laws to sell in CA.
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  #13  
Old 12-27-2012, 1:58 PM
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Pay attention, the issue is that some vendors are implementing their own restrictions without any legal cause, just paranoia.

Nobody is expecting a vendor to break any laws to sell in CA.
It's not paranoia. What you think is "legal" and how vendors are taken to court are completely different things. For example, Bloomberg in NYC had an agenda to sue all manufacturers and vendors into bankruptcy, legal or not. It took an act of Congress to stop this practice. Similarly, Yee thinks that bullet buttons are an illegal loophole and is fighting it.

A business is exposed to much more liability and frivolous actions than an individual. Businesses must live in real world where "legal" doesn't have a meaning and "legal action" is the keyword.
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  #14  
Old 12-27-2012, 2:39 PM
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It's not paranoia. What you think is "legal" and how vendors are taken to court are completely different things. For example, Bloomberg in NYC had an agenda to sue all manufacturers and vendors into bankruptcy, legal or not. It took an act of Congress to stop this practice. Similarly, Yee thinks that bullet buttons are an illegal loophole and is fighting it.

A business is exposed to much more liability and frivolous actions than an individual. Businesses must live in real world where "legal" doesn't have a meaning and "legal action" is the keyword.
Then they are giving the antis a win simply by being scared off. That's disheartening on many levels.
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Old 12-27-2012, 2:55 PM
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It's not really a win for the antis, more of a case for us to go and talk to these vendors and try to get them to push the envelope a bit. Think about how many gun stores won't do SSE even though we all know it's legal.
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  #16  
Old 12-27-2012, 6:12 PM
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Best way to get even is the pocket book, I've kept tabs on the places doing this\ extreme gouging and lots of others have too. They will be remembered when this blows over.
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  #17  
Old 12-27-2012, 6:24 PM
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PRIVATE COMPANIES AND INDIVIDUALS are not yet bound by 2A; gun owners are not any form of 'protected class' such as race or national origin or religion. That being so, companies and individuals are permitted to make their decisions based on whatever they like or their stockholders prefer. The available response to such businesses is to choose to patronize them or not, and to choose to tell such businesses why, or not.

Took a couple of years but I finally got Sportsman's Guide to stop sending catalogs. (Some still appear when they buy a new mailing list and I'm on it.)
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