Calguns.net  

Home My iTrader Join the NRA Donate to CGSSA Sponsors CGN Google Search
CA Semiauto Ban(AW)ID Flowchart CA Handgun Ban ID Flowchart CA Shotgun Ban ID Flowchart
Go Back   Calguns.net > FIREARMS DISCUSSIONS > Curio & Relic/Black Powder
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Mark Forums Read

Curio & Relic/Black Powder Curio & Relics and Black Powder Firearms, Old School shooting fun!

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 12-01-2012, 9:37 PM
RED VASQUEZ's Avatar
RED VASQUEZ RED VASQUEZ is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Foxtrot-Bravo
Posts: 240
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Question 1916 Mauser

Have some questions about the spanish mauser m1916 in 7.62x51.

What kind of accuracy can I expect?-I looked on youtube and other gun forums but couldn't find information on what kind of groups you can get with this rifle.

How sturdy are these rifles?-I know mausers have a reputation for being hardy, but what about this version?

Thanks for your help
__________________
"I don't facebook, I Calguns"~Me
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 12-01-2012, 9:50 PM
Milsurps's Avatar
Milsurps Milsurps is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: People's Republik of Kalifornistan
Posts: 1,756
iTrader: 7 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by RED VASQUEZ View Post
Have some questions about the spanish mauser m1916 in 7.62x51.

What kind of accuracy can I expect?-I looked on youtube and other gun forums but couldn't find information on what kind of groups you can get with this rifle.

How sturdy are these rifles?-I know mausers have a reputation for being hardy, but what about this version?

Thanks for your help
The mauser m1916 in 7.62x51. (FR-7) is the old 2 lug Mauser. It's weaker and won't safely handle modern 7.62x51 (.308). The 7.62x51 CETME ammo is difficult to find.

http://world.guns.ru/rifle/repeating...r-7-fr--e.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FR8
__________________
http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/signaturepics/sigpic56689_3.gif
Dulce Bellum Inexpertis

NRA Patron Member
NRA Range Safety Officer


I am not a product of my circumstances. I am a product of my decisions. –Stephen Covey
كافر
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 12-01-2012, 9:55 PM
C&Rtrader's Avatar
C&Rtrader C&Rtrader is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Marin (Nothern California)
Posts: 1,464
iTrader: 54 / 100%
Default

They kick like a very very angry mule. The rear sight starts at 300 meters for distance. sight radius is very short.

if you are looking for a target mauser this is not your gun. Get a swede. If you are looking for something go boom like a M44 mosin... this is your gun.
__________________
WTB: Russian Military Makarov. .22 mag Cylinder for 50s Colt Frontier Scout, C&R Walthers
WTS: Several Neat Mosins, Russian SKS
WTS: Vintage Kenner Star Wars, PM me re details.
Located in Norcal.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 12-01-2012, 9:57 PM
C&Rtrader's Avatar
C&Rtrader C&Rtrader is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Marin (Nothern California)
Posts: 1,464
iTrader: 54 / 100%
Default

I think the OP is talking about this:
https://www.samcoglobal.com/1-1916.html

unless I am mistaken?
__________________
WTB: Russian Military Makarov. .22 mag Cylinder for 50s Colt Frontier Scout, C&R Walthers
WTS: Several Neat Mosins, Russian SKS
WTS: Vintage Kenner Star Wars, PM me re details.
Located in Norcal.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 12-02-2012, 12:20 AM
gunboat's Avatar
gunboat gunboat is offline
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: san josie
Posts: 3,266
iTrader: 22 / 100%
Default

It might be -- or he could have a guardia civil carbine -- which is a bit harsher yet in recoil --
They are both built on M93 mauser chassis -- as is the swede --
The spanish 1916 and upgraded earlier spanish models have a gas relief hole added on the left receiver ring --
None of the pre 98 mauser designs handle gas from a ruptured case as well as the m98 ---
The Modified 1916, in the form of FR7, 1916 short rifles, and guardia civil carbines are chambered for the 7.62x51 nato, not the cetme, and are safe with that cartridge --
They were all rebored and the barrel set back and rechambered to the 7.62 nato which is NOT loaded as hot as the 308win.

Therefore it is not good form to make the poor 1916 try to digest a steady diet of 308win.

Note -- a batch of south american m93s were rebored, the chamber hogged out and a 7.62 chamber insert mashed in - a poor solution.
my tuppence
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 12-02-2012, 8:05 AM
RED VASQUEZ's Avatar
RED VASQUEZ RED VASQUEZ is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Foxtrot-Bravo
Posts: 240
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by C&Rtrader View Post
I think the OP is talking about this:
https://www.samcoglobal.com/1-1916.html

unless I am mistaken?
That's it. I was browsing through C&R dealers' websites and thought it might be a good deal.

Ammo issues were something that came up in my search. Are mil-spec loads correct for this rifle? Also, I know wolf and tula loads for 556 are weaker, is this true of their .308?

Edit: I didn't see that Gunboat answered part of my question.
__________________
"I don't facebook, I Calguns"~Me

Last edited by RED VASQUEZ; 12-02-2012 at 8:10 AM..
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 12-03-2012, 2:29 PM
gun toting monkeyboy's Avatar
gun toting monkeyboy gun toting monkeyboy is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: San Diego (more or less)
Posts: 6,553
iTrader: 2 / 100%
Default

Whether or not they are safe for .308 Winchester loads is one of those hotly debated topics online. Both camps have their arguments. I believe Century Arms converted one of these into a pressure test gun when they were importing these back in the 1990s. According to their tests, the .308 was well within what the action could take. That being said, how much do you trust the Spanish arms industry? Especially back then. It is a model 1916, but the vast majority of these rifles were made around the time of the Spanish Civil War. Often under war time conditions. So the steels may or may not have been properly heat-treated. Added to that, these guns have not been imported in some time. So if you have one now, the odds are that somebody over here had it before you, and who knows what they fed it, or how much they shot it before you got your hands on it. AND the working pressures for these guns, which were chambered in 7x57 Mauser originally, was around 42,000-45,000 PSI. The .308 is regularly loaded up to 56,000 PSI, with some loads pushing close to 60,000. All of that adds up to the fact that you may want to think about if you really, really want to use .308 in one of these rifles. I have in the past. And I would again if I had to. But for the most part, I prefer to use the 7.62 NATO specs for these. Especially when reloading. Those few extra foot/pounds just aren't worth it to me. Not when it has the potential to wreck the gun and/or my face. They really are fun little rifles, but some of them are rapidly approaching the century mark.

-Mb
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by aplinker View Post
It's OK not to post when you have no clue what you're talking about.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 12-05-2012, 10:27 AM
DennisCA's Avatar
DennisCA DennisCA is offline
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Bay Area: A.K.A. The People's Republic of CA
Posts: 3,521
iTrader: 33 / 100%
Arrow Don't do it!

I purchased one from SAMCO back in the summer, here's what happened:

- First rifle that sent; it so beat up I sent it back

- Second rifle, looked ok, too it out to shoot it: (using 7.62X51 ammo) after firing one round the shell casing was stuck so bad I had to use a cleaning rod to pop it out. The rifle was sent back.

- Third rifle: Awesome looking gun, took it out to shoot it - same result.
This time is was sent back and I got my money back.

Even though SAMCO said it can shoot 7.62X51/.308; it can't - at least mine didn't.

IMHO: Get something else - don't waste your time or money.

If you are going to get one, get it in the original cal. I think they where chambered for 7X57
__________________
"The only thing necessary for the triumph [of evil] is for good men to do nothing." Edmund Burke speech of 23 April 1770, "Thoughts on the Cause of the Present Discontents," delivered to the House of Commons.

Last edited by DennisCA; 12-05-2012 at 10:29 AM.. Reason: Added text
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 12-05-2012, 12:47 PM
emcon5's Avatar
emcon5 emcon5 is offline
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Reno
Posts: 2,890
iTrader: 10 / 100%
Default

I think a 1916 Spanish in the original 7x57 would be a great little carbine.

If I had a 7.62 version, I would only shoot mild handloads in it, (300 Savage-ish pressure levels)
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 12-05-2012, 2:33 PM
mosinnagantm9130's Avatar
mosinnagantm9130 mosinnagantm9130 is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Places
Posts: 8,252
iTrader: 1 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by emcon5 View Post
I think a 1916 Spanish in the original 7x57 would be a great little carbine.


I have a 1916 in 7mm...and I love it. Accurate, mild recoil (although that might be partly due to my reloads) and the sights aren't as bad as most mauser sights usually are.

I don't have any experience with the 7.62 versions, so I can't recommend those, but if you can track down one still in 7x57 they are fun little carbines.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoodEyeSniper View Post
My neighbors think I'm a construction worker named Bruce.

Little do they know that's just my stripper outfit and name.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChopperX View Post
I am currently cleaning it and I noticed when I squeeze the snake this white paste like substance comes out. What the heck is this crap?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeff L View Post
Don't D&T a virgin milsurp rifle. You'll burn in collector hell.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 12-05-2012, 2:41 PM
gunboat's Avatar
gunboat gunboat is offline
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: san josie
Posts: 3,266
iTrader: 22 / 100%
Default

I have a 1916 guardia civile carbine converted to 7.62 --
Seems ok mechanically, but certainly not pleasant to shoot full power 7.62 -
I rather doubt it was pleasant with the original 7x57 --

I don't know why dennisca rifle failed to extract, but the extractors are the same.
Perhaps he had one of the south american ones that were converted by installing a chamber insert rather than a rebore, barrel set back and rechamber.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 12-05-2012, 7:12 PM
DennisCA's Avatar
DennisCA DennisCA is offline
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Bay Area: A.K.A. The People's Republic of CA
Posts: 3,521
iTrader: 33 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by C&Rtrader View Post
They kick like a very very angry mule. The rear sight starts at 300 meters for distance. sight radius is very short.

if you are looking for a target mauser this is not your gun. Get a swede. If you are looking for something go boom like a M44 mosin... this is your gun.
Or if you are a tgt mauser, I suggest either a yugo 24/47 or a m48.
I have a yugo 24/47 and the more I shoot it (which isn't nearly enough
for my liking) the more I like it. The M44 does kick like a mad mule but
that's part of the fun, plus the fire-balls are great to see as well!
__________________
"The only thing necessary for the triumph [of evil] is for good men to do nothing." Edmund Burke speech of 23 April 1770, "Thoughts on the Cause of the Present Discontents," delivered to the House of Commons.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 12-05-2012, 7:43 PM
C&Rtrader's Avatar
C&Rtrader C&Rtrader is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Marin (Nothern California)
Posts: 1,464
iTrader: 54 / 100%
Default

OP.. if you post your location and ask nicely you might find a fellow calgunner with one who will let you try it.
__________________
WTB: Russian Military Makarov. .22 mag Cylinder for 50s Colt Frontier Scout, C&R Walthers
WTS: Several Neat Mosins, Russian SKS
WTS: Vintage Kenner Star Wars, PM me re details.
Located in Norcal.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 12-08-2012, 6:48 AM
Dutch3's Avatar
Dutch3 Dutch3 is offline
Dirt Farmer
CGN Contributor
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Butte County
Posts: 11,446
iTrader: 3 / 100%
Default

I have a 1916 Guardia Civil with SAMCO marks. It is chambered for 7.62x51.

It is a fun gun. Pretty stout recoil when shooting factory NATO loads, but less with my mild handloads. Others have commented that it is LOUD.

It always puts a smile on my face, a definite keeper.
__________________
Assembly Public Safety Chair Reginald Jones-Sawyer:
..."and with that I'd like to turn it over to my colleague Loni Hancock, Senate Public Safety Chair, and as I like to say, my partner in crime."

Senate Public Safety Chair Loni Hancock:
"Yeah, we do that quite a lot, actually..."

- Joint Legislative Informational Hearing on Firearms - Newsom Initiative #1756 - May 3rd 2016
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



All times are GMT -8. The time now is 4:19 AM.




Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2016, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Proudly hosted by GeoVario the Premier 2A host.
Calguns.net, the 'Calguns' name and all associated variants and logos are ® Trademark and © Copyright 2002-2016, Calguns.net an Incorporated Company All Rights Reserved.