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  #1  
Old 10-27-2012, 12:24 PM
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Default "Legal" gun collection confiscation

A little background on this question. My grandpa passed away from natural causes a little more than 6 months ago. He lived 70 miles east of San Diego by the border, so it was a dangerous area, drug runners, etc. He was by himself when he passed away and I guess it is standard protocol for the sheriffs department to confiscate all guns on site. He had close to 40 guns confiscated, some of which had 30 round magazines and were in the non-california modified versions (he bought all these mags and guns 14 plus years ago when they were legal in the state of California). The Sheriff told me that eventually, an investigator will call me to release the guns, if I want them. The sheriff knew that I was currently in the hiring process for a couple of 3 letter LE agencies and suggested that because of this, it might just be better to let them keep the guns.

So my question is will they ever reach out to my family to return the guns? I was to understand if they do not do it before a certain time then they end up destroying or keeping the firearms. Thank you in advance for your time and knowledge.
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  #2  
Old 10-27-2012, 12:29 PM
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Keep bugging them about it. It shouldn't matter to your potential department. If your gun "collection" is an issue to them, would you really want to work for them?

Who was listed as next of kin?
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  #3  
Old 10-27-2012, 12:54 PM
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Sounds like someone in the dept either wants something in the collection or just believes that guns are evil. Either way, keep bugging them and get EVERYTHING shipped to am OOS FFL to transfer to the new OOS owner who you either sell or give them to.
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  #4  
Old 10-27-2012, 1:00 PM
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In the meantime, try to get an inventory from them of what they're holding. PC 33800 says
Quote:
(a) When a firearm is taken into custody by a law
enforcement officer, the officer shall issue the person who possessed
the firearm a receipt
describing the firearm, and listing any serial
number or other identification on the firearm.
(b) The receipt shall indicate where the firearm may be recovered,
any applicable time limit for recovery, and the date after which the
owner or possessor may recover the firearm pursuant to Chapter 2
(commencing with Section 33850).
(c) Nothing in this section is intended to displace any existing
law regarding the seizure or return of firearms.
They will require a LEGR - Law Enforcement Gun Release, http://oag.ca.gov/sites/all/files/pd...orms/legr.pdf? - so you might as well get that set up. (The DOJ web page is not updated with the current PC numbering - 12021.3 is now 33850)
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Last edited by Librarian; 10-27-2012 at 1:09 PM..
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  #5  
Old 10-27-2012, 1:25 PM
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Originally Posted by fullrearview View Post
Keep bugging them about it. It shouldn't matter to your potential department. If your gun "collection" is an issue to them, would you really want to work for them?

This!!!
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  #6  
Old 10-27-2012, 3:02 PM
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It doesn't even matter to the three letter agency, so I would get the guns back legally
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  #7  
Old 10-27-2012, 3:12 PM
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Yup, get them all back and if possible, have them ship all the non compliant stuff to a friend or relative out of state. Let me us know what happens.
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  #8  
Old 10-27-2012, 4:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fullrearview View Post
Keep bugging them about it. It shouldn't matter to your potential department. If your gun "collection" is an issue to them, would you really want to work for them?

Who was listed as next of kin?
Right

Quote:
Originally Posted by CSACANNONEER View Post
Sounds like someone in the dept either wants something in the collection or just believes that guns are evil. Either way, keep bugging them and get EVERYTHING shipped to am OOS FFL to transfer to the new OOS owner who you either sell or give them to.
Wrong. I don't know where people get this insulting idea that LE can, or does, obtain property in this manner. There is no law that allows this.
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  #9  
Old 10-27-2012, 4:50 PM
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Originally Posted by Ron-Solo View Post
Right



Wrong. I don't know where people get this insulting idea that LE can, or does, obtain property in this manner. There is no law that allows this.
Ron,

I wish that you were right on this one. But isn't this exactly the sort of thing that Sheriff Floyd Tidwell of San Bernadino County got convicted of not too long ago? Here's a link:

http://articles.latimes.com/2004/dec...al/me-tidwell1
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  #10  
Old 10-27-2012, 5:36 PM
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Originally Posted by RickD427 View Post
Ron,

I wish that you were right on this one. But isn't this exactly the sort of thing that Sheriff Floyd Tidwell of San Bernadino County got convicted of not too long ago? Here's a link:

http://articles.latimes.com/2004/dec...al/me-tidwell1
Key word.

Not directed at you, but in general:

No gun is worth my career. As much as I like guns, they are still just a tool. I can buy/sell/trade, tools. I could own the most valuable firearm in history and it WOULD get used. I don't own a lot of guns because I don't need a lot of tools... But ALL my tools get used.
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  #11  
Old 10-27-2012, 5:40 PM
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Wow, the guy stole over 500 guns and only got a fine and probation. What would happen to a regular guy if he stole just one?
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  #12  
Old 10-27-2012, 6:02 PM
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40 guns, with legal 30 rd mags. hell yes u need to take ownership of them
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  #13  
Old 10-27-2012, 6:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fmxmyway View Post
He had close to 40 guns confiscated, some of which had 30 round magazines and were in the non-california modified versions (he bought all these mags and guns 14 plus years ago when they were legal in the state of California).
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eldraque View Post
40 guns, with legal 30 rd mags. hell yes u need to take ownership of them
If some of those turn out to be unregistered 'assault weapons', they are likely gone for good.

If some were registered, if they were 'by name' they could be shipped out of state, but may not remain in CA.

If they were 'by feature' but registered, might be converted to OLL with magazine lock configuration, or featureless configuration, and then UN registered, and kept here.

30 round mags probably also gone for good - illegal to give them, PC 32310 - a bequest is a giving.
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  #14  
Old 10-27-2012, 7:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron-Solo View Post
Wrong. I don't know where people get this insulting idea that LE can, or does, obtain property in this manner. There is no law that allows this.
Ron,
I've personally known a lawyer for one CA LEA who had a court order to release a firearm, which he had just purchased from a client, to him. A major CA LEA had possession of it and, even with the court order, the person in charge of evidence at that location, first lied and said it had been moved from that facility and destroyed. Then, a couple hours later, admitted it was there and still refused to release it. It took a call from the judge who issued the order to get it released. Then, it took a second call from the judge to get the holster, magazines and ammo released. I never did learn why the employees at this particular station wanted to keep a two week old Kimber. Did someone there think they could end up with it? Did the person in the evidence room not like firearms enough to risk a contempt charge? I don't know the answers. But, I have no reason not to believe the attorney who had to go though this about 7 years ago.
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  #15  
Old 10-27-2012, 7:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RickD427 View Post
Ron,

I wish that you were right on this one. But isn't this exactly the sort of thing that Sheriff Floyd Tidwell of San Bernadino County got convicted of not too long ago? Here's a link:

http://articles.latimes.com/2004/dec...al/me-tidwell1
Incidents such as Tidwell are an anomaly. Too many members jump in here and immediately insinuate or accuse LE of taking guns every time this is mentioned, without any justification. It gets old real fast.
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  #16  
Old 10-27-2012, 7:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron-Solo View Post
Incidents such as Tidwell are an anomaly. Too many members jump in here and immediately insinuate or accuse LE of taking guns every time this is mentioned, without any justification. It gets old real fast.
Ron,

You're right. I agree that too many calgunners jump at LEO's throats at the first opportunity. I don't like it either.

At same time, folks like Tidwell are out there, an they do make us look bad. Especially since Floyd was the elected sheriff of his county and the number of weapons involved was kinda large.
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  #17  
Old 10-27-2012, 7:22 PM
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A huge thank you for everyone that chimed in on this. I will follow up with the sheriff and present to him the PC 33800 and LEGR. There was no receipt or inventory given to me or any of my family members in regards to the firearms that were confiscated so that should be interesting. Thank you all very much for the valuable insight, it means a lot.
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  #18  
Old 10-27-2012, 7:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron-Solo View Post
Incidents such as Tidwell are an anomaly. Too many members jump in here and immediately insinuate or accuse LE of taking guns every time this is mentioned, without any justification. It gets old real fast.
Ron,
Please note that in both my previous posts, I have offered other plausible reasons that a LEA might try to retain possession of firearms instead of releasing them to their rightful owners. Many LESs are dominated by anti 2A administrators. I even have family friends who fall into this catagory. Anyway, I have to believe that some of these LEAs do everything in their power to not release firearms to the legal owners. On the flip side, I'm sure there are other department that go out of their way to return property to it's legal owners. I also have LEO friends who would fall into this catagory. LEOs are just individuals. Most are good. Occasionly, one slips through who isn't good or uses his/her position to advance his/her personal agenda.
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  #19  
Old 10-27-2012, 8:51 PM
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Hope you get the collection back. Good luck and keep us updated on the situation.
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  #20  
Old 10-27-2012, 9:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fmxmyway View Post
A little background on this question. My grandpa passed away from natural causes a little more than 6 months ago. He lived 70 miles east of San Diego by the border, so it was a dangerous area, drug runners, etc. He was by himself when he passed away and I guess it is standard protocol for the sheriffs department to confiscate all guns on site. He had close to 40 guns confiscated, some of which had 30 round magazines and were in the non-california modified versions (he bought all these mags and guns 14 plus years ago when they were legal in the state of California). The Sheriff told me that eventually, an investigator will call me to release the guns, if I want them. The sheriff knew that I was currently in the hiring process for a couple of 3 letter LE agencies and suggested that because of this, it might just be better to let them keep the guns.

So my question is will they ever reach out to my family to return the guns? I was to understand if they do not do it before a certain time then they end up destroying or keeping the firearms. Thank you in advance for your time and knowledge.
It is unusual for them to offer to hold them for you. If it is legel for you to take possession of the guns, you might consider taking them. Otherwise, request a detailed receipt for the items and guns. They will not reach out to you. It will be up to you to get the ball rollling and you will need to be peristent.

If it were me, I would be worried that they would be put on a list to be destroyed alongn with other guns in evidence.
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Old 10-27-2012, 9:26 PM
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Who is the executor of the will? The department would need to release them to the person intended to go to. If they were taken for safe keeping due to them being unattended and at risk for theft then they need to cover themselves on who they release them to since the owner is deceased. If the executor, if its not you, later shows up and the guns are gone, they would have questions as to why they were released to you and not them. I don't think it's for someone wanting to buy them in the department. Yes their are bad eggs, but few and far between and the media loves to exploit them when it happens. Just my opinion based on what you said, nothing more
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Old 10-27-2012, 9:29 PM
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When my father-in-law passed away at home a few years ago, the deputy who arrived to perform the coroner duty informed my mother-in-law that he needed to take the firearms from the home (two full gun cabinets in the bedroom). Thankfully, my wife and her brother arrived about that time and the guns didn't go anywhere.

I can understand taking any firearms into custody if someone dies alone without any immediate family around, but I have to wonder if this is some kind of standard policy regardless of the circumstances.

In another incident, a friend of mine had all of his (legal) firearms and reloading equipment confiscated during a warrant search of his home. He was never arrested, nor was he ever charged with any crime. After trying to get his property returned for over a year, he was informed it had all been destroyed. It does happen. It seems that some agencies like to get guns "off the street" and don't like to return them to their lawful owners.
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  #23  
Old 10-27-2012, 9:37 PM
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I've handled many in home deaths as the handling unit over the years. Never once did I concern myself with any property at the location unless is was evidence, or the location could not be properly secured.

It is not a LEO's job to get involved is the distribution of personal property.
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Old 10-27-2012, 11:56 PM
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Don't ever... ever... let your guns out of the house unless it was absolutely necessary. Not saying the agency will have anything evil planned, but even with the best and most cooperative agency, the paperwork and cost and time and headaches involved in getting your guns back is enough reason to not let them out of your hands in the first place.
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Old 10-28-2012, 8:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CSACANNONEER View Post
Sounds like someone in the dept either wants something in the collection or just believes that guns are evil. Either way, keep bugging them and get EVERYTHING shipped to am OOS FFL to transfer to the new OOS owner who you either sell or give them to.
This is the key.
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Old 10-28-2012, 2:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron-Solo View Post
I've handled many in home deaths as the handling unit over the years. Never once did I concern myself with any property at the location unless is was evidence, or the location could not be properly secured.

It is not a LEO's job to get involved is the distribution of personal property.
^^^ Same here ^^^
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Old 10-28-2012, 3:10 PM
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Has it happened? Yes. What's the reason? We will never know unless we talk to the officers themselves.

I had a close friend commit suicide with a pistol, LAPD West Bureau confiscated every firearm in the house. He didn't live with family, had a roommate. Guns were all returned.
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Old 10-28-2012, 7:09 PM
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My story is a little different. Rancho cucamonga pd (SBSO) took a home burglary in the evening a few houses away from me. The next morning very early they saw a suspicious male walking down carneilian and stop him and noticed a bulge in right front pocket (full size glock). They busted him and had the guns to owner by end of the night. 2 rifles and a handgun (no safe and window left open). Second story is also SBSO but out of Mentone near Redlands. Father committed suicide after dealing with stage 4 for couple years (we weren't shocked he spoke about it a few times) and sheriff left the glock 40 full size he used (forget witch one it wasn't the 27) and the 22 rifle that my dad had near front door and they left all the ammo also. It wasn't a crime but I was still shocked they left the glock. Sometimes I wished I kept that glock and carried it on CCW. Sounds weird but would make a great story of a gun that caused pain to us that turned around and saved family. I kick that thought around sometimes.
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Old 10-29-2012, 1:37 AM
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Be persistent and don't give up.

You will be charged by the DOJ $50.00PER gun to get them back and they will only release them either to the registered owner 9 who is now dead so that won't happen0 or to a FFL. I had a guy come into the station to get his guns ( 18 month is "safe keeping") and have to pay for each gun ($1000.00 for his total "collection"). they all had to be registered and check by the DOJ and they charged him for it. We had nothing to do with it. we needed the paperwork and that was the charge they put on getting the guns into his name...

sorry for your loss...

good luck.
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Old 10-29-2012, 1:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spec View Post
Be persistent and don't give up.

You will be charged by the DOJ $50.00PER gun to get them back and they will only release them either to the registered owner 9 who is now dead so that won't happen0 or to a FFL. I had a guy come into the station to get his guns ( 18 month is "safe keeping") and have to pay for each gun ($1000.00 for his total "collection"). they all had to be registered and check by the DOJ and they charged him for it. We had nothing to do with it. we needed the paperwork and that was the charge they put on getting the guns into his name...

sorry for your loss...

good luck.
Um, not ure where you are getting your information. This is from the DOJ website, off of the LEGR instructions:

Fee Submission Requirements
The processing fee for a Law Enforcement Gun Release is $20.00 for the first firearm (long gun or handgun), and $3.00 for each additional handgun being reported (e.g., 1 handgun and 1 long gun = $20.00; 2 handguns and 1 long gun = $23.00). If the agency or court determines the firearm was reported stolen pursuant to Penal Code section 33855, subdivision (d), the fees for the stolen firearm(s) will be waived. Provide documentation from the agency or court with this application to qualify for the waiver of fees. DOJ will process your application within 30 days from the date of receipt unless delayed by circumstances beyond the control of the department
.

Welcome to CalGuns, but if you post something that isn't accurate, expect to get called on it.
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  #31  
Old 10-29-2012, 1:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spec View Post
Be persistent and don't give up.

You will be charged by the DOJ $50.00PER gun to get them back and they will only release them either to the registered owner 9 who is now dead so that won't happen0 or to a FFL. I had a guy come into the station to get his guns ( 18 month is "safe keeping") and have to pay for each gun ($1000.00 for his total "collection"). they all had to be registered and check by the DOJ and they charged him for it. We had nothing to do with it. we needed the paperwork and that was the charge they put on getting the guns into his name...

sorry for your loss...

good luck.
Did you read my post about a firearm that was sold to a new owner while it was in an LEA lock up? The new owner, NOT THE REGISTERED OWNER, was able to pick the gun up straight from the LEA.
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Old 10-29-2012, 9:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CSACANNONEER View Post
Did you read my post about a firearm that was sold to a new owner while it was in an LEA lock up? The new owner, NOT THE REGISTERED OWNER, was able to pick the gun up straight from the LEA.
Who did the transfer while it was in evidence/safekeeping? How did they get the "seller" to sign off on the 4473?
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