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Centerfire Rifles - Semiautomatic or Gas Operated Centerfire rifles, carbines and other gas operated rifles.

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  #41  
Old 10-06-2012, 12:01 AM
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Spikes? Also a great company who makes a quality rifle.
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  #42  
Old 10-06-2012, 12:01 AM
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Originally Posted by Speedpower View Post
SHTF will never happen! it's more of a Fantasy!
A fantasy maybe for you, but not for someone that pays attention to alternative media every day and understands the massive amount of debt this country is in that is mathematically impossible to get out of, caused by the Private Federal Reserve Bank. But this thread is not really about SHTF right now. I'm not trying to turn this thread into that because it could easily go there.
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  #43  
Old 10-06-2012, 12:04 AM
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Originally Posted by Whatisthis? View Post
+1

Saiga Sporter is what I was looking at for a cheap rifle. Plus you can buy the rifle, shoot it as is as you save up more money to convert it to an AK-47.

You could also go with the M&P15 Sport.

You could build a good quality AR-15 from Palmetto State Armory parts. Buy a lower locally and then order everything else from their website.

You could buy here on the classifieds. Lots of good deals, but you need to sort through the people that think their firearm is worth 20% over retail (it's absolutely ridiculous sometimes... that's in a whole other thread tho).

All of these options can get you something for under $800 if you look hard enough. And the Saiga Sporter is IMO, the best value unless you REALLY want an AR-15.

I'll find the for sale ad but usually the Saigas are around $400. As a note, the chambering says .223, but this is an exception to the "Do not fire a 5.56 in a .223 rifle" (Another argument or belief in itself, I won't get into it). Anyways, it'll say .223, but you're fine to shoot .223 or 5.56 with no repercussions.

Thanks for your input I appreciate it but I really want an AR 15. I've looked at Saigas and Ak's but I really want something accurate out to longer distances.
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  #44  
Old 10-06-2012, 12:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Whatisthis? View Post
+1

Saiga Sporter is what I was looking at for a cheap rifle. Plus you can buy the rifle, shoot it as is as you save up more money to convert it to an AK-47.

You could also go with the M&P15 Sport.

You could build a good quality AR-15 from Palmetto State Armory parts. Buy a lower locally and then order everything else from their website.

You could buy here on the classifieds. Lots of good deals, but you need to sort through the people that think their firearm is worth 20% over retail (it's absolutely ridiculous sometimes... that's in a whole other thread tho).

All of these options can get you something for under $800 if you look hard enough. And the Saiga Sporter is IMO, the best value unless you REALLY want an AR-15.

I'll find the for sale ad but usually the Saigas are around $400. As a note, the chambering says .223, but this is an exception to the "Do not fire a 5.56 in a .223 rifle" (Another argument or belief in itself, I won't get into it). Anyways, it'll say .223, but you're fine to shoot .223 or 5.56 with no repercussions.
saigas like many other imports will say ".223" for the sake of "sporter" import purposes...they are actually 5.56mm NATO but that is not as "sporty", so they re-name it.
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  #45  
Old 10-06-2012, 12:07 AM
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Originally Posted by AbsoluteTruth View Post
your right I am thinking about the DPMS if I decide to return it. But I'm thinking if I return it I might be willing to shell out an extra 1-200 bucks for a better rifle 800-900$ maybe. Havnt decided. know of any good M4 AR 15,s in that price range?
Look at the marketplace here on CG's. Top quality, like new AR's are a dime a dozen these days. There is/ have been some unbelievable deals to be had.
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  #46  
Old 10-06-2012, 12:08 AM
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Originally Posted by AbsoluteTruth View Post
A fantasy maybe for you, but not for someone that pays attention to alternative media every day and understands the massive amount of debt this country is in that is mathematically impossible to get out of, caused by the Private Federal Reserve Bank. But this thread is not really about SHTF right now. I'm not trying to turn this thread into that because it could easily go there.
have you looked at any reviews for the AR? what did the peeps say about it? btw you sound like my co-worker lol

AK cough.
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  #47  
Old 10-06-2012, 12:08 AM
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Originally Posted by Cadre View Post
some, maybe most MFG has recommended ammo listed on the manual some will even say using said ammo will void the warranty if the weapon breaks and it was cause by using bad ammo what then? just my 2 cents.
They never said anything about the warranty and I haven't seen the manual its being shipped. Its should be at my ffl anytime now. If it voids the warranty I probably wont get it.
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  #48  
Old 10-06-2012, 12:10 AM
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Nothing wrong with the gun. Glock gives the same advice, as do most manufacturers.

They are telling you what any instructor with real life experience will tell you. Cheap ammo can and eventually will lead to problems. Quality ammo will lead to less problems less often. No ammo is 100% perfect with every single gun. But factory made quality brand name ammo is your best bet to avoid problems.

Can you plink with crap? Yes, and usually without issue. Is it the best idea in the world? No. Why? Statistically more likely to have an issue, and some of those can be serious.

I don't care who you are, or what you say to the contrary. Real world experience has proven you wrong. You won't ever change my mind on this issue. Seen too many kabooms, jams, etc. caused by crap ammo. My hands, my face, and my guns are worth a few cents more per round.

Last edited by tacticalcity; 10-06-2012 at 12:14 AM..
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  #49  
Old 10-06-2012, 12:10 AM
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dont over think this. get some rest bro.
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  #50  
Old 10-06-2012, 12:16 AM
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Originally Posted by Cadre View Post
have you looked at any reviews for the AR? what did the peeps say about it? btw you sound like my co-worker lol

AK cough.
There aren't really a lot of reviews about it that I can find. I looked on youtube but only found a video of someone shooting it for like a minute. I've seen other forums talking about Rguns but none of them really give a review of the gun all they do is bash on their customer service the whole time. Sounds like your co-worker is pretty smart. I bet he follows Alex Jones and wanted to vote for Ron Paul huh? haha Yeah what I said up there is just a small fragment of what I know. Another scary thing is that the (DHS) Department of Homeland Security has ordered 1.6 billion rounds of ammunition just this year with large portions of it being hollow points. Hollow points aren't used for target practice Your co-worker sounds like a good person to have around.
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  #51  
Old 10-06-2012, 12:17 AM
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Originally Posted by Cadre View Post
dont over think this. get some rest bro.
I will I just wanted a lot of people opinions. Thanks
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  #52  
Old 10-06-2012, 12:18 AM
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Originally Posted by tacticalcity View Post
Nothing wrong with the gun. Glock gives the same advice, as do most manufacturers.

They are telling you what any instructor with real life experience will tell you. Cheap ammo can and eventually will lead to problems. Quality ammo will lead to less problems less often. No ammo is 100% perfect with every single gun. But factory made quality brand name ammo is your best bet to avoid problems.

Can you plink with crap? Yes, and usually without issue. Is it the best idea in the world? No. Why? Statistically more likely to have an issue, and some of those can be serious.

I don't care who you are, or what you say to the contrary. Real world experience has proven you wrong. You won't ever change my mind on this issue. Seen too many kabooms, jams, etc. caused by crap ammo. My hands, my face, and my guns are worth a few cents more per round.
Thanks for the information and advice I will take everything into consideration.
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  #53  
Old 10-06-2012, 12:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tacticalcity View Post
Nothing wrong with the gun. Glock gives the same advice, as do most manufacturers.

They are telling you what any instructor with real life experience will tell you. Cheap ammo can and eventually will lead to problems. Quality ammo will lead to less problems less often. No ammo is 100% perfect with every single gun. But factory made quality brand name ammo is your best bet to avoid problems.

Can you plink with crap? Yes, and usually without issue. Is it the best idea in the world? No. Why? Statistically more likely to have an issue, and some of those can be serious.

I don't care who you are, or what you say to the contrary. Real world experience has proven you wrong. You won't ever change my mind on this issue. Seen too many kabooms, jams, etc. caused by crap ammo. My hands, my face, and my guns are worth a few cents more per round.
So we're supposed to buy american brass 7.62 for our AKs?

I'm not really arguing with you, but i'd say that reloads are a bigger problem than russian factory ammo.
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  #54  
Old 10-06-2012, 12:20 AM
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social security ordered more>
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  #55  
Old 10-06-2012, 12:30 AM
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The main reason steel cased ammo runs dirtier is because it isn't as elastic as brass and doesn't create as tight of a seal as brass so you get more fouling. It also doesn't rebound as much as brass so its tighter in the chamber during extraction. Probably one of the reasons you see ripped rims of steel cased ammo more often than brass because of the combination of more fouling and a larger size during extraction.


I like how they sent you the email after you bought their weapon instead of having it posted next to the add to cart button.


Honestly you should be fine with wolf they make good enough ammo if they didn't I'm sure Hornady wouldn't use their steel cases for their TAP training ammo. I've run about 1k rounds of the Hornady TAP training ammo out of one of my AR's taking some classes and I haven't run into any problems.


I've been buying steel cased ammo lately because ammo is so damn expensive and when I'm in a situation that I can't pick up my brass I won't let others pick it up either
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  #56  
Old 10-06-2012, 12:33 AM
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Originally Posted by Dhena81 View Post
The main reason steel cased ammo runs dirtier is because it isn't as elastic as brass and doesn't create as tight of a seal as brass so you get more fouling. It also doesn't rebound as much as brass so its tighter in the chamber during extraction. Probably one of the reasons you see ripped rims of steel cased ammo more often than brass because of the combination of more fouling and a larger size during extraction.


I like how they sent you the email after you bought their weapon instead of having it posted next to the add to cart button.


Honestly you should be fine with wolf they make good enough ammo if they didn't I'm sure Hornady wouldn't use their steel cases for their TAP training ammo. I've run about 1k rounds of the Hornady TAP training ammo out of one of my AR's taking some classes and I haven't run into any problems.


I've been buying steel cased ammo lately because ammo is so damn expensive and when I'm in a situation that I can't pick up my brass I won't let others pick it up either

thanks man this is reassuring to hear
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  #57  
Old 10-06-2012, 12:35 AM
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Originally Posted by Cadre View Post
social security ordered more>
Sorry I meant to say billion

Yeah DHS keeps ordering them every couple months they ordered like 350 million in the beginning of the year and they keep ordering hundreds of millions every couple months and if you add all their orders up it is up to 1.6 billion now. Combine that with the (NDAA) National Defense Authorization Act which states that American citizens can be detained without trial and due process and can be tortured and killed if they are SUSPECTED of being a terrorist.
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  #58  
Old 10-06-2012, 12:39 AM
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some positive here. time to SHtheBED,

http://www.nyfirearms.com/forums/rif...post-sale.html
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  #59  
Old 10-06-2012, 12:44 AM
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Originally Posted by Cadre View Post
some positive here. time to SHtheBED,

http://www.nyfirearms.com/forums/rif...post-sale.html

haha yeah I've seen that post before. Some good and some bad. Hopefully everything will be in spec and I wont have to ship anything back. thnx
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  #60  
Old 10-06-2012, 12:52 AM
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I thought I might as well throw this in here for anyone that's interested its my youtube channel. This is where I keep a library of information regarding whats going on in the world along with many other things. I've boiled down thousands of hours of research from the past few years into this youtube channel and I add stuff almost daily.

youtube.com/AbsoluteTruth88
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  #61  
Old 10-06-2012, 12:56 AM
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lol you guys just flagged yourselves to be part of the 50,000 unwarranted electronic surveillance by the USGOV.........

i am not a SHTF planner.

I just like rock out with my Glock out.
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  #62  
Old 10-06-2012, 1:04 AM
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lol you guys just flagged yourselves to be part of the 50,000 unwarranted electronic surveillance by the USGOV.........

i am not a SHTF planner.

I just like rock out with my Glock out.
I'm not scared haha everyone is already on a list just for owning a gun. You should read some of the things I've posted on another thread on this forum a while ago http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/s...d.php?t=609474

From what you just said your already admitting that we are moving into a tyranny. We have to speak out while we have the chance. Now is not the time to keep quiet

More and more America is turning into "land of the slaves and home of the cowards" I'm not saying you are, just making a blanket statement for the majority of Americans.

Last edited by AbsoluteTruth; 10-06-2012 at 1:21 AM..
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  #63  
Old 10-06-2012, 1:41 AM
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Sounds like they're already making excuses for their workmenship
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  #64  
Old 10-06-2012, 1:46 AM
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Sounds like they're already making excuses for their workmenship
I hope not ha
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  #65  
Old 10-06-2012, 4:08 AM
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I've recently taken a different stance on my firearms. I only want something that can shoot anything and everything I put into it. If it doesn't do that, I don't want it. For instance, I have 5K plus rounds through my P226 with various ammo and no failures at all. I trust my life with it because it will shoot any ammo I put through it.

That being said, I don't think you should have a problem putting whatever you want down the pipe. And if you do have problems with it, I'd send it back or sell it.
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  #66  
Old 10-06-2012, 4:57 AM
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I wouldn't worry about the email from RGuns, just shoot whatever you want and see how it goes. Clean the chamber once in a while, say every 500 rounds.

A buddy of mine has a S&W M&P and he recently had a stuck case after shooting Herter's steel cased ammo. Prior to this he had gone through about 1200 rounds of mixed steel and zinc cased ammo without problems. However he had never cleaned the chamber and had not recently lubed the gun. We squirted CLP everywhere and the gun ran fine for the rest of the day.

I've run mixed brass and steel through my BCM middy and it has been fine.
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  #67  
Old 10-06-2012, 5:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cadre View Post
some positive here. time to SHtheBED,

http://www.nyfirearms.com/forums/rif...post-sale.html
SHtheBED!!! I'm stealing that.

OP, I think you'll be okay. If you're worried about it, try shooting ~300 rounds of factory brass ammo through the rifle to "break" it in and let everything loosen up. Then go for the steel cased ammo. This is not to say that RGuns makes their products to such tight tolerances you have to do this but any new gun will be tighter at first.
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  #68  
Old 10-06-2012, 5:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Speedpower View Post
SHTF will never happen! it's more of a Fantasy!
It has happened before, and will happen again. The thing is that it is temporary, and the chances are almost nill for it happening in "one's area".

However, Google: Katrina, LA Riots, Watts Riots, 2011 England Riots, Egypt, Greece... The list goes on.

Check: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_riots

Many wish to make sure your kids can stay safe just in case it happens in your area... anything else is just plain blatant-ignorance. Those that don't have kids that one cares about, (teaching them responsibility, and disciplining them is usually the proof) or if one takes a bunch of illicit substances, then those people could care-less, and don't take precautions... just in case.
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  #69  
Old 10-06-2012, 6:37 AM
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If you're that worried about SHTF or eventually having to depend on your gun to save you life then I'd spend every penny I could on my weapon: top line brand names for the guns, 'ammo, 'mags, etc, etc. Don't you think your life is worth the extra few hundred dollars? I didn't even blink when I dropped $1300 for my Colt M4-with proper care and 'ammo I can trust my life with that thing. You might save some money now but a lot of good that money will do you if your gear fails you and you're dead....
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  #70  
Old 10-06-2012, 6:52 AM
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Buy a Boresnake, some of you fav flavor of lube and SHOOT IT! If you get a FTE, push it out with a cleaning rod, snake it and go back to putting things down range. All of my junk get steel through them and it usually takes between 250 and 500 rds through them to get to a FTE. I have tried mixing brass in the mags and it seems to extend the count to 300 to 600 before one sticks.

I've seen your youtube stuff before.
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  #71  
Old 10-06-2012, 7:26 AM
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I have a spikes and it will shoot anything, no issues, I seen a DPMS AR in brentwood armory and I think it was under $800. I agree with above and think it is a CYA but you do want to have a weapon that will not shoot different ammo, due to price and if S ever HTF you want a reliable weapon that will shoot anything.
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  #72  
Old 10-06-2012, 7:32 AM
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My buddy has a 20in flat top he got from Rguns.. He shoots pmc federal wolf Tula and hasn't had any problems.. As far as I'm concerned they r gtg
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  #73  
Old 10-06-2012, 8:04 AM
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sounds like a cheap product
Not sure I would go that far but I have a theory that you want to try and train with it with the crudest ammo possible. That way if something goes down you will know your stuff will work and anything better is pure bonus. not gonna be alot of premium boat tail ammo out there after the SHTF lol.
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  #74  
Old 10-06-2012, 8:54 AM
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My two PSA uppers fire anything I throw at it. Sorry to hear you bought a piece of junk.
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  #75  
Old 10-06-2012, 9:19 AM
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Just shoot it, you got what you wanted within your budget. Lube it like its a woman(lots), shoot the crap out of it and start saving for a quality AR. Research research research. Enjoy.
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  #76  
Old 10-06-2012, 9:30 AM
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Originally Posted by AbsoluteTruth View Post
The thing is I really want a foward assist and a dust cover on my rifle. I want the forward assist so if SHTF ever happened and I was defending my life and had a jam I could just hit it and be back in the fight...
It saves you money to think ahead instead of regretting it later. If you take that same mentality on SHTF scenario would you really want to use ammo you couldn't rely on 110%???? Kind of like buying a Ferrari, buying the cheapest and skinniness tire possible to save a few bucks. Some rifles function for 100s of rounds on steel case without a problem, some fail sooner. It's a know problem, so choose your SHTF ammo wisely. I would have no problem shooting steel case ammo at the range and a casual class but I would clean it after the day is done. As others have stated steel case doesn't expand as well as brass, is dirty causing fouling form in the chamber, and if a case gets stuck your going to need a cleaning rod to push it out or a case extractor on a extremely stuck cartridge. In my experience don't mix brass with steel since brass will expand in the chamber and all the crud will cause it to stick.
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  #77  
Old 10-06-2012, 9:33 AM
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...

Last edited by killathrilla; 01-06-2013 at 10:53 AM..
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  #78  
Old 10-06-2012, 9:33 AM
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Originally Posted by AbsoluteTruth View Post
I thought I might as well throw this in here for anyone that's interested its my youtube channel. This is where I keep a library of information regarding whats going on in the world along with many other things. I've boiled down thousands of hours of research from the past few years into this youtube channel and I add stuff almost daily.

youtube.com/AbsoluteTruth88
Why didn't you put any of those thousands of hours of research into your rifle?
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  #79  
Old 10-06-2012, 4:23 PM
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Originally Posted by TKM View Post
Why didn't you put any of those thousands of hours of research into your rifle?
I was kinda late in the game in the gun area. I didn't really start prepping until this year. I've put an ok amount of research into my rifle but there isn't much out there on Rguns. Mostly just people bashing on their customer service. Plus until recently I didn't realize I wanted an AR 15. I had bought a ruger 10/22 and put a kit on it as my SHTF rifle but after a while of shooting I decided I needed something more powerful. So I decided I wanted an AR after doing some research. I'm researching now and have been for the past month or two...
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Old 10-06-2012, 4:28 PM
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Originally Posted by Munny$hot View Post
It saves you money to think ahead instead of regretting it later. If you take that same mentality on SHTF scenario would you really want to use ammo you couldn't rely on 110%???? Kind of like buying a Ferrari, buying the cheapest and skinniness tire possible to save a few bucks. Some rifles function for 100s of rounds on steel case without a problem, some fail sooner. It's a know problem, so choose your SHTF ammo wisely. I would have no problem shooting steel case ammo at the range and a casual class but I would clean it after the day is done. As others have stated steel case doesn't expand as well as brass, is dirty causing fouling form in the chamber, and if a case gets stuck your going to need a cleaning rod to push it out or a case extractor on a extremely stuck cartridge. In my experience don't mix brass with steel since brass will expand in the chamber and all the crud will cause it to stick.
Obviously I would like better ammo but I just want to make sure I have a gun that can shoot the bad stuff too. If SHTF happened I would think it would be a lot easier to get steel cased ammo than brass. And technically I wouldn't say I have the "Ferrari" of AR's.. I just think an AR should be able to shoot steel cased ammo.
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