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California 2nd Amend. Political Discussion & Activism Discuss gun rights activism and 2A related political topics here. All advice given is NOT legal counsel.

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  #1  
Old 07-27-2012, 3:30 PM
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Default Moving to CA with an AR Pistol

I have combed through the posts as well I as could to find a definitive answer to the "can I move to CA with an AR Pistol from out of state?". The answer seems to be "YES" or at least "Maybe" as long as I conform to the CA gun laws.
Since I am moving to CA and not currently a resident trying to build an AR 15 pistol I believe I do not have to ship this to myself and I can just move into the state and fill out the new resident gun registration form.

http://oag.ca.gov/sites/all/files/pd.../ab991frm.pdf?

The only modifications I must perform to make the pistol CA compliant are as follows:

Add a Raddlock Bullet button
Have all of my Olympic arms magazines blocked to 10 rounds
and possibly have my flash suppressor/compensator pined onto my barrel

am i missing something?

My current 9mm AR 15 style pistol:





The configuration is as follows:

Receiver Material 7075 T6 Aluminum Forged Receivers Machined By Olympic Arms

Receiver Finish Black Matte Anodized Receivers, Parkerized Steel Parts

Gas Operated Semi-automatic Action

Upper Type Flat top w/ picatinny rails & detachable carry handle by olympic arms

Lower receiver from Surplus arms and ammo

Front Sight Elevation adjustable post - no bayonet lug

Handguard Free floating FIRSH w/ picatinny rails

Barrel 6.5", button rifled, 4140 chromemoly steel
Chambering 9mm

Muzzle Yankee Hill Phantom 5C2 flash suppressor/compensator

Stock None

Length 22.25"
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  #2  
Old 07-27-2012, 3:33 PM
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You can disassemble the mags if you cant block them.

I have one. They are legal.

Foregrip is legal federally but not in CA.

uhh.. And if you are truly paranoid keep the rifle and carbine length buffer tubes off of it.
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  #3  
Old 07-27-2012, 3:52 PM
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Default VFG no but what about this AFG?

I have an Angled Fore Grip from Magpul would these be allowed if moved into CA?

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  #4  
Old 07-27-2012, 4:10 PM
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The only legal configuration is a fixed magazine pistol that holds 10 rounds or less.

That is why you need a bullet button of some sort and 10 round magazines.

There are issues with importing "large capacity" magazines in to CA so unless you had them legally in California before the magazine ban went in to effect, disassemble them.

If you build them in to ten round magazines, you need to make it a ~permanent modification.

Since you have to be mag locked because the magazine well is outside of the pistol grip, you can have all the other "assault weapon" features including a threaded barrel so there is no need to pin your muzzle device. The forward grip is where things get interesting. If the pistol is less than 26" long, a vertical forward grip would create an NFA "any other weapon" AOW. That is legal in California if you have a tax stamp for it. It is a little questionable wether the AFG creates an AOW so I would not add one.

So bullet button, permanent 10 round magazines and skip the forward grip is the safe and easy way to import the pistol.
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  #5  
Old 07-27-2012, 4:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wash View Post
It is a little questionable wether the AFG creates an AOW so I would not add one.
ATF has, on multiple occasions, stated that the AFG on a pistol would not create an AOW, so I don't know why it would be questionable.
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  #6  
Old 07-27-2012, 4:37 PM
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Stay here in WA.

Problem solved
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  #7  
Old 07-27-2012, 4:43 PM
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Arent Olympic Arms ar pistols banned by name or is that a dif model ??

And your buffer tube cant accept a stock right ? I cant see on my laptop
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Old 07-27-2012, 4:47 PM
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nevermind just looked it up im was totally off i was thinking bushmaster lol
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Laws that forbid the carrying of arms... disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes... Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than to prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man. Jefferson's "Commonplace Book," 1774_1776, quoting from On Crimes and Punishment, by criminologist Cesare Beccaria, 1764
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  #9  
Old 07-27-2012, 4:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by durandal View Post
Foregrip is legal federally but not in CA.
Really? Why does a CA based company produce and sell +26" AR handguns in CA complete with a FPG? I will agree that the whole FPG is a bit confusing and that AFGs only make it more confusing but, FPGs can be legal in CA and can be a federal no-no depending on the exact configuration.


BTW, AFGs seem to be completely legal on any handgun in CA.
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Old 07-27-2012, 4:58 PM
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Add the BB, disassemble the mags and you are good to go. I have a AFG on my AR pistol no problem. You can buy mags for it 10/30, 10/20 or regular 10's at any gun store or gun show so I would just disassemble your regular mags and save them for trips back to WA or other free states.
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  #11  
Old 07-27-2012, 5:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CSACANNONEER View Post
Really? Why does a CA based company produce and sell +26" AR handguns in CA complete with a FPG? I will agree that the whole FPG is a bit confusing and that AFGs only make it more confusing but, FPGs can be legal in CA and can be a federal no-no depending on the exact configuration.


BTW, AFGs seem to be completely legal on any handgun in CA.
Thanks for the sarcasm.
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Old 07-27-2012, 5:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by durandal View Post
Thanks for the sarcasm.
Sarcasm? I'm never sarcastic.
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  #13  
Old 07-27-2012, 5:12 PM
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Check first . the olympic arm by name is not legal in Ca.
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Old 07-27-2012, 5:20 PM
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has to have a BB
And with a BB you don't need a pinned brake or pinned flash supressor
mag outside grip on pistol so you must do BB & no over 10rd mags so don't have to pin barrel at all
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Old 07-27-2012, 5:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ke6guj View Post
ATF has, on multiple occasions, stated that the AFG on a pistol would not create an AOW, so I don't know why it would be questionable.
This is California. Do you think a police officer who has a hard on for busting people with AR pistols is going to understand that an AFG isn't a forward pistol grip or whatever the AOW law says?
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  #16  
Old 07-27-2012, 7:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wash View Post
This is California. Do you think a police officer who has a hard on for busting people with AR pistols is going to understand that an AFG isn't a forward pistol grip or whatever the AOW law says?
just because some LEOs are ignorant of how CA and federal law interact doesn't mean that it is questionable. It is pretty clear that an AFG on a maglocked pistol doesn't violate any CA law, and ATF has repeatedly said that it doesn't violate federal law.

Otherwise, it can be argued that using maglocks or going featureless is questionable since some people have been arrested for non-violations by ignorant LEOs.
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  #17  
Old 07-27-2012, 7:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by emy View Post
Check first . the olympic arm by name is not legal in Ca.
inaccurate. Some specific Olympic Arms rifle models are banned in CA. There are offlist OA rifles. And there are no OA pistols listed on the ban list.
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  #18  
Old 07-27-2012, 8:22 PM
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The Feds say it is fine but ATF has reversed itself on things like that and I'm sure CA thinks that they are the ones who get to determine what a forward pistol grip is.

CA might say your AFG equipped pistol is an AOW even if ATF says it's not.

But really what does an AFG do that a mag well grip won't do?

It's better to leave it off and be safe if your OAL is less than 26".

Some choices fall on the very bad side of the risk vs. reward spectrum, when you see a tangible risk with nearly nonexistent reward, make a different choice.

Leave the stupid thing off.
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  #19  
Old 07-27-2012, 8:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wash View Post
The Feds say it is fine but ATF has reversed itself on things like that and I'm sure CA thinks that they are the ones who get to determine what a forward pistol grip is.
CA can determine what they will consider a forward pistol grip to be, but it doesn't matter when that grip is on a maglocked pistol. On a maglocked pistol, I can hang a full on VFG on it without it violating CA law.

Quote:
CA might say your AFG equipped pistol is an AOW even if ATF says it's not.
they can, but when the feds say that it isn't a crime, what is CA going to do.

there's a lot of stuff that is completely 100% legal that an ignorant LEO could decide to arrest you for even though it violates no law.

Quote:

But really what does an AFG do that a mag well grip won't do?

It's better to leave it off and be safe if your OAL is less than 26".

Some choices fall on the very bad side of the risk vs. reward spectrum, when you see a tangible risk with nearly nonexistent reward, make a different choice.

Leave the stupid thing off.
everyone has to decide for themselves how close to the line of legality they wish to venture. And yes, deciding to stay a couple steps farther away from the line, even when it is absolutely legal, to protect yourself from an ignorant LEO is an option that many take.
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  #20  
Old 07-28-2012, 12:48 AM
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Actually the lower receiver on the AR Pistol is from Surplus Arms & Ammo a Washington State company that has them made for them. So the lower is OLL. Which makes it compliant? In CA?
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